Jocko Podcast 318: 318: Even When The Uniform Comes Off, You Have a Lot To Offer. With Micah Fink

2022-01-27T05:22:42Z

Underground Premium Content: https://www.jockounderground.com/subscribe Join the conversation on Twitter/Instagram: @jockowillink @heroesandhorses351 @echocharles 0:00:00 - Opening 0:04:53 - Micah Fink. 4:17:30 - How to stay on THE PATH. JOCKO UNDERGROUND Exclusive Episodes: https://www.jockounderground.com/subscribe Jocko Store Apparel: https://www.jockostore.com Jocko Fuel: https://jockofuel.com Origin Jeans and Clothes: https://originmaine.com/durable-goods/ Echelon Front: https://www.echelonfront.com 4:38:50 - Closing Gratitude.

AI summary of episode

you know because like I said I became like a historian I read every book everything every there's probably not a book on the teams that I didn't read and this was before like a lot of books were coming out they're like old school books and I really believe like in the brotherhood like in the old school like do everything together kind of mentality uh matter if I could be herel he's like an old school team guy uh and he was like I never forget we're like sent drinking beer one down as a new guy and he's like he's like you and you know the other guys like you guys are like the spirit of like the old teams like the old teams like just I was always a good shooter I don't not that I grew up like you know you're hunting like like I always laugh because now I'm like big archery hunter and stuff and and actually a hunter but we're in high growth like hunting was like you know shooting out of the back of a truck and like you're like an accord field and like you know like that was hunting like you know like our hunting gear was like you know like one of these snow suit like you bought a wall crack and they were telling me about what happened to a bunch of our guys I mean helping us the walls shishkabab spears stuff through their hearts you know I mean like brutally killed so it was uh it was tough uh a good relationship with those guys so some of them are here in the states actually funny enough like what I'm like I don't know they don't we don't use our names but one of the guys somehow like found me and like reached out to like my secretary like I was like my name is like someone's so my homied like you know looking for Mike and they said it to me I'm like take everything off the internet I could remember being so hungry, like, going in the grocery store and just then like, just like grabbing like food and just like seeing like the big fat security guy, like just looking at me like, and I would do the whole, like kind of like Julio Jones like, you know, and you just, I'd make it out with like one tent of what I had. hey I know like what's going on like or you know what I was your trip like next thing I know I'm like literally like dudes with orange vest walking around looking for me with like rubber shape like laying the bushes like I was so mad I can't describe how mad I was the only thing I could do was think about how mad I was I was being possible from a getting mad or like I would explode so I go through you know I go through that I hurt my hand and and and up rolling out of that bulltune right before the tasking I got a pretty severe arterial injury in my hand so I started boxing with him on the weekends like smart partner getting them in shape and so you know I grew up watching Ray Mercer you know he devastated town in Morris and he lost the landing slow as he was a brutal dude he never been knocked down he had a head like a you know like a giant block of cheese and he was merciless I mean if you watch that knockout against Tim Morrison who was like my hero at the time before he got AIDS and but like I mean when he beat him down I remember he said he's like you can kill somebody in boxing he that's like all he said it was like very like that and I had like I don't like I got like guys like I like the prepatabors like you need help you know like it raises over like I'm like I can't breathe I can't breathe I can't breathe I'm like and I'm like underwater like like hand signal so I wouldn't change it for anything in the world because of the team I got to be a part of what we got to do and the knowledge that I gained of that mobility platform it was something that I think like within the teams is so like niche and most people think you know because the STV guys always get like bad rap you know like golf freaking like a STV guys like I mean I'm with ranchers I'm in rural I'm in agriculture people that's my life and you you listen to these old guys kneel down and pick up the soil dead right and where's all this stuff going where's all these things going what's happening around us is that people only care about their own projections and the very things that give them life they're destroying to further something that does only exist fictitiously as an idea and it's a scary time to be living in right now it's like you know here we are like Ukraine like Russia like look out like wow like they're coming they're gonna get us all like their actions and and it's like it's like something I feel like when I showed up at buzz it was like I felt really inferior to everybody like in the sense that everyone I was like ripped and like they were like all like you know played football and everybody was like sports athletes and everyone there but there are those things like that really matter in life are are your food your water your shelter in your relationships in your life and um if you're not in balance with those things there's nothing there's no things in life that are gonna help you find a place of completion because eventually you will face the man in the mirror you will eventually no matter what you know matter how many cart no matter what it is like I was using example of like warm buff it was like laying in the desert and dying like about to die and I came like walking by with some water and I was like hey weren't get me all the money that you have and I'll give you this water you would take it he would 100% take it he wouldn't be like and now I'm kind of figuring I'm in a total state of paranoia too because every move I ever watched about the CIA is like playing in my head you know I like turned the sink out of me for like a cable to come out like look at me and write everything like everything everybody is like everybody's on it which is kind of funny because what I went through this surveillance course and I actually got busted by like a big fat lady in a KFC she like busted me or you know any pretty much anyone's story and you hear those cool little parts of it where it's like oh man I need to take away the computer from my kids from now on you know it's like you get sucked into a story so much like it's so um what do you call like so engaging that you kind of like I kind of want to be a bohunter now you know it's like that kind of a woman given john that lea call I'm saying it when he's talking I'm like so I've just dedicated my life to you know right now the program is a 41 day long program you know at the end of it we have a Lakota sweat lodge I've had the opportunity to get to know some of those medicine men and you know that's an ancient tradition that is 16,000 years old that dates back and you know they say you go into the womb of the earth and when you come out you know you're reborn and it's it's really like it's like an insane sauna that has chanting and all those other kinds of things and you you're in there in the heat and you kind of go the heat brings you from the kind of physical into the spiritual and so every guy will pass through those windows and they'll do a four window ceremony upon graduation and then and then people are like and then what and I'm like and then go and live your life because now you know and if you want to go participate in those same things you can do it but not ignorantly because you know you know that yeah it's like sorry for the doing gloom you know believe me you listen to this podcast little bit more we got to do we got to play there is like there is like an IT for he's like a machete like I get the the weird thing is is as you look at this stuff in a large scale all these things are in place you know when you just were saying that about vets you're on a bunch of medications and you're being basically subdued you know you're being subdued and it's not just vets it's like humans humans are being subdued look we don't really actually want you to do anything we don't actually want you to come up with your own ideas we don't actually want you to write your own freaking books we don't want you to create something what we want you to do is continue to feed our machine that we've got work and over here that's what we want we want to feed our machine so it was like at first like not what I had like signed up to do like meanwhile I'm like watching the news you know it's like like let's go like break and I think we need to restore what it means to be an American like I think we've lost I think that term is synonymous with the wrong things and and being a patriotists synonymous with the wrong things you think patriotic like dude riding a jacked upside by side like woo like oh like freedom like no there is no freedom there's only free and that's what America freedom means that someone's affording me that to me free is an alienable right is is to live like as I see fit and fulfill my purpose and this nation affords me that and in turn I serve you know my country that gives me the opportunity and provides all this infrastructure and all those kinds of things we take all that for granted and we need to restore the message of what it means to be an American I don't care what political parties and what color and your race and gender I don't care about any of those things what it is is a common thread that made this nation incredibly great I didn't like and so I I'm down there like getting on my stuff just home from deployment like and to be honest with you like looking back like that whole like there's a lot that happened like that was like a lot because I just did back to back Clearly like we're all here together you know everyone's going everyone brother like and like even the even the guy at the front does give a brother and and so we check into the we check we check in and and my roommate is a team guy bunny in mind and so as we're like in like he's like a good buddy of mine and I didn't even know he was there so we're there and he didn't make it but the so I get a text message from over sea is like watch the news tonight so sons up we get back and he was there and he's like he's like in tears he's like gonna have a drink so we go up we go on the skiff and he's like I thought you're dead and I was like why do we do this like this is terrible like you should have never done this like blah I was the only team guy that made it out of the training me and three other guys first of all I didn't really like I had an idea but he wouldn't tell me anything and I got how it went down was like I got a random email being like you know you've been like recommended for training can you be here on whatever the date was and I was in Iraq so I remember I went to this guy I was like a total toolbag he was like some like army guy or something it's a it's a tricky application you know most nonprofits you kind of like fill out the thing and it's like you know you like presence or being on it's like you're welcome like thanks like this is like gets in your head just like oh you're just like you just get on the airplane I mean when I came home I flew through DC I still had like you know pieces of concrete like you know I was still banged up like and I just like arrive home at the airport like and he's like um like there's like guys sleeping like right next to the horse like I know I look you guys come on we're not in the military now we understand up and like but but so six days of so the beginning of the program they're there they're getting all this good stuff that you're given and they're only eating like meat vegetables what do you say salt water and coffee that's it and and they're like well we like need you to go back like you know take this team bubble bond and if you don't come back we're in a doctor pet and that's when I was like back to like my massager chief story you know I was like like like or you're just like you know sometimes you get that kind of like raciness or you feel like you got to like down regulate a little bit like the best thing you can go out is go outside take your shoes off stand in the ground being total silence and stand there and it usually goes away from like three to four minutes and I started seeing like you know these kind of like I guess like you would say a hallucination or whatever I started like seeing all kinds of crazy images and I started feeling like I'm going out unconscious like this is like but you really do nothing right like the jury's out like wake up do hard work learn about yourself turn the shed off like meditate like you know eat a carrot every now and then like and life is gonna be pretty good for you um doesn't mean it's gonna be easy but you'll have the built-in tools and you'll be going to learn about your higher self and you know people can say like and everyone's like you know this for a while was like the mental health month and the mental health stuff was going on like crazy like you know everyone's like hey guys mental health month you know skydiving for mental health like I'm conducting a boxing clinic for mental health and bringing awareness to it and mental health and I was like and he looked at me he's like there is no buddy breathing you're in like a full face mask he's like you know just remember he was like a watch you don't he just he just looks at me like you're dead like and I was like it doesn't even look like we took anything out I mean like how many potato pillars did we have I was like we had like nine potato pillars meanwhile and Ethiopia I'm like I'm like we had so many things and what do things represent their measurements of time their measurements of time because you have to have time expanded and energy to get that thing I have a couple great shots of me and him boxing together and he hit me so hard one time that for the first time I'm like I had like kneeled down the ground I wasn't really sure like I'm on like roller skates like I and I I remember I was like hurt for like week living the dream like I mean ride in dirt bikes like I was just like living the dream uh and then uh when Josh died you know that was my first experience with losing somebody and then it just was like really real to me you know it just everything changed after that for me um and that that mission was you know he drowned uh so that was uh the way that whole thing went down how that that was tough that was that was a tough one and then the guys that were with us you know uh chasing got killed on entry uh he got shot in the stomach and then John Mark and we got shot in the neck on that so that was a huge loss in 2008 you know for the teams and eventually I started learning how to shoot horses and start Colts and these guys like I kind of thought initially they were all about like helping vets and all this kind of stuff they were like the most like crooked human beings I've ever met in my life like real legit crooks you know because the equine business is tough like in the cowboy world and all that kind of stuff I happened to know a team guy buddy of mine awesome guy and who works for a guy that has a ranch in Mexico so he's been ranching in Mexico like his whole life is like completely different I think what would happen if more people got out and immediately took on the next challenge in their life in the face of everything and where would they be today and you know that's my overarching goal is that like you know the sweat lodge is a super powerful thing and it can be terrifying how hot is this sweatlock and really hot like like really hotter than normal sauna but I'm like a steady-headed person because I was like really like a roller coaster of emotions like I had I had just experienced all this stuff and in a nutshell and next thing you know I'm like felt like I was being shitted on you know and but I never had another about what that ever got and it was a moment where I was like I knew I had like I had like finally like face that thing down which was like playing in the back of my head it was really weird when I would get into water situations or be in drowning which happened a lot like in free dive spear fishing you know right what is this what is this thing meaning that we all have we all gonna answer that question at some point in our life whether you get hit by a you know a scape order like and whack your head in the curb or you die combat or you you know eat yourself to death like you're all going to face those those things and to me the heroes journey is the journey of learning about yourself and using those tools to overcome the external circumstances that you face and so like over the 41 days like we have you know that every guy walks at least 80 miles in the program just to meals they'll spend 22 days in the wilderness they won't eat a piece of sugar they won't eat dairy they won't eat they won't have juice they will only eat meat vegetable salt water and black coffee and they will learn to meditate looking to an ice tank every single day they will start today with mindfulness they'll read books they'll go through leadership courses they'll learn to shoe horses ride horses they'll learn to see themselves and working with wild moustangs they'll be put in very dangerous the situations all these are just tools to shift focus from a person that is always looking out for answers to a person that is looking in for answers and then using those answers to then change the material world around them with their choices that are authentically theirs and that's called purpose and when you start to do that years always the dragon that steps out right in front of you right the dragon steps out in front of you I'm like preling nervous I'm like whoa this is like I'm like insurance and like you know this is like really a wild place and there's huge cliffs so there's only kind of one way in this water to the to the river and I would be very distracted like I because I always knew that I had to like leave again and then in um in 2014 I was in a really significant ordeal um I would say it was like up there in my top two or three events I had in my you know military-parameter career was uh actually I would say it's probably the top like it was the most insane gunfire and combat and carnage that I ever been involved and um you know that's when I kind of was like enough was enough from I had enough at that point you know and then I see like some nods like lights and the guys have made it around come down there scanning the shore and I like popped out and like here's like mud dude with like you know and I've been watching this thing drone footage all the things I've been observing this for a long time I understood the flow of the river and there was a dog leg which was like the point of no return like if you went there there was a huge cave and I would watch on the footage like logs like trees did go in there and like days later would be like blue come out so I knew if I went in there that I wouldn't live and and now I'm like my black bear story when I was like a teenager coming back from my dark years and this black bear like 10th is kind of like if I see a black bear literally the back of the jump I'm just like I just pick a stick up I'm like

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Episode transcript

[00:00:00] This is Jockel Podcast number 318 with echo Charles and me, Jockel Winning. Good evening,
[00:00:06] I come good evening. The Native Americans believed that if you gave someone a diagnosis,
[00:00:18] it was a curse. It was a curse that can become an identity.
[00:00:25] If you accept it, but a rewiring can happen. When you realize that you are the one creating
[00:00:37] your own experience, this is a long and truthful conversation with yourself.
[00:00:45] How can we learn and evolve from our successes and our failures? Where do we need to change?
[00:01:01] How can a person find solace and sovereignty in the face of experience that has been
[00:01:08] shaped by such pressure, immense hardship, bad choices, chemical manipulation, digital stimulation,
[00:01:16] and sophisticated programming that teaches you to kill.
[00:01:25] When the antiquated ways fail and repeat the same answers and produce the same results,
[00:01:32] it's time to change. You are not the victim of this life, but rather the victim of your
[00:01:44] own choices. Truth is found within oneself, but to get to that truth, you have to peel back
[00:01:53] the layers to who you are. It's self-work and self-knowing that creates profound change.
[00:02:06] Today we have an addiction problem. We are addicted to other people's ideas. We become the victim
[00:02:13] of our experience. We take magic pills or become convinced by false profits as to what will
[00:02:20] fix us or make us happy. We just want to relieve hurt and make it go away,
[00:02:30] but running from pain only magnifies the pain. We are born to honor what is good while striving
[00:02:40] for our highest self. You have to be open to everything and close to nothing. The heat, the cold,
[00:02:50] your weaknesses, failures and successes, your loss and your regrets face them. Face yourself.
[00:03:01] This is the most important and difficult battle you have ever been in.
[00:03:12] Alexander the Great once said, bury me with my hands out of the ground so the world can see
[00:03:19] that I left it with nothing. That is the plan. You change your own life from within, always from
[00:03:33] within, never outside. It's 100% in you. Life is not here to punish us, but it's here to help us grow
[00:03:46] in wisdom and knowledge and to ensure we never again are a victim of life. The time is now.
[00:04:04] That is a compilation of words that I put together that were written by or spoken by or implied
[00:04:13] by a man by the name of Micah Think. I think you are going to see that through his path in life,
[00:04:25] in boyhood, in business and war and combat and service and sacrifice, it's allowed him to learn
[00:04:31] some valuable lessons and his goal is to teach those lessons. If not the lessons themselves,
[00:04:41] then at least teach other people how to learn those lessons, how to rewire themselves to be
[00:04:48] who you want to be, to be who you can be. We are lucky enough to have Micah with us here tonight
[00:05:00] to share some of those lessons. Micah, thanks for coming by, man. Thanks, buddy. Man,
[00:05:08] I was intense. Yeah, you've got a bunch of clips out and stuff that you've written on your website
[00:05:18] and I just pulled from some of it and watched from your videos and pulled from some of that
[00:05:23] to try and give people a feel for sort of where you're at, but in order to get to where you're at,
[00:05:29] I guess we started at the beginning. Yeah, where have you been? Yeah, where have you been? So,
[00:05:35] where did all start, man? You know, I kind of always started, I was just a small town kid from
[00:05:46] upstate New York and I laughed because if you were to tell me when I was a kid that
[00:05:52] I'd be doing the things that I'm doing today, I would have, I'd probably would have been over the
[00:05:56] head of the frying pan. I just, I feel really fortunate to, you know, to now be in a place where I can,
[00:06:04] I can take the experiences in my life that at a point did break me down and now kind of show people
[00:06:11] that those experiences of the greatest ally that they have and this journey of self-discovery
[00:06:16] that were all on and I grew up, my dad, you know, grew up tough family, you know.
[00:06:24] My dad was, you know, seven dollars and sisters and grandpa was a mob guy and so he was in federal
[00:06:32] prison for ten years and were you alive then? No, no, it was. So this is before you were born.
[00:06:38] Yeah, it's before I was born and but he had a tough life and so he grew up as an orphan on the streets.
[00:06:44] This is your dad? My dad's dad. My grandfather. Well, I was super close to. He died when I was 16
[00:06:50] and I was really close to him. He was a hard man and he grew up as an orphan and
[00:06:57] and ended up turning his life around. I guess you could say much later in his life. He came
[00:07:01] the head of the railroad union and you know. My dad always tells the story when their life
[00:07:08] kind of started straightening out and fast-forward a little bit. My dad said they used to go back.
[00:07:12] He was an engineer in the railroad and I said he used to go back and abuse my grandfather.
[00:07:17] He'd run all these card games, you know, hustling and doing this at that and my dad would come back
[00:07:22] and say, PAH, what are you doing back here? I thought you were a Christian and he's like, you can't
[00:07:27] gamble and he's like, well, with me it's a sure thing. So it's not again. He was a card counter,
[00:07:34] even cow cards, but you know, so it's like real blue collar family, railroad family and
[00:07:39] you know, my dad, my dad grew up in that kind of life. Some of grandfather's pretty severe guy
[00:07:43] and the spirit. So did your dad grow? Did your grandfather live in all someone upstate or was he
[00:07:48] down the city? So he was upstate, he was in the city and then family moved upstate New York and then
[00:07:54] mother and father died of alcoholism and then I think nine nine of the brothers and sisters
[00:07:58] were street kids. Basically they were orphans and then my graph archepic escaping and
[00:08:04] my her fact he broke his leg as an orphan was taken back to the home had to get surgery and
[00:08:09] you want to talk about having it rough. They circumcised them and he was 10. The dog, yeah, he's an orphan
[00:08:14] kid so they brought him in there. They just like, yeah, I'll give a little sniff. But yeah, so it was
[00:08:20] an interesting kind of upbringing because my dad grew up and he went to the 82nd Airborne.
[00:08:25] I always either go to prison or go to Vietnam type deal and my dad was a really, really rough guy.
[00:08:33] He's the epitome of a tough guy, like a real tough, like a violent tough guy and he wound up in
[00:08:40] prison and he wound up in the end worth and what was this before you were born? Yeah, then so this
[00:08:46] was before I was born. My mom and dad had been together since 15 or 16. My dad had to join the military.
[00:08:52] Did he go to Vietnam? Well, he was supposed to go to Vietnam but then he wound up going to prison.
[00:08:57] Which Vietnam might have been better. But yeah, he never had that balance in his life, you know.
[00:09:04] And you know, it's interesting. My mom and dad, I think 56 years or something they've been together.
[00:09:12] But yeah, my dad went to 11th worth and he got some trouble in the military, of course,
[00:09:16] and he was riding with all the bike or gates stuff like that. I mean, he doesn't, every tooth
[00:09:20] my dad's had to have been punched out. He's got hundreds of stitches across his head and
[00:09:25] you know, he kind of just he had a rough and he hit rock bottom and he got out and he ended up
[00:09:31] becoming a Christian and then so he's prison time was in the military. Yeah, he was 11th worth.
[00:09:36] Yep. Yep. So he went to 11th worth and how long was he in 11th worth for a couple years?
[00:09:43] And then after that it was whatever dishonorable discharge most likely. Yeah. And then he got out and he just
[00:09:51] took a bus back basically. So he owed a bunch of money to
[00:09:55] like the hell's angels and those kind of guys. So they like took everything when he went to prison,
[00:10:01] robbed and blind basically. And so he got out with nothing. And you know, when I was a kid,
[00:10:07] like my Christmas is first spent like in the city missions, you know, every single Christmas
[00:10:12] we were in the slums and the hoods. We had people at my house, like straight out of prison. Like
[00:10:16] my dad, he's always telling me I was a kid. He's like, you know why I come here? He said
[00:10:19] I come here because I never want to forget where I came from. And my mom said that when my dad
[00:10:24] wouldn't she met me at a van 56 panel van that said no hope without dope. He could never
[00:10:29] figure out why you have getting pulled over all that time. But like so he was a rough guy. And
[00:10:37] my fact I know because as a kid people would come up to my dad, I wouldn't believe that, you know,
[00:10:42] it was him. And he was he was a violent human being. And they're kind of person has nothing to
[00:10:49] lose. And he was tough and he was a boxer and he was a street fighter. And so yeah, so my dad gets out
[00:10:55] and he ends up becoming a walking down the street like lowest point of his life. And he sees like the
[00:11:00] windows open and a church and the lights on and he decides he's going to walk in there and he sits
[00:11:04] in the back. The ZZ top looking guy. He looked at the pictures. He's got the huge beer with the, you know,
[00:11:09] the Jaguar 87 patches on it, you know, rats and stuff. And tattoo is yet like Jesus smoking pot and
[00:11:16] his arm. Man, all kinds of crazy stuff. And he has an experience like in that church and nobody talked
[00:11:24] to him. Like nobody would even come up to him and they just looked at him like, well, this is a
[00:11:28] scary guy. And he turned his life around right there in that moment. And so I was born in
[00:11:33] 79. My sister was born in 77. And my dad had to figure out how to put his life together. So my
[00:11:40] grandfather got him hooked up on the railroad and I ended up becoming an engineer and working on the
[00:11:46] railroad through till I was in second grade and then he started a church in a really rural town of
[00:11:52] 600 people. So we're real poor when I grew up. We all live in the same bedroom. So how many brothers
[00:12:01] and sisters were one sister? Just the one sister? Just the one sister. Yeah. And this is still an
[00:12:06] upstate New York. Yeah. And then they started doing tent revivals. So when I was like, I always tell
[00:12:11] people, I'm like, listen, I, at the time I had become, and I'm not a religious guy. But I had become,
[00:12:16] I would get saved like pretty much three to four times a week. I've been, I've been saved more
[00:12:21] than any human being in North America because you would hear these guys and they would start preaching
[00:12:25] another crescendo would build. And the worms in the hell. And I'm like, I'm like, you know, I've been
[00:12:31] kind of touching my penis or something. I'm like, I should have been kidding. I would just be
[00:12:36] at my hand up. And I was like, I moved my way up to the blanket guy where I went into people
[00:12:42] would fall down. I'd rush in with the little blanket laid over them, which a lot of them are
[00:12:47] faking because I was like, man, these people kind of just fall down and like before they even
[00:12:52] get up there, sometimes they would just, they would get over the power or whatever. So I'd have
[00:12:55] these little blankets, you know, like seven or eight years old, I'd run up the blanket and I'd
[00:12:58] always like step on their finger and they'd be like, hey, all right, like, so then I was like,
[00:13:04] sorry, questioning things. I really, I really did. So I question things. They're such as they'd
[00:13:09] push you down on the ground. But that was a crazy experience. You know, we traveled all around.
[00:13:14] Was it all around the country you travel or just like skating your. Up. Okay. I'm
[00:13:17] skating your arc, you know. So it was, remember the 80s it was kind of a wild time for that kind of
[00:13:22] stuff that people would get the laughing spells and like, you know, there was all these kind of
[00:13:26] things going on. And so I ended up, uh, I didn't even home at 16. So I, and I lived in my own from
[00:13:32] that on. Where'd you move to? Kind of moved around the country. Uh, and, uh, yeah. So I ended up
[00:13:40] moving down South Florida and getting a job down there and working and what were you doing in South
[00:13:46] Florida? Uh, my grandmother lived down there. And I lived, uh, I was homeless for a little while.
[00:13:52] I was homeless for some months down there. And, uh, I got, you know, I've gotten in some trouble.
[00:13:57] I was also a very rough kid as you could imagine. I... The thing about that whole movement,
[00:14:04] looking back now retrospectively is, is the guilt and the fear and all the things that are associated
[00:14:10] with that. And we're movement. Yeah, the revival movement. And all that kind of stuff. And it
[00:14:15] wasn't ever about love, you know, and I mean to me, like, that loving yourself and not judging
[00:14:20] yourself and all those kinds of things. It wasn't associated with that at the time. And so,
[00:14:24] as soon as I got old enough, you know, around 15, I, uh, well, I started working at 10.
[00:14:29] And, um, yeah, my first job in a dairy farm and then my time on as 14 years old, I was working 35,
[00:14:36] 40 hours a week, sometimes. Um, and that was kind of my life. Where are you going to school?
[00:14:42] Yeah, let's go into school. So I get off school. Sometimes I work to 10 o'clock at night. I work
[00:14:46] all the weekends, work Sunday after noon. Um, and then I started working for our family as a
[00:14:52] lineman. First, I was like, pick up the sticks guy, you know, I'd run around and move the trucks and
[00:14:56] do all these things. And then, um, slowly, anything to get off the dairy. I don't really drink milk
[00:15:01] because of that. Um, milk is a disturbing product. Like, it is, I don't, sorry, like, new
[00:15:10] horizon organics or whatever, but it's nasty. Like, it's a nasty thing. You know, like, on
[00:15:15] my job was to clean the others and stick these little suckers on there and, you know, like,
[00:15:19] these old bags kicking in and then, shitting on you. And it's the worst thing. And then the melt goes in
[00:15:24] there. And it's the flies and the cats lick it and stuff everywhere. And then these things got to be
[00:15:29] like constantly, you know, kept the pregnant. You know, so they're like in this perpetual state of
[00:15:34] pregnancy to get them to keep lactating, you know. And the only thing I wanted to do is just get the
[00:15:38] hell away from it. So, yeah, I ended up, uh, ended up becoming a lineman. So I learned I do line
[00:15:44] work, beat start climbing telephone poles on about 13. And uh, start making like good money doing that.
[00:15:50] So, um, I didn't do that down in Florida. I did a bunch of other things. And then, uh, I
[00:15:56] asked like, like, oh, yeah, that was a really, really rough time in my life.
[00:16:02] Uh, my effect, we were just down in Florida. And I was driving through some of the areas that you
[00:16:07] still live in. I could remember being so hungry, like, going in the grocery store and just
[00:16:11] then like, just like grabbing like food and just like seeing like the big fat security guy, like
[00:16:17] just looking at me like, and I would do the whole, like kind of like Julio Jones like, you know,
[00:16:23] and you just, I'd make it out with like one tent of what I had. Like, and I remember this particular
[00:16:29] package of sausage that I had. Um, when were you hanging around with? What was that? What was
[00:16:34] going on? Uh, I ended up, uh, I've had met some guys when I was younger and, um, that were kind of
[00:16:40] passing through. They were like street guys. And at the passing through upstate New York. Yeah.
[00:16:46] They're like selling shit and, you know, kind of rough crew. And so I actually showed up at their house.
[00:16:52] Uh, in Florida. Yeah. And I was, you know, I was in some, I wasn't some pretty big trouble at the
[00:16:57] time. And, uh, I, uh, I was, I wasn't living at home at all anyway. And so I moved down there and
[00:17:04] I stayed down there until I was 20. And, and then I moved back home. I had like 30 grand on me and,
[00:17:12] and I saw all kinds of stuff and I moved back home with a, with a stripper girlfriend. I got that
[00:17:18] out of my system. So when I got the stripper, we've been in the team. So I was like, I got a boy's,
[00:17:23] I was there when I was 17. Don't do it. And yeah. So I, I moved back home. My life was kind of like
[00:17:30] an entailspin. Honestly, I, you know, had money, had things and I had a real hard chip in my shoulder.
[00:17:35] And I just, uh, you know, I had kind of become like my father, I guess in the sense where I was,
[00:17:43] I could be violent. I was pissed off. I was just angry. Once your dad found like God,
[00:17:48] was he still pissed off in angry? No, but inversely he was really hard. He was a hard man.
[00:17:56] Like hard. You know, I didn't, I never looked at God as like God has loved and he wants to like
[00:18:01] care for us in Jesus with the lamb and stuff. You're like Old Testament God. Old Testament God,
[00:18:06] like, I'm like, I'm gonna take the staff. Those are the stories I heard. You know, like the
[00:18:09] what you'd ever hear. You're like, Jesus just loves everybody. Like, if you listen to him,
[00:18:14] like worms are gonna come suck your brains out and you're gonna burn an animal in by the way. Like,
[00:18:18] I mean, I mean, it was like that. That was the, was the revival day. Is it was the fire and
[00:18:23] brimstone? And so I was afraid of it to be honest. And I didn't like the whole thing. I didn't
[00:18:30] like the hypocrisy and the whole movement and stuff. And so as soon as I got old enough, you know,
[00:18:36] I had a bunch of money. I had worked my whole life. That's what I did. I had put my head down. I worked.
[00:18:40] I worked really hard. And that's kind of all I knew. I was like excessive compulsive worker.
[00:18:46] And you know, when I left, I was on my own. I had like, I had no like balance in my life.
[00:18:51] So yeah, I moved back home. I started doing mine work again. And actually, what big turning point for
[00:18:59] me was that I, I went on a backpack and trip on myself. And I ended up kind of having this experience
[00:19:06] out there with a bear. It was like a little backpack, whatever. And I kind of just started like thinking
[00:19:10] about my whole life. And, and how I just wasn't ready to die. I wasn't ready to, that there was
[00:19:16] something else missing. And I walked out of there. And I literally, after that moment, I kind of changed
[00:19:21] my whole life. It was nothing religious. But what was, what were you out of? In the Adirondex.
[00:19:26] Yeah, kind of where I grew up going to all the time. And so yeah, so I ended up getting back on the
[00:19:32] line crew, climbing telephone poles again. And now I look back like when I was a teenager,
[00:19:37] working on these line crews, I would spend the summer is living in New York City. And I was
[00:19:40] living with a grown man that were shooting heroin and you know, living in these, they would put
[00:19:45] me up in these hotels. And I would live in these with these guys that were like vagrants, you know,
[00:19:51] they were, they were like, they would travel from a city to city on these huge contracts. And I would
[00:19:55] be down there for the weekend. Yeah, that was a, that was tough, you know, because that was a kid
[00:20:01] matter of fact. I remember there was a guy I'll never forget on my one say his name. He's probably dead.
[00:20:05] Now, but he was like six foot eight. He was the scariest guy I was from Long Island. His brother was
[00:20:11] another gigantic dude. And they were the heaviest people I've ever seen in my life. Okay, I've never
[00:20:16] seen men that hairy in my life. I'm telling that you. And then these guys were like, these guys were like,
[00:20:22] fucking Lebanese butchers. Like, and they had the deepest voices. And I get put on a splicing crew
[00:20:29] with this guy. And I remember I'm, you know, I'm 16. It's right before I laughed. I'm living in the city.
[00:20:34] I'm living with all these guys. And of course, they would never give me a bad idea in the corner.
[00:20:38] My little like sleeping bag, you know, and they'd be doing their things. And I remember this guy
[00:20:44] would never talk to me. And he would always flick his cigarettes at me. And he was just constantly smoking
[00:20:49] pot all of a sudden. You're 16 at this point. Yeah. Yeah. And so I'm down there with this guy. I'm like,
[00:20:55] he has a van, like a white, like murderer van filled with all his cable stuff. And his heads like
[00:21:00] touches the ceiling. And he'd always be like, he always called me loser or fuck me. Whatever. Like any
[00:21:05] name, it's ever my name. He would call me. They have the deepest voice he's covered in hair.
[00:21:09] And I remember we're in Long Island. And I mean, most kids are like playing basketball. And they're
[00:21:16] out there like trying to like, you know, make out with their girlfriend, like, high school prom,
[00:21:21] like, I'm there with this dude, Jim. And I remember we're in Long Island. I'm like setting the
[00:21:27] cones up or whatever. And I'm not doing it fast enough or good enough. Everything's getting paid by the units.
[00:21:33] And I remember he's like, he's in the bucket above. And he just looks at me and he starts swearing
[00:21:39] at me. And he takes like a bolt and he throws it down. He hits me in the side of the head with it.
[00:21:42] And I had an hard head and like, I mean, it rang my bell. He can do that away on him too.
[00:21:46] Yeah. So he just like whips it down. Like, boom. Like, and I like, remember like rocked back.
[00:21:51] And I like, I went around the side of the truck and I started like kind of crying. I was like,
[00:21:57] so then I like, I just snapped. And so I started like taking all the cones. I started screaming.
[00:22:03] I'm throwing them into the road and cars like laying on their horns. This isn't your kind of like,
[00:22:07] and then I run over and I grab their emergency controls and the bucket. And I'm like,
[00:22:12] and he's like flopping shit. It's coming everywhere. And he's screaming, I'm going home.
[00:22:17] And I'm like crying. I'm like, I'm like, I'm pushing all the tools on the ground. I'm throwing everything everywhere.
[00:22:23] I kicking the truck. I'm going crazy. So finally after like 30 seconds of going crazy,
[00:22:28] and the control is I can see his like, this dude's going to murder me. So he just like stands up when I stop.
[00:22:34] And he's like, you're dead. You're dead. He says to me. And I'm like, so I just grab a huge pipe off the thing.
[00:22:42] And I'm like, and I'm out the road. And I'm just bawling my eyes out and I'm like,
[00:22:45] I'm on my screaming. And he's like, he's like coming down as little bucket out. I'm the tears and people are laying on their horns.
[00:22:53] And shit's everywhere. He looked at me and he's like, he gets down like just like at a reach from me.
[00:23:00] And I'm hitting the truck. I'm like, you're dead. He like, any problem would have killed me.
[00:23:05] And then he just like looked at me. He's like,
[00:23:10] any way back up. He made a good decision. And I was like,
[00:23:13] so he's like, pick up everything. He piece of shit. He says to me, like,
[00:23:17] it's so I'm out there picking everything up and sure enough, like I got to live in the house with the guy.
[00:23:22] So I like, you know, I go back the weeks over. And of course we go back up. You know,
[00:23:26] he was like nothing happened. You know, when I would ride back up there and he would just be like smoking like joined after joining listening to the lead Zeppelin.
[00:23:33] He would like look at me and he'd get done it. You go,
[00:23:36] like flick it at me and like hit my pants and I'd brush it off and he'd like,
[00:23:41] and he'd like, he'd like keep driving. So I mean, that was kind of like,
[00:23:45] you know, I was like joke about like, when I got in the military, like,
[00:23:50] I was already kind of like a, I wasn't afraid of much at that point. Like in the sense of like,
[00:23:55] I just had had had a lot of experiences and I had grown up on my own and grown up, you know, pretty rough. And so,
[00:24:02] I'd end up starting my own mine crew and hiring some of my, to link with friends that I grow up with, you know,
[00:24:08] and, and I happen to be in Queens, New York. And at this point, I really did turn my life around.
[00:24:14] And I'm in Queens, New York when the first plane hit the World Trade Center. So September 11th,
[00:24:19] I go to the yards and Long Island. Pick up all my equipment. We used to store everything in these huge
[00:24:24] large yards just outside the city. And I'm gonna get some of this here. I got like,
[00:24:31] some coaches. And I get, uh, get all the stuff loaded up. I got the, we used to just go down there to be
[00:24:38] dude standing out the street and I was giving cash. So I've like, who needs a job? And I'm like,
[00:24:43] who's got a driver's license? I'm like, all right, 100 bucks get in and we'd hire like a ground guy.
[00:24:47] And, um, I was making big money at the time. And I bought myself like an Audi,
[00:24:52] which is not advised. Uh, wait, what? Is there something wrong with the Audi? Well,
[00:24:57] I mean, I didn't realize that when it broke, I couldn't afford to fix it like that. That was like,
[00:25:00] and they do break. Who are your friends that you're hanging out with? Who's dudes?
[00:25:05] So like, I only really kind of ever had like the same friends kind of growing up.
[00:25:09] So the same crew from Catskill and down with you? Uh, the got, yeah. So they would work with me during the
[00:25:16] week. We'd live down there. We can say, go home. So we leave Sunday night at like three o'clock in the morning,
[00:25:20] or whatever. And then we'd be there to work Monday. And then we had a place that we'd rent.
[00:25:25] And we'd live down there, work all week, and then come back up. What do you want to ban or something, too?
[00:25:29] Yeah, yeah, I played in a funk scob band. Shout out the funk shop luminous. I think everyone's probably dead.
[00:25:34] My band. But uh, and were you guys playing gigs back then?
[00:25:38] Yeah, so we were playing gigs back then. So I ended up, uh, man, I wish I had, uh,
[00:25:44] my wife has a great picture. I of me at the house with my band. I'd plant on blonde hair and like my
[00:25:48] ears pierced, and they're like stretched out and I got the dude. Oh, yeah. So this is like nice.
[00:25:54] So this is 1990. Well, I started playing drums as a kid in church as a, you know, playing that
[00:25:58] gospel music, you know. So when you weren't, cause we got all those like shots. Like it's.
[00:26:03] So it's all those kind of like old gospel chops. And, uh, and so I started playing drums when I was eight.
[00:26:09] And, um, you know, I wasn't like that. We ended up kind of moving out of being, you know,
[00:26:14] really poor and, and, um, you know, kind of got the leg. I guess you could say like, I guess we
[00:26:19] would be the considered middle class or whatever, you know. Yeah, cause you're that had a legit job,
[00:26:23] but then the railroad. Yeah, but he left the railroad. Not what we kind of went down because God was
[00:26:27] gonna pass. Oh, Jack. Yeah. So you guys were ginging, you were in a ginging band. Ginging band. Yeah,
[00:26:35] we actually, uh, the band, the funk shop looms opened up from all the beach double all stars.
[00:26:39] Um, do you play? Oh, bro. Yeah, I actually have a demo. We actually have a demo CD. We had a song,
[00:26:46] called single man. And, uh, TV dinners always the same cause I'm a single man.
[00:26:54] One night stands at Colin Mutt name cause I'm a single man. So it was, uh, yeah, we were kind of a
[00:27:00] jam band and funk scob band. And I like that kind of chops. I like gospel music. Like, you know,
[00:27:05] that's kind of what I grew up with and um, guys like Dave Weckle and Ginger Birch and, uh, you know,
[00:27:11] so I was really actually thought I was gonna become a professional drummer. That was like what I was
[00:27:16] really aspiring at the time to be. Um, and I probably would have been how did I stay in the
[00:27:23] trajectory had none 11 not happened. Um, I mean, I was getting, I just got sponsored by Evan's
[00:27:29] drum has JD Adario. Um, so I was, I was getting pretty like serious and I probably wouldn't have
[00:27:35] stayed with that band forever. I would have moved up, you know, and no, it's a very spans and
[00:27:40] so not your band before you made it bro. I know, I was looking to you. Yeah. Yeah. I would have moved
[00:27:48] up from Loomis funk. Yeah, my music guy definitely gets people. Well, Scott is like the fact that
[00:27:57] you were playing scommies. Yeah, it's like real pretty. Yeah. It's a well, it's a particular style
[00:28:04] playing to it's a lot of like odd time signatures, you know, like um, and so it's, it's, and it's
[00:28:09] phone can gospel and all that kind of stuff has a similar foundations, you know, it's all based off
[00:28:13] of kind of like jazz, you know. So that's what I did, you know, and I played a lot of like Christian
[00:28:18] music, you know, it was like Jesus rock. Um, and let me tell you something, you get the youth group
[00:28:22] girls when you're like Jesus rock star. You told me to you're playing like at the UG, you can't
[00:28:28] have some stuff, you know, you're like you're like, you're like, you're driving the beat, you know,
[00:28:33] you love a little hard, but you know, Christian youth camp attended, just went down by
[00:28:38] eight percent of for a long girl. By the way, don't go there. I'll never send my kids there. It's
[00:28:43] the worst, you know, back at the van. So so all that's kind of where you're at, your bus and your
[00:28:51] ass work and your playing music and making money enough money to buy an outie that you really can't
[00:28:57] afford to fix, but still you got the outie and then September 11th comes. Yeah, September 11th came
[00:29:03] and I had never like, you know, thought about joining the military and then like, where were you
[00:29:06] on September 11th? Cause you're in the city. So I was in Queens, New York. Yeah, I was on a telephone
[00:29:11] bowl when it happened. So I was on a railroad pole at the time. My job was to send a, so time
[00:29:17] Warner was being stood up high speed internet road runner and we had to isolate those systems
[00:29:23] what they called power supplies. And so power supplies had to be isolated. So if there's a
[00:29:27] lightning strike, it would only go like 300 feet before the next pole and not blow the whole system.
[00:29:32] So I had a job putting in these power supplies and then grounding everything to power,
[00:29:37] bell, cable, and all the way down to the ground and then I would stall these big supplies and then
[00:29:41] wire everything up. And I got paid for everything. I mean, if I put like a screw on, I could
[00:29:46] bill for it. Whatever it was. So it was, it was a good gig. I mean, make it 7800 bucks a day. After I paid
[00:29:52] my guys on all my expenses. So it was like, it was good money and I was a hustler. And so,
[00:29:57] I mean, I could just, I would work when the sun was up, like, you know, I was on my second
[00:30:03] cup of coffee and making money. So, um, yeah, the, the first plane hits the world trades
[00:30:09] center. I'm on telephone pole. I have no idea what's going on. And I get a call in the next
[00:30:14] tell from a friend of mine that tells me that I'll play and just hit the World Trade Center.
[00:30:19] And at first I really didn't believe him. And I come down off the pole and end up like meeting a lady
[00:30:26] who's had her door open, like right next to where the pole was basically. She lived right by the
[00:30:29] railroad tracks. And what a terrible place to live. Oh my god, when people live by the railroad tracks,
[00:30:35] it's like, especially on the East Coast, like when you take the train, they'll, they'll
[00:30:41] contract. Yeah, if you live by the railroad tracks, it's a bummer. That's, that's right. Let's face it
[00:30:46] out here in California. You can live by railroad tracks in Ensenitis and have an ocean view that
[00:30:51] right in the house that you paid $4.8 million for. It's not that way on the East Coast. No,
[00:30:56] it has made it. It has made it. Shingles. Yeah. They're like, the, how, you know how this house is
[00:30:59] our shingles? Yeah. It's like, yeah, these are working on the roof. Let's just keep going. And,
[00:31:05] yeah, so I was like, so I come down. I see this lady. She's in there. She's watching the news.
[00:31:08] Has been was a port authority police officer and she was kind of crying and emotional. You know,
[00:31:13] then, obviously, the other plane hits. And like, at the time, I thought like America was like under
[00:31:19] attack or we're being invaded. I don't know. I had all these like weird thoughts probably from
[00:31:23] watching like movies and red don't. Red don't. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. So, I, I go back to the
[00:31:31] yards. And I got my buddy with me. We got rid of the other dude. We gave him his hundred bucks. And
[00:31:36] and I was like, I'm going into the city and my buddy's like, to do what? I don't like it. I don't
[00:31:41] know how to like help out. And he's like, you don't know anything. I remember this conversation
[00:31:45] we were at because I did. I don't know. I was going to do a victim or something. How old are you?
[00:31:50] I was 21. Okay. Yeah. So, I'm 42 now. And so I was like, so I go in an air drop everything
[00:31:57] off take the outie. Get on the LIE 495 and I'm like hauling an ass down there. There was no traffic.
[00:32:02] It was crazy. And I'm like, Max and this car out. It's probably why I broke down. And I get to the,
[00:32:10] I think it's the Lincoln tunnel and there's like already tactical teams and guys all standing there
[00:32:16] tell you how tight security was. Like, I had like a bunch of like cable TV and electrical IDs.
[00:32:21] And like just, you know, I look like a state department guy and I rack, you know, I have like
[00:32:26] a million badges or whatever. And I tell him I'm like a demolition crew and can you, can you let
[00:32:33] me through and they're like, yeah, bring it in. And so I just drove right on through and we went
[00:32:37] down there and parked. And that's when I, you know, towers had fallen into the radio. And that's when
[00:32:43] I realized like the severity of everything that was happened. And like I could see the smoke and people
[00:32:48] were screaming and running everywhere. And I'd never seen anything like that in my life. And so
[00:32:54] I ripped the sleeve off my shirt, put it on my face and my buddy and just walked into the smoke.
[00:33:00] Basically at this point, no idea where I was going. So I would stay there for 24 hours till September
[00:33:06] 12th. And that was, uh, what are you doing? At first, like nothing. I was just like trying to like
[00:33:16] see if anybody needed help. But like I needed help myself because I was covered in a smoke and
[00:33:20] everybody was running the opposite way. So I ended up getting in there and then they were putting
[00:33:24] together these like makeshift shirt. It was total chaos. Like I don't think that people,
[00:33:28] unless you were there, like realize like there was really no organization. It wasn't like,
[00:33:33] there was half, you know, the fire department was dead. There smashed vehicles, cop cars everywhere. So
[00:33:39] we kind of started like getting together with groups to like look for people.
[00:33:42] Layed in the afternoon, I ended up seeing like a guy's leg sticking out from underneath the police car.
[00:33:48] And a bunch of us got over there and lifted it up and he was dead. And I remember like all
[00:33:54] their gravel and everything was like shoved into his face. He must have hit underneath the car.
[00:33:58] I don't know the speculate, but whatever happened, the car lifted up and smooshed him. And so
[00:34:05] people like pulled him out and they pulled like some blankets over him and fire department came in.
[00:34:11] City bank tower fell. That tower, you know, mystical tower seven. I was like right there.
[00:34:15] And, you know, for a couple of hours, I couldn't see my hand around my face. It was one of the
[00:34:20] most terrifying experiences in my life until I became an SDV guy. Did you stay put? Did you just stay there?
[00:34:25] I just stayed there with my shirt over my head, but I couldn't breathe. And then I go to the fire department,
[00:34:29] they watched my eyes out and I stayed there all night. I found like an arm and like testins,
[00:34:35] like I had I crawled inside the World Trade Center. Like I was sliding down the metal beams
[00:34:40] into the belly of the World Trade Center. And it was like the most insane noises I ever heard of my
[00:34:46] life like creaking and you know, just like smoke and steam. And it was just it was so chaotic. I had no
[00:34:52] idea what I was doing, but I wanted to help. I had this memory of like on a bicycle to tire on my
[00:34:59] heart hat with those little like disposable ever ready like red and green like with the white switch
[00:35:05] lights. That was my headland. I had them like tied on there to the rescue. And
[00:35:10] even if I found somebody, I don't really know what I would have done because I had zero skills really.
[00:35:14] And so I'm right by that iconic picture of where the exoskeleton of the World Trade Center is,
[00:35:22] where the guys are raising the flag and it's all over the posters and stuff. I'm like sitting
[00:35:26] off to the right. And so the next morning, I was there, got some food to have like a smashed up
[00:35:33] like little bagel cart that was there with my buddy. And I remember for the first time since
[00:35:38] like that dude hit me and I had that bug nut. I uh, I was like crying really hard.
[00:35:44] Like I could feel the death. I could feel the departure of life in that area. Like you could
[00:35:51] feel the immense loss. And I was in there with my buddy. I'm like we're just crying. And he's just
[00:35:58] looks at me. He's like, man, like, what are we going to do? The sun's coming up. It's the next morning.
[00:36:02] And I just like, time was like, I'm not fucking killer. I did this. And he was like, okay, like,
[00:36:10] you know, maybe you kind of patting me on the back like, yeah, okay. And so I ended up
[00:36:17] deciding 2003 that I joined the military because what happened was I lost my contract. Like six,
[00:36:21] and maybe it wasn't six months, maybe three months later. I lost my contract.
[00:36:25] So through the end of 2001, you go back to work. Go back to work.
[00:36:32] But then they're like, you know, all this economic ambiguity, all the new build, all this stuff
[00:36:36] they start cutting, I'm like, low guy in the total, you know, subcontractor. So I own like all these,
[00:36:44] like all this line equipment that I bought and you know how to truck that was, I bought that payment
[00:36:49] on at my Audi, like I had all this shit. And now I'm like, you know, basically I'm just trying
[00:36:55] to keep everything afloat. I couldn't find any work. Everyone's freaking out. I'm watching it.
[00:36:58] It includes the TV, you know, 24 hour new cycle. And so I ended up selling everything off.
[00:37:05] picked up some like side work. And then moved out to big sky Montana. And I got a job as a ski
[00:37:12] tech out there because I was just like, I was was watching this warren Miller movie. And he said,
[00:37:18] if you don't pack up everything that you have, I moved it big sky Montana. You only be one year old
[00:37:22] year when you do. And I was like, so I got a job out there in a ski shop, fix and skis. And so I worked out
[00:37:31] there, came back. Did you know anything about skiing? Yeah, I had, I mean, my idea of skiing, like,
[00:37:37] I hate them. Like, I basically just like stole the skis. Like, and I would, I had a pair of
[00:37:42] wires and they first. And that's how I learned about ski. My parents did take me on like a youth group
[00:37:47] thing one, but I spent most of the time trying to like make out with a crow. And then get saved on the
[00:37:54] next Sunday. Get forgiveness. But I know I would go up with a pair of like wires and numbers.
[00:38:01] And you know, you just have the old things. And I would like snip them off and put them on my jacket.
[00:38:05] And that's how it would ski. And that's what's ski all the time like that. I know it sounds terrible.
[00:38:10] And I'm sorry if you're listening. And I did that too. It's free forgiveness. But I mean, that's
[00:38:16] how I was. You know, I mean, I didn't really, I didn't have, you know, a lot of things. And so
[00:38:22] so anyway, I went out there and I worked in the skate shop. And I was just basically with a ski bump.
[00:38:26] And it was awesome. And I met my, um, my first and only ex-wife. So, uh, she was like a work exchange
[00:38:35] program for Brazil. Little spotty of the English show, weren't well. And, um, yeah, so, so I ended up,
[00:38:42] you know, working out there for basically about a year coming back and then getting on a line crew.
[00:38:47] And that's when I decided I was going to join the military. And then how do you figure out the
[00:38:51] maybe? Well, um, I tried to join the army because I had seen like everything Roberts ridge and all that kind of stuff.
[00:38:59] And, uh, I didn't know like a ton about the military. And I, you know, of course, the army's
[00:39:04] turning to give me to go on the infantry and you work your way up. And this is where it starts.
[00:39:07] I'm like, hmm, I didn't. So, a navy guy actually came out and like saw me and I kept going to the mall
[00:39:14] because the recruiting station was in the mall, um, which meant, you know, go try to get a military.
[00:39:19] I didn't work out. Get orange, Julia. So, that's kind of, it's orange, Julia still around.
[00:39:27] Do you best still look there? I think all the customers died. One like at a time.
[00:39:32] Yeah, pretty good. I didn't even do that all the time. Yeah, exactly.
[00:39:36] So, obviously a navy recruiter sees you. He sees, well, he's like, he starts chatting up with me.
[00:39:40] He's like coming back for lunch on one day. And he's like, oh, I have like, seeing you coming here
[00:39:45] at a bunch. Like, what are you doing? You're always like, you're like, oh, they're like, I'm trying to get a
[00:39:49] rate going the Rangers. And he's like, oh, why do you want to do that? And I was like, oh, because, you know,
[00:39:53] they're the best in the world. Like, it was none or not. He's like, let me show you a video.
[00:39:59] He brings me in there and shows me like the CJ crock is kind of video. Like, it's like the
[00:40:05] dudes doing flutter kicks in the shorts and they're like in the desert. Like, I mean, it was at the time,
[00:40:11] the coolest thing I'd ever seen in my entire life. And I was just like in Thrall. And these dudes are like,
[00:40:16] doing the triangle defense and like they're so, I was like, man, he's like, yeah, the navy seal is like,
[00:40:22] they're the best. And I was like, oh, man, what do I got to do? He's like, you got to just sign up,
[00:40:25] take a little PT test. I was like, great. Like, so I go through all this stuff. And it took me a
[00:40:31] little while to get longer to get in. Then I had wanted because I had a couple of like,
[00:40:35] little altercations in my life. I had to get cleared up. And yeah, so I ended up started doing
[00:40:41] like a bunch of research. And I was like, I could barely swim. I could swim. But I wasn't like,
[00:40:47] that kind of swimmer. So I started, I started training. I bought the, like a
[00:40:54] navy seal workout book. And I started boxing again. Because you grew up boxing? I grew up boxing.
[00:41:02] Yeah. How much did you boxing your or a kit? On and off pretty much since I was like about 10.
[00:41:08] I started in Catskown, New York. Same place, Mike Tyson learned in Catskown village boxing.
[00:41:12] There you go. Yeah. And I actually continued. I understood working out. Because if you never did that,
[00:41:19] you were working. But working in the back of the day was kind of like the toe touchers, you know,
[00:41:23] you're doing the side. It was not as like, you know, side-dificors. It is, did I?
[00:41:28] I remember getting ready to come in the navy and thinking like, dude, you know, I did whatever.
[00:41:34] Five sets of eight pull-ups like on. What a good workout. Because you just had no idea. I mean,
[00:41:38] this is like 89. So there's no, well, at least there was no information available that I had.
[00:41:43] I mean, it wasn't going to go to a library. Library, Lee couldn't get Google shit and figured out.
[00:41:49] So, and at least if you box like you knew, even if you just knew like, you got to pressure
[00:41:54] yourself. Like you obviously did you compete boxing? Yeah, I bought something. Then you knew. Like you,
[00:41:59] you knew how to push yourself hard in a workout. Absolutely. But that was like a different kind of like
[00:42:05] in the sense, basically, the workouts I was doing was running push us. So like, I was, I would get
[00:42:10] up in the morning. I would get up before work. So I had a job. I started working for a roofing
[00:42:14] contractor. Once I was working for a line guy, that job kind of foiled out and thank God.
[00:42:20] These guys were crazy. I was working on Glenn's falls. Anyway, Lauren Cruz got some crazy
[00:42:25] feefall in it. They got a lot of problems. I found myself living in a trail and Glenn's falls
[00:42:30] with this dude, Johnny's even to pay my hotel or whatever. But anyway, so I'm like, doing that.
[00:42:34] I ended up getting job for this roofing company. So I'm roofing all day. I'm working at a
[00:42:38] pizza re-at night. And on the weekends, I worked for this guy, Sange, as you gone in guy,
[00:42:43] who had a bunch of slums. And I was going there and basically patch everything up temporarily.
[00:42:48] You know, I wish FlexTate was around because I was basically flex-taving everything.
[00:42:54] Just to make it like, you know, pass the sniff test for the runners. And so I was working three
[00:42:59] jobs. And you know, Boston might ask making pizzas. And matter of fact, this is so when I went to
[00:43:05] buds, I had a bicycle that I bought from a guy that came in the pizza rea. It was a really cool
[00:43:13] specialized stump jumper. Like for the day, it was like, yeah, like the shocks. I mean, it was like
[00:43:20] they was sick. And I took that the buds with me. I bought it for 60 bucks. And at the pizza rea. And I
[00:43:26] sold that bike to Mike Everett, who was my neighbor. Yeah. Anyway, just a little factoid. But
[00:43:36] um, so if he still has that, you know, I don't know if he's been in the car. Oh, he's been my key ever.
[00:43:41] Mike Everett. The team guy. Yeah. Oh, wait. He was your neighbor. Yeah, there's my neighbor when I
[00:43:45] lived in buds. I lived in a period of beach. Okay. And I lived like two blocks over him. And how I
[00:43:49] met him was I was going through buds. Of course, I showed him, you know, I got the toe head. And
[00:43:54] I he was selling a Jeep. And I had seen the movie. I wanted a Jeep as Navy SEALs. And I didn't
[00:44:00] end of getting one. I mean, I had I wanted to say when I like bought into it like big time. He
[00:44:05] became like a Navy SEALS story. And I bought every single, I've read everything. You know,
[00:44:10] hunters and shooters, you know, men of devil's with cream. I read everything. The stories that
[00:44:14] I mean, I was like obsessed. And that's how I am on like a total immersion guy. But Mikey was
[00:44:22] I when I lived in Coronada, we was a team one. Yeah. Mike used the team one. Mike was my
[00:44:25] opportunity. One. We lived in the upstairs apartment. And he lived in the downstairs apartment. So I have
[00:44:31] many, many, many, many Mikey's. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's pretty good all. I would go over it. Like,
[00:44:37] so I met him. He's like, I went over there and I was like, Oh, how much for your Jeep is like,
[00:44:41] are you in buds? I was like, yeah, he's like, the fuck out of here. He says something like that to me or
[00:44:47] something. I was like, if we come back when you get a brown T shirt, he said to me, I ended up like,
[00:44:52] getting him known through buds. I like he's like the nicest guy ever. He's the nicest guy. And his wife,
[00:44:57] you know, his little girl, just great people for sure. It was like a hells angel and he was like on
[00:45:02] easy riders and stuff. Like, I mean, super cool people. The best. The best. But I get used to get crazy
[00:45:11] with stuff. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I was like, so I went over. I remember I sold my bike to him. I needed
[00:45:17] like the money. I forgot. I forgot. I was, why? I was, I wish I never sold it. My sold in that bike
[00:45:24] that I bought the pizza ria and for 60 bucks. I think it sold to him for 150. So I'm ripping off
[00:45:30] it out to the business. I got you Mike. So I'm like, so I'm training for buds. I'm like, basically
[00:45:38] order the baits like 626 or whatever they were and the pants and and I just start working out
[00:45:45] and and training my ass off and I'm meeting a guy named through my recruiter. I got him
[00:45:51] drew a bit of it. You know he is? I don't know. And old team guy. He was a commander. I don't know.
[00:45:57] Yeah. And he started off in UDTs and went on and they ran this like seal,
[00:46:04] training course and Greenwich Connecticut. So you would go down there and you're supposed to get
[00:46:09] this like letter of approval or like recommendation. I never got shit from it. But it was a great
[00:46:14] experience because I met a bunch of guys that later on I would go on and serve with. And we would
[00:46:21] train like on the once a month together for like a whole weekend and I'd never done anything like that.
[00:46:26] And so it was a really good experience. I you know worked out tons and you know I'd work out
[00:46:31] the morning. We're out in the evening. I showed up the buds. You know go through boot camp.
[00:46:37] Which was like I'll never forget it because I remember the boot camp guy was like I got busted
[00:46:42] taken them lunches for the sick people and eating them tonight. And I was so hungry because I
[00:46:48] would like go work out in the bathroom. And I was so nervous about failing. And I got busted.
[00:46:55] And so they another you had all these restrictions going on. Then they had that dive.
[00:46:58] My voter rating program going on run by Jody McIntyre was right at the time. And so I would
[00:47:05] like go over there and I'd get these little passes. And then I started knowing all the scruffs
[00:47:10] waiting to go to buds. And so they would give me these passes. And then eventually I was just kind of
[00:47:13] feeling about leaving like and wandering around boot camp, right? So I started calling my my my now
[00:47:21] X-wife. Um and I'd go in the phone booth and I got busted by the chief like right before graduation.
[00:47:27] So I never really got to see my family. They restricted me before I left to go to buds or whatever.
[00:47:32] I was eating Eminem and I was like in the booth and I was like I saw my chief and I was like
[00:47:37] I just time it wrong. Literally I was walking on with like chips on my chin. I like walked out.
[00:47:42] He's like looks at me and I was like I have a pass and he's giving your pass.
[00:47:47] Okay. He's like who signed this? I was like a petty loser Johnson.
[00:47:53] Like I got it. That was my first taste of like the military has you by the balls.
[00:47:59] And yeah, so I show up a class up with class 2, 5, 4.
[00:48:04] Matter of fact, I graduated Brian Booshwa. Oh right. Yeah. Right. It was my mind.
[00:48:10] And yeah, so I classed up with them and yeah, I grew through. I think we graduated 13 original guys
[00:48:18] that class graduate was like guys like Ryan Bates and uh yeah, I remember I didn't shout through
[00:48:25] I'm making that first because I'm like hey Ryan's like he does like rassals like that.
[00:48:30] Lions then like what the fuck is the lions then you know that one's like he's like in the
[00:48:36] best shape ever like everyone's there. I was like forget be his ass like I just was like not having it.
[00:48:42] We ended up becoming super good vibes you know, but yeah, I tell a story a lot, but I don't say his name
[00:48:50] Brian, but uh it's like one of those moments where I was they were going through training and
[00:48:55] through work up training and I was running the training and there's like total chaos going on in the
[00:49:01] mountain town and there's just like everyone's getting shot up with paintball or whatever and no
[00:49:06] once making any decisions and I could already I a guy like him he stood out because he's just like
[00:49:13] we're stuck freaking stud and we're square it away and I don't think I had trained because eventually
[00:49:18] you know we trained together in GJT and whatnot so I think I kind of knew that or whatever but that
[00:49:22] wasn't he was good as an operator you know beyond GJT through he was good as an operator and I knew it and
[00:49:28] you could all you could tell like in a platoon there'd be like two guys that were good or three guys
[00:49:32] that were good or whatever and it might be the OIC it might be the platoon chief it might be the LPL
[00:49:36] or it might be some for freaking random E5 so I've been watching him and there's some total
[00:49:41] mayhem and chaos going on and he's like crouch down behind a wall and I walk over to like hey bro
[00:49:46] what's going on he's like just crazy and I said what do you think you do right now and he's like
[00:49:51] we should we should pretty strong point that building and I go why don't you make it happen he and he
[00:49:56] it was beautiful the look on his face was like oh I can't do that and he just is like hey
[00:50:05] we're strong point in that building over there and here's like you know I don't even know he's a new guy
[00:50:08] maybe he's a one cruise wonder whatever he started making calls and people just listened and they did
[00:50:12] with their supposed to do and yeah I love that guy yeah I know yeah you know I have so van Wilson
[00:50:19] he was a team guy that got killed in car crash day after we graduated but academy grad officer
[00:50:27] he was an NCAA wrestling champ monster I know we're all heartbroken we all got like tattoos
[00:50:32] the night before whatever together and you know we're all all super tight and yeah that was uh that
[00:50:40] being in buzz and that like that changed my life you know that whole that whole experience you know
[00:50:46] I was like finally like a part of something you know did you have trouble with anything you said
[00:50:50] you weren't that great of a swim or did you figure it out no I used everything except for the last one
[00:50:54] but uh my heart got been in first time every time had I not dragged another friend of mine
[00:51:01] he's getting ready to get out uh because he was he was done after that if he didn't pass that it was over
[00:51:06] for him and he was like sandbag and like crazy drag on but you that's pretty good that you were
[00:51:13] able to not really be like a water guy and pass everything yeah I mean later on I would become you
[00:51:18] know I started competing you know you know a free dive spear fishing I know around the world
[00:51:23] so I mean I that water experience and then being an STV guy which was like if they they should
[00:51:30] just have the STV at Buds like day one everyone get into this we're gonna sink in under the water
[00:51:34] into the dark you would you would you would weed out like 75% of the people a lot of people it's terrifying
[00:51:41] and so I got out went you know went to eating Delta went to the soccer medicores and then
[00:51:48] got sent to STV D1 how tall are you six four do they think about that at all I mean that
[00:51:55] this is a make sense bro no so if you don't STV is like a mini sub and it's it's a it's what's
[00:52:02] called a wet submersible which means when you're in it it's filled with water so it's not like
[00:52:07] you're in a little submarine like James Bond all listening to iTunes with with the freaking
[00:52:12] eater on it's it's like this tight they're not big they're small and they fill up with water
[00:52:21] ocean water not like one water ocean water is around you and can't move in it there's a guy in
[00:52:27] front of you and so like the dive profiles get so you know I went to STV school I crashed the STV
[00:52:34] like before I graduated which was great because I ended up becoming a backseat guy and I got to do
[00:52:37] the real world mission but I was like I'll never forget I had to officer next to me I can't remember
[00:52:44] his name he was a told dick and and he was like so bossy he's a new officer he knows he wants to
[00:52:49] believe me yeah and I'm but we drive they nap so I got the stick I'm like you know control in the
[00:52:56] ballast I'm like you know and I was like hey sir I think there's like there's something in front
[00:53:00] of us I think it was like just stay on this course and I'm like I don't know he's like it's just
[00:53:04] artifact I'm like I think that's a thing like and I was like so I was like okay fine so I
[00:53:10] like cranked celery and it like he fell right in I hit it and it was like how the middle of
[00:53:15] ocean was like one of those like rock little jetties with the with the little lighthouse on it
[00:53:21] and also it was like you know we come rocketing out and all of the water trades out like
[00:53:25] shhh I'm like hmm so I like open up the door and I like looked down there's like land
[00:53:31] I look at him he's like oh shit like we're there and so that was the end of my driving career
[00:53:38] and he was he was pissed because I did I said okay fine and I just accelerated right in
[00:53:42] it so um graduate as to be school go out to the team and you know that's when I started learning
[00:53:49] like how sophisticated that really is and how you know it's super complicated you're diving mixed gas
[00:53:58] rebriebers and open circuit all in these various profiles throughout a very long dives under
[00:54:04] under pressure and like 12 hours eight hours like yeah and you you'll switch on and off so you'll
[00:54:10] be like you know you can't be on rebrie either you know because you get oxygen tosses it
[00:54:15] it's a area you can't be on all heli-ox or nitrox or you can't be on all open circuit because
[00:54:20] I'm nitrigen our coasts so you're like in the new have these like computers with all these
[00:54:23] like lights that blink and like these huge like screens and I could never remember like
[00:54:28] I knew that double red was not good you might know that there's like double red not be like
[00:54:34] uh manually enter the air like and I'm like oh double green I think it's okay solid I'm good
[00:54:41] and so there's a guy right in front of you and you can't move so he sits in between your legs
[00:54:48] all your gear and all your equipment gets shoved in the back and then everything's pitch black so
[00:54:52] when we're training for the national tasking like everything's by memory every single thing
[00:54:58] has a not every single light has a signal you know because you're not using the under the OTS system
[00:55:04] you know because it could be heard so everything is by feel so everything begins like you know
[00:55:09] first you're in these huge tanks and then you're graduating up until you're in the ocean so
[00:55:13] everything in the pitch black so like when things get out of sync it gets very confusing and then
[00:55:20] you have to FSA at the end you have to take your rigs click it to the outside and then the sub will
[00:55:25] surface and then you like blow out closer rebrie either and kick away and then the sub leaves
[00:55:30] and then you're on the surface and then you swim ashore you know and then you have underwater
[00:55:34] painters that find you like all that kind of stuff so it was like at first like not what I had
[00:55:40] like signed up to do like meanwhile I'm like watching the news you know it's like like let's go like
[00:55:46] break and I'm like underwater like like hand signal so I wouldn't change it for anything in the
[00:55:54] world because of the team I got to be a part of what we got to do and the knowledge that I gained
[00:56:01] of that mobility platform it was something that I think like within the teams is so like niche
[00:56:08] and most people think you know because the STV guys always get like bad rap you know like
[00:56:12] golf freaking like a STV guys like but I got out of that and then I got to augment damn neck
[00:56:18] so seven days later after that deployment so yeah that it's at the the attitude of like oh
[00:56:27] STV guys like I I don't know at some point and I was pretty young when I was like yeah you know
[00:56:34] what that those guys freaking get my respect and because it's it I don't know I I mean I
[00:56:40] talked to some on my friend one of my friends particular was like who came from STV and was that
[00:56:45] whatever team we were at and I remember he's a good dude all solid dude and a like team a reliable
[00:56:53] team guy that you would want to go with you on top and one time when you're talking he was like
[00:56:58] hey man we were doing like some exercise off of Korea and you know it's winter time and he was like
[00:57:06] he's telling me he's all like he's all like in the like he starts filling up with water he's like
[00:57:11] I don't want to do the city board yeah but he's like I don't want to do this I don't want to
[00:57:16] this about whatever this is not what I don't do I don't do this anymore like literally
[00:57:19] having deal our thoughts like you wanted to quit after he's been in team for 10 years bro people
[00:57:24] bolt we've had team guys I'm gonna call him out but like there was team guys that would
[00:57:27] freak panic I mean you can get we had a we had a chief uh in my second putin who drowned and died
[00:57:36] I mean got tangled up in the lines and I bought him up you know because they would bought him
[00:57:40] up underneath stuff and it was uh it's sketchy there's lines everywhere there's stuff going
[00:57:46] everything's by merit you have all this gear all this equipment all this stuff like it is you
[00:57:50] have to maintain like a totally cool mind and then when you get into like dried out sheltering
[00:57:58] in the real world and all those kind of things like things can go sideways quick
[00:58:02] so there's no mistakes matter fact I remember we were training for that for that mission how
[00:58:07] was that 80 feet on a river my buddy my my best friend actually like we're down in the bottom
[00:58:13] I remember I had like a leak in my mask and I was like looking at I was like pointing you know
[00:58:17] doing the same like there's a problem he's like typically like you're good and I remember I was like
[00:58:23] and the whole piece goes like and I was like and he looked at me he's like there is no
[00:58:29] buddy breathing you're in like a full face mask he's like you know just remember he was like
[00:58:33] a watch you don't he just he just looks at me like you're dead like and I remember I just was like
[00:58:37] it's just blown go hey blown go from me to feet yeah it was wild these like I'll never forget
[00:58:46] your face it was hilarious that was like it was all areas you could like it never make that he's
[00:58:50] again and listen about to die we did we used to do more solops in the regular teams yeah and so
[00:58:59] you know like I did a few trips of doing lockouts and stuff and even that you know you're in this
[00:59:03] little freaking chamber and it's filling up with water and it's freezing cold and you got it
[00:59:08] you would we have we'd have like weapons bags and engine bags and all this stuff in there
[00:59:12] and it's all claustrophobic and I'm I'm I'm very comfortable in the water but like guys did not like
[00:59:18] even that and that's one you know 100th of what it's actually like because when we do that we be like
[00:59:24] cool hey we're gonna do we're gonna use sawbops for a week or whatever two weeks you guys is just like
[00:59:31] oh what are we doing for the rest of our lives sub-ops it's like you got to go through something right
[00:59:39] you know you're learning and it's got through something that's just your life and you know
[00:59:42] we we just did a 12 hour dive today cool what are we doing tomorrow that's 12 hour dive
[00:59:47] no man it never it's like you you had to I mean you you got to learn to relax like you can't
[00:59:55] freak out in those situations at all no no like you know we used to always say like those who
[01:00:02] panic first die if you panic you'll die I mean that the what happened to you know that chief
[01:00:09] that guy was he got tangled up in some lines and you know then his mask got pulled off and there was
[01:00:15] no getting it there's no getting out like there's no your it's pitch black you know and the
[01:00:19] worst is you know the bioluminous and it's like all that kind of you're like completely blinded
[01:00:23] you know and then working all the way up to a national testing with those guys and doing a
[01:00:28] lot of stuff my fact we had to we were like getting to the point we didn't know we were going
[01:00:34] we didn't know any of the information still you know still classified to this day probably always
[01:00:40] will be and you're just getting sick of the same people you know the same probs same personality
[01:00:45] the same dirty coffee cup the same dude the same you know it's the same and we were traveling
[01:00:50] all around the country in different environments like you know preparing for anything
[01:00:55] and I remember finally our chief at the time was like he called a smokers and he got
[01:01:01] big trouble because he's like okay this is it we got to settle these beef before really even
[01:01:05] of what you like well at first I didn't really have problems with anybody I was gonna just like
[01:01:12] whatever and so you want a new guy when this was going on yeah it's your first first
[01:01:18] that's freaking savage you guys and so I was like you know I'm super moto guy like I was just like
[01:01:24] so fired up and did you know what you were getting into into when you got assigned STVs?
[01:01:30] no well I had read the old books about the dudes like in the tortito like to get in
[01:01:34] covering grease and like squirting out of like a sewage pipe or whatever old school you know
[01:01:40] but that's that's really all I knew about I had no idea and yeah so like he had calls a smokers and
[01:01:47] we're getting ready to leave and he's like hey we're gonna put the board up here officers and
[01:01:51] listen doesn't matter everybody right name on the board one five minute round so by the way yeah that's
[01:01:56] just so if you don't know echo you want smokers is yes sir okay smokers is hey we're gonna it's
[01:02:01] usually boxing is it we're just gonna it's boxing yeah and they do it on ships too they do it
[01:02:06] well at least they used to you step smokers on ships and smokers on navy bases we're just
[01:02:11] gonna go and box other people yeah that's what I'm like no there was like tough back in the
[01:02:15] day but it was a great let me tell you something it leveled the scores between a lot of people
[01:02:19] and I didn't it's so everybody like got up and the other right your name on the board with the guy
[01:02:23] that you wanted to fight and of course like some guys jumped up right away and like wrote the
[01:02:28] guys named down it and I just kind of sat back I'm like and then the student gets up and he's one of
[01:02:33] the divers and he writes my name on the board I was like I didn't know yeah like a problem so I was like
[01:02:40] so we go he didn't know you freaking box and jet jet in your little well I've wore all my shit so
[01:02:46] we like so everybody starts coming to me and they're like hey like help me out they're all nervous
[01:02:50] now so I'm working with some guys a week goes by it's like a Friday night or something we show up there
[01:02:56] and and I wore like my old boxing trunks I had like no custom gloves I got all my stuff no
[01:03:02] had gear I didn't want anything out of my gold teeth like about a piece and I put it out of my
[01:03:06] coat and so when I was in the medic course I actually was Sparim Partner for Ray Mercer
[01:03:13] yeah that kind of ended my hopes of like thinking that I was gonna be like great some
[01:03:18] I don't you know you know I mean I like we just kind of think like but I like the back track a little bit
[01:03:26] I started boxing again while I was going through the medic course and for Bradford year and
[01:03:30] I ended up fighting in the North Carolina State Prison so boxing like guys like Bernard Hopkins and
[01:03:36] then they come up out of the prison programs and so I went in there and went through all the
[01:03:41] security stuff whatever and I fight like a you know various rounds kind of like a
[01:03:45] tournament style and I ended up winning to like the top guy well we was a draw with the top guy and he was like
[01:03:52] the scariest I'm telling you he was like the biggest scariest dude he was doing like 17 in the
[01:03:58] life and Ray Mercer was there and so his coach saw me boxing or whatever and was like hey
[01:04:04] Ray's like getting back in the game what he did and ended up fighting like Tim Silvia
[01:04:08] oh that's right crushed his face and Ray Mercer people remember like that guy was an animal
[01:04:14] beast he was so unfortunate lost a Kimbo slice
[01:04:18] Ray Mercer dude yeah in MMA yeah but the funny thing is they didn't box
[01:04:24] like somehow I think if I remember right Kimbo slice got him in a guillotine and Ray and Ray was like
[01:04:31] I don't know what this is but I thought we were gonna fight yeah yeah like that we're gonna fight so
[01:04:38] yeah so like I started I was so did you go like a camp with them or you just follow me so I started
[01:04:42] boxing with him on the weekends like smart partner getting them in shape and so you know I grew up
[01:04:48] watching Ray Mercer you know he devastated town in Morris and he lost the landing slow as he was a brutal
[01:04:52] dude he never been knocked down he had a head like a you know like a giant block of cheese and
[01:04:59] he was merciless I mean if you watch that knockout against Tim Morrison who was like my hero at the
[01:05:04] time before he got AIDS and but like I mean when he beat him down I remember he said he's like you
[01:05:12] can kill somebody in boxing he that's like all he said it was like very like that like
[01:05:16] does he okay or anything and when he lost the landing slow switch was controversial actually um
[01:05:22] I kind of ended his career had some more fights like along the way but um when he hit Tim Silvia he
[01:05:27] he came just whole head in I mean he if you watch that clip on YouTube I mean it's brutal so
[01:05:33] I'm in there boxing with him I have a couple great shots of me and him boxing together and he hit me so hard one time
[01:05:39] that for the first time I'm like I had like kneeled down the ground I wasn't really sure like
[01:05:42] I'm on like roller skates like I and I I remember I was like hurt for like week and I'm starting
[01:05:48] thinking to my head like man this is how like people are hitting like this level I don't
[01:05:54] I think I'll die like because I don't have a huge neck I don't know I just got like more of like a
[01:06:00] noodle neck like no matter how hard I wear it I need to iron neck or whatever but um yeah so I
[01:06:07] so I I boxed with him and then I just just stayed in shape you know whenever we didn't once I left
[01:06:11] there I had three amateur fights and then boxed with Ray then whatever went in the teams and so
[01:06:16] we show up at the smokers and so I got all my trunks I got all my stuff I got my shoes on my little
[01:06:21] tassels and everything and I got the whole thing in there and he's looking at me over there with his
[01:06:27] like you know I don't know off-brand boxing gloves or whatever and he just comes over he's like
[01:06:33] hey man that's just I don't I don't I don't know why I signed up for the I don't really have a problem
[01:06:40] with you or anything like that it's just are we good like you're dead and we got in there and
[01:06:46] I let him like punch me around for like 30 seconds I hit him one time knocked him out
[01:06:51] cold and so the shout out of my chief because like he had a big trouble because some guys got hurt
[01:06:57] and they couldn't die because they're because you know there knows his and he was like dude dude
[01:07:01] he's got beat up so yeah so it was it was a good experience you know I uh really really fortunate
[01:07:08] that I went there you know it was it was a unique experience and then I then seven days later
[01:07:12] well while underway I got told those getting getting all of that and two tf 373 so
[01:07:18] and where did you go for that? I went damn neck and I did like a train up with them and then
[01:07:25] went deaf gain of sin to an outstations and that was at the point that one was rough that one
[01:07:31] we lost Josh Harris so I was with him when he died I was right next to him and then Jason
[01:07:39] Free Walden and John Markham so that was a tough one and so you know that was my first experience
[01:07:47] in real war you know I mean what I had just come off though like the implications were so high like
[01:07:52] the intensity that if anything went wrong like literally no one's coming to get you like you know
[01:08:00] it's uh not gonna be good so but it was completely different you know uh then being shot at
[01:08:06] in the desert so um yeah was uh that was a really good experience and then it kind of just like you
[01:08:13] know up to my aspirations it got to work with some incredible people and uh do a lot of really
[01:08:18] cool missions and kind of do the stuff that I had been hoping to do from when I was sitting there
[01:08:22] at 9-11 and had an you know an envision of what I was gonna do you know what were you guys doing
[01:08:27] like pretty much just DAs yeah what's that what you're doing do a DAs uh a lot of like SRs and stuff
[01:08:34] like that a lot of overwatches for the army you know in various areas where I had a lot of remote
[01:08:38] outstations and then we were with the um the people that I later went on a work for uh we were kind of
[01:08:45] the military component for them so and so the off-temp was high. off-temp was high was 2008 so
[01:08:51] and you're just living the dream. living the dream like I mean ride in dirt bikes like I was just like
[01:08:56] living the dream uh and then uh when Josh died you know that was my first experience with losing
[01:09:02] somebody and then it just was like really real to me you know it just everything changed after that
[01:09:10] for me um and that that mission was you know he drowned uh so that was uh the way that whole thing
[01:09:19] went down how that that was tough that was that was a tough one and then the guys that were with us
[01:09:23] you know uh chasing got killed on entry uh he got shot in the stomach and then John Mark and
[01:09:30] we got shot in the neck on that so that was a huge loss in 2008 you know for the teams so
[01:09:36] so when you when you say you say like things changed or you changed or it changed what was what was
[01:09:44] like the change was it hey all of a sudden oh we're not immortal what was the change that you were
[01:09:50] yeah I think that was it like I think I had this like I had this like immortality idea in my head
[01:09:57] or I could outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart outsmart out
[01:10:00] do anything and then uh the realism when someone's wrapped in a flag on a helicopter you know
[01:10:07] has a young guy I was just like the implications were so high I have a great picture at my house
[01:10:13] I don't have a lot of military stuff at my house I have stuff in my office but
[01:10:16] because I don't want to influence my son you know I try to you know I don't want him to feel that
[01:10:22] you know and um it's a picture that was taken by an OGA guy of me that he sent to me later on
[01:10:29] and I was standing out looking over the corn golf and uh I couldn't believe like where I had come
[01:10:37] from and that I'm like standing here with these people like these men you know like who
[01:10:43] are we're giants to me you know because like I said I became like a historian I read every book
[01:10:49] everything every there's probably not a book on the teams that I didn't read and this was before like
[01:10:54] a lot of books were coming out they're like old school books and I really believe like in the
[01:10:58] brotherhood like in the old school like do everything together kind of mentality uh
[01:11:05] matter if I could be herel he's like an old school team guy uh and he was like I never forget we're
[01:11:12] like sent drinking beer one down as a new guy and he's like he's like you and you know
[01:11:16] the other guys like you guys are like the spirit of like the old teams like the old teams like
[01:11:21] just and I I mean I was I like lived it I loved it and um so you know going to actual war
[01:11:30] though it's very humbling you know and it kind of puts you like in a place where you realize like
[01:11:35] this is like super dangerous because to be honest with you I didn't really think that way at the time you know
[01:11:44] real quick Kirby or else story because it's just awesome he's he was on the podcast and he's
[01:11:51] talking about the Phoenix program and he's like yeah he goes so he we'd we'd go up and I was talking
[01:12:00] to him because you know I have a little bit of perspective of like what doing missions or like so I was
[01:12:05] like so so how would you know what what like hot you're going into an village and he's like oh well
[01:12:12] I would I would have source tell you like H3 huts down on the right and he's like yep that's what
[01:12:16] happened I go that's cool and so there's one op there in a in a little sandpan him and one other guy
[01:12:24] and they go into this village and he and so he's telling the story and he goes yeah you know so I went in
[01:12:29] there and went into the third hut on the right or whatever it was knock the guy out I come out
[01:12:34] throw him in the boat and so I'm thinking I'm like that's cool and I go I go uh how did you knock
[01:12:39] him out he goes and he goes without misnabee I go I go how did you knock him out he goes ball peen hammer
[01:12:46] so like he's even as a webgyer he's got a ball peen hammer and it's freaking webgyer just
[01:12:51] whack it dude at the head and that's that's so bad that's so bad ass oh that was the man we're ironing
[01:12:59] the ships were wood how long was that deployment to Afghanistan that you uh I think we were so
[01:13:05] four months yeah months like working up in Rani and then when you still actually technically attached
[01:13:11] to SDV and there TAD yep yep that was our TAD so so when you got done with that deployment what happened
[01:13:18] I went into uh while I went into another bouton like basically I got home my girlfriend now wife
[01:13:27] we've been together for 15 years now um heard for TAD and she picked me up at the airport and
[01:13:35] I showed up to drop all my gear off I got my car this is coming home from deployment coming home
[01:13:39] from deployment I got picked up uh no fanfare obviously at the command like again to just get
[01:13:44] all your stuff and hung out with some of the guys for a couple of days and then headed out and
[01:13:49] I get back to the command and so I was with slab so after Josh and I got went to another base
[01:13:57] got to kind of know him and um which obviously was like wasn't icon you know looking up to
[01:14:02] whatever just like really great leader like real real quiet real steady like you know
[01:14:09] got to meet him and I was like I want to go screen and go to the command or whatever and so
[01:14:13] some guys like reached out about me you know putting my package in and all that kind of stuff and so
[01:14:18] it's like a Saturday or something I get to the I get my car get on my stuff tell my girlfriend
[01:14:23] then I'm gonna meet her and drop everything off and the master chiefs there and so he sees me in
[01:14:28] the locker and he's like come on up this is the S.D.V. Master Chief? Yeah yeah I didn't like and so
[01:14:37] I I'm down there like getting on my stuff just home from deployment like and to be honest with you like
[01:14:43] looking back like that whole like there's a lot that happened like that was like a lot because
[01:14:51] I just did back to back so I mean I was like hadn't been there in like a long time and all this
[01:14:56] stuff had gone down and here I am like checking in thinking I'm gonna like get some time off
[01:15:00] or whatever and he goes up in the office and he's okay I want to talk to you and want upstairs
[01:15:05] and he goes so you know you just got back and like yeah I just got back like right now you know
[01:15:10] and he's like so you think you're kind of like go over there and like screen is that what you think?
[01:15:16] I was like what like apparently some people had sent some emails and said hey we want him to come over
[01:15:21] above our and and I was like yeah he's like well you know they're not in charge of meening I am
[01:15:29] he says to me and I was like thinking about my headspace at the time you know I was like not in a good
[01:15:37] headspace and I was like I said something both of them inflammatory I think and he went like
[01:15:45] crazy and started like screaming I mean he came over the desk like got my face you know and he's like
[01:15:50] you'll go where I tell you to go and Donna Donna and I was like I don't fucking get out you know
[01:15:55] like I mean I had that kind of attitude and so we get in this huge thing I get the text message
[01:15:59] from the chief he tells me hey I'm gear ready on Sunday 96 hour SR I'm like okay so I like unpack my gear
[01:16:09] call my girlfriend to her I'm like packing out so I rolled right into another bulltune two days later
[01:16:16] and I was pretty bitter about that nobody like asked me how I was doing nobody was like hey I
[01:16:22] know like what's going on like or you know what I was your trip like next thing I know I'm like
[01:16:27] literally like dudes with orange vest walking around looking for me with like rubber shape like laying
[01:16:33] the bushes like I was so mad I can't describe how mad I was the only thing I could do was think
[01:16:41] about how mad I was I was being possible from a getting mad or like I would explode so I go through
[01:16:50] you know I go through that I hurt my hand and and and up rolling out of that bulltune right before
[01:16:56] the tasking I got a pretty severe arterial injury in my hand and so then I go to like he said
[01:17:04] go to trade at 86 and go to trade at this is like STV trade at or did you go to
[01:17:10] it was like standoff weapons that we had it was like no it was like STV trade at
[01:17:14] truth never forget what it's called something so you're still at STV yeah but you're in the training
[01:17:19] I'm in the training part of it's all like going to Seattle lot and you know working over in
[01:17:23] those regions or whatever and then then I got out because and then I tried to screen for
[01:17:30] while I went into the reserves immediately and then tried to screen for CAG and the reserve unit
[01:17:36] wouldn't let me go so then I try to go from the reserve unit I remember the mesh chief at the time
[01:17:41] and he wanted me to go sell res for two years and serve my time at the reserves before I can go
[01:17:46] because this isn't going to be a stepping stone everything I was trying to do is try to get the
[01:17:50] opportunity to go over there so then I ended up I want to say his name because he ended up
[01:17:56] getting a lot of trouble but I ended up meeting getting picked up and doing a job and I rack
[01:18:00] for during the I think it was a status of forces agreement that was going on at the time
[01:18:06] doing like PSD stuff so now you're a contractor so now I'm a contractor still still
[01:18:10] deserves but you're a contractor yeah and I was like picking up schools and stuff and going to
[01:18:14] schools or whatever and trying to like figure out I could like weasel my way like back into
[01:18:18] active duty that's all I wanted to do and I was just really got out of pure spite I was just
[01:18:25] so angry like and I looked back at like my state and I was like man like luckily I'm like a
[01:18:30] fairly I mean that sounded like it but I'm like a steady-headed person because I was like really like
[01:18:37] a roller coaster of emotions like I had I had just experienced all this stuff and in a nutshell
[01:18:41] and next thing you know I'm like felt like I was being shitted on you know so I am in Iraq and I'm
[01:18:49] like standing at the greed being and I see a guy who knows me and he starts talking he's like oh hey
[01:18:54] what are you doing I was like I told him when I was doing he's like give me your email I got another
[01:19:00] job for you and so I ended up going over to a contractor for the say I had and I did like almost
[01:19:08] four years over there and did you go what what did that you know from what you can say that's cool to
[01:19:15] say was that did you get some immediate training or they like hey you're good on your training
[01:19:20] what would you have to do? I was the only team guy that made it out of the training me and three
[01:19:25] other guys first of all I didn't really like I had an idea but he wouldn't tell me anything and I
[01:19:31] got how it went down was like I got a random email being like you know you've been like recommended
[01:19:36] for training can you be here on whatever the date was and I was in Iraq so I remember I went to
[01:19:43] this guy I was like a total toolbag he was like some like army guy or something and I was like oh hey
[01:19:47] I got to like get out of here I got like family health problem and he's like you can't leave here
[01:19:52] I was like I'll walk right out of this gate and I'll get on that airplane and I'm like you know
[01:19:56] own me I'll do it over at a woman so finally like they like they made me fly come air so I'm like
[01:20:02] like I do whatever I want because I was like I'm taking this job like I want this job and so
[01:20:09] I couldn't have got either made it's training so I ended up flying calm air out and I'm like
[01:20:15] rethinking everything I was a month ago like the bag that airport like there's no orange
[01:20:19] Julius is there and and I'm like one of these guys is not like the others so I fly back
[01:20:28] and two days later I'm in training and uh and I'm at a undisclosed facility and it's like
[01:20:36] go top like can you perform like show up here on the line nobody talk nobody's saying anything like
[01:20:43] nobody's like I'm in this like vending and it's like four or five weeks all over in various locations
[01:20:51] and uh I show up it was really funny because I'm checking in the hotel and one of the states and of course
[01:20:58] I'm in the lobby and I look around it's like typical contractors like you know huge like
[01:21:02] America flag had some beers like everyone's like low-prow up. Clearly like we're all here together you know
[01:21:11] everyone's going everyone brother like and like even the even the guy at the front does
[01:21:17] give a brother and and so we check into the we check we check in and and my roommate is a team guy
[01:21:25] bunny in mind and so as we're like in like he's like a good buddy of mine and I didn't even know
[01:21:32] he was there so we're there and he didn't make it but the so I get a text message from over
[01:21:40] sea is like watch the news tonight okay been loud and goes down and I'm in the hotel like no way you know and of
[01:21:48] course you know then you got all you got all the sea of experts on there and describing exactly how they did it like
[01:21:55] it was like it was like the uh there's like the captain Philips thing you know that had that dude
[01:21:59] like I forget it was like branded weather something that it was like a watermelon like swoop swinging
[01:22:04] slowly and he's like shooting it with a 50-kow like showing how like difficult it would have been
[01:22:08] to hit the watermelon but so I'm like glued to the news show up the next morning we got like selection
[01:22:14] starts and um you know PT tests all those kind of things and the quals were super hard shooting
[01:22:20] quals yeah they were very difficult like that's what got most people was the quals and then the
[01:22:27] CQB um I mean it's and then they never like there's no coaching there's no like if you don't
[01:22:34] make past these tests at this time you're just you just go away like a van just pulls up and you
[01:22:39] just leave there's no like hey bro you think you'd do better next time like I mean I've
[01:22:44] what I mean where I was there a cat guy seen guys like everybody and so I get to the end there's only
[01:22:49] four of us left and now I'm kind of figuring I'm in a total state of paranoia too because
[01:22:55] every move I ever watched about the CIA is like playing in my head you know I like turned the
[01:23:00] sink out of me for like a cable to come out like look at me and write everything like everything
[01:23:04] everybody is like everybody's on it which is kind of funny because what I went through this
[01:23:08] surveillance course and I actually got busted by like a big fat lady in a KFC she like busted me
[01:23:16] so I was like you know there is those kind of people I was doing like some countering surveillance
[01:23:23] thing and I was I was in San Diego and I was all dressed up like a bum and and I'm like sitting there
[01:23:32] and I'm all freaking dirty and shitty and and I got busted and I got busted because I had my
[01:23:39] watch on and like you know this you know it's like whoever we were surveilling whatever it was surveilling
[01:23:46] the surveillance or whatever and like we got back to the briefing they're like hey you know
[01:23:51] Jaco freaking nice watch they're like you got rolled up because that you know everyone
[01:23:57] everyone was like look you look like a bum with this freaking uh Iron Man watch on this
[01:24:01] this is the healthiest bum ever yeah this was before everyone had like the big
[01:24:06] tactical watches that everybody has now yeah but back in the day I guess this was sort of like a big
[01:24:11] tactical watch for a second so yeah the old school that's funny so not so only a few you get through
[01:24:20] this mega through yeah and so some of the guys got the opportunity to try you know they were good
[01:24:23] dudes and they hadn't tried again but the quals were like I mean were you always a good shooter
[01:24:28] yeah I was always a good shooter I don't not that I grew up like you know you're hunting like
[01:24:34] like I always laugh because now I'm like big archery hunter and stuff and and actually a hunter
[01:24:39] but we're in high growth like hunting was like you know shooting out of the back of a truck and like
[01:24:43] you're like an accord field and like you know like that was hunting like you know like our hunting
[01:24:48] gear was like you know like one of these snow suit like you bought a wall crack yeah exactly and
[01:24:54] a six bag was like Bubba um but you must have good hand eye coordination from maybe from boxing
[01:25:00] in there just going there knock the shit out of a course like that that's a legit yeah the pistol
[01:25:05] I mean the pistol shooting was like they had this one called the run down uh so it was
[01:25:11] you lined up on the 100 all right and then you would sprint to the 200 drop down two shots prone
[01:25:17] and then you'd sprint it no no no this is rifle so I thought you were talking pistol I was like
[01:25:22] day off now this is no no it's like you're at French double over nine so um no but this was a
[01:25:32] tough one so it's full kit on and then you'd start you had to have six mags and with two
[01:25:35] rounds in each mag you'd start at the 100 sprint to the 200 drop down two shots prone then sprint
[01:25:41] to the 100 two shots kneeling then sprint to the 50 two shot standing then to the 25 two
[01:25:48] headshots then to the 7 two headshots mag change in between everyone you had two minutes and
[01:25:53] minimum score 24 and a epic um that got a lot of guys and then six seconds four shots from the
[01:26:01] concealed 25 yards on the pistol so that was and you can't miss real that's kind of
[01:26:07] it's good and then there's like you know again by time you get through all that then you got like
[01:26:11] CQB so I'm like and this is the interesting thing about this is no work up it's not like you went
[01:26:16] through you came off some shooting school or you like okay hey let's get you guys all dialed
[01:26:20] in here's your test this is like hey welcome here's your test yes and you're you're basically
[01:26:24] testing the whole time because it's like a vetting and uh I was really funny because we show up
[01:26:30] and we're at like the uh the Duane Deeter thing so I thought I was done with that because I went to
[01:26:36] that mosquito you know okay you hit me have the thing in her it's a time I know this is deadly like
[01:26:41] but you know how to get into the most level one everyone's a level three it depends who you know
[01:26:45] if you got somebody a me head they're gonna hit you with it so I'm thinking I'm done with that I show
[01:26:50] up there and I'm like oh no I karate chops to the head like so we go through all that stuff we
[01:26:57] had done there's another series of calls at the end you finish that off and then you get off
[01:27:02] and a job and get ready start to point and then every two years you have to redo it
[01:27:08] and if you fail you're done so there's like this looming pressure of like I have to redo all
[01:27:14] these things and then it gets more like I went through that and then it gets more like training
[01:27:20] there's like you still have to crawl but there's more training involved but that the initial one
[01:27:24] was just the vetting out and that was tough that was some of the toughest training that I
[01:27:28] went through so now you get to that job and you're starting to conduct operations obviously there's
[01:27:35] only so much we can say about the operations you know where you're conducting him and kind of what
[01:27:40] you're doing but broadly speaking what was your what was your tasking yeah so a tasking was to
[01:27:47] protect you know see I a person out you know around the world they conduct their missions
[01:27:53] so it's intense and you work all the time there is no more atory out and there is no standing down
[01:28:00] there is no you know you're employed and it's one season two z's and then there's also like the
[01:28:07] high-vis military side we're doing the paramilitary stuff depending on what basis you're at so
[01:28:12] as a team leader in a couple of bases where it's like full on I mean it's full on military
[01:28:16] like you're you know you got a whole you got a whole team of guys underneath you and yeah it's uh
[01:28:26] looking at it from that side and looking at it from the military side is just so different like
[01:28:30] it's unbelievable and so yeah was uh or team of guys that you're talking about are not Americans
[01:28:36] yeah not Americans yeah and and you know people can say what they want about those guys and I
[01:28:42] wouldn't say I trusted all of them but you really develop a relationship you know you you rely on
[01:28:47] these guys and you know watching Afghanistan fall and it was hard you know it was hard
[01:28:52] matter fact I met some of the guys recently that got out of the country last month they reached out
[01:28:58] to me and they're here somewhere living in the refugee camp basically and they were telling
[01:29:03] me about what happened to a bunch of our guys I mean helping us the walls shishkabab
[01:29:07] spears stuff through their hearts you know I mean like brutally killed so it was uh it was tough
[01:29:13] uh a good relationship with those guys so some of them are here in the states actually
[01:29:18] funny enough like what I'm like I don't know they don't we don't use our names but one of the
[01:29:24] guys somehow like found me and like reached out to like my secretary like I was like my name is like
[01:29:30] someone's so my homied like you know looking for Mike and they said it to me I'm like
[01:29:33] take everything off the internet like yeah that's bizarre it is bizarre and you know it was uh
[01:29:44] I sat down for a matter fact what happened was I was I won't say where I was but I was in a
[01:29:51] state for work a month ago my plane gets canceled so I'm like kind of wandering around like oh my god
[01:29:59] I got like forgetting another hotel I do all this up I walk into the parking garage and I hear
[01:30:03] somebody calling me by my call sign but of course like my spidey sense is like just per cup I
[01:30:09] don't know a lot of people that know that and I like turned and Logan it's two of my guys like
[01:30:14] where I was the team leader of that place for three deployments and uh and he's like you know I'm like
[01:30:23] like what's happening right now so I ended up like going back to their house with them
[01:30:28] and having dinner at this which is like it's a wicked refugee camp I just ran into them at the
[01:30:36] airport all right so I sit down and we go off I'll show you some pictures of me with them but uh yeah
[01:30:41] they started telling me like what happened to all these guys I mean dude it's like that guy is all
[01:30:47] these ever done since he was 20 years old was work for the Americans my family's been killed
[01:30:52] houses burned down people have been beheaded I mean they've been tortured I mean it's it's it's rough
[01:31:01] this the amount of people that worked with American Afghanistan is like a massive number it's a massive
[01:31:08] number to think like oh well there's only a small amount of people that are gonna bear the burden it's like
[01:31:12] there's a massive number of people that work with Americans well if you look at uh you know kind of
[01:31:17] in my work with my foundation um if you look at the number of people that have served in the war
[01:31:22] Americans right 2.7 million Americans served in the global war in terrorism 20 years all right so 7,000
[01:31:30] died in the war over 20 years 1500 are amputated so that's 0.002026 percent
[01:31:39] 0.0056 percent are those who have died right and then you look at the fallout though from the
[01:31:46] war so we just we look at those hard numbers right but we don't look at the cost of it and you look at
[01:31:52] only 4.5 percent of them are 10 you know American veterans tempting star businesses would be
[01:31:56] out to a pernors you know there's 50,000 non-profits in North America 2 and 6 veterans on you know
[01:32:02] psychiatric medications and between 2005 and the end of 2025 25,000 guys have killed themselves
[01:32:10] so people will say well you know some of those guys were other vats or whatever you know that
[01:32:16] didn't serve in there there were Vietnam vats or it doesn't matter like that's a huge number
[01:32:22] that's every 64 minutes and so we look at those numbers on the fallout on American culture
[01:32:29] and then you got to look at the fallout on the on the host nation culture and that that will be
[01:32:35] felt for generations like and then what we did like I don't mean we but like what our nation did like
[01:32:44] we're no longer like a force of righteousness and of good like we are we are colonialists that
[01:32:53] have just destroyed the foundation in fabric and our fact I was talking to Andy said like
[01:32:58] what is it 98 percent of all people have guessed I didn't know who someone been a lot of
[01:33:02] was and didn't know 9-11 and have it right so so we just think about our cost of war
[01:33:09] but then you got to look at the long term cost of what's the displacement within societies and
[01:33:16] it's going to come home to roost I mean I was listening to there was a general who supported us when
[01:33:20] I worked on the other side of the house he was a badass my effect I have a teacher with his face on it
[01:33:27] I worked out with it all the time he was that he was a real he was committed to the cause and he was
[01:33:33] he was just just a band in them and they they tore these guys told me they just tortured them
[01:33:40] viciously and this is a guy that for for 15 years 15 years dedicated his whole life to our nation
[01:33:48] and they you know they told me what they did what they did to him and I was just like
[01:33:52] oh man it's not like there's a cost there's a huge cost you know I think the cost is felt on
[01:34:02] our our soldiers here you know I think that the enemy that we're fighting is not it's not like
[01:34:11] it's not like you know they're not like Chinese or like Russians you know these guys didn't have
[01:34:16] drones they didn't have bombers they don't have any that kind of stuff you know they they had
[01:34:23] you know weapons that were you know that they took from the Russians the 70s and run around
[01:34:28] a flip-flops and like pajamas and and the ones that fought alongside of us believed in us that we
[01:34:35] they took us at our word that we would you know that we would honor our commitment to them as a
[01:34:43] people and as a nation and think about the girls and going to school and the children and
[01:34:49] my heart breaks for it there's nothing I can do I'm a pawn I'm a minion like it in the scope of
[01:34:54] things but but I you know I think that the karma is gonna come home it's gonna hunt this nation
[01:35:03] you know I think you look I look at my little children I got you know my fifth kid about to be born
[01:35:08] and I think about what is 50 years look like right 50 years it's gonna come home it's gonna come home
[01:35:19] to us and you could see the hurt and you know what these guys I'm sitting there you didn't
[01:35:22] with them I'm eating the footbred I'm sitting in there of course I'm waiting for someone to come
[01:35:26] out and stab like a ventan in the side of my head like I cannot believe I'm in this situation but
[01:35:31] I share these pictures of like I'm like I can't first of all they're in like I'm Jack poverty
[01:35:37] all right they're like in these refugee camps where it's like no wheels on the vehicles shit everywhere
[01:35:44] and like here here you go thanks for helping us out and you know I just uh
[01:35:52] you know I have a heart for people that's my life my life is people and I see that hurt whether
[01:35:56] they're you know afghani or american or whatever um I see the hurt because it adds the global
[01:36:02] collective you know and you can everybody can feel it they can feel the whole world changing right now
[01:36:09] and you know I think that hammer is gonna come home I think it's gonna hit us right the face
[01:36:18] that's so how long did you continue to work um doing that job with OGA
[01:36:26] yeah so I yeah I did it for almost four years and uh and what was the uptemp
[01:36:35] a half when you'd going on a pump out off of your home it was I was every 60 days to 90 days depending
[01:36:42] on where I was and what I was doing sometimes I could extend it or whatever um and that's about
[01:36:48] all you could take of that job before you just got completely burned out so it's uh 60 90 day deployment
[01:36:56] 30 days home and then 30 days home mm-hmm is it yeah like when you come home how long to take
[01:37:04] you to reset and freaking enjoy your life before you're like well I gotta go back again and
[01:37:09] four days or whatever you don't you don't I never get out of that zone I would come home uh and be
[01:37:18] I was so intense you know I was I wasn't an intense person and I didn't have I wasn't on the face
[01:37:24] but I didn't I didn't live that my whole life was isolated I had like the same friends like the same
[01:37:31] people you know the same job I I didn't like I wasn't out there my I would come home and I would be
[01:37:38] very distracted like I because I always knew that I had to like leave again and then in um in
[01:37:44] 2014 I was in a really significant ordeal um I would say it was like up there in my top two or three
[01:37:54] events I had in my you know military-parameter career was uh actually I would say it's probably the
[01:38:00] top like it was the most insane gunfire and combat and carnage that I ever been involved and
[01:38:08] um you know that's when I kind of was like enough was enough from I had enough at that point you know so
[01:38:17] that's kind of when my whole world fell apart really because I didn't have that anchor anymore
[01:38:24] and that that had become my identity like when that identity went away you know I was kind of left
[01:38:30] spiral with all these experiences and skills and things and now I had no mission no purpose like
[01:38:37] uh well what was different about that event that I mean you'd had your buddies been killed before
[01:38:45] you'd done missions where there's a ton of pressure you've been in gun fights like what what why
[01:38:51] was that particular event the straw that broke the camels back because there's no community
[01:38:57] uh you know you're a gun for a higher and there's no community it's not like I come home and
[01:39:02] I'm like with the team and with all my buddies I'm in my platoon I got the people I got the things I got
[01:39:08] this culture I show up and I'm with different people from different units I got two guys here
[01:39:14] and a green beret here and a you know a CCD guy here I you know and you become friends and you yeah
[01:39:20] there was a brotherhood but then I mean I've never seen I mean I've worked with them again I
[01:39:24] may be over here you know so that so when you go home it's kind of just like oh you're just like
[01:39:28] you just get on the airplane I mean when I came home I flew through DC I still had like you know
[01:39:36] pieces of concrete like you know I was still banged up like and I just like arrive home at the airport
[01:39:43] like and then that's just it there's nobody calls this is like you okay like what's going on like
[01:39:49] how's the family like nothing you're just I'm living in a rural area by myself with my wife and
[01:39:56] kids and I'm you know there's I you feel like you have nobody your wife have any idea what's going on
[01:40:01] not I mean yeah I mean I didn't like tell her stuff but she could just tell my
[01:40:07] fact when I left and I and I resigned I um there and there was a lot of reasons for that but
[01:40:16] I remember my my daughter my middle daughter said to me mom always sits in the car and cries
[01:40:21] every day and by herself and I was like and I was like about what you know like so like I went
[01:40:29] over there and I remember I was like where are you crying in the car like what's going on and she's like
[01:40:32] you're just you're so intense like and I didn't say anything I mean I wasn't like chatting it up
[01:40:40] but I just rated it in form of intensity like at any minute I'm ready to go and yeah I mean if it wasn't
[01:40:47] for horses and what I'm doing right now I'm probably I don't know I look at the state of veterans
[01:40:53] today and I don't think that people understand it's a severity of what's happening to our culture
[01:41:01] it's especially like kind of where we come from you know and my my career is a just a fraction of
[01:41:08] you living a lifetime in that you know and but it has a huge impact on you long term and we
[01:41:17] forget about those people and like I was kind of rattling off some of those statistics like I mean
[01:41:24] if you look at having 50,000 nonprofits in North America for vets 50,000 between 2012 and the end of 2020
[01:41:34] we spent 92 billion dollars all right the top five non-profits for veterans have billions of dollars all right
[01:41:41] there's organizations in those top five that you know spend $29,000,000 dollars last year on postage stamps
[01:41:49] all right 18 million dollars on TV ads all right the the addiction rate of what I see of guys coming
[01:41:55] and applying to my program a couple hundred a year I can only look at those hard numbers right
[01:42:01] but 75% of those guys are on at least two my maximum guy had come to heroes and horses had
[01:42:07] was on 13 medications last year yet a guy come on 11 medications come off all in lose 37 pounds
[01:42:14] in 41 days in the program right nobody cares about nobody looks at any of those kind of things
[01:42:20] the joblessness the suicide and then there's a conversation about living and being alive
[01:42:26] we say oh this is a success story because you didn't kill himself and I and I looked at guys
[01:42:29] and I told me you're you're your your dead you're ready dead you haven't pulled the trigger but
[01:42:35] you're dead you're not living any form of life and you know if it wasn't if I didn't happen to fall into
[01:42:45] I guess you could say or or be directed I guess Sarah dip itously or you know
[01:42:52] I don't I don't know I don't know because I was a
[01:42:55] I was just I was so wrapped up in anger you know and I felt alone in the world because it's not like
[01:43:06] you don't have anybody around you you're just you're just done you know and you realize like
[01:43:13] you're just you're just a number you are literally if the tool breaks they throw the tool away
[01:43:18] you never hear these stories I could tell you stories about guys that have been shot and
[01:43:23] busted they're you know like a crippled and they can't even pay their bills they're living in a
[01:43:27] one room shack and you know trying to get medical payments like contractors like it's
[01:43:33] um and tie that into their military career it just becomes this cost at cocktail and uh that's why
[01:43:39] I've dedicated my life to this because I think that there's something special whether no matter
[01:43:43] what you did in the military that you went and signed up knowing that you could die in the time of war
[01:43:48] and because you believed in something and I think people don't think that means fighting for the
[01:43:52] government but I think it means fighting for your country and fighting for what is good
[01:43:58] and somewhere when that gets lost and gets twisted I think a whole person loses their
[01:44:04] anchor point and they spiral out of control and yeah I mean I
[01:44:12] yeah so that's why today the program that I run is it's so intensive and
[01:44:16] when you got out when you when you left that contracting job did you have a plan?
[01:44:24] No well yeah kind of I guess I left because I remember I was I got home and Christmas Eve
[01:44:30] and I was like putting together all this like my wife picks me up from the airport and I remember
[01:44:35] I'm driving she's driving. Who you're living on the east coast of this country? No I'm living
[01:44:38] Montana and snowing out and she's driving and she just starts like hysterically cry and like
[01:44:44] you know what's your problem and she's like are you okay and I'm like yeah I'm fine and she's like
[01:44:51] I just like I can feel your energy coming off you're like a furnace right now I was like I'm fine
[01:44:57] like and she's like okay like well we got to like you know put the Christmas stuff together
[01:45:02] I got extended so I've been on like a long trip so Christmas Eve I go back and I remember I'm like
[01:45:08] it was the frozen the frozen thing. So you want to talk about Frankenstein?
[01:45:14] I've been like I had the frozen car like I'm trying to put the wheels on like and I remember I was
[01:45:19] shaking so bad and I was like I was just sewing my head because you know after that we
[01:45:24] you know some things happened we got to the suicide bomb went off and all these things that happened
[01:45:28] and I remember like I just I couldn't down regulate I mean I just couldn't down regulate
[01:45:35] even just driving in the car I felt like I was there like everything was happening around me
[01:45:40] you know when you said that 30 days coming home for 30 days I can remember coming home off of
[01:45:46] deployments and it takes like a 30 day period to where you're like okay like my first deployment
[01:45:53] to Iraq we were there was this big paranoia about getting you know IE deed when you went
[01:45:58] under bridges or ambush when you went under bridges and so you know you'd always kind of like
[01:46:03] take a little breath before you'd go under a bridge in a in a convoy and I remember when I
[01:46:09] came home you know I'm like I'm not trying to say I was freaking out or anything but
[01:46:15] when I would be driving my car from work back home and go under a bridge it'd be like
[01:46:21] you'd have that just like oh yeah I remember that just this little something in your mind right
[01:46:24] and it would take like a month for me to go away so I'm thinking you're coming home for 30 days
[01:46:29] that's not enough time to get any sort of like to what you say down grade or whatever
[01:46:35] down regular down regular there's no time 30 days is not enough to down regulate period and when
[01:46:42] you're all you're doing is coming home and you know you're going on another deployment in
[01:46:46] that 30 days you might as well I kind of feel like you might as well might even come home
[01:46:50] because it's just what is what good is it gonna do that's freaking crazy it is and it's it's
[01:46:56] it's crazy that the amount of work that's carried out by contractors around the world I don't
[01:47:00] think people understand the scope of it especially when it pertains to like you know the DIA then
[01:47:05] say the CIA like you know these institutions that use contractors yeah it's a it's a tough
[01:47:13] transition for sure and I happen to you know for me like going back to work you know I started
[01:47:19] working on a ranch I met some guys and so I would kind of like immerse myself in that and
[01:47:25] so Christmas Eve yeah so I kind of cut off your story so this is this is you just had this
[01:47:31] sort of what you called the biggest incident in your career yeah I would say one of the top three
[01:47:36] for sure like now you get into the freaking aluminum tube and you've wake up and you're in freaking
[01:47:43] Montana again I'm in Montana and I'm like and I remember I was trying to put I couldn't
[01:47:50] focus to like even put the wheels on the thing I was just so and I remember like I stayed up all night
[01:47:57] you know I got in late I got in basically Christmas morning and like the kids got out of
[01:48:00] of course you know they're like you know American consumerism like I'm not even looking at the
[01:48:06] thing ripping stuff stuff like everywhere and I'm like you know the waste like it's all
[01:48:12] it's gonna eat that so we're like you know and I remember I'm like trying to cook breakfast that morning and
[01:48:18] I've been up now for I don't know probably 48 hours or something and and I remember cooking
[01:48:24] breakfast and looking at the window and I was like my wife came and we were kind of put her arm on me
[01:48:28] and I'm trying to like be happy and everything but I just looked at her I was like I'm just like
[01:48:34] I need some more time home you know so I emails and say hey I kind of need some time home
[01:48:40] and obviously like this huge thing happened and it was huge and like you know the highest levels
[01:48:46] were involved and came overseas like so like it's not like you know they didn't know or anything
[01:48:53] and and they're like well we like need you to go back like you know take this team bubble
[01:48:58] bond and if you don't come back we're in a doctor pet and that's when I was like back to like my
[01:49:06] massager chief story you know I was like like and and I was just I was just done I really wasn't
[01:49:13] sure I had I had started you know I'd started my foundation and and so then I did a film called
[01:49:21] one EDM you had already started your foundation yeah I had filed the paper work and I hadn't
[01:49:25] run anything or done anything yet and so I did you have a vision for what the foundation actually was
[01:49:30] yeah and that's evolved significantly to what it is today but yeah so then I ended up in 2015
[01:49:40] running my first season which was like come out for two weeks go home come out for two weeks go home
[01:49:45] and so I did a film with the EDM called 180 out and I had met a guy strange I had my wife had this
[01:49:53] like mommy's workout thing I watched a video is a big hunter uh Mark C. cap and uh he was like sick
[01:49:59] because main guy yet he's main guy big artery wrote it he made a video called searching for west
[01:50:05] and it's about him being this prolific archer and how his son's born and he's kind of like
[01:50:12] thinking about why he he should be there with him and you know so I watched this video over
[01:50:16] season a bunch of guys and then he's like oh this guy lives in both minutes so I send the video
[01:50:20] in my wife she launches this like mommy's workout thing and his wife comes and strangely enough like
[01:50:29] so I was like this is the guy from the video like this is the hunting guy and so we ended up like meeting
[01:50:35] and he goes hey I want to do a video on you uh yety video and he was making all the yety videos at the
[01:50:40] time like a bunch of him and so initially it was about me like being an archery elk hunter or whatever
[01:50:47] and uh and then he got to know me and he's like I want to like do it on your standing up this
[01:50:51] foundation on your first season and that first season was I don't know how that year didn't kill me
[01:50:58] honestly uh I mean it was one of the it was probably the hardest year I've had my entire life
[01:51:05] I got to you know I bought my house basically broke no paycheck I started trimming trees for a guy
[01:51:10] I'm like working on the side like you know my relationship was like touching go I was you know
[01:51:16] started chewing horses I'm trying to bring these vets out I'm self-funding everything
[01:51:21] I have basically down to you know a few thousand dollars in the bank account and uh I ended up meeting
[01:51:29] a gentleman that over over a beer totally randomly for a friend of mine that gave me 25,000 dollar check
[01:51:36] and before it gives me the check and I was 24,500 in debt with a nonprofit and I never met
[01:51:42] this guy before I'm a way to Wyoming the super national geographic and I got a huge fight I'm charging
[01:51:47] up my credit cards non-profit just supposed to raise money the people donate and you use that money to do good
[01:51:53] I didn't really know anything about that so I started it on profit and started putting my own money into
[01:51:58] the nonprofit and going broke I missed that page so I'll never forget this guy comes I got horses on
[01:52:05] trailer I'm heading in the Wyoming it's shoot for national geographic pack and some guys
[01:52:10] buddy calls me up oh stop and get a beer with this guy I'm like I can I'm just like a lot of
[01:52:14] problems right now and I couldn't pay for the vets to come back so I don't these vets feel as to come back
[01:52:19] and the last words I have in my wife was like I'm doing this and I'm charging up the cards and
[01:52:23] I'm gonna finish when I start out and I don't care what it costs I'll care if we sink the whole family
[01:52:27] I'm doing this I'm finishing this so on my way to Wyoming my buddy's like hey dude it's marine
[01:52:33] he's like let's get a beer with this guy and I and I refuse refuse he keeps persistently calling
[01:52:38] me so finally I stopped I could have one beer with the guy I said there I kind of talked for like
[01:52:42] I don't know 45 minutes I was like I got a gig cone he's like can I talk to you outside so
[01:52:47] I go outside he looks at me he goes he wanted to pet the one of the horses he's allergic so he puts
[01:52:52] a glove on he's out there petting it both he got it looks him he goes you're the worst nonprofit guy
[01:52:58] I've ever met my life and I've been working with charities for 40 years and I was like of course
[01:53:04] my ego's like you know far how like you know Darium but he was right I was I didn't know what I
[01:53:10] I didn't know anything and he hands me a check and he goes I want you to call me I like what you're trying to
[01:53:17] do so it gives me a check I drive down the road look at it's for 25 grand and that's what I knew I was doing the
[01:53:23] right thing and so you know I think like initially looking back I think really I was like trying to
[01:53:30] find a way to help myself you know and because I I felt so lost you know I just I felt lost I had no
[01:53:39] purpose I had no mission you know and working with horses and she went horses and just that world
[01:53:46] just took me out of where the focus was all of myself and my focus became on managing these animals
[01:53:55] and learning about them and learning and learning about myself through the animal I didn't really
[01:54:00] know that then because my my the guys that I was with were a force fear and repetition you know
[01:54:07] they were old school cowboys put me on horse has given bucked off kicked and all those things
[01:54:11] and whiskey trache and that was perfect for me at the time but you know through that relationship over
[01:54:18] the years horses became a mirror reflection to who I was you know because they're a pre-animal
[01:54:25] and they're designed to stay away from things with eyes in front of their head you know they're
[01:54:29] instinctually highly intelligent so we really very stupid of course this is not manimal and but
[01:54:37] instinctually they're highly evolved and so you know I brought these guys out I finished out the
[01:54:42] season with them I start the next season I start getting some fundraising behind me I have the first
[01:54:48] class I guy leaves the two weeks goes home to Odies and dies army officer and dies in his house Odies
[01:54:56] he was a lieutenant and so then I extended the program to realize I still have this letter I wrote
[01:55:05] the class and so I extended and today the program is now 41 days long I'll kind of skip ahead to that but
[01:55:13] what I realized is that it's actually struggle that gives everything in life value and so
[01:55:19] everything designed for veterans is designed to take the struggle away like people that wanted
[01:55:22] to help me wanted to take the struggle away when it was the re-engaging in the struggle that helped
[01:55:27] me re-establish a foundation and who I am as a person or who I was and I really just became an
[01:55:34] identity I had lost a baseline to that connection with myself and you know so many time the job
[01:55:42] is what you do but a purpose is how you live your life and so when that job went away I didn't
[01:55:46] have that purpose because I never really learned that you know that deeper connection to
[01:55:55] something that is you know I think that that's what makes us human I think that we live in
[01:56:01] sort of our minds and we live a series of ideas and we we level up through all these things and we
[01:56:06] get some stuff and we get some therings and we get to some places we achieve some heights but at the
[01:56:12] end of the day when it's all said and done the real question is like what is it all for what is
[01:56:19] meaning in life and I think when those identities fade and people stop waving the flag and
[01:56:26] nobody really cares that you're in the air force for 20 years and it's you know nobody cares
[01:56:31] that you were overseas like you kind of life kind of goes on everything spiral side of control and
[01:56:36] your the problem is always you and I think that you know now today looking at what happens over
[01:56:43] 41 days it's really one long continuum conversation with yourself who am I as a person because
[01:56:49] you know the average person I was reading yesterday spends between 15 and 23 years in front of the
[01:56:55] TV okay all right I started like I started like I started I was I was verifying it this morning
[01:57:04] because I was like that is the craziest thing ever because the average person lives well let's say
[01:57:09] 80 80 years that's 30,000 days right so if you spend between 15 on the low end or 23 years
[01:57:18] watching television right then you're not working for 24 hours right you have eight hours of sleep
[01:57:24] every day and then you know ages one to five what are you doing you should off the floor you're
[01:57:28] putting your pans you don't know anything you came talk right here it's like wandering around
[01:57:31] people stuffing you in seats and putting your clothes on you right and then they do the same thing
[01:57:36] to you when you're old right so you got to knock off a few years at the end where they're
[01:57:39] putting weird things in you and putting diapers on you and you're kind of revert back right so how
[01:57:44] much time do you really have well I was just crunching some rough math so between 37 and 38 years
[01:57:54] roughly because you spend you know what is it 419 hours on the toilet you know you spend you know
[01:58:02] a year and a half showering you know there's all these other things so that you look at
[01:58:08] I mean the question is like what is this all about you know and and what I really is is that
[01:58:15] success and failures are one and the same you can have a success and that success can be the worst
[01:58:21] thing that ever happened to you and you can have a failure and that can be the worst thing that ever
[01:58:25] happened to you because the byproducts are the same they inhibit growth and they stop evolution
[01:58:31] because you have an experience then you perpetuate that identity associated with that experience
[01:58:37] and then you live and create your future so human beings are constantly the victim of their own
[01:58:44] choices and everything is society is saying no it's not your choices it's everything else around you
[01:58:50] and so you know over 41 days I always say like I don't have any ideas for you I'm not advertising
[01:58:58] come to me and I'm gonna tell you what to do I say come here and I'll put you in a place what you're
[01:59:04] gonna learn what that is and I'm not gonna judge you for whatever the outcome is because that's
[01:59:09] your life to live that's your 37 years that you have get off the TV but the state of the
[01:59:16] American veteran is absolutely in dismal condition I didn't know a lot about non-profits when
[01:59:25] I started it matter fact I didn't know anything and along the way I've met every crop
[01:59:30] wire and charlatan from here to the Rio Grande because it's it's a people make billions off the
[01:59:37] backs of other people's pain I'm sorry if you serve 10 years in the military the answer for you
[01:59:44] is not too float in the tube and he don't it's like or you know to go to Texas and you know shoot
[01:59:50] a deer that's tied to a tree in front of a corn feeder like nothing's more healing than that right like
[01:59:56] you know I'm sorry like and people hate me for saying that my thing is like your your own
[02:00:02] fuck you like I don't care like because I see it I see the state of these guys that show up
[02:00:09] and they are completely fractured and they've been to 15 16 institutions they're on this they've
[02:00:15] been injected with that they're on these pills they're on these psych meds are on this Medicaid they're
[02:00:19] on this and I look at them like the pandemic of suicide in the veterans community can't be
[02:00:27] understated and the numbers like I don't even know if you would ever even be able to find the
[02:00:31] real numbers really but it's substantial you know and this whole catch thing you know 22 a day like
[02:00:39] like if you're doing 22 push-ups a day for veterans suicide you're an asshole like 22 push my
[02:00:46] kick into a hundred he's eight okay like I'll be just have some dignity and then it's like you know
[02:00:52] you're on there filming like hey guys fats are killing themselves shout it to my sponsor
[02:00:57] from my new t-shirt I'm gonna be doing 22 push-ups today new lycra by the way going on my 10%
[02:01:02] use my code Bob and I mean this is the world that we're living in and I'm like we have to get back
[02:01:10] into the business of developing human beings you know we have a we have a desire you know human
[02:01:19] beings are now in such a state of like hyper complexity where everything is integrated to everything
[02:01:25] is connected that there is no individualality there is no original thought you become an
[02:01:31] amalgamation of everything that you've heard and been exposed to but you really do nothing right
[02:01:36] like the jury's out like wake up do hard work learn about yourself turn the shed off like
[02:01:42] meditate like you know eat a carrot every now and then like and life is gonna be pretty good for you
[02:01:48] um doesn't mean it's gonna be easy but you'll have the built-in tools and you'll be
[02:01:54] going to learn about your higher self and you know people can say like you know oh this is like
[02:02:00] woo magic or whatever but like there is like I don't care you're in war like you got the
[02:02:05] spidey senses what is that what is that what is that thing what is meaning right what is this
[02:02:12] what is this thing meaning that we all have we all gonna answer that question at some point in
[02:02:16] our life whether you get hit by a you know a scape order like and whack your head in the curb or
[02:02:21] you die combat or you you know eat yourself to death like you're all going to face those those
[02:02:27] things and to me the heroes journey is the journey of learning about yourself and using those tools
[02:02:33] to overcome the external circumstances that you face and so like over the 41 days like we have
[02:02:41] you know that every guy walks at least 80 miles in the program just to meals
[02:02:45] they'll spend 22 days in the wilderness they won't eat a piece of sugar they won't eat dairy they
[02:02:51] won't eat they won't have juice they will only eat meat vegetable salt water and black coffee and
[02:02:58] they will learn to meditate looking to an ice tank every single day they will start today with
[02:03:05] mindfulness they'll read books they'll go through leadership courses they'll learn to shoe horses
[02:03:09] ride horses they'll learn to see themselves and working with wild moustangs they'll be put in
[02:03:13] very dangerous the situations all these are just tools to shift focus from a person that is
[02:03:19] always looking out for answers to a person that is looking in for answers and then using those answers
[02:03:26] to then change the material world around them with their choices that are authentically
[02:03:31] theirs and that's called purpose and when you start to do that years always the dragon that steps
[02:03:39] out right in front of you right the dragon steps out in front of you and and then you find out
[02:03:46] what you really want it because everything is designed today to keep you from knowing what you are like
[02:03:52] social media doesn't exist if you're not there the internet doesn't exist if you're not there
[02:03:57] you are the energy source that feeds your own demise so so you give your energy to feed your
[02:04:06] own destruction and then you complain about the very thing that you're feeding when it's always you
[02:04:13] you're the one I always tell people like oh god like the guys I did to wait or something
[02:04:17] isn't that you know whatever it's like it's like oh god he's not there if you're not there
[02:04:23] you feed it you are feeding and you are clothing and you are arming your own captors you are and
[02:04:30] everything is designed to keep you sound asleep consume consume consume consume consume yeah yeah yeah
[02:04:39] food moment let's get something you know everything is designed to fulfill these physical desires
[02:04:44] that then override you from searching from the real energy source that the people that are
[02:04:50] aware know of they know I need you to feed what I'm building you will serve serve serve
[02:05:00] as the cog you know gigantic organism and you will give your energy 40 50 years of and you
[02:05:09] get your little plaque thanks for Bob play of the month and then what you go down to self-order
[02:05:18] and you sit there and you just wait your car you're sitting in the same traffic yeah
[02:05:26] maybe it's a Ferrari so what you're in the same traffic and maybe get a little bit of better beef
[02:05:33] you know maybe this one was massage by 50 Japanese ladies or whatever right it doesn't matter
[02:05:38] it doesn't matter because then the fear starts to build and then the clock just starts going
[02:05:47] in the next thing you know what are they doing they're like ah it's too late it's too late
[02:05:52] you've missed the meaning of life you've missed it and veterans are out there like perpetuating
[02:05:59] these identities that's why I don't do like you know these guys they show up and it's just like
[02:06:04] dude you got out in 2005 it's 2020 too okay they're putting chips and people's brains man
[02:06:14] no one cares about the logistics department and boggerman 05 that you know may or may not have been
[02:06:24] ordered right like like think about the numbers you would think that every veteran is burned and
[02:06:29] every veteran has been amputated 1500 amputees 0.0026% of veterans have been amputated
[02:06:38] there's billions of dollars of organizations to help they have be dated billions
[02:06:42] we got this guy a wheelchair ramp a ramp how about like a ramp made of like wood like that's like
[02:06:54] 800 bucks right but but but this is what's happening we have to get back to where we start to
[02:07:00] developing ourselves push ourselves away reunite as a community and start getting serious about
[02:07:07] human development and begin giving our energy to things that matter like our food our water
[02:07:13] our shelter like the community around us doing things that are good turning off that stuff don't
[02:07:19] spend 23 years of your life in front of the TV like we have to change we have to change our minds
[02:07:27] we have to change our bodies we have to we have to become the governors of our own perceptions
[02:07:32] we're no longer the governors our own perceptions perceptions they create actions and
[02:07:37] behaviors and they're being governed by something else and you know my message is that I don't
[02:07:44] have the answers but you do and the jury's out on greatness it's it's it's spattered on walls
[02:07:52] and caves and books and tablets throughout all of mankind the jury is out no thy self
[02:08:00] know thyself there's a reason why everybody wants your energy because you're building an empire
[02:08:08] and an empire just turns out that you're it's unwitting prisoner and you can walk away
[02:08:14] and you can let yourself out and you can change you can do it we can do it and I'm not going to
[02:08:21] sit back and be a participant and watch generation like I'm nobody special I'm nobody of notoriety
[02:08:28] I'm not like all's ideal is I believe in the dignity of the human experience and there's people
[02:08:36] that I have done some really great things throughout all of the history of mankind and they did it
[02:08:41] by knowing themselves and then whatever you know we love to watch the brave hearts and we love to
[02:08:47] watch the patriots and we love to be that person be that person it's not about dying when
[02:08:52] being being burned at the stake when you're 23 we'll do you spend 23's your life watching TV that's
[02:08:56] a great 23 years that a guy like William Wallace had he was able to do that because he
[02:09:01] understood it something dradano van Bruno who was burned at the stake by the Catholic Church
[02:09:06] in the 1500s for writing the Pope of vote he he looked at them when they were going to burn
[02:09:12] him at the stake and they cut his tongue out and they nailed it to over his head they were
[02:09:15] getting ready to burn him they try to get him to recount you know that the earth revolves around
[02:09:20] the sun and all these things you know that was heresy and he looked at him and he understood
[02:09:25] the deeper meaning of life and he said it's not his last words what it's not eyes who is afraid
[02:09:32] it's you and then they let the fire what a badass way to go you know so I've just dedicated my life
[02:09:41] to you know right now the program is a 41 day long program you know at the end of it we have a
[02:09:46] Lakota sweat lodge I've had the opportunity to get to know some of those medicine men and you know
[02:09:54] that's an ancient tradition that is 16,000 years old that dates back and you know they say you go
[02:10:01] into the womb of the earth and when you come out you know you're reborn and it's it's really like
[02:10:08] it's like an insane sauna that has chanting and all those other kinds of things and you
[02:10:15] you're in there in the heat and you kind of go the heat brings you from the kind of physical into
[02:10:18] the spiritual and so every guy will pass through those windows and they'll do a four window
[02:10:24] ceremony upon graduation and then and then people are like and then what and I'm like and then go and
[02:10:30] live your life because now you know and if you want to go participate in those same things
[02:10:35] you can do it but not ignorantly because you know you know that wow I'm creating my own experience
[02:10:43] like the the whole idea of free will I believe is what project Earth is all about it's about free will
[02:10:53] well the experiment in free will is coming to an end because everybody's been programmed everyone
[02:10:59] it's coming to an end and I'm not going to let it come to an end of my life I'm going to take power of
[02:11:06] that because free will is powerful I could get up on this table right now sell my rental car illegally
[02:11:11] to a chop shop and go climb out of Everest I could do anything anything but people do nothing
[02:11:17] they do nothing they don't understand the power that they have instead they give that unknown
[02:11:22] power away and then they blame life and they've they've become the victims of this experience we can
[02:11:28] change we can change right now people can change and in turn the goodness can be restored the goodness
[02:11:37] of this nation you know the goodness that made you sign up and say you know what I want to fight
[02:11:41] against the evil I want to stand again if I lose my limit if I get burned if I get I don't care
[02:11:46] I want to do it and and return to those values that represent not only as us as Americans but
[02:11:52] us as human beings and you know that's that's that's that's my message you know to the world
[02:12:00] is like that book right there about face wake up and turn around and do 180 degrees from what you're
[02:12:08] doing and your life will change you will change it will change and it will change for the better
[02:12:15] take that journey reject the easiness of life that is being sold because it is a poison and it is
[02:12:22] a cancer and and you will maybe you'll be rich maybe it doesn't it won't matter because you will
[02:12:30] be wealthy and heart and wealthy and mind and wealthy and spirit you know and that's uh
[02:12:36] you know that's kind of what I want to share with the world well so what's this look like first question
[02:12:41] do you need to know how to write a horse to show up no no matter fact like the majority of
[02:12:49] guys come up very you can see you know you know every even written horse before in their life
[02:12:53] had you written horses before when did you start writing horses I had one horse growing up
[02:12:58] I never I wrote it like a couple times and that was about my experience that was it
[02:13:03] and then you're I'm going for this uh yes so was the introduction horses so I did not meet some
[02:13:08] uh I was uh right before I got out so this is like 2013 I ended up meeting some cowboys
[02:13:14] uh with horses in the back country and I got to know them and they invited me to the right
[02:13:19] I met him on a hiking I was just hiking with my daughter and I met him and that's how I
[02:13:24] started shooting horses so I first started shooting horses with a guy on a tip and table so they
[02:13:29] put him into a huge machine tip them on their sides and then I just my job was around like the
[02:13:33] wheel grinder and I was just like helping out and eventually I started learning how to shoot horses
[02:13:37] and start Colts and these guys like I kind of thought initially they were all about like helping
[02:13:42] vets and all this kind of stuff they were like the most like crooked human beings I've ever met
[02:13:47] in my life like real legit crooks you know because the equine business is tough like in the cowboy
[02:13:54] world and all that kind of stuff so um but I did learn a tremendous amount those guys were
[02:13:58] mentors to me you know all that should decide and then um and then I just did these sort of
[02:14:04] ride horses all the time obviously every single day a day in and day out yeah I mean I like I said
[02:14:09] I just crossed my 18th wilderness on a horse you know so uh I we have 70 horses today
[02:14:15] I've been breaking in training while Mustangs for five years now like straight from the wild
[02:14:20] and I always tell people like if you like you're like a legit tough guy like you're like
[02:14:24] I will put you in there with a completely wild horse and you're gonna find out real good
[02:14:29] how tough you are because the horse is immediately kind of sensitive you're afraid and like I had
[02:14:35] this I had this horse two years ago I never did quite get him I'll show you a cool picture of him
[02:14:40] going straight up in the air and I'm on the end of this rope um he's the only horse I ever had
[02:14:45] actually like just straight up attack me um and like attack me and what what happened was is that
[02:14:53] he would like you know you get in there and he'd start moving around and if you even take one step
[02:14:57] back there one step forward okay because in the horse world you know there is uh there is a high
[02:15:04] archie you know so there's the alpha male and the alpha female and they lead the herd and then
[02:15:09] everybody else falls up's a quint land underneath so the alpha male runs it rums around looks for
[02:15:13] predators and it keeps everybody at bay and the mare's leading them to food and water in the
[02:15:16] wild the eat first they do everything first and then it slowly goes down so you're falling somewhere
[02:15:20] in the horse high archie and you know to think about horses horses the highest video two
[02:15:25] max out of any land animal on earth alright they have binocular and binocular vision they can see
[02:15:30] out of both eyes completely independently the right brain and left brain doesn't know so they're
[02:15:35] looking at something the left the right brain has no idea just like my ex-girlfriend and so
[02:15:42] but you know they uh you know when they put their heads down they can see almost 360 degrees while
[02:15:47] they're eating and but they can't see four feet front of their nose and they can't see four feet behind them
[02:15:52] um and horses does not really do one thing run so they have you know 50 liters of fluid and
[02:15:58] they're stomach and any given time which slashes around this fleet free floating intestinal
[02:16:02] system so as the horse moves that fluid slashes and slaps in the diaphragm which causes them
[02:16:07] to go to breathe in so it's boom boom so they're they're breathing in super hard and uh they
[02:16:13] can't breathe through their mouth so they breathe through their nose and their noses are
[02:16:16] flared so it's like a irram system and so horses design like you know I I can be a mile away I
[02:16:23] was not Wyoming either as well horses on horseback they can feel the vibrations in the ground
[02:16:27] and you just can see them on your bino they just they sense you alright so they're highly
[02:16:32] evolved at getting away from predators and now here comes human beings like hello I want to ride you
[02:16:36] and and so you have to one become their leader first so you have to have an ability of self
[02:16:43] leadership alright because they can sense that and then and then you know two you have to gain their
[02:16:49] trust and you gain that trust with that animal um by you know pressure and release so
[02:16:55] applying pressure that animal releasing that pressure and essentially talking to them you know so
[02:17:00] if you watch me working while the horses I can I'm doesn't really look like I'm doing much
[02:17:03] but I'm controlling the direction of that animal because in horse language whoever moves their
[02:17:08] feet first loses so what happens is especially with the students when they're first working with
[02:17:13] wild horses as the program progresses it's a couple days they get with wild animals you'll see the
[02:17:18] guy you know I don't know 20 year-grain were there whatever horse takes a step towards them you'll see
[02:17:22] him take a step back well that horse is like okay now you're my bit and in the next time around
[02:17:28] he's on you right and you know horses are are like people some are you know docile some are nice
[02:17:34] some are psychotic whatever in terms of the wild ones and so yeah I had this horse and he's
[02:17:40] you know I get them like finally where I can get him saddled and everything like that it takes
[02:17:45] me like three or four days and I could get hands on I'm certainly pick this feet up and one day
[02:17:50] he just came in and he just never was a trusting horse and I kind of pushed him more than I think
[02:17:55] he was capable of at the time and I just kind of like he was just there as I'm gonna let him
[02:18:01] like soak or just let him stand there and rest and it was a pretty rough morning and and I turn
[02:18:07] around and he just like tears back and tries to strike me him back in my head you know I kind of
[02:18:12] like fall forward and then he bites me in my back you know and kind of throws me to the side of it
[02:18:16] every you know of course I'm like can't crawl up the round pen fast enough you know like I mean
[02:18:21] that's a large beast and you know so this was three or four days into you working with them
[02:18:27] yeah and he so we we adopt him completely wild I think 28 of our 70 horses are wild horses
[02:18:33] I've been been five years ago I did a film called the 500 mile project where I rode 16 wild
[02:18:40] moustangs from New Mexico to Arizona 760 miles after trading them for three months with a couple
[02:18:47] guys and it's the story of the unpurpose horse and the unpurpose human being and so here you have
[02:18:52] the wild horse which is facing the same thing as the American veteran which is huge government
[02:18:57] monies right so there's there's you know 50 100,000 whatever it is today I haven't looked wild moustangs
[02:19:03] in captivity so in 1979 they had the wild horse had burrow act so they started running them
[02:19:08] up off the ranch lands and putting them into long-term holding facilities and today it's a
[02:19:13] 60 or 70 million dollar program and the problem's only worsening they've tried to shoot them
[02:19:18] at a helicopter with birth control and all these kind of things and and so the whole thing's a disaster
[02:19:23] and adoption doesn't really work either it works on a small scale but there's too many
[02:19:27] being produced to adopt them out so we go there and we adopt them we sort them out we figure
[02:19:34] them out and if you watch the film and the opening scenes of the films is very intense I mean
[02:19:38] these horses have never been around people so they're terrified because they're designed to run away
[02:19:42] from us and so you know through a series of shoots and sorting things you know we pick out what we
[02:19:48] want out of hundreds of them and then we load them into trailers and we're bringing back and then
[02:19:52] we start training them and those are the horses that then go into the program so you know horses uh
[02:19:58] is a mirror reflection to who you are because a horse is designed at sensing your predatory
[02:20:03] instincts so you may say I'm not scared or or maybe I am going to hurt you because I'm going to be
[02:20:11] very aggressive with you and then the animal becomes very afraid of you then you may not be per you know
[02:20:16] portraying that on the outside but on the inside that's what the horse is looking at you could look
[02:20:22] like you're totally calm but your heart's going 140 beats a minute and the horse feels that so
[02:20:27] then he starts thinking what are you going to do to me and then they'll test you because where you're
[02:20:31] going to be in the hierarchy and if you watch them in the pens you know there will be this one horse
[02:20:36] that will come along everybody's eating and soon as he starts walking over everybody goes away
[02:20:41] and there will be one horse that's like maybe I'm not going to go and this horse like double barrel
[02:20:44] kicks in music yeah I'm going to go so you're they don't you're somewhere on that scale
[02:20:50] and so horses a lot of the program happens in the 41 days with these horses without talking
[02:20:56] because what happens is the horse reflects back what you really are and so people blame the animal
[02:21:02] this horse is an idiot well you're an idiot now we don't say that sometimes I do
[02:21:10] but but these guys begin to realize and when they change their internal compass
[02:21:16] their relationship with their horse instantaneously change it is the most beautiful thing
[02:21:23] you see this union where all sudden okay you're my leader you're the alpha male or alpha
[02:21:28] mare and I'll kill myself for you and when a horse believes in you that might like some of my
[02:21:34] like rope horses and my really good horses like the one you go kind of like that video I said
[02:21:38] you're whatever you know they'll kill them so they will run for you until they die they will run
[02:21:44] through a fence they will they will do anything for you because they trust their leader
[02:21:50] but a lot of guys initially are just passengers on an animal that hates them because they hate
[02:21:55] themselves and they're not able to have that internal compass be calibrated so throughout that
[02:22:01] relationship and throughout the learning about horses they're really learning about themselves
[02:22:04] of the medium of the horse and so from day one you know guys apply to the program it's a really
[02:22:10] comprehensive application process and it's a hundred percent veterans all veterans yep and
[02:22:17] it's a it's a it's a tricky application you know most nonprofits you kind of like fill out the thing
[02:22:21] and it's like you know you like presence or being on it's like you're welcome like thanks
[02:22:25] like this is like gets in your head and then you know through that process you get selected
[02:22:30] you know kind of rate guys one to five you know we can only take so many guys you know we get a couple
[02:22:34] hundred applications a year and then and then we send them two books communicate with them every week
[02:22:39] help them lose weight change your diet we send them articles on testosterone suppression
[02:22:43] through SSRIs and medications and all these kind of unhealthy lifestyle we help them kind of
[02:22:48] level up as they're preparing and then when they arrive it's you know kind of indoctrination
[02:22:55] getting the ice tanks this is how this works this is our morning routine so you wake up it's a
[02:22:59] mile walk in the dark off the ranch they walk down to the main area the you know mobility work
[02:23:05] with Jim Jones so they designed our workout program all based you know these guys are not trying
[02:23:09] to get jacked or anything but they some of them are like straight off the mission of the kitchen so
[02:23:13] you know they they like I mean we have guys that like haven't why did a guy last year that said
[02:23:17] he had walked up a flight stairs in seven years all right so now like you're entering into like
[02:23:22] you want I mean pain when you're scoping out applicants are you trying to create a what
[02:23:30] you call it a class yeah so I create a class but I are you trying to create a class of like
[02:23:35] do you look at the people go look this guy's probably he's gonna need some help but he's probably
[02:23:40] gonna do well this other person's like like this is a train wreck over here or he just looking
[02:23:45] for train wrecks I just take the worst of the worst guy so you're looking for and I put them all together
[02:23:49] and there's no signs to that because to me it's like you to get through this you have to work as a
[02:23:54] team but it's about the individual you're on your own journey and you're gonna need other people
[02:23:59] to help you along the way but I don't care if they ever talked to those guys again a lot of
[02:24:03] amainting some of the closest friendships ever a matter of fact on the way here some guys a
[02:24:10] Canadian special operations sent me a guy and last year and he
[02:24:16] changes life this guy was in a real bad way and they've made team relationships with each other but
[02:24:24] ultimately it's about the individual because they're on the heroes journey and the heroes journey
[02:24:28] is that you have to walk through those flames you have to go through those fires you have to
[02:24:32] feel it and so you know 430 in the morning they wake up they walk a mile down to the main camp
[02:24:39] then they intentionally move their bodies they get done with that we do a meditation and then
[02:24:46] they do breath work the Wim Hof breath holding and then they get into a nice tank and then that
[02:24:50] scales up to you know they're sitting there for like 10 minutes and that's pretty rough on guys
[02:24:57] that are like straight off like and then and then it's all about horses and so then in the evening
[02:25:02] we have what we call the the Maxim Lab which is a leadership course based on stoism so I don't tell
[02:25:08] them any ideas while presenting a question what does it mean you know choose to be harmed
[02:25:12] in your harm choose not to be harmed and you haven't been what does that mean and guys will go around
[02:25:16] and let them talk things out and so throughout the program they'll do that for 40 days and then
[02:25:21] after after six days they'll head into the back country for eight days they are given a horse
[02:25:26] and a mule so it's weight six days they've been there yep they've been doing this routine
[02:25:30] they've been learning about horses well at this point everybody can load the horse
[02:25:35] and go down and run everybody can you know rain control their horse and pack a mule
[02:25:40] and understands equine medicine, trucks, trailers all that kind of stuff they get all that in
[02:25:45] six days so it's very intensive those are some long days extremely long days
[02:25:50] um matter of fact like there was like a guy with a vet came out and he's like um like
[02:25:56] there's like guys sleeping like right next to the horse like I know I look you guys come on
[02:26:02] we're not in the military now we understand up and like but but so six days of
[02:26:10] so the beginning of the program they're there they're getting all this good stuff that you're
[02:26:13] given and they're only eating like meat vegetables what do you say salt water and coffee
[02:26:19] that's it okay there's no juice there's no dairy there's no honey nothing you know and and then
[02:26:24] after six days of that then it's we're going in the wilderness yeah all the horse back
[02:26:29] with the horse you on your horse and your mule correct as a team as a team some of these
[02:26:34] guys are most they're paired together eight guys in the class are paired together and they
[02:26:36] got to pack their own stuff and then of course there's camp gear and all that stuff we have
[02:26:39] duties and all lined up for everybody and that's a progressive trip so there is no main camp
[02:26:44] so everyday they pack up and move so you know all ultra light stuff you know most of
[02:26:49] time I never use a 10 I'm just I just sleep out and let's say rains and they'll spend eight
[02:26:54] days we'll do like around eight or 90 miles on that trip then they'll come back and they'll start
[02:26:59] the next morning what's called ranch week so now they're going to learn how to rope they're
[02:27:02] going to we have you know cows they're going to learn how to rope cows how to do stock management
[02:27:06] they're going to learn more advanced riding they're going to learn how to work on a ranch how to
[02:27:10] be in working ranch and so that's called ranch week it's all about ranch stuff they'll drive
[02:27:15] tractors and they'll learn all these things in different groups throughout you know the whole facility
[02:27:19] then a lot of times we'll move we'll go to another ranch we'll help them gather and sort and
[02:27:23] ship cows and do stuff depending on what's going on so that's ranch week and then they start you know
[02:27:27] I guess you could say like phase two or something where there are another six days of training so
[02:27:32] that training is blacksmithing so they'll learn how to shoe over so they'll learn how to trim
[02:27:37] learn how to pair and learn equine medicine they'll work with wild moustangs they'll do cult
[02:27:40] starting they'll do raining they'll do more advanced riding they'll do roping well actually
[02:27:45] rope live cows and they'll learn how to you know how to manage them how to operate on a working
[02:27:50] ranch in terms of all the agricultural components and they'll learn more packing and they'll
[02:27:54] learn how to put we know seven eight ten animals out of time pull them together how to drive
[02:27:58] trucks how to drive trailers how to do chains how to run chainsaw how to run axe it all those
[02:28:02] kind of things and then then they'll head into the backcountry for eleven days and then that's
[02:28:07] it's how many days deeper we into this program right now like is the eleven days or something
[02:28:14] so is the eleven days sort of like the final days in the field yeah and that's a tough trip like
[02:28:18] it's tough on me it's tough like you know eleven or twelve days in the wilderness like that
[02:28:23] progressively moving wears on you plus the animals have their own personalities and there's
[02:28:29] you know we run our stock loose so we tie you know we hobble them and we turn them loose in the
[02:28:34] mountains and so you know you gotta get up and you gotta gather in the morning it's cold snowing
[02:28:38] in August you know all those kind of challenges last year we rode across the wind rivers
[02:28:42] or either 120 miles across one river range and that was brutal trip it was incredible but it's just
[02:28:48] tough and then you know you're chewing horses you're constantly where you build and camp you're
[02:28:51] cooking everything and it's all this you know like whole food stuff so guys are it's a tough trip
[02:28:57] and then they lead every day so every day a different guy leads he has the map he has the
[02:29:01] routes he makes all the decisions I let him fail I let him fall flat on their face I let him make
[02:29:05] mistakes as long as nobody's gonna get hurt let him feel that take you know ownership of all those
[02:29:10] kind of you know that leadership component and confidence and stuff and so and then they get back
[02:29:16] and then when they get back from that trip obviously everyone's decimated so the average guy last year
[02:29:21] lost 20 pounds in the program her record that last year was 37 pounds in 41 days and yeah and
[02:29:30] then and then the med countless 11 psych meds guy I walked away from so and then of course you
[02:29:37] have the guys on the ones season the doos season stuff like that so they get back then we wake them up
[02:29:42] at one o'clock in the morning they usually get the bed around 10 that night after we because you know
[02:29:46] horses come first so you got a doctor horses clean horses you got to do shoes you got to do
[02:29:50] all those things and then we'll wake them up driving them to a mountain make them climb
[02:29:53] saccharidrea peaks with 10,000 foot peak in the dark because the metaphor is that nobody really
[02:29:59] cares what you just accomplished because behind every mountain is another mountain and so we
[02:30:04] want them to feel that and in that video you can see the guy standing on that peak and then one
[02:30:08] guy's gonna rub in the other guy in the back you know none of that's acting or anything and I was
[02:30:12] a real emotional moment because they have lived a lifetime and it is real life it's not like you're
[02:30:18] coming here and this is fake life and I'm gonna leave and go back to real life it's all real life
[02:30:22] there is no fake life right it's all real right you put the virtual reality goggles on for nine
[02:30:28] hours that's real life right it does not time doesn't stop and so um the climb that mountain they
[02:30:35] come down pack up all their gear in the next day is graduation day so then they get into the sweat
[02:30:39] lodge so they graduate getting into the sweat lodge they go through that we do some sound stuff with them
[02:30:46] and then we have a year long take home course called stay the course or the guys I've died
[02:30:51] reading suggested reading you know fitness stuff access to an app and kind of like you know
[02:30:58] whole food eating and stuff like that and then the guys that want to we plug them into an
[02:31:04] internship and then they go for four to six weeks to Alaska why don't we Montana you
[02:31:08] totally go to work in ranches they go to cowboy outfits they go to outfiters and you know
[02:31:12] and you come and at this point in their wife when they're done they've moved on and had an
[02:31:21] interesting guy this year who gave straight out of the marine corps basically like weeks and came
[02:31:27] here and he showed up and he was like straight up like rager Rick you know yeah they're like the
[02:31:33] oakley's on you know yeah the like you were like he straight everything was the military everything
[02:31:38] was the military when he left he had left all his military clothes in my garbage bag had you know
[02:31:48] cowboy hats like the whole thing and had essentially he's been worked on his Mexican I got him
[02:31:54] I happened to know a team guy buddy of mine awesome guy and who works for a guy that has a ranch in
[02:32:01] Mexico so he's been ranching in Mexico like his whole life is like completely different I think
[02:32:07] what would happen if more people got out and immediately took on the next challenge in their life
[02:32:13] in the face of everything and where would they be today and you know that's my overarching goal is that
[02:32:19] like you know the sweat lodge is a super powerful thing and it can be terrifying how hot is this
[02:32:24] sweatlock and really hot like like really hotter than normal sauna hot oh yeah so so the rocks
[02:32:34] that they use they go out and gather the rocks there lava rocks they haven't been heated up since the
[02:32:39] last you know younger dry has impact they're our last major volcanic eruptions and you know
[02:32:47] they put them in there and there's a lot of drumming and songs they honor everything the water and
[02:32:53] earth and all those things and it's called the Anipi will come which is one of like seven sacred
[02:32:58] ceremonies so like the sun dance which is hanging by your flesh from a pole for three days with no
[02:33:06] food or water and then to come off that they hook buffalo skulls to you and you have to run into
[02:33:14] the desert until they rip out of your back these guys have all done this numerous times and then there's
[02:33:20] the you see these guys you're talking about the look guys yeah yeah yeah and they there are
[02:33:28] some of the there's some of the deepest most special people that I've ever met they are people
[02:33:32] that when you meet them you know like these people are good they're like good peat like there's a
[02:33:36] wholeness to them that is attractive like there is a balance to them and so these guys of course
[02:33:45] are terrified you know everybody's like you go into this little tiny lodge and you're in there you
[02:33:50] can't see your hand in front of your face and the heat begins to increase in the songs and they
[02:33:56] you know they welcome in you know all kinds of different things in animal spirits all that kind
[02:34:00] of stuff and when you come out how long are you in there for well the door open closes four
[02:34:05] times with the whole things like a couple hours and so then there's the then there's the vision
[02:34:10] quest where you go in there for 24 hours with no food or water alone that's and then there's the
[02:34:17] four days we've had people on our ranch that grown up there for four days with no food and
[02:34:21] water by themselves in the mountain and they sit up there in the sweat lodge no that's one of the other
[02:34:28] rights so the sweat lodge was banned in North American until 1976 it was illegal
[02:34:35] matter fact dancing was illegal native American dancing was illegal so when Columbus arrived in
[02:34:40] the North American continent there was 60 million natives here at the start of World War One there was
[02:34:45] 800 thousand left in Buffalo almost 60 million had been killed to what's to extinction so those rights were banned
[02:34:54] and it was illegal matter fact it was illegal to carry those names let's sort of like on a reservation
[02:35:00] so there's a real tradition and history you know you're not taking psychedelics or anything that's
[02:35:05] it's the heat and and it's the prayers and it does change you and it leaves an impact in the first time
[02:35:12] I ever did it I'll tell you right now I was ready to dig my way out of there like I did not like it
[02:35:18] because your mind's like of course I started watching YouTube videos you know I'm like oh no
[02:35:22] like I get it I was like I'm in a die I can't get out of like STV like no and I'm back in the
[02:35:28] black tube of death and and I it's had such an impact and I've done eight of them now and
[02:35:36] you know I've really like learned I guess like in a way to honor myself like in a way that is
[02:35:44] you know my mind my body my spirit by like what I eat and and how who I am in relationship with
[02:35:50] who I expose my life to my energy to like what I put my intentions towards like all these things
[02:35:56] begin to kind of open up to you as the weeks and of your life go on and so it's something that we've
[02:36:03] integrated into the program that's been really effective and deep do you hallucinate
[02:36:09] is that what you're talking about? So like I had an interesting I guess you could say not every time
[02:36:14] is been different not one has been the same some have been like incredible other ones I feel like
[02:36:19] I just suffered like they're all different but I actually had really interesting thing is that like
[02:36:26] I was in there and I saw a baby in the womb up here over the fire and but there's no fire.
[02:36:34] That's a hallucination I think. Well I think I'm not sure though.
[02:36:41] There's no fire the rocks are just red but you can't really see them then they're in this hole
[02:36:47] so there's no fire it's a hot rocks and they keep and then people open the door and bring them in and
[02:36:52] put them in there and then they have buffalo horns and they add the water to the keep dumping water
[02:36:56] on it with buffalo horns and they're singing drums and chanting and all and stuff and I saw like
[02:37:01] a baby in the womb like in a fetus and it appeared over the fire and I thought like oh man like
[02:37:09] like the children like are dying or so I don't know I had this like thing and then like a week later
[02:37:15] my wife found out she was pregnant and then I and Centaneously knew like that's what I saw
[02:37:22] and knew that I would have another child and I don't believe that children come from me I think
[02:37:27] they've passed through you and you know I think they're here for particular times I think we can
[02:37:32] become derail that's human beings because we you know we get enticed you know by gross materialism
[02:37:38] and all these things that detractors for ourselves and then somebody else has got to come along
[02:37:43] but yeah so so that experience has been powerful so I added it to the program and people I was like so
[02:37:49] what book did you read? who did you do? like what did you? I'm like nothing zero it's just my own journey
[02:37:54] it's all the things that I've done in my life that have helped me really become united with myself
[02:38:01] I had become homesick from whom I was as a person rather it was the wild and crazy
[02:38:05] religious stuff of the day where you know casting the dean is or whatever or it was the military
[02:38:10] or it was the agency or it was all these other experiences you know I had lost a footing
[02:38:17] and a connection to myself and now that that connection and that link has been restored
[02:38:24] you know I feel a balance that I've never felt before my life I you know I always tell people
[02:38:31] like I don't have a retirement I don't have any 401k I tell my kids I'm not paying for your college
[02:38:38] and I'm not buying you a car like I'm not doing any of those things but I will build an ecosystem
[02:38:44] here and teach you how to hunt and how to work the land and how to honor the animals and do all those
[02:38:48] things and I will support you but you're gonna have to do it yourself and yeah I'm not gonna
[02:38:54] if I go tomorrow they're like you got cancer I'm like okay I'm going to like Bob Marley like I'm
[02:38:59] just gonna be like alright cool and not poking me and sticking me and doing anything I'll just like
[02:39:04] I'm not you know so these experiences have given me a connection to a place where you find true peace
[02:39:14] it doesn't mean the world around you is peaceful but and it doesn't mean you're weak and you're
[02:39:19] some kind of like you know snowflake or whatever it's a it's a balance that you when you read
[02:39:24] about the great wars the the the sun zoos and you read the towel jeans and you read about the
[02:39:30] Alexander the Greats and you read about the people that you list season all these great people there was
[02:39:35] a balance they had they were artists they were calligraphers they were also kill you in 57 different ways
[02:39:40] but not out of anger and not out of hate and there were such a place of balance and so you know my life
[02:39:47] now is about restoring that balance and then bringing that balance to other people but I can't do it for you
[02:39:53] and over the course of 41 days you know it is a it is a is a conversation how much do you do
[02:40:01] really want it more often than not we fall in love with getting in shape you know we fall in love
[02:40:07] with being healthy or we fall in love with you know having things or whatever but we don't like the
[02:40:13] idea of what it takes to get there you know we don't like that we we don't like to feel uncomfortable
[02:40:19] and and we have to become comfortable and the uncomfortable and in turn the things that are
[02:40:24] holding you back they they dissipate and go away you know so that's what the 41 days is about
[02:40:30] yeah you know you and I didn't talk before you showed up here today and and so when like I was
[02:40:35] putting together your words and I'm glad you've hit this a couple times today and I wasn't 100
[02:40:41] percent sure but certainly I was pretty confident that idea that you are introducing situations
[02:40:50] to people that then they figure out like what the answers are to their questions and then you said
[02:40:55] it multiple times today like hey I don't have the answer for you and I can't tell you what to do here
[02:41:00] what to do there but I can take you to a place where you're going to start looking into
[02:41:04] you're going to start looking inside and you're going to start asking some questions and finding the
[02:41:10] answers yeah it's exactly not that's everybody is trying to tell you how to be you know like you
[02:41:16] go to Tony Robyn I don't want to disown your Robinson and then because he's like probably
[02:41:20] it'll send us assets ever. I'm like good luck to those assets for you for you I dare you
[02:41:28] but yeah like they're going to track you up in the mountains on four sides of the
[02:41:32] southern you get me Tony Robyn coming in there you're like dare you a challenge you Tony I saw show how
[02:41:42] they get so amped up and they spend their life watching all this stuff and all these things
[02:41:46] and going to these things but they don't actually do anything if you did one tenth of the
[02:41:50] information that's contained in your brain you wouldn't be in a situation you're in we just
[02:41:55] become addicted to getting more information you know it's like you know 12 steps to purpose like
[02:42:00] oh man like you're going to get to the end and 12 is like woo but then was a guy come out with
[02:42:05] nine steps like oh shit I got to get the other book there's only nine like you know like now
[02:42:10] with he he's got he's got nine more books to write uh to me the jury is out on what it means
[02:42:17] to really be a human but we've lost that we've lost that knowledge um in pursuit of a construct
[02:42:25] that if I if I get to the end of an idea that never was mine in my first place all achieve
[02:42:30] some end state right all retire or all achieve happiness you know maybe it's a it used to be in the
[02:42:38] 80s you know become a millionaire now if you're a millionaire who gives a shit a million bucks like I
[02:42:43] mean it's like a million bucks is like nothing nowadays right you know it's it's what was it like
[02:42:48] they're had that spending bill or whatever it's like if you took one trillion dollars you stack
[02:42:52] that on end and go a third of the way to the moon okay so 3.5 trillion goes to the moon in part of
[02:42:58] the way back right like so but there are those things like that really matter in life are
[02:43:06] are your food your water your shelter in your relationships in your life and um if you're not in balance
[02:43:13] with those things there's nothing there's no things in life that are gonna help you find a place of
[02:43:19] completion because eventually you will face the man in the mirror you will eventually no matter what
[02:43:26] you know matter how many cart no matter what it is like I was using example of like warm
[02:43:31] buff it was like laying in the desert and dying like about to die and I came like walking by
[02:43:35] with some water and I was like hey weren't get me all the money that you have
[02:43:44] and I'll give you this water you would take it he would 100% take it he wouldn't be like
[02:43:49] oh no he'd be like like he'd want it right so it puts everything in relative perspective and the
[02:43:57] most exciting adventure you can go on is the adventure with yourself that is the most exciting
[02:44:02] adventure and then your whole life opens up we spend our time like in shitty relationships with
[02:44:08] shitty people afraid to change and jobs that we hate doing things that we don't want to do
[02:44:14] to get to places that we never wanted to go in the first place and then we play and then they
[02:44:19] when I was using this yeah I'm like okay if you're depressed okay and everyone's like you know
[02:44:27] this for a while was like the mental health month and the mental health stuff was going on like crazy
[02:44:32] like you know everyone's like hey guys mental health month you know skydiving for mental health like
[02:44:38] I'm conducting a boxing clinic for mental health and bringing awareness to it and mental health
[02:44:46] so then you're like I'm depressed and it's like okay I'm depressed so then you go to the person
[02:44:50] that's in charge of the construct and they say what's a matter you don't like your life well
[02:44:56] I don't know something's wrong like hmm well we're gonna give you some things to get you back to work
[02:45:02] okay we're gonna get you back in love with the very thing that you hate it's never something is wrong
[02:45:07] with the thing the construct itself it's always something wrong with you so then you're like okay
[02:45:14] so you take this stuff and you feel good for a while and you're like butterflies and everything's
[02:45:17] going around with it and it wears off in six months and you go back and then the people tell you okay
[02:45:23] we gotta get you back in love we gotta get you back to work we gotta get you back on depressed
[02:45:27] it's never about making massive lifestyle changes like it's never about throwing the keys away
[02:45:34] getting radically committed to yourself it's always about changing you to get you back in love
[02:45:39] with the very thing that's causing the depression right it's never about like radical change it's
[02:45:46] always like hmm you have a chemical amounts so we'll give you some chemicals to get you back in
[02:45:49] balance that'll work by the way 79 bucks a month and and so I think that like we have to stop
[02:45:58] like we have to pump the brakes like you know we have to return back to the basics of what it
[02:46:05] means to be a human and you know my work with veterans is like they're basically involved in a social
[02:46:10] system right they show up to an institution it's a one size fits all right my greater goal is to create
[02:46:18] a board of the smart innovators people that that maybe there's a wellness arm like a FedEx for
[02:46:26] veterans right in the post office doesn't work where guys can say you know what red pill blue pill
[02:46:31] hmm six weeks in therapy meds this that counseling for ten years all these other things institutions
[02:46:37] meanings or whatever or maybe there's an eight week program I'm gonna go to that'll be the
[02:46:42] suckiest thing I've ever done in my life it'll be the true heroes journey but when I come out the
[02:46:48] other side I will have learned what I am and I will take that knowledge and I will begin to change
[02:46:54] the world around me with my own energy my own impetus and my own identity from the inside out we should
[02:47:02] give people that opportunity but instead you know you show up to these like you said these false
[02:47:07] profits that what are they there really really to do yeah what's scary about this is
[02:47:14] so much of the stuff that that people get like prescribed or advised it actually you know in
[02:47:25] some of the talks that you talk about like peeling away layers to get to you all those other
[02:47:30] things are actually added layers they're adding layers on top of layers on top of layers
[02:47:36] that seem to smooth things over for a month or you know three months or whatever and then all
[02:47:42] the sudden that whatever's in there is starting to burn through and cause you know costic material
[02:47:49] to rise the surface and so you're like wait a second I don't know if this is it so you go back
[02:47:53] and they say cool oh oh you got a little friction coming out little costic materials coming out
[02:47:58] cool let's put another layer on that and put another layer on that and then we you know what are you
[02:48:03] going to put over yourself you're going to put you know a car or a watch or whatever expensive item
[02:48:09] that is another layer on top of this it it's not a solution no it's not it's not it's not it's like
[02:48:19] this is set I so I just went through yesterday with my wife we like threw out like a shit ton of
[02:48:25] stuff right because the average American household has over 300,000 items in it and I walked in there
[02:48:33] you have a weird like a nerdy freaking what a statistical analytical mind well I like it I actually
[02:48:40] just watched like a big when I was traveling back from Florida about these like minimalist people or
[02:48:44] whatever and they you know of course went in there and it's like I told my wife so we were
[02:48:48] down in Florida and what does she want to do she's like obsessed with a good will we don't buy anything new
[02:48:52] but nothing and my kids nothing new zero everything we buy used or you know could build whatever
[02:48:57] but that in and of itself is an addiction right because I'm like she's like oh my gosh I got this
[02:49:03] flan on like you have like 90 flan on I should kind of know what this one was like three bucks and I'm like
[02:49:09] that's the problem right like you don't need that right so so we went we were like okay
[02:49:15] once a week we're in a target one portion of the house and get rid of stuff so yesterday we threw
[02:49:19] a wee we're taking to the good well we I mean I don't we took out an entire like four to expedition
[02:49:26] full of things okay and then like we were done I like three o'clock after noon and I looked around
[02:49:32] and I was like it doesn't even look like we took anything out I mean like how many potato pillars
[02:49:38] did we have I was like we had like nine potato pillars meanwhile and Ethiopia I'm like
[02:49:44] I'm like we had so many things and what do things represent their measurements of time
[02:49:50] their measurements of time because you have to have time expanded and energy to get that thing
[02:49:58] right and so and then I get this thing and then there's always another thing that you need to get
[02:50:03] wow the attachment for the mixture that goes in the thing that does the pasta like oh I'm doing that
[02:50:08] should have like well it's an action tag you know we'll have to add it on there and so we started going
[02:50:13] through and just getting rid of tons of stuff you know and and the scariest thing is going to be
[02:50:18] like going to my closet you know like and and realizing that wow I've spent a lot of time in my life
[02:50:25] getting these things and I'm like never have time I had a time and I'm enough time what am I doing
[02:50:30] with my time I'm using my time to get things that I don't need and so it's like Gandhi was
[02:50:35] asked the question what confuses him most about modern man he said modern man spends all his time
[02:50:40] to get money then spends all his money to get this time back that's I mean that's pretty profound
[02:50:46] right like and I remember I'm not calculous I was like a young well not not a young seal but
[02:50:52] I'd been in the team for a while and there was people I guess as sort of maybe
[02:50:58] remember the adventure racing things is that started coming out and but then that became sort of
[02:51:03] extreme sport and like that whole thing and then I thought to myself man people like work hard
[02:51:10] to get money to pay for to learn how to skydive or scuba diving I get to do that best is freaking cool
[02:51:16] like I had the whole system beat man but God did it a little bit you know it's like a man
[02:51:20] I'll do it you're working your ass off to go to this I'm literally getting paid to do that stuff
[02:51:24] in the first place I want one thing that I that I think was probably it might be it's a very important
[02:51:35] part of my life when I was in the teams I my first platoon and I like figured out to take a
[02:51:41] step back and look around I call it detachment now because I don't know that's the word that
[02:51:46] I figured out to call it but like you're in a situation there's shit going on and no no one's
[02:51:52] making a decision and I like learn hey take a step back look around and you'll be able to see
[02:51:57] infinitely more than if you keep staring down the sights of your weapon or whatever I learned that
[02:52:03] clearing oil rigs and training and then I started applying it and everything I did but then at
[02:52:08] some point I started applying it to like you know having a conversation with my platoon chief and my
[02:52:12] platoon chief starts getting mad about something I'm thinking instead of me being in the moment like
[02:52:17] in my own head getting mad back and escalating the situation and now I'm just yelling
[02:52:22] match with my platoon chief I never never never did that I'd be like oh god it chief and I would take a
[02:52:26] step back and and I feel like that was helpful and is helpful to me I guess all the time
[02:52:34] because I'm always like taking a step back and saying hey well I'm not really doing what's what
[02:52:41] am I what's driving this need to do this particular thing or what's making me do this other
[02:52:47] thing or why am I not doing something else and it seems like when you go into these extreme situations
[02:52:55] it's another time where it happens like when you're freaking dog ass tired or you're freezing cold
[02:53:00] you know it's like I was telling that story about my my SDV buddy that was just like I don't want
[02:53:06] to be doing this anymore and you take that step back you feel anything like that like in these
[02:53:11] sweat lodges where bro you can only suffer so much and then you got to just like take a step
[02:53:17] back and look at your whole life except yeah you have to let go see it's like yeah it's the art
[02:53:25] of like letting go it's art of detaching like and that's when you go from that kind of physical
[02:53:33] to spiritual where where you're no longer holding onto anything and you're just being and that's when
[02:53:41] we spend so much time asking and wanting things but no time listening just being still and listening
[02:53:55] well you know in those places you know I'm like you know your mind's going a million miles an hour
[02:54:02] and you're like I got to get high like all these things like oh this things are popping up everywhere
[02:54:05] I don't know Betty I wonder she's not who's Betty like all these things are coming right and
[02:54:11] and then also when you when you learn to quiet your mind and be still and begin to listen the
[02:54:16] things that you need for your life out of the nothingness comes to that I don't know how to explain
[02:54:22] it scientifically or by like an elaborate like whatever but I'm telling you right now the the
[02:54:29] when you look at like Jesus for instance right like Jesus really like I mean I mean Jesus wasn't
[02:54:35] a religion okay Jesus basically said love your neighbor has yourself well to love yourself you
[02:54:43] have to know who self is or you only love the idea of self so you have to know what your self is
[02:54:49] right and then the kingdom of God it's in you okay it's actually within you and then like those
[02:54:57] leaders of the day is like by the way those dudes are liars and they're gonna kill me but you know
[02:55:03] whatever so he was a cataclysm he was a nuclear bomb dropped on culture of the day okay so
[02:55:10] we think of cataclysm we think of meteorites or floods or earth fractures or whatever solar flares
[02:55:18] but a powerful idea that speaks to the core of who we all are as people is a cataclysm and he was a
[02:55:24] cataclysm of the day but his message was simple right you have to love what you have to
[02:55:29] you have to love yourself we have to know who itself is and you have to love yourself then you have to
[02:55:34] love your neighbor the same way right and then the kingdom of God it's in you it's in you so you have
[02:55:41] to go within and so what does he do he goes up there and he doesn't have food or water for 40 days right
[02:55:46] and then you know they kill him and then by the way he comes walking through walls like by the way
[02:55:51] you never die okay thanks for the message right I mean that's the message like if you look at
[02:55:59] through all about history it's always the same know that itself it's inscribed in the oracle of
[02:56:05] delhi and every year we have a different saying it heroes and horses that's on the belt buckle
[02:56:09] set the guys get when they graduate it's coveted belt buckle and everyone they have a different
[02:56:15] saying in this year is gonna is the saying is know that I sell and you know one year we had
[02:56:21] think greater than you feel you know we have all these other ones but know that I self and I think
[02:56:25] that's just kind of kind of stay there forever now I'm done making up slogans I think like
[02:56:32] know that myself is a powerful thing right and so that is inscribed in gold at the oracle of delhi
[02:56:38] 1400 BCE it hasn't nothing has changed it's set for know that myself I'll caveat that or else
[02:56:47] other people that actually know what you are will use you to create their own kingdom and enslave you
[02:56:53] that's that's what it is this is this is reminding me of uh I don't know we were doing a podcast
[02:57:01] a while ago and we asked a question something it was like legit I think it was legitimate dating advice
[02:57:07] someone was asking or they got dumped or something like this and so I was saying and I've given
[02:57:13] this answer a few times on the podcast hey when you're when you get dumped and you get broke up
[02:57:17] and you're all heartbroken I I try and explain that like hey the person that you were in love with
[02:57:25] that cheated on you or that you know ran away or whatever they did the person that you were
[02:57:31] in love with actually didn't exist they didn't exist that girl that seemed so sweet but then she
[02:57:38] cheated on you or whatever you were in love with this idea of this person and and now it's gone
[02:57:44] you have to accept the fact that the person that you were in love with actually didn't exist and it
[02:57:47] kind of is a good thing you go oh wait a second I'm all heartbroken now whom I can
[02:57:52] marry now whom I need to spend the rest of my life with oh no actually the person that I thought
[02:57:55] I was going to marry and the person I thought I was going to spend the rest of my life with didn't
[02:57:58] exist that this girl was not a good person and now I got to learn that now I can move forward
[02:58:04] but what I'm relating this to what you're talking about is when people look at themselves and they
[02:58:11] got this idea of themselves that they're kind of maybe not in love with but they at least like yeah
[02:58:16] you know I'm this or I'm that I'm a fighter I'm a soldier I'm a Wall Street dude or whatever
[02:58:23] you are you have this idea of yourself like hey you know I kind of love who I am
[02:58:29] and then there's something going on where you actually don't love that person and because you know
[02:58:36] that that person that your portraying doesn't actually exist it's a projection it's a projection
[02:58:41] and so that's a rude awakening and I think that can be a rude awakening when someone gets out of
[02:58:46] the military and is all of a sudden saying oh the person that I was which was a soldier a sailor
[02:58:54] an airman or marine that person all of a sudden they literally don't exist anymore and you can
[02:58:59] try and hang onto it but it's got it's it's not gonna be there you don't like you said you don't
[02:59:05] have your friends you don't have a word you don't have a puttoon anymore you don't have a puttoon anymore
[02:59:10] it's think about how heartbreaking it is when you don't have a puttoon anymore it's a freaking
[02:59:16] horror show it's everything I love a sailpatoon and all of a sudden you don't have a sailpatoon anymore
[02:59:22] you don't have it doesn't exist anymore for you and so you can't you you have to figure out okay
[02:59:26] what what am I really and you got a dig in there and figure that out and you know I think for me again I was
[02:59:35] always like a rebellious kid growing up blah blah blah and I always was like questioning myself and
[02:59:42] I don't know I think when when even when I was in the seal teams like there was I look at some
[02:59:49] leadership and be like this guy is whatever this this guy's not me right this guy's legitimately
[02:59:55] not me like I know who my guys are I don't know what we're like but that guy's he's not really
[02:59:59] one of us and there's a bunch of people that aren't really one of us so I always kind of felt that
[03:00:04] and it was okay when okay now I'm gonna move on to my next job whatever I got out of the navy
[03:00:09] retired from the navy but man trying to figure out trying to make sure that you know who you are
[03:00:18] and make sure that who you are isn't a construct I just used your word to the day
[03:00:23] construct I'm the one who I don't use that word that's an interesting word I don't you don't
[03:00:26] really use that word that construct that you built it might not be for real and if it's not for real
[03:00:34] that's gonna it's gonna sting and all but it's gonna sting it's gonna hurt but cool now you know
[03:00:38] that now you can figure it out now you can get in there start doing work baseline you got to hit
[03:00:44] though you got to hit the bottom of the bowl you know where where where the projection doesn't protect
[03:00:49] you anymore listen you can you can you can dress up all day put on the MMA stuff or whatever and
[03:00:54] until you know you get freaking spun kicked in the side of your head and then the projection doesn't
[03:00:58] work anymore right like and that's life we were all you know everybody's living some form of
[03:01:03] projection at some point in their life and you know the thing is as those projections fade you
[03:01:09] become depressed and you become disenfranchised and the thing is like you don't have to be if you
[03:01:14] have one job really in your life is to wake up and just be yourself and then you can't fail
[03:01:24] it's impossible like sure it doesn't mean I do dumb shit I do dumb shit I say things I have
[03:01:29] around second gas my shit I don't call my wife I should have never said that she's like honey
[03:01:34] but then she's like it doesn't matter because that's just how you are just be okay with that and so
[03:01:39] you just if everybody just woke up and just and just where there's authentic self the entire world
[03:01:45] would be a completely different place like think about like think about filters think about a filter on
[03:01:50] a cell phone right you got some like lady where like the other Botox is failing shit's going down
[03:01:56] probably was hot exosperies and Dallas like you know but you know she's kind of like that she's
[03:02:01] kind of a little trophy and then and then she puts the filter on and you're like boom right
[03:02:06] and love with the projection of themselves you know it's like the worst thing is you see
[03:02:10] everybody sitting on the bus and I'm sitting on the bus you know the today and everyone's like
[03:02:15] you can see them over there like liking they're like and they're like LOL LOL like heart hurt LOL like
[03:02:22] happy smiley face right like they're the saddest looking people you know dudes like the
[03:02:26] alleys or gross or mask is on croquet they're hair is just fucked up they got two cell phones
[03:02:31] like LOL LOL right it's all a projection it's a total projection and so like we have to stop
[03:02:39] being projections and get back to the basics of who we are but unfortunately we put projections
[03:02:46] in these places where we try to be like somebody else rather than being ourselves and that's
[03:02:52] just drawing the fabric of humanity and you know if you look at you know you look at Chinese culture
[03:03:01] they're all simulated everyone's wearing the same clothes everyone's doing the same things everyone's
[03:03:06] serving the same people they're all born from Chinese mothers they're all you know they all have this
[03:03:11] they all have this plan in place this 10,000 year destiny okay what are we trying to do we're trying
[03:03:17] to like you know we're trying to make the rent you know we're trying to like you know we're trying
[03:03:21] to pass the bill you know we're trying to you know you look at these people well I don't want that
[03:03:26] either that is a nightmare there is no individualality like what do you exist you exist to serve the
[03:03:31] state well you exist here in North America to serve the projection the projection oh I'm going to
[03:03:37] go why I'm going to buy the car so that when people see me they'll think I'm successful even though
[03:03:43] I work at in and out which I'm not no dings on and out actually props to the in and out
[03:03:48] yeah by the way then they just do some great stuff or something they would do
[03:03:53] co-vaxxers and I don't know shout out to the in and out
[03:03:55] they're good writers like you know or whatever like you you but like you'll see people will buy
[03:04:00] things and do things and extend themselves to a point to fulfill a projection and it's so empty
[03:04:07] because there's never enough there's always a new thing there's always another thing so your
[03:04:12] whole life is giving me a projection and that's why people are the quintessentially lost
[03:04:16] they are they are literally have their self standing next to them in their life and they're completely
[03:04:23] in the material realm everything is material the five senses there's nothing else beyond that so in
[03:04:30] that case I have to chase these projections down get that one get the next one get the next one
[03:04:35] so on and so forth that's why like filters and all those things like they're cancer because
[03:04:40] they they they are nothing more than a project you don't look like that you don't you're not
[03:04:46] that way like the crate it's if you take a step back and think about this hey I got a
[03:04:53] when I send a picture to my friends I'm gonna run it through a computer program that makes me
[03:04:59] look better like that's crazy because it drives it it's put us into all forms of chaos as a society
[03:05:11] right like where I mean you think about you know this whole thing on climate change everything that's
[03:05:16] happening in the world is like I think the debate is like are we causing climate change or are we just
[03:05:21] destroying the environment right well we are 100% destroying the environment um and for what
[03:05:29] so you can have like another table another mahogany table okay like or more diamonds you know
[03:05:38] because I love you and I want you to have this diamond that was mined by children
[03:05:43] in Africa it smuggled over here so that we can be together for a year
[03:05:48] and then you can take it out of everything I have but you know it's it's this whole bizarre
[03:05:53] thing where it's like we don't even care about anything except for enforcing our own projections
[03:05:59] so it's like hey maybe we shouldn't like chop down every tree because maybe what I breathe out
[03:06:04] the tree breeze in with the tree breeze out I breathe in maybe we shouldn't be dumping the chemicals into
[03:06:08] the rivers what is that almost every river in North America now contains glycophate in it right so
[03:06:14] it's bleeding in from um and pk from mass farming and agriculture the soils dying I mean I'm
[03:06:20] with ranchers I'm in rural I'm in agriculture people that's my life and you you listen to these old
[03:06:27] guys kneel down and pick up the soil dead right and where's all this stuff going where's all these
[03:06:33] things going what's happening around us is that people only care about their own projections
[03:06:40] and the very things that give them life they're destroying to further something that does only
[03:06:45] exist fictitiously as an idea and it's a scary time to be living in right now it's like you know
[03:06:52] here we are like Ukraine like Russia like look out like wow like they're coming they're gonna get us
[03:06:56] all like their actions and and it's like okay but you're really concerned about their borders but
[03:07:04] like what about like our borders like aren't those important to know only the ones in Ukraine
[03:07:13] and it's you get sold these illusions and and in turn we destroy every single thing around us
[03:07:22] including ourselves and if we don't change we're coming into an epoch we're coming into a time
[03:07:32] a real time that we will become unrecognizable to ourselves and when I see guys coming and they're
[03:07:39] on 11 medications or on 8 medications there have been in therapy for 10 years and they're unrecognizable
[03:07:45] to themselves they are unrecognizable they look in the mirror they don't know what they are
[03:07:51] they only exist as a projection of an identity and you know yeah it's like sorry for the
[03:07:59] doing gloom you know believe me you listen to this podcast little bit more we got to do
[03:08:05] we got to play there is like there is like an IT for he's like a machete like
[03:08:11] I get the the weird thing is is as you look at this stuff in a large scale
[03:08:19] all these things are in place you know when you just were saying that about vets
[03:08:25] you're on a bunch of medications and you're being basically subdued you know you're being subdued
[03:08:34] and it's not just vets it's like humans humans are being subdued look we don't really actually
[03:08:40] want you to do anything we don't actually want you to come up with your own ideas we don't
[03:08:45] actually want you to write your own freaking books we don't want you to create something what we want
[03:08:51] you to do is continue to feed our machine that we've got work and over here that's what we want
[03:08:58] we want to feed our machine and we don't want you to feed your own machine and that that's
[03:09:04] that's like what is actually happening because people spend as I don't know what you say 37
[03:09:10] years in front of a screen or whatever it was you're not gaining when you're doing that that's not
[03:09:14] for you that's for them that's what they can sell you they can sell you to whoever their
[03:09:20] advertisers are so you can buy more of their stuff that's what's happening it's your energy they need
[03:09:25] your energy see everything is energy they need you and I say they okay like corporate
[03:09:36] accresies government whatever it is marketing companies data capture people whatever you see they need
[03:09:44] your attention in your attention is your energy and that is the impetus for them to grow but if you're
[03:09:50] using your own energy to do your own thing that's problematic that's scary that's really scary for
[03:09:58] that right it's terrible and they can't have it for anybody running around so what they want you
[03:10:02] running around with a projection you need all these things to help your projection and it is
[03:10:08] this is like almost cliche right now it's cliche for me to say what I'm about to say there are
[03:10:14] psychologists and scientists and computer programmers or whatever they're called sitting
[03:10:21] figuring out literal ways to make you look at the screen more to add it to you to that that's
[03:10:29] what they're actually doing they're actually doing that they're actually doing that and you're
[03:10:33] by the way you're paying them to do it in many ways you're actually giving them money to do this
[03:10:37] so that they can get you to not think for yourself and I'm not saying like oh think for yourself
[03:10:42] come up with some crazy don't think for yourself yeah like actually think about what's going on
[03:10:46] around you instead you're just receiving what someone else is telling you which what they're
[03:10:50] telling you to do is waste more time looking at this and and and to buy whatever product it is
[03:10:55] that they're making this is what what's actually happening I think about like what have you
[03:11:00] read the middlegram experiments oh yeah it's crazy right yeah well two thirds of the people killed
[03:11:05] the person because they got a white coat told them to right so it's already figured out we already
[03:11:12] understand how to like grow human beings and to get them to give their attention and focus into
[03:11:18] developing whatever whatever it is is going for your attention needs you it doesn't exist without you
[03:11:24] I mean our founding fathers are pretty smart we the people okay you know they're interested
[03:11:31] that there's a power associated with the people you know the people united the people you know
[03:11:37] believing in the goodness and the opportunity that was afforded by this nation and and instead
[03:11:43] we we have fractured ourselves among the most trivial things and then given our energy and then
[03:11:50] we can plan about the very thing that we feed to build we can plan about it when we are
[03:11:57] responsible for paying for the bricks the prison keepers the uniforms everything and so
[03:12:03] turn your attention to something else if you took that same time you know between 14 and 23
[03:12:07] years watching TV in your life let's just say take one year out of that maybe get 22 years in
[03:12:13] Netflix and all right take one of those years and and just solely dedicated to yourself and if you do
[03:12:22] well you will regain time because time is accelerating extremely fast and it's accelerating because
[03:12:30] because time is only realized by the experiences that are contained in it right so like like
[03:12:37] you know I've heard it said like one million years with one event or 10 minutes with 50,000 events
[03:12:46] every moment of our life is filled with with with with an experience and so we realized time and time
[03:12:52] accelerates and we accelerate our own time and life it's like at the end of the day you're like
[03:12:58] man like you feel like you live the lifetime because you realized every moment of that day
[03:13:05] and none of it was spent with you none of it and so you feel disconnected all right well don't worry
[03:13:12] take a vacation down the Disney we're gonna get you patched up you know have a couple margaritas
[03:13:19] and eat four meals a day it's vacation can soon right and so this built-in acceleration that's
[03:13:27] happening that we feel in the world right now is caused because all of our energy is directed towards
[03:13:34] that and so I think that we can walk away and you know I've walked away you know I kind of started
[03:13:42] out when I first started this I didn't know it's social media I had nothing I'm like okay I'm
[03:13:45] starting a foundation like I got to get an Instagram you know so I used to look back I like the
[03:13:50] Instagram I had it was like I didn't I didn't even know what a hashtag was you know I was like
[03:13:56] it I was like it was like me like chopping wood and I'm like do work or something I had the worst
[03:14:01] things but then they kind of grew and I got to like almost 20,000 people and I was like sharing
[03:14:05] ideas and then and then I you know throughout you know my experience of going through the program
[03:14:10] every season because I'm out there doing it all right I'm not out there like standing there like you
[03:14:15] know I'm living it with the guys I'm feeling it I'm feeling ice I'm feeling the cold I'm you know
[03:14:21] I'm hitting the ground riding the cold so I'm like at 10,000, 11,000 feet I'm building the
[03:14:26] can I'm feeling every moment I'm in the sweat lodge I'm doing I'm not like this like kind of passive
[03:14:31] participant I'm there and then I just realize I have to walk away like I have to just do it so I
[03:14:39] just I just deleted it and I just walked away and man all these like anxieties and things like
[03:14:45] and what a way you know of course like my foundation has it and all those kind of things and then like
[03:14:50] I don't know like a year later I was like I'm gonna start it off again I got a message
[03:14:56] just here at the world and what do I start doing next thing I know I'm sucking back in the
[03:15:01] hole I'm in there and I'm doing this and then I just and I just stopped I was like I'm done for
[03:15:05] the rest of my life I'm never doing that again and it's like it's the battered wife's a drovita
[03:15:11] that's like that's what I had and and I looked and people can choose whatever they want to do
[03:15:15] whatever but I'm just saying for my life I needed to realize that my energy need to be directed
[03:15:21] at something else and that I wasn't being you know I wasn't fulfilling and maximizing my potentials
[03:15:27] of person because I was spending my time just start and I was like you know consciously like this
[03:15:32] is not a projection this is who I am this is but then of course I'm like I don't like that
[03:15:36] I will love handle like I'm like I'm gonna get on a side shot here with the axe
[03:15:41] then the remote will earn is here to photoshop right away like photoshop you know just you know
[03:15:47] three bucks you get the abs it's no big deal this is the freaking man wilderness filter
[03:15:52] yeah exactly exactly so you know so I'm trying to change like I we haven't bought meat from the store
[03:15:59] in four years you know I sold my beloved pickup truck to my good buddy team guy and I bought a
[03:16:07] 66 foot by 17 foot wide geothermal greenhouse and an excavator and working my land and you know we
[03:16:16] have the ranch and you know training my horses and like my kids like they don't have any tech
[03:16:21] they don't have any screen I have the iPad and many of those things teaching them the real basic
[03:16:27] things like and I started realizing how much time I was actually spending doing the things that
[03:16:34] I'm actually railing against you know and so little tiny changes one step out of time you know
[03:16:42] so do you not have a vehicle no I have a vehicle but no I had this truck I had the 75
[03:16:47] forward high boy put a 429 co-project and I was sick red lifted it was all you know it was cool
[03:16:53] guy like one mile of the gallon when I started like a bird died you know it was like that kind of
[03:16:58] truck and I loved it and I always wanted that grown up as a kid you know I mean the forward high boy
[03:17:04] was cool when I was a kid and but I sold that and I bought things and and I've really
[03:17:10] changed the relationships in my life and even the things that I exposed myself to and the
[03:17:16] content and those kind of things radical quiet time in the morning you know like like not just like
[03:17:22] working out and getting in my son or whatever but like like learning to just sit there and be still
[03:17:28] and thoughtless and then like you know get to the place where I can do that for 40 minutes without
[03:17:34] without a thought and just breathe nothing and then all of a sudden I have all these realizations
[03:17:40] about things I don't know where they come from I do know where they come from right you get plugged in
[03:17:47] that energy is real and you get plugged into it that's what guys find listen there's days in the
[03:17:52] backcountry where it's like everyone's kind of chatty and then they'll be like days where you're on a horse
[03:17:56] and it's like nobody says a word it's just like man you can like it's amazing everyone's
[03:18:05] real talking about the first like 12 minutes of a forced road march you know this is gonna smell
[03:18:10] a little bit of a little bit of a little bit like 30 minutes in dead silence for the next four
[03:18:15] hours as you just on but out you trapped in there in your own little brain do you think that you were
[03:18:20] do you think that you made the sail team or sail team is made you?
[03:18:29] probably a little bit of both well yes a little bit of both I can I can tell you like from my
[03:18:34] experience of like going through buds I was never gonna quite a never thought about quitting I was just like
[03:18:39] I was so stoked and happy like this is what we're doing this is what I'm doing I it took me a while
[03:18:46] to figure out like I wanted to be a good seal you know that's what I wanted to be once I got
[03:18:52] in the teams I wanted to be a good seal and it took me a while to figure out what that actually was and
[03:18:57] I don't think I really figured it out until probably about five years after I retired I think I would
[03:19:02] still be mod if I'm still working on it right now but you know there were different things that
[03:19:07] I did along the way where it seemed like the team guy thing to do and then as I got older and
[03:19:13] figured out oh yeah that wasn't really exactly a good team guy thing to do now there's some
[03:19:18] core tenants that never changed and I think the ultimate one is like if you're a good team guy
[03:19:24] you put your team in front of yourself and that was seem clear to me from day one and I think that
[03:19:31] that is the ultimate sort of the ultimate quality of a good team guys like oh that guy he will do
[03:19:38] he will he he's gonna put you ahead of him and if you have a platoon full of guys and they're all
[03:19:43] putting each other ahead of themselves like that's a freaking kick ass platoon so I kind of
[03:19:50] knew that I kind of felt that way like even with the friends I had growing up it was sort of that
[03:19:56] same mentality about not being selfish and not putting yourself like not looking out for yourself
[03:20:02] and and so when I got in the teams that core belief was probably it was probably an
[03:20:09] existence when I got when I was when I got in the teams of like hey you don't put yourself
[03:20:14] ahead of your friends I think that's what I was kind of that's what me and my friends were like
[03:20:21] when I was a kid and I think that was that core tenant was there so did it get honed hell yeah they
[03:20:28] got honed but I'd say it was kind of their man yeah it's like something I feel like when I showed
[03:20:37] up at buzz it was like I felt really inferior to everybody like in the sense that
[03:20:43] everyone I was like ripped and like they were like all like you know played football and
[03:20:47] everybody was like sports athletes and everyone there and I just felt so inferior I had like the
[03:20:52] shitty tattoo like everyone made fun of not my classmates but that was the shitty tattoo
[03:20:59] oh I have a I still have it I have like a transformer tattoo but it's just like a shitty
[03:21:07] outline that was done by a friend of mine like on this arm and whatever but like I got this thing
[03:21:14] and they used to say think it up here and show everyone your stupid head and then I had to get
[03:21:18] up on the truck and then they would like everyone laugh of course everyone would laugh and
[03:21:23] then say when come down and I remember we had this one chief my instructor out there for
[03:21:27] get his like he was the one that was constantly calling me out he's like get up here and try
[03:21:31] when you're stupid tattoo and I was like whatever sounds like go out there I shall
[03:21:34] am tattoo everyone did laugh and then we'd take off on the run you know kind of the thing
[03:21:38] and then one day he's up there and I was like he's like you know if I had that tattoo like that
[03:21:46] I think I would just kill myself and I was like well if I had legs like yours I would kill myself
[03:21:51] oh damn and everybody was like and then everybody laughed for me so I I proceeded to eat
[03:21:58] a mouthful of sand and I did the run every time I lost the sand because I would slowly do a little
[03:22:04] like I would stop it I have to refill refill and I'd put the sand in and I'd run but all
[03:22:11] these instructors came up to me and they were like we got props for you because that we know
[03:22:15] that like really sucks because they're like you can't drop you know and but I just kind of like
[03:22:22] going through that like I did have that belief in myself like I had a belief in myself and I would
[03:22:28] look at that the instructors not in the sense of like they're out to keep me but that like if they
[03:22:32] could be on the other side of this experience then I could be too that's all I ever thought about was
[03:22:38] like if he can do it I can do it you know it's like that was that movie the edge or whatever
[03:22:43] with Anthony Hopkins and who's the dude that just shot the guy oh Alec Baldwin he just shot
[03:22:51] it that I'm a female actually yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah but Marie did that movie the edge
[03:22:59] he's a little bit like what one man can do another man can do like and I kind of like I
[03:23:06] mean I would say I was like thinking about that movie but like in my own way I I thought like
[03:23:11] and if somebody else can be standing there with that shirt on I could be standing there with that
[03:23:15] shirt on you know and I think pressure I think those experiences just reveal who we really are
[03:23:21] and I think that everybody could make it if they had the ability to look in at that you know that
[03:23:27] fire and the gut or whatever but too often not it's too enticing to ring out I was uh I was not
[03:23:35] graded anything right I wasn't the fastest runner I wasn't the fastest one or kind like I
[03:23:39] said you I wasn't like a great athlete I was like maybe slightly below average athlete in high
[03:23:44] school and then even I got to the team so it was like I was never gonna win anything yeah so I was
[03:23:49] felt like I had to work harder and to be a good team guy and the quitting thing is crazy actually
[03:23:57] when you look at the things that happened with people like incredible athletes like I was literally
[03:24:05] above the low average athlete and I was young you know so like even if you went to college you
[03:24:10] your mortgage developed with me the difference between a 18 year old and a 22 year old is a big
[03:24:15] freaking difference but you know I I had college athletes D1 college athletes had an Olympic alternate
[03:24:24] for gymnastics which is crazy quit uh wrestler D1 wrestler quit. Ressler really? Yes.
[03:24:31] You think I think so I think so I'm actually I want my one of my swim buddies
[03:24:38] rang out in like um the after hell week in dive phase we're doing something in the pool and
[03:24:46] I'm I think we're doing buddy breathing in the pool and so I'm passing it my regulator and I'm
[03:24:51] taking two breaths and he's taking nine and this dude was from like Iowa or something he's never
[03:24:58] really the ocean before and he was super pale so he was just sunburn he looked bright red like the
[03:25:04] entire time and and so I'm doing you know taking whatever two breaths given him he's taking nine
[03:25:10] and finally he just stands up we're in four feet of water and the pool he just stands up and he
[03:25:14] goes at surface and I'm like down there and I think well okay so I stand up and he's just calling
[03:25:20] out like hey I quit I'm out of here this is I'm not doing this after hell week so that water thing
[03:25:25] can get a little bit crazy on some people yeah the water thing is legit you know I've had some so
[03:25:32] I mean I was drowned in Afghanistan and yeah I had like some I've had that happen I had some
[03:25:40] cross in a river and the a rope that I was attached to got wrapped around a rock and I'm really
[03:25:48] know how much I can say about because of the nature of where we were and all those things that
[03:25:52] were going to river I was in a river yeah and so basically I had gone down there once checked it out
[03:26:00] it was much more intense than anticipated you know and I had this like idea like about this water
[03:26:05] up and all those kind of things I'm getting studying it and there was a really there's a mission
[03:26:09] that we needed to get done that had not been successful previously and I was in this this this this
[03:26:15] space with with some guys and just kind of like really amped up on this you know first water up all the
[03:26:19] things so go down there the second time with like a hundred meters of one inch tubular nylon
[03:26:27] all tied together and right in the alice pack and the plan was that I would go upstream and offset
[03:26:34] and then swim down either side then pull the equipment set off a hoist system so that you know we
[03:26:39] could zip line all this stuff and get everybody across the sound of good so it was like a you know
[03:26:44] class for rapids way way way north and so it starts off I'm down there I got my my boots on
[03:26:53] I got my stuff in my second time now and I've been watching this thing drone footage all the
[03:26:57] things I've been observing this for a long time I understood the flow of the river and there was
[03:27:01] a dog leg which was like the point of no return like if you went there there was a huge cave and
[03:27:06] I would watch on the footage like logs like trees did go in there and like days later would be like
[03:27:12] blue come out so I knew if I went in there that I wouldn't live and so I go down there and
[03:27:21] I start going like upstream so now this is the you're executing the miss I'm well I'm doing
[03:27:25] the I'm basically doing the recon to see a proof of concept and so we're down there I got
[03:27:32] guys set up security the whole day I'm down there I'm like preling nervous I'm like whoa this is like
[03:27:36] I'm like insurance and like you know this is like really a wild place and there's huge cliffs
[03:27:42] so there's only kind of one way in this water to the to the river so I kind of start
[03:27:47] going up well I end up getting like sucked into a cave that I couldn't see it was just like a
[03:27:51] dark spot on the on the on the aerial and they like let all the rope go the rope can
[03:27:57] all tangled up around me I'm like a cat grabbing on the sides like I can't grab on anything so
[03:28:01] I'm end up making it to the beach now I can't I can't get back there's no way to get back
[03:28:06] unless I do that again I'm not going in that cave nobody has any ideas like one o'clock in the
[03:28:10] morning so finally I go up and I get the the rope and I get it taught and I'm on the beach and I'm
[03:28:17] like I sit down I have a rigor's belt on with a carabiner my boots fins and no shirt
[03:28:24] a pair of shorts and a speed out underneath because I have to contain that thing just kidding so
[03:28:33] that's a lot see it's a projection and so anyway I'm like so I'm sitting there and I can tell you I honestly
[03:28:40] felt like a lot of fear I felt afraid because like the waves were so big it was like whoa
[03:28:46] so I'm like okay okay like just like just fucking Michael helps it like you can do it that and like
[03:28:51] so I get into the water and I start like swimming as hard as I can and I was the unprepared for the
[03:28:57] violence of that water it literally swept me away and as I'm like flying down I'm like I kind of get
[03:29:06] like almost to where the dog leg is to get to the other side and so everybody's like in this
[03:29:12] water there's guys up here on this mountain and these two mountains and this is all like cliffs
[03:29:17] and it's kind of not cliff-y on the other side and you know that was the plan so as it's like
[03:29:22] turning like this I kind of get to here and there's a boulder in the center and the rope
[03:29:26] goes right around the boulder which just they're holding an anchor and I just become like a
[03:29:32] flapping parachute and it just sucks me underneath and my feet going underneath the boulder
[03:29:38] and I had a UDT life vest on so I pulled a little thing which I've never done in my whole training
[03:29:44] and I was like and it just ripped right off was like a toilet and my shoes are gone everything's
[03:29:49] gone. Fins gone shorts are gone. I'm in my speed of all this is happening very quick and I realize
[03:29:55] like I'm drowning and I try to unhook the carabiner physically can't I'm not strong enough and
[03:30:03] I'm no like cream puff like I I couldn't physically the current was so strong and I'm trying to move
[03:30:08] the rope one and a half inches to get it out of that and it was to stupid little like black
[03:30:14] issue like locking carabiner you know where I got to twist the thing a half turn and like
[03:30:19] and I'm like and I started like really I started drowning and I started seeing like you know
[03:30:24] these kind of like I guess like you would say a hallucination or whatever I started like seeing
[03:30:28] all kinds of crazy images and I started feeling like I'm going out unconscious like this is like
[03:30:33] and I remember saying like please god they'll let me like drown enough canis and and and then
[03:30:39] meanwhile these guys are like everyone's piling down off the hill like thinking I'm like dead
[03:30:44] they saw me like zip by and so they're heavowing and they're like heavowing heavowing there's a lot of
[03:30:49] rope so they end up like heavowing the rope off the rock and like I right when I'm like about to
[03:30:55] totally just drown and I remember the singing buzz dry drowning is better than wet drowning dry
[03:31:00] drowning is better I mean don't breathe in because you can be resuscitated but if you suck in
[03:31:05] your toast like all that water is going to go in your lungs you know being a medic like it too and
[03:31:11] I just have seen dry drowning is better than wet drowning and I just refused to breathe in and then
[03:31:15] awesome and I like pop up into the foam and I remember like gagging in and sucking all this foam
[03:31:21] and I'm like and I just started washing down the river again I'm just hitting rocks I'm like doing
[03:31:26] cartwheels I don't know which way is up and I'm like screaming help like to know buddy
[03:31:34] and and I'm like I remember like breathing in foam and I get to the other side which they could
[03:31:41] not access me because of the the terrain and I get to their side and I'm like I'm on land and I
[03:31:48] start like crawling you know super fast to get up on shore and then they just start dragging me
[03:31:52] on my face right they're like heav oh like and and I'm like getting dragged back into the river
[03:31:58] and so I get against this boulder there's a lot of slack in the line I do kind of like a squat
[03:32:03] like and I pop the beaner off and apparently everybody like fell down and they pull it back and
[03:32:07] they're like he's alive they thought I was dead they thought I had drowned so now I'm like in my
[03:32:13] speedo with no shoes on or anything in real bad guy land like and there's like people
[03:32:18] like lights clicking driftwood there's like and so I'm like I'm crawl underneath this like outcropping
[03:32:23] and I cover myself and mud because I saw it on predator and and I mean that's really what I did
[03:32:30] I remember you know like that scene you know and and so I cover myself and mud and I just lay
[03:32:37] there to like almost like probably an hour before first light and I'm like thinking I'm going to be
[03:32:46] the first seal that ever be captured like and I was like a fuck that and I'm like I got like
[03:32:53] sticks and like rocks like piled up and I'm just like and I'm freezing that like one of the
[03:32:59] coldest moments I've ever been in my life it was the water time what time it was it was
[03:33:03] August okay but it was cold yeah super cold and we were pretty damn close to as far
[03:33:11] north as you could go and so I'm like laying there and then I see like some nods like lights and
[03:33:20] the guys have made it around come down there scanning the shore and I like popped out and like
[03:33:24] here's like mud dude with like you know cool guy no like a speedo on no shoes well I had no shoes
[03:33:30] so like they have my bag though we got to get out of here now like some like you know we're
[03:33:36] hugging like I thought you're dead we're doing that whole thing so I get my clothes and I have no
[03:33:40] shoes on into teletooth I don't remember walking back I think I just like blacked out or something
[03:33:45] like because I was so cold and I have my shoes on and I was so you know I got my gun and got
[03:33:50] all my stuff got everything we go back get the base one of the guys there one of the OGA guys
[03:33:54] sons and team guy he runs one of the branches now so sons up we get back and he was there and he's
[03:34:02] like he's like in tears he's like gonna have a drink so we go up we go on the skiff and he's like
[03:34:09] I thought you're dead and I was like why do we do this like this is terrible like you should have
[03:34:13] never done this like blah blah so it gives me a drink we have a drink and I go back to my room
[03:34:17] and I'm like that was like whoa so back to like up and it up whatever move on well my team leader
[03:34:26] comes to me like a week later he's like hey brother I think you could do that again and I'm like
[03:34:31] I'm like sure definitely like oh my room my I'm so scared I don't want to do that like that
[03:34:36] was the worst experience of my whole life like but of course I'm like yeah I'm in definitely
[03:34:40] brother like for sure like so I started like watching call these YouTube videos and I started like
[03:34:45] river crossing all this kind of stuff I'm like okay like and so I order all this equipment from the
[03:34:51] PJs and all this stuff comes up I got throwbacks rescue stuff I'm like inflatable
[03:34:56] is protects the whole deal long story sure I go back down there to prove the concept and there
[03:35:01] is people down there so we bagged ass can't get everyone up right there now everyone's hearing
[03:35:05] about this like water mission going down and the night we were supposed to go and execute we
[03:35:12] never did do it and two hours before we left I was switched out with Josh Harris who drowned and died
[03:35:20] and I was right next to him yeah so there's a lot of little details in there I'll leave out but
[03:35:25] it was a bad deal yeah and you know that experience had an impact on me for sure and so when I
[03:35:34] did the Iron Man in 2012 one of the reasons why I did the Iron Man was because as a free diver I
[03:35:40] got into serious freediving like serious I've been as well a Mexico a do all over the world that's
[03:35:45] why you were in the team's year during that when I was contracting and but I started freediving
[03:35:50] in the teams uh matter fact I came over this whole thing called spear fishing PT because we had
[03:35:55] surf PT and I was like that's not fair it's discriminating like we should have spear fishing PT
[03:36:02] which was like greatest thing because we never got back to work on time there was always some kind
[03:36:05] of issue and so we got the day off basically I know that that only lasted for like three weeks
[03:36:14] but yeah so I I had to fell even diving around the world like I mean I was going to very deep
[03:36:19] dust you know 110 feet like killing you know tune on panaman then I spent you know three weeks
[03:36:25] and then as well a diving I always had this wreck playing in my head of what had happened when I
[03:36:31] would get in situations I got my arm caught Venezuela underneath the rock at 80 feet you know
[03:36:36] and the next thing I know it's like in my head like I'm gonna have kids I'm drowning like it was
[03:36:40] crazy I'm like I got to kick this thing so I ended up like signing up for the Iron Man because I
[03:36:46] heard like the the swim is the most terrifying thing in the world which it was no good yeah I had like
[03:36:52] a pain it's a bold statement coming from that freaking afghanist is you want a bunch of like
[03:36:58] middle-aged men and women that are like you know hate their lives and trying to find themselves
[03:37:03] like you don't want to be in the water with them because they're vicious and but anyway like I'm
[03:37:09] out there and I'll never forget it like I'm a fast swimmer I I was like finished I think 112 on the
[03:37:15] swim and Iron Man which is is really good 2.4 miles and I'm out there and I started too far
[03:37:22] and advanced for my skill and then people started swimming over top of me like I was just a
[03:37:27] random boolee I mean they literally just kicked me in the face and just there was 2400 people just like
[03:37:31] swimming and I couldn't catch my breath and I got kicked in the face my goggles got kicked off and
[03:37:37] I had like I don't like I got like guys like I like the prepatabors like you need help you know like
[03:37:41] it raises over like I'm like I can't breathe I can't breathe I can't breathe I'm like oh my god I'm
[03:37:44] back and I remember this guy was like I'm never forget it he looks at me he's an a panic like me
[03:37:50] and I'm like not panicking panicking but I'm just like I can't catch my breath because every time
[03:37:55] I try to breathe I get some like you know 45 year old ladies foot toe up my nose and so he grabs
[03:38:02] on me and he's holding on to me and I'm at this buoy and I remember he's pushing me down and
[03:38:07] I got him and the paddleboards are trying to get in and I'm like in this mix and I remember I
[03:38:12] just looked at him and I was just like in that moment I like faced it and this dude was like pulling
[03:38:19] me down and I just like grabbed him by his rubber cap and I punched him between the shoulder
[03:38:23] blades as hard as I could and he was just like just like like electric shock like hit him and I was
[03:38:28] like I just like I just started like swimming and my wife has this great shot of me coming out I
[03:38:35] look like I look like I have like PTSD when I'm coming out of the water like my I have like
[03:38:39] bags of my eyes I got news for you you did yeah I came out of the water and I was like I was
[03:38:45] like totally terrified and but I never had another about what that ever got and it was a moment
[03:38:54] where I was like I knew I had like I had like finally like face that thing down which was like playing
[03:38:59] in the back of my head it was really weird when I would get into water situations or be in
[03:39:04] drowning which happened a lot like in free dive spear fishing you know and so I never had another
[03:39:11] another other issue again so it was a it was a moment of my life and I will never forget as long
[03:39:18] as I live we go offline I'll tell you somewhere details and then what what are you going on right now
[03:39:25] like with the the beef the ranch the cows like you're full on just going for it yeah I mean
[03:39:32] I just I mean my goal is so we just purchased this ranch we got a capital campaign going on
[03:39:38] and we've raised some money building a human development center there so which will be it's a 10
[03:39:43] person coal plunge a 10 person sauna a jam in the center and then a meditation room that's sound
[03:39:50] proof and then it vibrates at 520 it made the megahertz of the earth so it's very good grounding
[03:39:57] and when something's vibrating 525 megahertz do you hear it you feel it or it's not it's the earth
[03:40:04] so like if you ever if you know I always tell people like if you're having like anxiety or something
[03:40:09] like that like or you're just like you know sometimes you get that kind of like raciness or you
[03:40:13] feel like you got to like down regulate a little bit like the best thing you can go out is go outside
[03:40:17] take your shoes off stand in the ground being total silence and stand there and it usually goes away
[03:40:22] from like three to four minutes and I just breathe it's very grounding it it's very it grounds you
[03:40:28] and so you know frequencies are super important so we actually do sound with the guys and
[03:40:32] last of the guy said it was our first year doing it almost every guy said it was the most
[03:40:37] profound experience of their life we have somebody that comes in and brings those sound bowls
[03:40:42] and they bring up the resonance outside on the ranch like deep where the sweat lodges and it just
[03:40:47] vibrates it and they do these bowls and it's like whoa so some people it's so intense they vomit
[03:40:53] from it so wait you sit you lay there and these are big bowls I don't know what you're talking
[03:40:58] about yeah they're bowls and they stir them and they put the each bowl produces a frequency and
[03:41:03] they can bring you up to the resonance which ground it grounds you and so you know obviously like
[03:41:09] everything is frequency and everything is is like how are you looking at somebody on their iPhone
[03:41:15] they're like how am I talking to you how am I vibrating right now and you are somehow interpreting
[03:41:19] what I'm saying to your brain I'm literally vibrating to you and somehow you're like yeah
[03:41:25] let's go do something right go over here like and so you know that's that's that sound therapy
[03:41:32] is something that it works it's very very powerful if you've you've never tried it there's
[03:41:37] probably places here go go to a sound bath they have all these bowls all these things they'll
[03:41:41] bring you in there and because your whole life is inundated with blue light and frequencies and
[03:41:46] what Wi-Fi signals and all those kind of things so what you're doing is you're reestablishing a baseline
[03:41:51] so so yeah so the ranch we're building the human development center we got an arena going up
[03:41:56] 100 by 200 indoor arena so we can expand kind of into the winter time and then the guys live in
[03:42:02] non-electric wood cabins without door showers and an outhouse total minimalist so
[03:42:09] brings in the guys the students the students are going through yeah are going through so they
[03:42:13] do live in like little lodgepole cabins that were building that are just little bunks a little wood
[03:42:18] stove and an outdoor shower and an outhouse a double outhouse good get some about yeah get some yeah
[03:42:25] I'm our fact this year when we put the double outhouse that we forgot to put the little blanket in the
[03:42:29] center three days later the guys like hey do you know like a blanket or something I was like
[03:42:33] I'm sorry I totally forgot about that but they were using it yeah which is the survey that's one
[03:42:38] of those things that's one of the like starkest memories I have from navy blue camp was that there's
[03:42:44] no stalls in the shitters and you were just literally sitting down and there was someone sitting next to
[03:42:48] you you know a photo away taking a shit next to you it's just the removal of whatever it's kind
[03:42:55] of the removal of all privacy is gone yeah it's gone yeah it's got a hundred percent yeah
[03:43:00] poop next to you that's how much we only move in that whole next to that other dude
[03:43:06] different than before and by the way there's another dude on the other side of you that's also
[03:43:10] shitty so that's good times so you're so you're building this so this is gonna up our capacity
[03:43:16] to take more students do more yeah because right now I mean the guys are living in wall tents
[03:43:21] and everything's out all the outdoor showers all that kind of stuff the ranch we bought has
[03:43:24] basically a tiny little cabin on it that you know Abraham Lincoln's contractor bill and two
[03:43:30] pivot you know and and a small shop that had no well or anything so we popped in a well we've done
[03:43:36] all this stuff and so now we're raising money to to build that out and to expand the program
[03:43:40] to year round and you know my goal is not to have some big giant program like I think that is
[03:43:46] the problem is that everybody thinks there's like one institution that can do it all and
[03:43:52] my idea is to kind of get to a sweet spot with guys and then you know we're capturing data
[03:43:58] and then to go and to get other organizations to uplevel themselves and to begin to really
[03:44:03] start thinking about like human development and bringing forth change rather than like me saying
[03:44:08] like I can do it all and I can build this huge thing and I want to I want to network with people
[03:44:13] and have them scale up and that people that are really serious about human development and I think
[03:44:17] that will I think we'll look back in this will be a hub of you know it'll be a place where
[03:44:24] a spark formed and when people start looking at things different because the guys that graduate
[03:44:28] this program you know it's a they're they're they're they're different they're changed you know what I mean
[03:44:37] and and so I think that everybody deserves that opportunity but I can't do it all and I think that
[03:44:43] other people like I said there's 50,000 nonprofits in North America you know we spent 92 billion
[03:44:48] dollars since 2012 in the end of 2020 and it's gotten worse you know and I'm sorry and a lot of people
[03:44:56] like you know I hate me because I say you know you got organizations they got shatlin ponies
[03:45:02] that you can take and they put sneakers on them and you walk around town like my message is
[03:45:10] you know fuck you like that is that does it that does it do anything like it takes time and it
[03:45:16] takes commitment and maybe that's not for everybody and you'll have to walk your own path but I think
[03:45:21] that as all these existing institutions maybe I can find 10 maybe I can find 10 that are
[03:45:26] focused on human development maybe maybe it's saying like hey think about the change of a guy you
[03:45:31] take a guy's 75 pounds over ways on meds he's like but he wants to change and he's got the fire and
[03:45:36] you put him in a 10 week fight camp right and then think about who that guy would be at the end of
[03:45:41] 10 weeks right nutrition diet focus meditation ice bass like working out purpose like feeling
[03:45:47] good it's you're all like getting balance all those things like I mean it's it's simple
[03:45:53] but it's it's it takes effort and it takes work and so my my goal is to is to start a new conversation
[03:46:02] and bring people together about what it you know about restoring you know these guys back to the
[03:46:09] dignity of who they are it's crazy like the shit's not gonna be easy if you're gonna reset your life
[03:46:17] and dig in and find out who you are that's not gonna that's not gonna be an easy evolution
[03:46:24] no don't it's like yeah it's like yeah and it's crazy you know that that opening that
[03:46:29] read for me was like literally there are some people that are literally trying to give you a magic
[03:46:35] pill that's gonna do all this work for you like which is a crazy thing it's crazy it's insane
[03:46:42] like when you think about it but the thing is we already know the secrets of it right that's why
[03:46:47] you know the business people are like hmm let's create something called obstacle course races
[03:46:51] right like you literally climb over a log flop into the mud then some roi did out dude
[03:46:56] hit to ahead with a phone bat and then you get like a metal and then the next day in the office
[03:47:00] everyone's like whoa what's dipping about him he faced an obstacle gym and he overcame right
[03:47:08] I mean that is the asset obstacle course races like I mean we so so set that challenge in front of
[03:47:15] yourself I think we can like unite together dude different for me like I never thought you know
[03:47:20] we bought a ranch for three million bucks I met this guy he was delivering hey I started talking
[03:47:27] to me he goes oh my dad might be selling his ranch you should meet him are you looking for
[03:47:30] a ranch I'm like sure yeah definitely we worked we were seven years with no ranch
[03:47:34] at least everything set it up every year mobile gypsy camp it was a living hell imagine 70 horses
[03:47:40] not owning 16th of an acre was a nightmare and most people never saw that and so here I am like
[03:47:47] going to this guy's place I sit down a cup of coffee you know big business guy I sit down I'm like
[03:47:52] he's like so he interested in the ranch like yeah he's like well to have any money I'm like no
[03:47:57] no thanks for coming like basically it was like really nice but then never talked to me again
[03:48:04] so then like a year later he calls me up he's like I'm definitely gonna sell the ranch
[03:48:07] are you interested and I was like absolutely so I ride down there my mortar cycle and I'm like
[03:48:11] I sit down with him he pours me a cup of coffee goes do you have any money and I'm like
[03:48:17] no but I'm gonna get it because it was like it was like the jerk store with like you know
[03:48:22] with George just adds it I was like thought of this this come back like the whole year and he's like
[03:48:28] well I said I'll give you my word give me an opportunity and I'll get it and I didn't have any
[03:48:36] of that kind of resources so ended up getting alone what was that that was last year so you
[03:48:40] got the wrong against a charity yeah we got loan yeah we got loan on the ranch and so
[03:48:46] and I raised a million five from various donors and put that you know down payment whenever took a
[03:48:51] loan out and you know and we just launched a four year capital campaign to build a ranch out so
[03:48:56] some 7.5 million bucks over four years and and then you know the funny thing is about non-profits
[03:49:02] is that at own it I'm basically even though I'm the founder I'm just an employee I'll never have
[03:49:08] those assets like if the whole thing dissolved tomorrow goes to either the state or to another
[03:49:11] nonprofit and so you know I exist in this solely for the development and betterment of my fellow
[03:49:19] man and I think that you know whether it's a veteran or it's a stay-at-home or somebody recovering
[03:49:26] from a get ran over by a dumb truck or whatever it is I think that people are gonna once again
[03:49:32] begin looking to to partake in that heroes journey and that journey of self-discovery to get out of the
[03:49:39] places that they're currently in and so that's that's my goal and we're capturing data we're
[03:49:45] working with the university to get results and stuff like that so that I can go to other non-profits
[03:49:49] and sit down with that person say listen I know you give $5,000 to critically injured soldiers
[03:49:55] I also know that you have $290 million in the bank because your financials are public and online
[03:50:00] as a nonprofit maybe you could run a program that actually does something for people beyond
[03:50:08] getting on their kids' iPads maybe we can do something to a better mankind you know maybe we can do
[03:50:13] something to level up you know society our society our community in a way and and stop giving
[03:50:21] handouts and start you know giving hand-ups you know I think that handouts are a total failure I think
[03:50:30] yeah of course people have things and stuff like that you know critical things but like for the most
[03:50:34] part like you have to own it you have to earn it and you have to own it and I think we get in the
[03:50:40] opportunity business and we get out of the handout business oh you served come on and float into
[03:50:46] tube and we have a massage therapist online thank you for your Air Force time oh here's a
[03:50:51] flame and yon and a care and a raspberry like you know then a jacket and some fishing here even
[03:50:58] though you live in Detroit and you live in one bedroom apartment and you live below the poverty line
[03:51:02] like most veterans do and and maybe I'm going to give you an opportunity to change your own life
[03:51:08] but you're going to have to do the work and we get back in the opportunity business that's
[03:51:14] what I want to see happen and then hopefully you know you know in the meteorite hits the world
[03:51:20] and dinosaurs come back or everything like that it'll be like a plaque somewhere and I was like
[03:51:24] he tried to do good but it was futile they destroyed themselves aren't you aren't you trying to
[03:51:32] do something with with beef too like yeah so we're going with that yeah so so the beef model is kind
[03:51:39] of like so I I talked about the social hybrid is this nonprofits are in this perpetual
[03:51:45] starvation cycle right where you're beholden to the donors where you know you have to raise money
[03:51:50] and then you know you're constantly in this state of having to raise money because you can't
[03:51:53] generate money because you're a non-profit I didn't know that by the name when I started
[03:51:57] like why am I so broke and then like five years later I'm like wait a second non-profit
[03:52:04] and damn it so but I was like we have this ranch you know we're going to start a cattle company
[03:52:13] farm to table you know and I think that like the care of the animal from the moment it's born
[03:52:18] living and dying on the ranch treating the animal with respect you know if you've ever been
[03:52:23] to mass agriculture and you saw what it's really about it's one of the most disturbing things
[03:52:28] that you've ever seen in your life and if you've ever been to a slaughterhouse or packing plan
[03:52:31] where they're doing a thousand head a day you know they're picking them up with skid stairs and
[03:52:35] terrified adrenaline hormones like smat ages very it's not good and I think that I think that
[03:52:45] carries over to the food and so like you know raising that animal honoring that animal letting
[03:52:49] them graze letting them live letting them be out there letting them live their lives sustainably
[03:52:53] harvesting them teaching people how to do that you know integrating that and then selling that beef
[03:52:58] to donors that can then in turn support the program so the ranch stands on its own to legs so
[03:53:04] it's a social high bread it won't exist to make money but it will exist to sustain you know the
[03:53:09] program then also expose people to that animal husbandry into that ranching side of the house and then
[03:53:14] also you know down along with the beef I I think like to me food like where your food comes from
[03:53:21] is so important and it's so critical to the wellness of the individual you can expect to be happy if you're
[03:53:26] eating you know cheeses and garbage and all those kind it all is tied together your body is the
[03:53:33] subconscious mind and even down to the food that you eat and you know what I started getting exposed
[03:53:39] to this world and I started seeing things I was like man this is like rough like when you really
[03:53:44] see what's happening put to the animals and those kind of things and listen I'm not like you know
[03:53:48] out there like you know whatever like an activist or anything like that but I'm like there's a
[03:53:53] better way like the natives did it right you know they they harvested they took what they wanted
[03:53:58] they they used every component of the you know think about the waste that we have the only
[03:54:02] take the best cuts everything's dog food or this or that like and so for me it's like but
[03:54:06] you're in the whole animal using the bones to create bone broth taking the hides and making
[03:54:11] boxing gloves and and American made boxing gloves with the hides and like taking all the fat
[03:54:16] taking all those things taking the bones making biochar out of them right so like using that as a
[03:54:22] organic fertilizer that we could use on the ranch and we could give away and share with other
[03:54:26] people like using the whole animal and teaching guys those things because when they become connected
[03:54:31] to their food they start to understand the system that they're a part of you know I tell people
[03:54:37] the whole world is like your life is held together by a wire okay a wire so like if the wire breaks
[03:54:45] meaning like the power goes out millions will die within weeks from a wire like oh I'll hunt you're
[03:54:53] not gonna hunt you're not gonna make it out of your high rise you're gonna like you'll be in a
[03:54:58] 25 million dollar tomb okay the water comes out what are you gonna do it's over a cable a cable
[03:55:06] breaks the internet goes out and millions die and I think that so many guys like common they
[03:55:12] realize and they change their whole lives because they start to realize the role that we pay in the
[03:55:16] system and how you know how everything is now handed to you and you take for granted all those
[03:55:23] aspects and so my goal is to stand up that that system and that human development program and then
[03:55:30] begin to get other people to do the same thing and I want to expand a community you know and
[03:55:35] that's my goal so that's what's going on with the beef and just I mean I talk a lot well and not a lot
[03:55:42] I talk about China China yeah China and you know we saw a lot of this during COVID
[03:55:49] like where do we depend and on but we're dependent on China food and a lot of people don't
[03:55:55] recognize that China let me China China is coming for us I tell people I'm like if you look at
[03:56:04] Mao during the Chinese industrial revolution the Great Leap Forward Mao knew that he needed
[03:56:10] nuclear technology there's been five emperors in China emperors you want that's what I'll call
[03:56:15] dictators whatever leaders great ones whatever dragonlords so like microcrash and so
[03:56:24] but if you look at what they did he understood that they needed nuclear technology so what do
[03:56:29] do he traded food to the Russians and exchange for nuclear technology star-dismone people 30
[03:56:35] million people died during peacetime and he got the nuclear weapon they have a 5,000 year plan
[03:56:42] all right they understand that by by enslaving their own people for cheap labor because Americans
[03:56:49] exist for consumption I want it now and I want to cheap and you know it's like my house I go in there
[03:56:57] how many how much shit do I need right it's cheap it's only three bucks another potato dealer
[03:57:04] you never know so so so so chop me potato peelers did you actually have five I did have five
[03:57:11] so I did have I kept two shout out to queez and art but I I was like if you look at them they're
[03:57:18] smart because what they did is they understood the American psychology they understand that Americans
[03:57:23] are overconfident because from childhood they're told you're the best you're good you get praise
[03:57:29] for things you never deserved they're entitled and lazy Chinese are the opposite right
[03:57:35] so they're like marching forward to their 5,000 year destiny and so what are we do we outsource
[03:57:42] everything to them for super cheap goods and in turn handcuff ourselves to them right including our
[03:57:49] medications the world's most critical medications are men trying and so you know China is on the move
[03:57:55] and their military is now expeditionary they're providing aid to foreign countries they've
[03:57:59] got their jets and let me they got hypersonic missiles and let me tell you something they're not
[03:58:04] over here like trying to pass the PT test okay oh didn't you know gotta go to FAP because I didn't
[03:58:11] make it by the way my rights matter you don't tow the line in the Chinese army you wind up as
[03:58:17] biochar okay they don't know need for you and and GZing Ping said that you know if we try to
[03:58:24] stand against the China this is two months ago and a live speech he said on their show of force
[03:58:27] and he said you will meet a great wall of steel made by 1.8 billion Chinese that are unified
[03:58:35] what are we over here like don't go over here like I don't like you like so they banned all
[03:58:41] girly men on TV there is no boy bands allowed social media turns off at 10 o'clock at night
[03:58:48] and and what are they preparing for to be a world leader and who are they in lock
[03:58:54] stuff with the Russians right and and because they see the United States to wind the link
[03:58:59] because consumption consumerism entitlement over confidence and and and this desire to tell
[03:59:07] people what's right and wrong you know like we have these things on the what happened in Afghanistan
[03:59:13] right we're no longer a force for good we aren't we better rethink because this enemy is not like
[03:59:19] an Afghani running around in pajamas these dudes are probably genetically modified who knows what
[03:59:25] they're gonna do they might unzip their fake Chinese bodies and come out and just be like who knows
[03:59:30] right we they are genetically modifying super soldiers for just that or was it a time or whatever
[03:59:35] just had a thing on them so we are facing a time right now where this entitlement and all these
[03:59:42] things that we have are coming home to roost on us and you know buyer beware because if the cable
[03:59:49] breaks if the earth even burps okay if it just rumbles in the wrong place and the power goes out
[03:59:56] for say two months millions upon there won't be enough excavators to dig the holes for the bodies
[04:00:04] that will burn people because oh no but it's the truth think about it if you're living in a 25
[04:00:13] million dollar high rise on the 98th floor and the power goes out where do you get your next sandwich
[04:00:21] from by time you make it down every store will be gone now the food will be gone there will be
[04:00:26] no water your well pumps won't just think about it life is held together by a cable and we never
[04:00:33] think that that cable is going to ever break and you know who's holding part of that cable
[04:00:38] network is China and I don't think that China would have picked a fight with us but I think we've
[04:00:44] picked a fight with them and because here we are just bloating bloating bloating bloating bloating
[04:00:50] and and and they're refining refining refining refining refining so I mean if if put in a
[04:00:58] vase you crane I bet you I bet you you see China China go after Taiwan simultaneously I wouldn't be
[04:01:04] surprised and and they could launch hypersonic missiles and vaporize our fleet in two seconds and then
[04:01:09] it's either go nuclear or stand down I think I don't know what's what's today just for reference
[04:01:16] today is the 24th of January nice I think that bootens going in I think you crints I think it's on
[04:01:24] and I think it's what he's doing he's looking at Biden who's compromised and he is
[04:01:32] it breaks it breaks my heart and Russia is a bonepic because think about it we Eisenhower screwed them
[04:01:37] over because we're supposed to pay them all that money and we never did and then we chased them over to
[04:01:43] right over to Afghanistan you know cause problems over there walked on them over there did the
[04:01:48] cold war ripped the walls down with crushed her economy did all these things right and now we're telling
[04:01:54] them oh you can't go across those borders and they're just like meanwhile the Russians are over there
[04:02:00] like every guy is like kabib yeah there's a like kill kill kill kill kill how guys are over here like
[04:02:07] stand down people are being mean we're they're gonna call us back oh yeah not all Americans are
[04:02:14] like that there's definitely too many of that I mean there's definitely plenty of Americans I
[04:02:18] were I work with a lot of young military folks and man they are yeah there's kids ready to rock and roll
[04:02:24] but I don't know if the country is I'm if the country's willing to sacrifice like in those
[04:02:29] situations our guts are ripped out I mean think about 20 year war you think you think about like the
[04:02:35] United States there was a USA article last year it's it's worth checking out even though they're kind of
[04:02:40] like whatever but like they have a article with a moving map on it called the cost of war
[04:02:47] if you go if you look it up or Dr. Gore whatever brave it and you will see a moving map and it
[04:02:53] shows last year the United States you know wedged war in 88 countries okay so we we had we had an 88
[04:03:01] so we're getting look at the British Empire they got so spread so thin and so many places
[04:03:06] right and they got so worn down there face and conflicts in Turkey and the conflicts in India and
[04:03:11] conflict next thing you know America you got George Washington's like gonna kill you right and
[04:03:17] and so America's become super extended and I think we need to restore what it means to be an American
[04:03:24] like I think we've lost I think that term is synonymous with the wrong things and and being a
[04:03:30] patriotists synonymous with the wrong things you think patriotic like dude riding a jacked upside
[04:03:35] by side like woo like oh like freedom like no there is no freedom there's only free and that's
[04:03:43] what America freedom means that someone's affording me that to me free is an alienable right
[04:03:48] is is to live like as I see fit and fulfill my purpose and this nation affords me that and
[04:03:55] in turn I serve you know my country that gives me the opportunity and provides all this
[04:03:59] infrastructure and all those kinds of things we take all that for granted and we need to restore
[04:04:02] the message of what it means to be an American I don't care what political parties and
[04:04:07] what color and your race and gender I don't care about any of those things what it is is a common
[04:04:12] thread that made this nation incredibly great and we've taken it for granted and it's starting to get
[04:04:16] afraid and what happens is is that it's like Lenin said you give them a rope and let them
[04:04:24] pull it around their neck and they'll hang in themselves matter fact they sold us the rope
[04:04:29] and we put it around our necks and so I hope I hope we can change I hope the noise can
[04:04:34] quiet down because if people got serious just you change the world by changing yourself that's
[04:04:40] the thing there's not these big grandiose ideas where I get out there and I'm like have the
[04:04:44] huge idea the idea is that I'm the really macro scale I change myself and when I change myself I
[04:04:51] change the things around me and when the people around me change themselves the things around me change
[04:04:56] and that's how mass change happens it happens inversely as well and so you know change for the
[04:05:04] negative and I think like to restore what it means to be American to be able to walk down the street
[04:05:09] and be able to grab somebody about a hand to be united to to restore it kind of that that viewpoint
[04:05:16] of what's made us so great is is the is is the common thread that runs through the hearts of
[04:05:23] every single one of us and and we have to put all those things aside all these projections aside
[04:05:30] and get back to the basics of what it means to be a human and I think that we can come back from this
[04:05:36] do I think we will I don't know um I don't know but if we don't um it will happen to us
[04:05:48] and uh and it will be more swift and more violent it would could ever imagine whether it comes
[04:05:54] from the planet or whether it comes from another nation um the time to change is now is right now
[04:06:01] and and and to readjust so yeah and like you just said all that starts with you yeah
[04:06:11] whoever you are you if you're listening to this right now it's you change and don't be afraid to
[04:06:18] change you know we're so attached to these outcomes like don't be afraid to change and uh um yeah
[04:06:25] I just like I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I see it in the world and I see people like I like today on the
[04:06:32] bus I saw these people and like man we are so disconnected from each shot just trying to walk
[04:06:39] out the door of the bus to the rental car company people are shoving each other just to get out first
[04:06:47] so they could do what the one step in front of the other guy right like that's not who we are as a
[04:06:55] nation that's what makes us different and we got to get we got to get back to those cores core values
[04:07:02] all right this is a long one that's all good man um I want to make sure so you've been mentioning
[04:07:08] your your nonprofit yeah uh horses and heroes heroes and horses but I get it backwards
[04:07:15] it's heroes and horses yeah heroes and horses you go to heroes and horses dot org is in there
[04:07:23] you also have Instagram and Facebook and YouTube channel heroes and horses all of those can be found at the same spot
[04:07:33] echo you got anything I do actually keep so long time ago few hours ago you mentioned something
[04:07:39] about an experience with a black bear and then you just sort of moved on day point I wanted to come back
[04:07:46] I don't want to know what what happened with the black bear let's see where it looks looking
[04:07:50] like you around you right now look you know you know it's really funny about that I've had so many
[04:07:55] runins with bears at this point in the game I look back at that one and it's kind of makes me
[04:08:01] chuckle I mean I've had we had a bear come out horse go off a cliff and get him pale like I mean
[04:08:07] I run into him archery hunting all the time and and now I'm like my black bear story when I was like a
[04:08:13] teenager coming back from my dark years and this black bear like 10th is kind of like if I see a black bear
[04:08:19] literally the back of the jump I'm just like I just pick a stick up I'm like god he's like I like take off
[04:08:23] a grizzly bear is different a grizzly bear is like you feel like you're hunted but
[04:08:28] yeah no what had happened was I was out hiking um I was kind of just like you know here I am
[04:08:33] returning from you know this kind of childhood you know I guess you could say productle son kind of
[04:08:39] experience and I'm up there hiking and a grizzly bear while I'm sleeping out no 10 small black
[04:08:45] bear kind of comes in and he's like literally sniffing around he's all by me and everything and
[04:08:50] I also had was like a Swiss army knife that I'm gotten from my grandfather you'd have the
[04:08:54] kind with a little white toothpick you could pull out and and I have never had it and and I was
[04:09:01] actually very terrified at the time I was like oh my god like here's this thing I'm laying in my sleeping
[04:09:06] bag and he's just kind of sniffing around sniffing around he's walking around and that's what really
[04:09:11] like I started thinking about my life he got my food I didn't have it wrapped up probably it's my food
[04:09:15] and so anyway that experience right there like when I came back I finished my hike with no food
[04:09:22] it was like a three day hike so two nights and three days total and that was on my first night
[04:09:28] and that whole time I reflected on what I want my life to be and so that was a real pivotal moment
[04:09:33] in my life that that little pack bear came in and it made me think about the fragility of my own life
[04:09:40] you know and I'll tell you like there's nothing more that feeling in the wilderness of
[04:09:48] the wilderness is no mercy you know it has only rule and only law it has no mercy that there is no
[04:09:55] quality in nature you know and you feel that when you're around animals and you see them and you're
[04:10:00] with them there's a there's an honesty that happens you know and I discovered that honesty really for
[04:10:07] because I was a lost person you know and I I did feel like I was invincible and so that little
[04:10:12] back bear kind of brought it in made me when my Swiss army knife and maybe feel my own fragility so
[04:10:16] that's what kind of led me to take in the next step to change well I'm gonna ask you I'm just gonna
[04:10:22] ask so what happened with the gris the horse fall off the cliff so I mean I mean I think I
[04:10:27] can ask you now we're gonna stop recording I'm gonna ask you as soon as we get done so you
[04:10:30] know as I tell everybody know as ever it's gonna happen yeah so I was like you know
[04:10:34] it's like my second season packing and you know I got a pack string with me and I'm in the
[04:10:40] back and a grizzly bear kind of comes out on the trail it comes kind of like barreling down
[04:10:44] most of the time the bears will stop kind of like look sometimes they'll stand up and then
[04:10:49] they usually when they see the horses they don't like the horses when you're alone by yourself that
[04:10:53] is a completely different story and one of the guys one of the cowboys was in front of me and he
[04:11:01] thought he was kind of kind of spooked the bear off more which was still kind of going down the trail
[04:11:06] because he dropped down to the next switchback and when he did the the horse spooked when the bear
[04:11:12] moved and he went off the side it was very steep and the horse kind of locked up as hindquarters
[04:11:17] and then took a jump locked up as hindquarters and then there was like one huge like Douglas fur
[04:11:23] with a giant timber or bow sticking out that was like pointed and when the horse leaped you know
[04:11:29] at that kind of steep grade it gained a lot of altitude and it landed directly onto that thing
[04:11:36] and I went through it stomach and out it's side and it made the most horrible noise I've ever heard
[04:11:42] a horse make in my life and it was like like and it was like making this bellowing sound that the
[04:11:49] cowboy flips off peels the head stall off the horse everyone's like screaming like am I gonna
[04:11:55] so I'm like jump off my horse I just leave the mule's loose and I start like kind of trying to get
[04:12:01] down on and the horse is like kicking and blood is like pumping out it's hitting me my face I mean
[04:12:06] it's a large animal and I'm trying to get him up off this thing and the cowboy is kind of
[04:12:12] the heads dazed and he's like there's like I need help getting this horse up we're trying to stop
[04:12:16] the bleeding like and I'm like and then the horse died died like probably like within 10 seconds
[04:12:21] blood out I'm as massive injury and uh where was nothing more healing than that uh yeah so I you know
[04:12:31] that was uh that was an intense experience I've had them um we had some guys we had a guy quit
[04:12:38] three years ago bear came out barreled towards the whole pack string
[04:12:45] the guy that was working for me at the time shot him and tumble them bear turned came out of
[04:12:51] again hit him a second time what was he shooting what was he 57 that's why I carry 44 mag
[04:12:56] and it was a guy who had to attend them more shots and like 44 mag and they're so the bear
[04:13:05] tumbles and of course you got to call the forest service and since like investigation and they
[04:13:09] came up and it was 13 feet uh the shot was made 13 feet the bear print from the horse I use
[04:13:15] about to use about the tackle the animal but most of the times you know they don't really want
[04:13:21] to bother you but you know you never know and the guy that quit was like yeah and I'm good well the
[04:13:26] whole pack string exploded okay so if we hear comes at grizzly bear a dead run and next thing
[04:13:31] you know these guys are five you know they're on day nine on horses their horses start
[04:13:36] bucking and you blow up and the meals are going ever I mean it's like a yard itself this is
[04:13:41] complete freaking mayhem mayhem mayhem mayhem you because like I mean somebody that was more
[04:13:46] skill could have like got a hold of them if you watch that film the 500 mile project
[04:13:50] you know it's it's a great film but we had a guy a mountain bike run into them and the horse
[04:13:59] rid back and broke his orbitals broke his face and and then half of it meant a factor whatever
[04:14:03] but things can get sideways you know with horses like pretty quick and that grizzly bear
[04:14:08] experience was was one of those but doesn't happen often and you know so by the way applied
[04:14:14] to the program totally safe almost totally well well protect you know but it's it's a huge
[04:14:21] opportunity we just opened applications by the way I'll plug that real quick last week so
[04:14:27] they're piling up quick and you know we'll close them I think March 31st and then April 1st
[04:14:33] we select the class so we're kind of select them along the way and that selection is eight people
[04:14:38] yeah or is it six or three eight man classes and then we'll run everyone across the wall 32 guys go through
[04:14:44] the program this year so yeah so so applications are open nine so go to heroes and horses.org and
[04:14:51] but apply if you're interested in coming out for the experience of your lifetime right on
[04:14:55] and so 357 mag no no good for for bear no it's not I mean I have a 44 mag I'll tell you right now
[04:15:02] I've like I've done so many side cuts by side comparisons with guns like 10 mills 357s I'm telling
[04:15:11] you you want that initial knock down power to be a wake up call and let me tell you when
[04:15:15] a bear runs they put their head down load of the ground they're not like up there's super
[04:15:22] load of the ground and so you know a lot of people don't realize that like they're actually
[04:15:26] difficult to hit because they're like when they're running at you like that you know 30 miles
[04:15:31] an hour they're coming at there's a lot happening very quickly and bears aren't as scared of people
[04:15:36] anymore the scariest thing is when I shoot you know when I knock an elk down and I'm by myself
[04:15:42] and then I got you know hit on the GPS for the guys that read the horses or whatever and I'm out
[04:15:46] there by myself like stand over gut pile that is like the worst feeling. Chum in the water man
[04:15:51] it's the worst feeling like you want to you know I always build a fire and I like make it like
[04:15:56] super big or whatever and I try to put pine bows over and piss on I'm gonna do all these like the
[04:16:00] kind of things or whatever but you want to talk about like getting in your you know I'm doing
[04:16:04] the whole like what's that I'm the only one out there my god there's not like come on to take
[04:16:09] that horses to get to you depends where I'm at you know some long-awaited okay
[04:16:13] you ever slept out on some guts no no no guys come no matter what you're forced to see at night
[04:16:20] I always felt listen we ride at night and it's for I mean things happen I mean there is no
[04:16:25] this what it is you're at a night you want to find out you know he's tell people I said you don't know you know
[04:16:30] a lot of people don't know this a little bit of history but I always tell them that the uh
[04:16:34] maybe I shouldn't say this but the an old cowboy told me one time that the cathode religion was
[04:16:40] actually started in Montana and it was uh it was an old outfit or looking for a tree branches at night
[04:16:45] right so riding the source and I always told that joke to the guys joking around shout out to the
[04:16:50] folks whatever but I I it works like if you ride you can't see anything and you're like
[04:16:58] you know it is the craziest feeling to ride all through the night on a horse it's wild but the horse
[04:17:03] is no what's up oh they see perfect right no but you can't see anything you know and you're
[04:17:08] walking on these like ridges and you just hear like rocks like ding ding ding ding ding
[04:17:12] you're like ah okay you just like you really ride an horse name like ding batter at every like
[04:17:16] I don't know I trust you but they don't want to die either so yeah here is an horse is that or
[04:17:22] I really appreciate the opportunity uh and taking the time you know to kind of hear the story and stuff
[04:17:27] so thank you very much well hey man thanks for coming on you know sharing these lessons
[04:17:33] thanks for your service and in everything that you did and and really man I think thanks for the
[04:17:39] most part what you're doing right now man I think it's awesome and um appreciate it bro all right
[04:17:45] thanks thanks Echo Mikeo just stepped stepped out awesome having him on I just was reviewing my
[04:17:54] notes that I was taking while he was talking and most of them I got to but there's one that I
[04:18:01] didn't get to address and I'm sure maybe come back on at some point we can talk about her we'll
[04:18:05] just talk about it but you remember he told the story or he was he was making hypothetical
[04:18:10] situation Warren Buffett is in the desert he has no water and Micah Sees him and Micah has water
[04:18:20] and Warren Buffett's gonna die and he says you know I'll give you this water but you have to give me
[04:18:26] all of your money and and and Micah says so he's gonna do it right and that's true
[04:18:35] often but here's the crazy thing there are people whose ego will not allow them to make that trade
[04:18:48] they would actually rather die I know that sounds crazy sounds a little bit inconceivable let me
[04:18:54] tell you how it's not inconceivable in what LaFroat about with the with the situation with a
[04:19:03] a special operations unit that was gonna conduct an operation and LaF talk to some
[04:19:12] national guard guys that were saying do not do that operation LaF goes and gives that information
[04:19:18] to the special operations unit that was gonna go do it and those guys were like no we're going
[04:19:25] the national guard guard guys they don't know how to handle it I forget with the exact
[04:19:30] warning but we don't need to listen to them instead we're gonna go do this mission and so we have
[04:19:36] to keep in mind that ego is so strong that if you have a guy now look Warren Buffett might be a guy
[04:19:43] who's you know let us eat these older guy maybe he's got enough life experiences to be like oh
[04:19:48] I want to live that's more important to me but I guarantee there are some individuals that would
[04:19:53] rather die than admit that they're wrong they'd rather die than take help from someone else
[04:19:59] they'd rather die than ask for help so that was just one little thing that I thought about as
[04:20:09] and unfortunately you know I took the note and then I didn't get to get to bring it up with
[04:20:14] with Micah but that is something to think about you don't realize how powerful
[04:20:20] a negative force an ego can be yeah I was thinking the same thing to at that time there's a movie
[04:20:30] like kind of new I think where it had Kevin Spacey in it and then before they released it they replaced
[04:20:35] them because there was Kevin Spacey scandal you know I'm gonna be talking about something about the
[04:20:41] don't want to say the cats beer I don't know I don't know what movie but it was basically
[04:20:45] the famous rich guy when is in the movie or that's the movies about both okay both um it's
[04:20:52] I don't know yeah so it's about a real it's like kind of like a true story or something I think
[04:20:56] if I'm mistaken I'm only getting like piece of it but it's basically about uh this super duper rich guy
[04:21:03] they I want to say they kidnapped his son or something like that the daughter or something
[04:21:09] and they're like hey basically like you know held him for ransom or like give us this money or
[04:21:14] whatever and the guy and he was no money for this guy like he was not that much and he was in the
[04:21:20] I think it was like on the news or something it was like oh so what are you gonna do it was like I don't
[04:21:23] care I don't care like there's no way he would give money it was that it was like that no that much you know
[04:21:30] where yeah I can lose a son like whatever it's like the it's not like and I'm totally trying to
[04:21:37] remember the thing but it wasn't it wasn't like oh I kind of forward it or it wasn't it was
[04:21:41] more about the prince ride yeah yeah like like no no no no I can't get much money no I can do that
[04:21:46] to me kind of a thing like I'm never mean what like you know kind of really important thing you
[04:21:51] know the son or the grandson or something like that but yeah I thought that same thing to I said
[04:21:56] I get I get the example because true it is true it's basically like like saying without your
[04:22:01] health you have nothing you know like you can't you can't bring your mind to the grave like
[04:22:04] it's true true but there are these weird little exceptions where it's like that doesn't matter
[04:22:09] to some some people yeah that ego gets that ego starts to get charged up man it's um it can be
[04:22:15] it can definitely be a scary thing so it's like anybody even said this before where he goes essentially
[04:22:21] like a like a drug that you can you know some people like they'll they'll just take drugs till they die
[04:22:28] like you're gonna kill you that's an example yeah yeah exactly it's like that you know people
[04:22:32] those smoke cigarettes like so much it'll be like hey they think that I said was your ego will love
[04:22:37] you to death your ego will love you to death just like drugs will love you do like drugs love you
[04:22:44] yep and I took this from Jay I think if I remember correctly Jay Adams who is an old school
[04:22:51] skateboarder like dog town Z boys and I heard him saying drugs will love you to death
[04:23:00] because you know he had a bunch he had problems with addiction and went to jail and all the stuff and
[04:23:04] actually met him and kind of hung out with him little bit I was my friend my friend
[04:23:11] uh ran and underground skate downhill skate boarding uh event I like not just one but like
[04:23:21] a regular basis yeah and and it was like hey we're gonna meet at this random mountain that just
[04:23:27] got freshly paved the state just freshly paved some of them mountain and we're gonna meet out
[04:23:33] there and do downhill races have you ever been on a downhill skateboard uh I've been on a downhill
[04:23:38] skateboard yes okay I said oh I'll try what this is like or whatever I got on a downhill skateboard
[04:23:46] I went 20 feet and I was already going so fast I jumped off because I could see where this was going
[04:23:54] say it wasn't a good place I don't have the skill set to be doing this yeah guys race in levers
[04:23:59] like like a motorcycle racing letters they race in those things so I kind of so at any one of these
[04:24:06] underground events Jay Adams, REST and piece was there and you know I got to shake his hand and I
[04:24:13] didn't get a picture that's a bad move actually well how long ago was it 10 years? 10 years ago
[04:24:23] maybe 10 years oh maybe even a little bit longer ago you should have got a picture then
[04:24:27] pictures are available at that time because if it's like 1990 money oh no this was that this was
[04:24:32] recent this was like you know I was a grown man trying to get on a downhill skateboard
[04:24:37] those guys are freaking cool yes they are bombing hills yeah bombing hills you're on a
[04:24:44] scale this isn't on the snow or the water yeah like you fall on the snow look you can get
[04:24:48] her on snow for sure you can get her on the water you can notice there's a keyword there can
[04:24:53] you can get her on the water you can get her on the snow if you fall in a vegan downhill
[04:24:58] is it able to you're getting her now I the interestingly they don't they would let others they
[04:25:03] know how to fall better whatever yeah I think I think a lot of times especially in skateboarding in
[04:25:08] general that you just get hurt and I think those these guys are kind of just used to it where sure
[04:25:13] unless you break like your ankle you'd risk to whatever or whatever break whatever either hurt
[04:25:18] or you injured so skateboard is just used to get her it is basic well you get you get
[04:25:24] especially on the downhill right where you got to bail or whatever and you're sliding oh yes I mean
[04:25:27] oh you're what are you hitting someone's gonna stop you you know so Jay Adam said drugs will
[04:25:32] love you to death and as soon as I heard him say that I was yeah you know what also will love you
[04:25:36] to death your own ego your own ego will love you to death so you got to watch out for it you know
[04:25:43] yeah like the the short term payoff of what it delivers to you is just so makes you feel so good or safe
[04:25:49] or secure or whatever get that the later that like yeah I mean while you're your health safety
[04:25:55] well being got to be careful out well hey this has already been a really long podcast to
[04:26:00] appreciate everyone for listening if you want to support the podcast go to jockelfuel.com get some
[04:26:06] get some supplements of whatever kind you may need jockelfuel.com we also have look we talked
[04:26:14] a little bit about China today China we talked a little bit about China we are we are in an
[04:26:21] economic war with China for the time being could it escalate yes it could if we lose the economic
[04:26:27] war trust me the escalation is going to be real bad so we're in an economic war with China right
[04:26:32] now and at origin USA we are on the front lines of that war we are building stuff in America
[04:26:39] the things that Mike was talking about today you know a sense of purpose when you when you're
[04:26:45] not making anything you don't have let me refresh that when you are making something producing
[04:26:52] something building something you have a sense of purpose and when you're building something that's
[04:26:57] helping rebuild your community you haven't even greater sense of purpose so if you want to help us
[04:27:06] rebuild our communities help us rebuild our country help provide a sense of purpose
[04:27:12] to hundreds and one day thousands of hardworking Americans then check out origin USA.com get
[04:27:22] awesome stuff that's made in America yeah I think that that content kind of
[04:27:28] probably goes deeper than maybe we might think at a glance where you know all like you know
[04:27:33] as technology involves involves and all like all this other stuff or whatever you know basically it's
[04:27:38] just an it's an evolution of problems being solved so the smaller problems get solved solve just so
[04:27:43] you can take on bigger problems right and then we have innovation and you know all this
[04:27:49] invention like back in the day right you have these simple tools a stick or rock you know and you're
[04:27:54] making like you're spending five days making this one thing that literally you can buy at 70
[04:27:59] 11 nowadays like that kind of stuff but back then it's just how it worked it's like yeah
[04:28:04] but if you want to fire bro it's going to take a lot to make that fire then after you make that
[04:28:08] fire it provides the warmth and the heat and you can cook for you and your family and all this stuff
[04:28:13] so it's like this little system that kind of works together but then when you start inventing
[04:28:19] things that fire part making the fire part becomes really inconvenient like we got to focus on this
[04:28:23] bigger problem here that making that fire takes like freaking I don't know 35 45 minutes that
[04:28:29] maybe would help us in this bigger problem if we could just do that in an instance so let's solve
[04:28:34] that problem in deaf or in in an indefinite level you know so boom we saw that problem now you
[04:28:39] got lighter as matches whatever right I'm sure it didn't happen in that order but I'm just saying for
[04:28:43] example but it just keeps going and going and going and going so we got a bunch of problem solved for us now
[04:28:49] yes all kinds of problems yes but now the problems because you know what's that hierarchy it's like
[04:28:54] had some hierarchy right hierarchy needs so now technology kind of like exploded so fast so now
[04:29:01] it ended us up on that that higher part of the hierarchy or the needs right but technology has it
[04:29:08] right now it's not good enough to solve those problems so now you got people
[04:29:12] depressed or whatever same same so now yeah if you we can infuse little sent sprinkles a
[04:29:20] sense of purpose into all of our lives really I think that's going to be the beginning of the
[04:29:25] the solution for our problem awakening yeah but it was just kind of like how micrussain where
[04:29:30] you kind of got to go down to the the baseline a little bit to explore like where can I infuse
[04:29:36] some of the purpose in that baseline then your life it just says the whole will be more
[04:29:40] more beneficial more fulfilling or whatever yeah I think fulfilling is the word yeah like you'll
[04:29:46] you'll feel more purpose like just in your day to day you know just how it works but all right
[04:29:51] think it works like that oh check so origin us a dot com cool awesome to support get it get whatever
[04:29:58] you need there also we got jocquistore dot com which echo Nate made up the name for very original
[04:30:03] yeah because we have a store no I think I accepted the name for us and thank you but did I name it
[04:30:09] literally made it up you know what actually now that you mentioned you actually said to be like
[04:30:13] a dog I'm gonna start a store and it's like oh what's going to be called I don't think I asked
[04:30:18] I was probably like three days later you're like hey I set up the store okay cool yeah you like we'll
[04:30:24] look at the website and I go okay cool what's the website and you're like a jocquistore you know it's
[04:30:28] funny like I'm remembering it and you're correct exactly right I don't know you can tell me anything
[04:30:32] right now and I believe you you're like no you're in post it on me or no you said you know your
[04:30:38] idea is dumb or you you said you know jocquist you wanted to name the store or something
[04:30:43] lame and then I came up I would believe whatever you said yes I was I remember I am remembering it
[04:30:47] now and it's weird because it's not like I was like hey what's the best kind of name for this or
[04:30:54] that you know and I make this it was just like it was just kind of like a foregone conclusion like
[04:30:59] I didn't even really think of it that's like oh let's just just think there's just how yeah so
[04:31:03] jocquipadcast so he got out of the store so jocquistore no less on jocquistore you can get your uh
[04:31:09] apparel shirts hats hitties good stuff if you want to represent on this path that we're on
[04:31:16] subscribe to the podcast subscribe to our YouTube channel all that stuff we appreciate it
[04:31:20] check out jocquandaround.com look there's a lot of influential things going on out there in the
[04:31:26] world people getting banned whatever not whatever really yeah straight up some of us got shadow banned
[04:31:32] did you get shadow banned I don't know I don't know it's kind of like there are people that I follow
[04:31:38] that I know when they're shadow banned because I'm like you know how you kind of miss it like you're
[04:31:41] like oh I haven't heard from this person when they're not posting and they've been and you even
[04:31:45] try to look them up and they're there and that's the thing that they don't know that someone sent me
[04:31:49] was they're searching for my name and it's on up there look we don't know what's going to happen
[04:31:54] we don't know who's in control of these platforms they seem to be being okay sometimes but sometimes
[04:31:58] we're getting shadow banned so go to jocquandaround.com if you want to help us out on that
[04:32:04] psychological warfare you know the deal on that flipside canvas Dakota my our got's cool stuff to
[04:32:08] hang on your wall I've written a bunch of books if you want to check them out there's some
[04:32:13] information in them that could help you especially the kids books man get the kids some books
[04:32:18] and also have a leadership consulting company go to ashlandfront.com if you want some details on
[04:32:24] that check out our our online training academy our online training academy extreme ownership.com
[04:32:30] put in all kinds of effort the lessons that the lessons that we learned are so helpful we this is
[04:32:38] what we hear all day long every day I get emails I get handwritten letters we get updates
[04:32:46] utilizing the skills that we brought back the leadership skills the life skills
[04:32:52] if you want to get in the game go to extremownership.com and check it out.
[04:32:57] It's funny that that academy because you have it under ashlandfront you know and I always
[04:33:04] looked at it or kind of imagined it as essentially oh this is what you you know if you work
[04:33:09] or if you manage a team your boss was something like that oh yeah perfect freaking perfect really
[04:33:14] but when you kind of look into it and you kind of go on there and stuff this is really what it is
[04:33:18] where it's like okay yeah sure I listen to jocco you know sometimes involuntarily against my
[04:33:23] will whatever but let's say involuntary I listen to jocco and you know I have some good advice
[04:33:28] you know and actually if I'm gonna tell the truth here where if I listen to and by the way
[04:33:35] kind of choose what you put in your head and what you listen to right so what choose to listen to you
[04:33:39] most of the time sure so now jocco with all this advice or whatever he actually has
[04:33:45] an online academy like to train you that's literally what it is it is like okay so I'll
[04:33:53] and I kind of took it for granted where I can ask you questions like when I see it easy I can
[04:33:58] literally call you up if you answer you've asked me a lot of questions over the years yes if you
[04:34:03] think about it now I'm not talking about questions about how to do a commira what you have asked me
[04:34:08] but I'm talking you come in with a legitimate scenario that is an instant out family scenario
[04:34:13] I needed advice straight up straight up just the other last time I saw you I asked you what do you
[04:34:18] think about this something about this or this and I need like straight up legitimately needed advice from
[04:34:22] you right now do I give you good advice yes I think so I'm following it I'll tell you that's working
[04:34:26] right now so far I guess it was more of a long-term decision making course straight up
[04:34:32] that we're probably thinking it's the right move because you probably weren't thinking no offense
[04:34:37] you may not have been thinking long-term yeah I'll just make that mistake we think short-term
[04:34:42] yeah what plays out I was it's like one of the things we're you know how you make this decision to
[04:34:47] pursue this it's gonna put this other thing on hold for a long time or you can pursue the other one
[04:34:54] and it'll put this one on hold either indefinitely or for a long time so it's like which one is
[04:34:58] the advice I gave you is very good by the way I agree and even when you said it it
[04:35:03] hit me so quickly that yep I think you're right you know that's a good call so if you didn't know me
[04:35:08] if you weren't we didn't hang out if we weren't doing the digital if we weren't doing the podcast
[04:35:12] and you had that question you could go to extremistrybore.com and literally ask me and I would give you
[04:35:18] the same advice exactly right and that's why I'm getting some more particulars maybe your
[04:35:22] scenario is different maybe your area of operations different but essentially you'd get at least
[04:35:26] now this means I'm gonna preach to you that I know 100% know but I would help you way through the
[04:35:30] options which is what I do with you right yeah exactly right and that's exactly what I was going to say
[04:35:34] it's that's exactly what it is you know where you and then of course you know you have a bunch
[04:35:39] of other experts in little little special specialty elements of life or whatever as well but yeah
[04:35:46] that's what it is yeah you want to you want to get straight up life advice from jocke you want to
[04:35:50] get straight up online training from jocke what there it is boom you got it right there.
[04:35:54] extremownership.com hey if you also if you want to help out service members active and retired you
[04:35:58] want to help out their families go to mark least mom she's got an awesome charity organization
[04:36:06] called America's mighty warriors you go to America's mighty warriors dot org she's doing a ton of
[04:36:12] help a ton of help that I've seen with my own eyes my friends have gotten help from her
[04:36:18] so it's a great organization also obviously check out heroes and horses dot org
[04:36:25] Mike a in case you couldn't tell is a freaking awesome guy with an awesome vision and he's
[04:36:31] moving forward with that if you want any more of my tortures tales or you need more of
[04:36:39] echo's discombobulating disclosures you can find them on the web you can find us on the
[04:36:47] in the web's on twitter on instagram on facebook echoes adecutrals i am at jocke one
[04:36:52] does this mean we want you to go in there and waste time freaking getting sucked into the aggro algorithm?
[04:36:59] no don't do that you want to check out you want to hit us with something you want to give a
[04:37:05] shout out cool we appreciate it you want to get a little information about what we're doing cool
[04:37:13] don't get sucked into the aggro rhythm the so listen and I my brain mind and I'm sure a lot of
[04:37:20] people do the same thing where it does this thing where anytime I listen to like micha or
[04:37:26] you know any pretty much anyone's story and you hear those cool little parts of it where it's like
[04:37:31] oh man I need to take away the computer from my kids from now on you know it's like you get sucked into
[04:37:36] a story so much like it's so um what do you call like so engaging that you kind of like I kind of
[04:37:42] want to be a bohunter now you know it's like that kind of a woman given john that lea call
[04:37:46] I'm saying it when he's talking I'm like dang maybe I miss my calling from you know for bohunter
[04:37:52] yeah even I have yet to know in the woods with the with the gris I literally shot one bow in my life
[04:37:57] one time by the way I'm pretty recently but nonetheless I still had that feeling
[04:38:01] soon saying because you see you get so immersed in like the story or whatever they knew
[04:38:04] he was talking about like the social media and I felt it I was like yeah you write social media so toxic
[04:38:09] but the reality is it can be toxic and it can be very beneficial like you you know and I'm you know
[04:38:17] you can be in communication with very valuable people for very good reasons I've gotten into
[04:38:23] social we've probably gotten 30 guests on this podcast legit awesome guests freaking so stoked
[04:38:32] from social media oh yeah so that's definitely and it's and it is a legitimate way to
[04:38:38] communicate with other people it doesn't mean you have to get in the algorithm so it's there
[04:38:43] we're there and also heroes and horses at heroes and horses you can check out the Instagram
[04:38:51] the Facebook the YouTube go check out the YouTube I bunch of the things that that Mike
[04:38:54] I talked about today you kept getting hey we made this film we made that film go check those things
[04:38:59] out they're they're really cool to watch I watched them and yep so there we are
[04:39:06] Mike I really appreciate you coming down really appreciate your service in the military and out of
[04:39:12] the military and once again thank you for what you are continuing to do to help out that's and
[04:39:21] it's going to have a huge impact so thanks brother and to our active duty military and our veterans
[04:39:27] out there thank you for your service and remember you got a lot to offer even when that layer comes off
[04:39:36] even when that layer comes off of the uniform and the military when that uniform comes off you
[04:39:43] still have a ton to offer so go out find a mission find yourself that's where it starts
[04:39:51] and also thanks to our police and law enforcement firefighters paramedics EMTs dispatchers
[04:39:55] correctional officers board of patrol secret service and all first responders thanks what you do
[04:40:02] and remember just like the military what you do is not necessarily who you are you have more than
[04:40:11] your uniform so remember that and to everybody else let's follow the words we heard today quoted
[04:40:21] from Micah from Alexander the Great who said bury me with my hands out of the ground so the
[04:40:31] world can see that I left it with nothing let's leave it all in the field by going out there
[04:40:41] every day and getting after it until next time the Zeco and Jocco out