Jocko Podcast 309: There's Always Room for Improvement. There's Always More To Learn. W/ JP Dinnell

2021-11-26T09:33:17Z

Underground Premium Content: https://www.jockounderground.com/subscribe Join the conversation on Twitter/Instagram: @jockowillink @echocharles @jpdennell 0:00:00 - Opening 0:01:31 - JP Dinnell. Always more to learn. 1:51:58 - How to stay on THE PATH. JOCKO UNDERGROUND Exclusive Episodes: https://www.jockounderground.com/subscribe Jocko Store Apparel: https://www.jockostore.com Jocko Fuel: https://jockofuel.com Origin Jeans and Clothes: https://originmaine.com/durable-goods/ Echelon Front: https://www.echelonfront.com 2:34:01 - Closing Gratitude.

AI summary of episode

and I have tears rolling down my face as I'm like reading the book I'm like you have your kid and me now if anybody knows me well, it's not a surprise like you know a emotional person you know one of my real close friends is one of my black people so Matt Waltman and he He just knows he's like bro, he's like I know when you're gonna get emotional If you listen to a podcast amount he's like yep, and then I'll get emotional just if you know me I don't like You don't get it like how do you keep on I'm like I love I literally love what I'm doing and it was like the same thing He's like wait just wait hold like hold like all and I'll study like JP activate. and I was like hey, you're following him now because I followed you You gave him back to them like I was like why was this that I'm like you look like he's being shadowed It starts like looking through all your stuff. She was dead serious like just like this is going to be horrible like body posture like like go down to the side like And so we go through this whole talk and that you know I said hey, I know one of you guys have to leave because it's actually your your teammate I said you guys have hit all the training objectives and so we can be done and this would be a good day training Or we can do one more run and we can do it to honor this gentleman that just got killed Because I'm telling you right now leadership is what's gonna solve every problem within this organization If we pulled the thread there was a leadership failure somewhere that allowed this complacency to creep in and this individual just got killed Because what this guy was doing he had done thousands of times over his career It was literally thousands of times and so we finished the run we finished today strong That was a Friday We had another week with them that we're supposed to do at the end of that month Two days later we get an email from the leaderships and hey, we'd like to talk to you guys about You know some stuff We're testing a bruiser all the other stuff doesn't matter Like this is who we are and this is what we're going to do and I like to also tie that in When I'm talking about Ramadi, you know when we talk about like hey, well you come back from the point when we talk about the cost and the burden and all that stuff I tried to make it very clear when I'm talking with individuals or large groups like We're all gonna have those dark times we're all gonna have those things from our past that could hold us back if we allow them to Like if they're not doing something right, make sure we're not being like, hey, you know, get on to them like we would team guys and Marines because team guys and Marines are very good at going back to that default of like, hey, you stupid. Yes, which is awesome and continuing to see success after success after success that's That's another great example of the many companies that we work with that go out there It take these principles implement them and dominate yeah, and it shows them one thing that I've written down I wanted to hit is the importance of like Like the diversity of people's like different people's ideas and backgrounds That's one thing I was talking like a company. We don't know what's causing it and then COVID hit and I hit up my Malika she was like, hey, you need to get these treatments for your TBIs and I'm like, okay, yeah, because you know Real bad tonight is and you know just Issues with just remembering stuff and headaches and stuff like that and Problems sleeping and she just been trying to get me in the treatment. Like you know, a basic student thing like it should have been like 20 push-ups or you know, make them like jump in the pool with your gear and come back out and go. well what's interesting about that is this this training program In situations like this which I've seen and you've seen when it goes Beyond Business application beyond the combat application obviously beyond the business application and it starts to get into people souls and sitting there listening to people debrief seeing grown men Seeing you know women apologizing for behavior that they know they they shouldn't have done and it was negatively impactful to their family like seeing those deeper those deeper changes That's always it's always amazing to see that this stuff applies and gets through gets through the people's souls it does I mean One of our larger field train exercise clients one of their upper executives You know the company I'm talking about everyone that we've been interacting with since 2018 run these FTXs all of those key leaders So we go we give the class and then we let them have fun like our hey shoot the guns like shoot them as fast as you can here's how you reload it we teach them how to put like a basic patrol and I always tell them like, hey guys these are not tactics these are the basics. All right, so those means where people were like this is my body like with all the checklights like That was you me I trade at me on the outside and sales of financial company It's been me for a long time, but not anymore that you're like They're like just it's incredible What those treatments do and actually to the point that One of our clients that I should on a front that's a part of Dave's LDAP program that we did an FTX for One of the guys is like, hey, what's a good charity that we can donate to and I told them America's mighty warriors This is what they're doing Well, one of these team members was so motivated because I told them what happened to me Other members like Cowell who's on our team a he went got those treatments He said it's been a game change night and day And we explained them like hey That problem is a leadership problem that is a leadership problem and you allow complacency to creep in People get offended at first They they get offended, but then we kind of changed the tone like let's pull the thread If we pull the thread enough it goes back to a leadership problem that allowed the complacency to creep in Because if we go to war with that complacency and we combat it and we do what we're supposed to do we mitigate all those things That's what we talk about being default aggressive as what we tell people hey default aggressive isn't and mindset for victory against another human being Now in combat yes, but we're not talking about that We're talking about being default aggressive to improve a relationship Work on your communication being default aggressive to mitigate safety risks and if you're Not allowing that complacency creep in because Of the leadership that you have because the culture culture is an ultimate form of decentralized command It is very disturbing It is very very disturbing and to that degree where they can wear someone and I'm totally dispaculating But they'll hear you say something that they didn't like like Somewhere else and then be like let me go to his Instagram And shadow it really makes me start to think about all the level of Interconnectivity between some of these elements out there and it's Because it is very strange now look could it be like Like, like, you're stoner, be like, Roger, you know, like, no handle that shit. I'm like that's a lot I was like I know a lot of bad ass females that run companies that are kicking ass I know a lot of bad ass female leaders in the military that did some phenomenal things I'm like don't. and he said hey One of our guys just got killed on a job site and it brought me back to when when Seth was like hey Mark just got killed It brought me right back to them and I remember sitting on the wall That's all I could think about is just like I didn't think I was dealing with this stuff anymore I don't have I could not Make something like that and sell it to people I couldn't yeah as far as I'm concerned I might as well be a drug dealer that that that is a drug dealer that is it that is a person that is Given freaking crystal meth and fedemine to people and and knowing that they're gonna get a dick to do it Knowing that you're hurting the health probably gonna kill them and you don't care because I'm making money I could not do that from a moral standpoint as a human couldn't do it zero chance and yet I kind of felt like I got to do something because otherwise people are out there They're visiting the meth dealers So I talked with Carlos and Cody like we give the intel pull them aside on my k we just keep an eye on her we need to like pour into her because she thinks it's going to be horrible like we need to make sure she gets the burden. I'm like what do you got like this is like this is the time for let's talk through it as if you're comfortable if you're comfortable with it she goes well for my past. and You got some smart guys you got some educated guys you got some uneducated guys you got some short guys some tall guys some slow guys some fast guys You got somebody that was born with a silver spoon in their mouth You got someone that was raised in the ghetto you got all these different people with all these different perspectives and That makes that platoon strong. But I also know that because I have that background perspective I do at times a peeled a larger base Then some of the other instructors because I can relate to all the different levels and I and I get that so I want to be when I'm like talking through this stuff I want to be I don't think I was just phenomenal like perfect leader in the military I was a Good team guy. So we want to make sure they know what we're talking about and Carlos is going to if somebody pops up the middle We have to shoot like what would you be able to shoot them and it's all every single time Like the client who has zero tactical training goes It's like hey, what was What was your biggest takeaway that you're gonna Leave this training with the implement back home and hers was you know same thing like I'm not gonna let my past define me This is this is what I've been looking for came to a monster pay for some guys to go to the monster with them Came back was like hey, we want to engage with you guys We did a we did a little trial FTX with with a bunch of their leaders and when they saw that FTX are like Okay, we need this I won't get into all the details of how they run their business and what they're doing so immediately I'm like there's something there like there's something deeper there obviously for her to be like she was not thrilled and just thought it was going to be bad. But this shitty chief that was in charge of us just completely, like even though Bobby was like kind of Raymy back and I was like, okay, yeah, And so I said all right, you know you guys kind of let me know I'll give you guys some time to kind of think about it and everyone's kind of like checking and they're talking and there's a few people crying

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Episode transcript

[00:00:00] This is Jockel Podcast number 309 with Echo Charles and me, Jockel William, good evening,
[00:00:06] I call, good evening.
[00:00:07] Also, joining us tonight, JP to now, good evening, JP.
[00:00:11] Good evening.
[00:00:12] So I got very lucky in my career, very lucky in my career and was able to learn a lot
[00:00:20] from being in the military.
[00:00:23] And a lot of what the military taught me, I was able to learn because I was able to teach.
[00:00:29] I was, you get put in positions in the military where you're teaching, which is an awesome
[00:00:36] way to learn and it starts in the sealed team starts really young.
[00:00:39] My, the first time you go overseas, you're going to be teaching.
[00:00:42] You're going to be teaching some host nation personnel, marksmanship or map and compus or whatever.
[00:00:50] And so you're just kind of learning how to teach.
[00:00:54] But then what I really realized the power of teaching and learning at the same time was when
[00:01:02] I was in training cell at sealed team one, when I got into training cell at sealed
[00:01:06] team one.
[00:01:07] So I had done three deployments, three workups, three deployments and I went to training
[00:01:10] cell at sealed team one.
[00:01:11] And when I got to say training cell at sealed team one, I was single, no kids, no
[00:01:16] cares, volunteered for every trip that there was, which means I got to teach everything.
[00:01:22] I taught every subject that you could teach, I taught Land Warfare, CQB, what we used
[00:01:28] to call CQB.
[00:01:29] What did that change to CQC?
[00:01:31] Was it always CQC for you?
[00:01:36] They would, they would switch up between CQB and CQC and SQT and I believe in my first
[00:01:41] will tune.
[00:01:42] It was CQC.
[00:01:43] Yeah, it was, they were really trying to hard like, hey, it's now CQC and guys are like,
[00:01:47] okay.
[00:01:48] We had, we had a new, I have a free time.
[00:01:51] My second platoon, we had this awesome guy.
[00:01:54] And we had to write up, like the new guys had to write up their bullet points for their
[00:01:59] evaluations.
[00:02:01] And he wrote, completed CQB training.
[00:02:04] But he had it, CQB, like three to the power of three, CQB, CQB, and everyone, yeah,
[00:02:14] CQB.
[00:02:15] And he was totally serious.
[00:02:18] Like he thought that's what it was called.
[00:02:21] So I maybe that's why the head is so serious.
[00:02:24] CQC to make up for the homes.
[00:02:27] But look, I got to teach that.
[00:02:28] I got to teach Mount or at least go on Mount trips, Marops, OTV, I taught a diving course.
[00:02:34] I taught a freaking awesome diving course.
[00:02:36] And this is back in the day when the diving course was five weeks long.
[00:02:40] And you take off your rig and climb through pipes up into the pears and stuff and then
[00:02:45] go do something and then come back and put your rig back on.
[00:02:49] And then you go back and jump back and re-con, top, spec, re-con.
[00:02:51] So I got to teach everything.
[00:02:52] I was very, very lucky.
[00:02:53] And that's where I felt like I really started to learn.
[00:02:57] And what allows you to be able to learn so much is you're detached.
[00:03:03] You are detached.
[00:03:04] You're not part of the platoon.
[00:03:05] You're watching the platoon.
[00:03:06] So you are detached.
[00:03:07] And that's when you, if you pay attention, if you pay attention, you realize that you can see so
[00:03:14] much because you're detached.
[00:03:16] And that really brought it home for me.
[00:03:18] And it's what I wrote about leadership strategy and tactics.
[00:03:20] I kind of figured that out on an oil rig.
[00:03:23] My first platoon about how to detach.
[00:03:25] But then when I realize as an instructor, oh, you can see everything, everything.
[00:03:30] Everything.
[00:03:31] When you're in an elevated position or when you take a step back.
[00:03:34] So that was awesome.
[00:03:36] And then from there, I got picked up with Austria program, assistant platoon commander,
[00:03:39] platoon commander, tasking commander went through more workups, more deployments.
[00:03:44] She took learn assemble thoughts in my head about how to do things about how to run missions,
[00:03:51] about how to lead.
[00:03:53] And those workups and those deployments solidified a lot of ideas in my head about combat
[00:04:00] leadership.
[00:04:02] And the more I learned as I was teaching the guys and my platoon's about stuff.
[00:04:10] And then the Battle of the Mottie, obviously put those theories to the ultimate test.
[00:04:15] And we're able to utilize those principles for victory.
[00:04:20] But I'll tell you what, it wasn't until I got home.
[00:04:24] Took over Naval Special Warfare Group one trade at.
[00:04:27] That's when the leadership principles that we talk about all the time, that's when they
[00:04:31] got really crystallized.
[00:04:35] Because at that time, in that place, in my opinion, I think that was the best leadership,
[00:04:44] laboratory and instructional facility that has ever existed in the world.
[00:04:50] And look, I know that is a crazy, crazy, big statement to make.
[00:04:56] It's accurate.
[00:04:57] But what were you were able to do?
[00:05:03] At that time, look, we had a huge budget.
[00:05:06] The war was in full swing because of our deployment and because of our combat experience
[00:05:13] and tasking a breuser being in sustained urban combat, man, I was given the widest possible
[00:05:22] boundaries to push the envelope and do whatever we kind of wanted to do.
[00:05:29] And that's what we ended up with.
[00:05:30] And look, the training that we went through when we were in tasking a breuser, the
[00:05:34] cadre that pushed the training was also awesome.
[00:05:37] It's what it was not like this revolutionary change.
[00:05:41] But we took it, we did take it even further.
[00:05:43] We took, and even that training, you know, when I had Roger Hayden on, we came back from
[00:05:48] Vietnam.
[00:05:49] We still do stuff.
[00:05:50] So I'm not sitting here saying that this training at that time was better than anything
[00:05:56] else.
[00:05:57] And it's because of us.
[00:05:58] No, what I'm saying is that the training that you get to do is awesome.
[00:06:02] And when we were in that lucky moment in time, because of the way the freaking planets
[00:06:08] aligned, it just was epic.
[00:06:10] It was epic.
[00:06:11] So what we end up with is that we have multiple arenas, multiple arenas of leadership challenges,
[00:06:23] to test and train leadership capability.
[00:06:27] And they're all different arenas you can go to.
[00:06:29] The two that I'm going to talk about the most because they probably had the most power
[00:06:33] was the Land Warfare arena.
[00:06:35] And then the Mount or South arena.
[00:06:38] And this is another thing that they changed at some point.
[00:06:40] It used to be Mount when I was younger, which was military operations, urban train.
[00:06:43] And then it got changed to South, which is special operations, urban combat.
[00:06:47] But whatever you want to call it, these two arenas that we were allowed to run these training
[00:06:54] missions.
[00:06:56] And we were had the opportunity to put platoon, after platoon, after platoon, after platoon,
[00:07:02] through complex dynamic, reactive, intense, realistic, high pressure scenarios, where the
[00:07:11] difference between success and failure came down to one thing and one thing only.
[00:07:16] It only came down to one thing.
[00:07:18] And that was leadership.
[00:07:20] That was leadership.
[00:07:21] It was 100% leadership.
[00:07:22] So if a platoon or a task unit was successful, it was because of leadership.
[00:07:27] And if the platoon or task unit failed, it was because of leadership.
[00:07:31] Because there's some constants.
[00:07:34] There's some variables in some constants.
[00:07:35] The constants are look, you're going to be in a stressful situation.
[00:07:40] That's going to be a complex mission.
[00:07:42] It's going to be a opposing force.
[00:07:46] So the bad guys are going to be highly capable.
[00:07:49] They're also going to be tightly controlled most of the time.
[00:07:52] Sometimes my brothers would get a little out of head.
[00:07:56] But most of the time it's tightly controlled.
[00:07:57] And then you have a platoon or two platoons of seals.
[00:08:03] Now some people might think, well, you know, there's going to be a variation in the seal
[00:08:06] platoon.
[00:08:08] And that is accurate.
[00:08:09] There is going to be some level of variation of the skills in a seal platoon.
[00:08:18] But overall, the variation of the troops of the 14 or 16 shooters in that platoon,
[00:08:26] overall when you combine them altogether, you're going to have some smart guys.
[00:08:31] You're going to have some dumb guys.
[00:08:33] You're going to have some old guys.
[00:08:34] You're going to have some new guys.
[00:08:35] You're going have some aggressive guys.
[00:08:35] You're going to have some passive guys.
[00:08:36] You're going to have all these different smaller guys.
[00:08:38] You're going to have all these different guys.
[00:08:39] And you take them all together and you mix them up.
[00:08:41] And that platoon is going to fall within the margin of error of a normal seal platoon.
[00:08:47] That's what's gonna happen.
[00:08:50] Seals coming all different shapes and sizes.
[00:08:53] And that's just the outcome that you get
[00:08:55] when you put them all together is a seal platoon
[00:08:58] and they're all kind of pretty much the same thing.
[00:09:01] Look, there's a variance, like I said,
[00:09:03] there's a variance, but there's not one platoon
[00:09:06] that's filled with idiots.
[00:09:08] It just doesn't exist.
[00:09:09] There's not one platoon that's filled with
[00:09:11] tall everyone's a stud.
[00:09:12] It doesn't exist.
[00:09:14] Casing we get the stacked platoon occasionally,
[00:09:16] and sometimes they'd implode
[00:09:17] sometimes they'd be good because again,
[00:09:19] you got the mixture, but what would happen
[00:09:23] when a stacked platoon just depends on how
[00:09:25] red the leader was.
[00:09:26] The leader could contain those egos.
[00:09:27] That platoon could be great.
[00:09:28] If he couldn't fall apart.
[00:09:31] So because the platoon is kind of the same functional thing
[00:09:36] within a margin of error, the only difference
[00:09:40] between success and failure ends up being
[00:09:42] the platoon, the platoon leadership.
[00:09:46] And it doesn't really even matter
[00:09:49] where that platoon leadership is coming from.
[00:09:52] It doesn't really even matter.
[00:09:53] It took me, it probably took me
[00:09:57] one month to figure this out.
[00:09:59] It took me one month before I didn't care
[00:10:01] who the leader was.
[00:10:01] I didn't care if it was the chief,
[00:10:03] I didn't care if it was the platoon commander.
[00:10:04] I didn't care if it was the leading petty officer
[00:10:07] of the platoon.
[00:10:07] I didn't care if it was the E5, three E5s
[00:10:09] that were just awesome, and they could make shit happen.
[00:10:12] That's enough leader step in a platoon that they can win all day.
[00:10:16] So you talked about when you were running trading
[00:10:19] at your given month to really not care
[00:10:21] where that leadership came from or when you were in your first platoon.
[00:10:25] I would say, no, when I took over trade at,
[00:10:29] I was watching, and at first I thought, hey,
[00:10:32] here's the job for the, oh, I see,
[00:10:33] here's the job for the platoon chief.
[00:10:34] Here's the job for the system platoon commander.
[00:10:37] Here's the job for the LPL.
[00:10:38] Hey, these are the roles and responsibilities out.
[00:10:42] And gave them to people and issued them to people,
[00:10:43] and they were like, okay, this is cool.
[00:10:45] But then you'd realize you'd have a platoon chief
[00:10:47] that didn't know what he was doing.
[00:10:49] Or you'd have an OIC that didn't know what he was doing.
[00:10:51] And so he couldn't handle that job, whatever that job was.
[00:10:53] But if you had a horrible platoon chief,
[00:10:57] but the LPL was a badass, wouldn't really matter.
[00:10:59] That guy would just cover for and make it happen.
[00:11:03] And maybe the chief is good at admin.
[00:11:06] And so he's kind of a look man,
[00:11:07] I'll have to get the paper work over here,
[00:11:09] you know, you gotta do your thing.
[00:11:10] I mean, it's not like LAPE BABON was relying heavily
[00:11:13] on Tony a fratty to handle the paperwork for LAPE, right?
[00:11:17] I bet you Tony did not turn on a computer, right?
[00:11:21] Because that's not what his skill set was.
[00:11:23] And it didn't matter one bit.
[00:11:24] LAPE's doing paperwork, his junior officer doing paperwork,
[00:11:27] Tony's run in tactics like Tony should be run in tactics.
[00:11:30] But that can swap.
[00:11:31] Yes, that can swap.
[00:11:32] You can end up with a platoon commander who's just a stud
[00:11:36] and has a good comprehension of tactics.
[00:11:39] And platoon chief that doesn't really get it,
[00:11:42] he's a good guy, but he's not gonna add much from the tackle front.
[00:11:45] But so that's what it boils down to.
[00:11:48] It took me about a month to go, look,
[00:11:50] I don't care, as long as we have leaders in here.
[00:11:53] I'm happy.
[00:11:55] And so going through this training,
[00:11:58] the training that we had, not only identified who the leaders were
[00:12:02] and then what their shortfalls were,
[00:12:04] but most important, it allowed us the opportunity
[00:12:10] to teach them how to lead.
[00:12:11] That was the most important thing,
[00:12:13] was that it allowed us the opportunity
[00:12:16] to teach them how to lead.
[00:12:18] And the lessons that you get learned
[00:12:21] in these dynamic environments when you feel them.
[00:12:24] You ever heard that thing, he who suffers remembers.
[00:12:26] Yes.
[00:12:27] I think I quite frankly got that in a fortune cookie.
[00:12:31] It's important, my life.
[00:12:31] I don't want to tell you, I got it from Sunsu.
[00:12:34] Or Musashi.
[00:12:36] I'm pretty sure there's also some Bible verses around that as well,
[00:12:39] but I didn't get it from any of those ice.
[00:12:42] I think I legitimately got it from a fortune cookie.
[00:12:44] He who suffers remembers.
[00:12:46] And that's kind of what happens.
[00:12:48] You go through this training and it's hard.
[00:12:50] Not so much like, oh, it's physically hard,
[00:12:52] but all of a sudden you look around
[00:12:54] and everyone's no one knows what's happening
[00:12:56] and you go, I'm supposed to be in charge of this.
[00:12:57] I'm horrible.
[00:12:59] And I don't want to make this mistake again.
[00:13:01] And that's what's incredibly important.
[00:13:06] The one of the key components of this training,
[00:13:08] all of it, there's three major components to it.
[00:13:14] It was humbling, it was humbling,
[00:13:17] and it was humbling.
[00:13:19] And if you couldn't, if you approach that training
[00:13:24] in a humble way, the guys were just you awesome.
[00:13:27] And we had freaking studs, just total studs,
[00:13:33] legendary seals come through that training.
[00:13:36] Legendary badass seals come through that training
[00:13:39] and totally humble and be like,
[00:13:41] yep, we screwed that up and just be awesome.
[00:13:43] And they would turn their platoon around
[00:13:45] and just kick ass and it would be unbelievable.
[00:13:48] And then you'd have all the guys come through
[00:13:50] whether they had a lot of experience or not
[00:13:51] or whatever their ex background was,
[00:13:53] whether they didn't have any humility
[00:13:54] and it would just eat them alive.
[00:13:56] It would be horrible to watch.
[00:13:58] And you couldn't really help them.
[00:13:59] It was painful.
[00:14:00] It was painful.
[00:14:03] But having this training and running this training
[00:14:05] and seeing the literal transformation of minds
[00:14:12] to see, you could see it's a light switch.
[00:14:15] Sometimes it's a light switch or some guys,
[00:14:17] some guys is a little bit more like a dimmer switch
[00:14:19] that's getting turned on.
[00:14:20] But to see them go from not understanding how to lead
[00:14:23] to fully being capable of how to lead
[00:14:27] was incredible.
[00:14:28] And we would see it because in the beginning
[00:14:32] of let's say the field training exercise
[00:14:35] time of land warfare or of urban training,
[00:14:41] the first couple days, you know, it's four or five days,
[00:14:44] maybe six days of training.
[00:14:45] The first few days, the platoon is getting annihilated,
[00:14:49] annihilated.
[00:14:50] And as they start to learn the lessons,
[00:14:52] as they start to implement the lessons, all of a sudden,
[00:14:54] you fast forward to the last day and the opposing force,
[00:14:59] the bad guys can't get anything done.
[00:15:01] They're getting locked down, they're getting shot,
[00:15:03] they're getting pinned down, they're getting maneuvered on
[00:15:05] because the leaders learn how to lead.
[00:15:10] And that's why, you know, eventually we took this
[00:15:13] this training and wanted to duplicate it
[00:15:15] for the business world.
[00:15:17] So we could get these same tools
[00:15:20] to help organizations and help leaders learn to lead,
[00:15:23] which is the most important skill in the world, bar none.
[00:15:30] But JP, you ended up taking that.
[00:15:33] You ended up coming over here, we'll get into that.
[00:15:34] But let's talk about when you came home
[00:15:37] from deployment to Ramadi and you immediately went to Buds
[00:15:41] for a short glorious and crazy.
[00:15:45] You have to talk about that.
[00:15:47] No, it just fill us in.
[00:15:48] It's actually kind of funny, I was talking to a couple
[00:15:50] young team guys the other day.
[00:15:53] And I was explaining to them that when you came home,
[00:15:58] you went and they were like asking about you.
[00:16:00] And I said, you know, he came home, he went to Buds
[00:16:04] and they were like, ooh, and I go, oh, it was,
[00:16:07] no, they were bad.
[00:16:09] I mean, it was so bad.
[00:16:10] It's embarrassing, really, you know, it's embarrassing
[00:16:14] because we just came back from Ramadi and, you know,
[00:16:22] I'm looking at all these guys going through training,
[00:16:24] comparing them to Mikey and Mark and Ryan and Kaui
[00:16:28] and all the guys in our task unit that were injured, right?
[00:16:31] And that stayed in the fight.
[00:16:33] I mean, we had multiple guys get wounded on that deployment,
[00:16:35] that stayed on deployment.
[00:16:37] And then those Marines and those soldiers that we worked with
[00:16:41] were some of the bravest humans we'd ever been alongside.
[00:16:43] And so I'm mad that I'm not overseas
[00:16:46] because I wanted to still be over there.
[00:16:49] And I got pulled from my platoon.
[00:16:52] And that was what was the worst part is
[00:16:54] because I had shoulder surgery,
[00:16:57] ended up with some temporary nerve damage
[00:16:58] where I would just drop something.
[00:17:00] Well, you can't be in an act of platoon when that happens.
[00:17:02] And so I get pulled from the platoon.
[00:17:05] What face did they put you in?
[00:17:07] Indoc.
[00:17:08] So before that you start first face.
[00:17:10] Yeah. So how old were you?
[00:17:15] Like 23?
[00:17:17] I was still 23.
[00:17:19] Yeah, I remember, yeah, I was 23 when I was at Buds.
[00:17:23] No, I'm sorry.
[00:17:24] I was I turned 24 and then I went there because I had the surgery
[00:17:28] and the like three hours.
[00:17:29] So it was a little more time.
[00:17:30] Yes.
[00:17:31] I mean, not much.
[00:17:32] I mean, come back to my body.
[00:17:33] Yeah.
[00:17:34] And then we started the work up.
[00:17:37] I was I went to, you know,
[00:17:38] I was going to school, we started the work up.
[00:17:41] And had to have surgery issues with the surgery.
[00:17:45] You know, there I was at the, I was still at team three for a while.
[00:17:48] And, you know, because stone was my task in a commander.
[00:17:51] And I mean, I was just super fired up.
[00:17:54] I was so excited to go back.
[00:17:57] And I think we knew we were going to be going to saw the
[00:18:00] solder city at the time.
[00:18:01] And so anyway, so I get pulled.
[00:18:03] I go to Buds.
[00:18:05] And I'm just an absolute train wreck right there.
[00:18:09] I'm comparing all these like I said, all these guys to mark
[00:18:13] and my key and Ryan and Cowley and like right.
[00:18:16] So what are you supposed to be doing in the end doc?
[00:18:18] You're supposed to be just p-teeing them and kind of like you're preparing
[00:18:21] them for first phase.
[00:18:22] Right.
[00:18:23] So you're not supposed to be beating the shit out of them.
[00:18:25] No.
[00:18:26] I got your company had that.
[00:18:28] Well, when I got pulled aside and they said, hey,
[00:18:32] J.P. this isn't first phase, you're not supposed to have this
[00:18:36] many guys quit.
[00:18:37] Yeah, I was how long did you last?
[00:18:43] It wasn't that long.
[00:18:44] It wasn't long.
[00:18:45] Thank God, like for the community because I mean,
[00:18:49] so like I said, what would you, what was your favorite way to
[00:18:51] torture students?
[00:18:53] Because I was thinking about this too.
[00:18:54] So when you get this leadership laboratory that we had,
[00:18:56] where what we figured out was what exactly what,
[00:19:00] where do apply pressure, where do relieve pressure on these leaders
[00:19:05] to force them to start to understand how to lead and how if they
[00:19:11] didn't understand it, how they were going to break.
[00:19:13] But I was thinking about it.
[00:19:14] If you're a buds instructor, what you learn is how to get into
[00:19:17] people's heads and apply pressure to make them break.
[00:19:20] Yeah.
[00:19:21] Yeah.
[00:19:22] So one of the, I'll give you two examples of some stuff like one
[00:19:27] that was probably like the worst that I did that I definitely
[00:19:29] should not have.
[00:19:30] Is there a statute of limitations on this stuff of
[00:19:32] weekly or?
[00:19:33] Mm-hmm.
[00:19:34] I'm sure the leadership knew about this eventually.
[00:19:40] It was at the end of the day and they were leaving the
[00:19:43] Bulldeck and all the other instructors had gone and
[00:19:46] I had to mistake right there.
[00:19:48] Yeah.
[00:19:49] Yeah, all the instructors and I was by myself and
[00:19:52] yeah, there's a lot of other stuff that was going on in my
[00:19:55] life.
[00:19:56] So I literally had no life outside of this.
[00:19:58] So I didn't have to go back home.
[00:20:00] I actually got a room at the barracks so I didn't even have to
[00:20:04] leave.
[00:20:05] I was just sleeping in the barracks there.
[00:20:07] I was like just making these students life absolute hell.
[00:20:10] I mean, I was, it wasn't cool what I was doing.
[00:20:13] Like I know that.
[00:20:14] I'm very apologetic and I feel really bad now that I'm older and
[00:20:17] a little more mature.
[00:20:18] But one of the times I took like they were trying to leave the
[00:20:21] Bulldeck and someone did something stupid.
[00:20:24] Like you know, a basic student thing like it should have been like
[00:20:26] 20 push-ups or you know, make them like jump in the pool with your gear and come back out and go.
[00:20:30] But I was like, nope, I brought them down to the pool deck.
[00:20:33] Like so you know the observation and like deck down below.
[00:20:36] Oh, where you're underwater.
[00:20:37] Yeah, you're under the pool deck and underwater and you can see the pool.
[00:20:41] You can see the pool and it's dark down there and nobody knows
[00:20:43] around there and nobody can hear that you're down there.
[00:20:45] So I brought them down there and closed the gate to the compound
[00:20:48] to where it looked like everybody was gone and beat them down there for
[00:20:51] I was over an hour.
[00:20:53] Then I'm just like just doing different like photographs like the bellyback
[00:20:59] feet drills or they're just rolling.
[00:21:01] I mean, but you're back.
[00:21:02] You're bellyback.
[00:21:03] You're bellyback.
[00:21:04] You're bellyback.
[00:21:04] You're bellyback.
[00:21:05] You're bellyback.
[00:21:06] Feet bellyback.
[00:21:06] Feet.
[00:21:07] Yeah, and just alright, you guys can't seem to get seen.
[00:21:09] Can they just continue going through it?
[00:21:12] So anyways, that happened in another time.
[00:21:16] I was just walking by the barracks and looked in one of the
[00:21:20] windows of the barracks and it was on the octomencloth.
[00:21:23] Climbed in their window.
[00:21:24] In the room was doing a little section.
[00:21:27] Open up the fridge and there was like two 18 packs of beer.
[00:21:30] Oh, that's like.
[00:21:32] Okay.
[00:21:33] So I emptied every beer into the room and then went and found the
[00:21:37] class OIC, brought the OIC and there and the kids that were in there
[00:21:41] were under eight.
[00:21:42] Oh, I was like, how do you guys want to handle this?
[00:21:45] Like, I wasn't going to try to get these kids in trouble front or
[00:21:47] Adrian, because I'm not going to be a hypocrite when I went through
[00:21:50] Buzzles 18, and guess what I would do in the weekends.
[00:21:52] I would go have some beers in my friends.
[00:21:54] Like, I know it happens.
[00:21:55] And if you drink under age, I know you're not, I'm not
[00:21:58] condemning this, but if you're trying to go into the
[00:22:00] sealed teams and you're going to have a beer under age,
[00:22:03] like for me, that's not something that's like, oh, we can't trust
[00:22:06] that guy.
[00:22:07] You know, and especially in our community, I know it's not right.
[00:22:09] I'm not saying it's right.
[00:22:10] Yeah, well, yeah, and nowadays it's nowadays.
[00:22:12] Oh, nowadays you're done.
[00:22:13] You're done.
[00:22:14] Yeah, you're done.
[00:22:15] Yeah, and I'm about 100% and zero tolerance is an actual real
[00:22:18] thing now.
[00:22:19] And so there's, I wasn't going to, I was at least at least
[00:22:23] stable enough to know that I'm not going to ruin
[00:22:26] somebody's career over this.
[00:22:28] That, that's not fair.
[00:22:30] Because I happened to my brother.
[00:22:32] My brother was in A school with a contract to go to
[00:22:35] Buds.
[00:22:36] He would've been like, you know, four Buds classes behind me.
[00:22:40] And he was training in A school got injured.
[00:22:44] And so he got rolled back to where he couldn't
[00:22:46] class up, had surgery, came back.
[00:22:49] Most kids in A school, right?
[00:22:51] They go off base.
[00:22:52] They have some drinks.
[00:22:53] He came back.
[00:22:54] Came back.
[00:22:55] They had been drinking.
[00:22:56] Turns out like, it was the underage.
[00:22:59] Yeah, he was underage.
[00:23:00] He was 18 at the time.
[00:23:01] And he got in trouble.
[00:23:04] And they were like, who's with you drinking?
[00:23:06] He's like, it was me.
[00:23:07] I was the only one drinking.
[00:23:08] They're like, who was with you?
[00:23:09] He wasn't going to say anything.
[00:23:10] He was going to rattle on the guys at all.
[00:23:12] I didn't know about this until recently until a guy who was in the teams at a different
[00:23:17] command running training told me he was like, the reason why I'm still in the Navy and
[00:23:21] here is because of your brother.
[00:23:23] Oh my, what?
[00:23:24] He goes, yeah, your brother covered for all of us.
[00:23:26] My brother didn't like, was like, nope, it's just me.
[00:23:28] So my brother ended up getting an admin set out of the Navy for underage drinking.
[00:23:32] And he lost his contract to go to Buds and everything.
[00:23:35] Yeah.
[00:23:36] So I knew that happened to Cory.
[00:23:38] And Cory is a freaking stud.
[00:23:40] I'm not my brother. He's super smart.
[00:23:42] He's one of the smartest guys I know.
[00:23:44] He was a physical stud still is and it's just, I wasn't going to be.
[00:23:48] Yeah.
[00:23:49] I wasn't going to do that.
[00:23:50] So I gave the OICA, OIC an option and we secured him for the weekend.
[00:23:54] And it was just uniform inspections about every 90 minutes.
[00:23:58] And yeah, a crappy thing.
[00:24:01] I didn't know it until I came to check out
[00:24:05] the master's zero zero one with y'all met Jamie Cawcran.
[00:24:10] And she's like, yeah, you might know my husband.
[00:24:13] Here's the teams.
[00:24:15] She's like his name's Flann.
[00:24:16] I was like, I don't know.
[00:24:17] I don't know.
[00:24:18] And then later on, I see him.
[00:24:20] I'm like, what's up, bro?
[00:24:22] And he's like, what are you doing?
[00:24:24] Here's like my wife, Jamie.
[00:24:25] She's like, you guys know each other?
[00:24:26] And he goes, yeah, it's instructor to know.
[00:24:28] I'm like, Cawcran.
[00:24:29] That's how we knew each other.
[00:24:30] I didn't know.
[00:24:31] And Flann tells Jamie.
[00:24:33] He's like, yeah, J.P. is the reason why I missed our wedding.
[00:24:34] What?
[00:24:35] Well, that weekend that I secured him, he was a OIC.
[00:24:39] He didn't tell me he was supposed to be flying up to Seattle to have a wedding.
[00:24:44] Him and Jamie got married, but then there haven't a big,
[00:24:47] like official official official.
[00:24:48] Officials, I like the official one, but now they're doing a part of it.
[00:24:50] Officials, doing a party for all the family.
[00:24:52] Well, I secured him that week.
[00:24:54] And so he missed out on that.
[00:24:56] And I was like, oh, this is great.
[00:24:57] So this is my first introduction to Jamie five years ago.
[00:25:01] And yeah, so yeah, when I was in instructor at Buds,
[00:25:05] I was thinking about when I went through Buds,
[00:25:08] what some of the instructors used to do, and some of those instructors were evil.
[00:25:12] Evil.
[00:25:13] Yeah, that, you know, about the red circle, right?
[00:25:16] The red circle and die phase where you have to bear crawl with all your gear on
[00:25:20] until there is blood in a circle from guys like hands and feet getting raw.
[00:25:24] And just crazy stuff like now there's.
[00:25:27] I'd be surprised if some of that stuff still went on.
[00:25:30] Yeah, well, they actually have other ways.
[00:25:32] Hey, they have other ways and there should be other ways to there's then the herd and hold that.
[00:25:38] There's that training is freaking hard right now.
[00:25:42] Oh, yeah, it's probably hard.
[00:25:44] I can't do it.
[00:25:45] Probably harder and just in a different way.
[00:25:47] But yeah, they're not like, like, I mean, I had instructor that got in trouble
[00:25:51] because he would test the sharpness of the knives by cutting people's freaking palms.
[00:25:56] Right.
[00:25:57] Like, that's what is happening.
[00:25:58] That's crazy.
[00:25:59] Yeah, he got in trouble for it.
[00:26:01] Oh, we had an instructor that got in trouble because we had to do pushups on the back of our hands
[00:26:06] with twin 72s on our backs.
[00:26:08] That's awesome.
[00:26:09] Yeah, I mean, you're just, hey, why don't you just hit people's freaking hand with a ball
[00:26:14] of pain hammer.
[00:26:15] It's just a call it good.
[00:26:16] Who went on?
[00:26:17] I came back to the court.
[00:26:18] Like I said, I lived on base.
[00:26:20] I mean, I had a room.
[00:26:21] I lived with Derek Benson, who was my homeboy for, since like we checked on the teams together.
[00:26:26] It just really, you know, another good team guy from Northern California.
[00:26:30] Get an awesome house.
[00:26:31] We lived, I lived there.
[00:26:33] But I was so obsessed when I was a buzz instructor.
[00:26:36] And I saw him live in on base.
[00:26:39] Like I said, I had the room in the barracks and I was staying there.
[00:26:42] I caught a guy at the court of the watch, a sleep.
[00:26:47] And I just beat his boots off, man.
[00:26:50] For like three hours straight.
[00:26:52] And then I made him call the OIC, who lived down in I.B.
[00:26:55] He had to get dressed.
[00:26:57] He came in.
[00:26:58] I was like, where's the LPO?
[00:26:59] So he calls him.
[00:27:00] He was out in town as well.
[00:27:02] And it was just a beat session.
[00:27:03] And to all of them, I got there.
[00:27:04] And I explained what happens when guys fall asleep on watch overseas.
[00:27:09] And I told them about the stories that we'd hear about Marines being murdered.
[00:27:13] Because somebody fell asleep when they're in a building, right?
[00:27:16] Or soldiers at the same thing and happened to them.
[00:27:18] It's the same thing that we would talk about when we were in a room.
[00:27:21] We weren't going to let anybody else be in charge of standing watch.
[00:27:25] And unless you were a team guy.
[00:27:26] Because we knew we couldn't.
[00:27:29] Like we weren't going to let the Iraqi soldiers.
[00:27:31] Like hey, you stand watch.
[00:27:32] Okay.
[00:27:33] Just going to fall asleep.
[00:27:35] Like leaning on his rifle and his toe on the trigger.
[00:27:37] Like it's just crazy.
[00:27:38] So yeah, I was, I was wound real tight.
[00:27:42] What was the straw that broke the camels back?
[00:27:45] That, what was it?
[00:27:47] Was it anything specific happened?
[00:27:48] Were they like, are we going to get this guy out of here?
[00:27:52] It was just constant like I didn't, so the problem is.
[00:27:56] Because I remember I don't think they called you.
[00:27:58] They were like, hey, you basically you need to come get your boy.
[00:28:02] Yeah, because I'm straight real quick.
[00:28:04] I was like, I was like, really a sign to do it.
[00:28:06] I was temporarily a sign to do it to the command.
[00:28:08] So I was getting ready to actually, I was probably going to get in trouble.
[00:28:12] Because I, I didn't, well, the horrible thing is like,
[00:28:16] I didn't respect the chief that was in charge of the training.
[00:28:18] He was a piece of shit team guy.
[00:28:20] He just didn't represent the teams and well in anything.
[00:28:24] With his life, his reputation, the teams,
[00:28:26] his, you know, were instructors at at buds.
[00:28:30] And he is grossly overweight.
[00:28:32] I'm just like, and it wasn't because of an injury.
[00:28:34] There are some guys that have injuries.
[00:28:36] I go there. That's one thing.
[00:28:37] No, it was his actual lack of discipline.
[00:28:40] Just it was, I had zero respect for him.
[00:28:43] And so he was the one that was like, pulling me aside and trying to like,
[00:28:47] Hey, you shouldn't be doing this.
[00:28:49] Oh my.
[00:28:49] You're going harder.
[00:28:51] Yes.
[00:28:52] Yeah, I'm like, okay.
[00:28:53] We got Roger that.
[00:28:54] You know that, that feeling of,
[00:28:58] this is the same type of feeling that I would have.
[00:29:01] So when we'd be out at Mount or something like this,
[00:29:03] when I was running it.
[00:29:05] And I'd see like a guy standing in the middle of the street.
[00:29:09] And I would get like a knot in my stomach.
[00:29:11] I would, I would start to sweat and I would get so,
[00:29:14] how so emotional about like, hey,
[00:29:17] this guy's going to get fucking killed.
[00:29:19] Yeah.
[00:29:20] And, and I can't imagine like, here you are.
[00:29:22] You're having the same feeling, but oh, this guy's falling asleep on watch.
[00:29:25] This is a night.
[00:29:26] This is, I can't allow this guy in the teams like that level of.
[00:29:29] Commitment and emotional commitment to wanting to make sure that
[00:29:34] that guys that are going to make it to the teams are the best
[00:29:37] freaking guys.
[00:29:38] And that was me.
[00:29:39] I was trying to make sure that these guys were ready.
[00:29:41] And it was a, a very, it was an emotional thing.
[00:29:44] It was an emotional thing.
[00:29:46] Yeah, I was, a hundred percent.
[00:29:49] Like, my, my marriage at the time was falling apart.
[00:29:54] And I was okay with that because I was more concerned about the teams.
[00:29:58] And in hindsight, like, okay, cool.
[00:30:00] She was a good person.
[00:30:01] We weren't good together.
[00:30:02] Like, I'm very thankful that that didn't work out because of my family
[00:30:05] that I have now.
[00:30:06] I'm very thankful.
[00:30:07] But I was so just in the, like, that's all that matters.
[00:30:10] It was the teams, the teams, the teams.
[00:30:12] And I, you know, I just, I was like, you just said, I was just emotionally involved
[00:30:17] and connected all the time.
[00:30:19] You know, I saw guys that I put through training.
[00:30:22] They come back through training later on.
[00:30:24] Like, the training we ran and then I came out in the teams.
[00:30:26] And I'm always like, hey man, I'm sorry.
[00:30:28] They're like, bro, you cared about the teams.
[00:30:30] Like, we're good with that.
[00:30:31] And it's funny.
[00:30:32] Yeah.
[00:30:33] Because the guys that made through training that turned out to be good
[00:30:35] team guys, it bothered none of them.
[00:30:38] Not one of those guys everywhere.
[00:30:40] Like, yeah, that kind of sucked.
[00:30:41] They were just like, bro, you were in the game.
[00:30:43] Like, you just came back from it.
[00:30:45] So they, they understood it.
[00:30:47] Yeah.
[00:30:48] Yeah.
[00:30:48] And what you just said is, you know, the, the leadership thing, right?
[00:30:51] You're so emotionally invested in getting these guys trained and developed.
[00:30:54] And when you took over training, you saw the void of the leadership training.
[00:30:59] Our tactics are ridiculous.
[00:31:01] The amount of money and the high level training that we have with it comes
[00:31:04] to all the, like, the tactical stuff that we do is, is awesome.
[00:31:08] Can we make it better all the time?
[00:31:09] Yes, we're, we're always trying to make it better.
[00:31:12] But we actually didn't have any actual leadership development.
[00:31:15] And it showed in all of their areas of the teams.
[00:31:18] And I know I've talked with you a lot about this is I was very aware that I was young
[00:31:23] and immature and not going to be a good leader.
[00:31:26] I knew that.
[00:31:27] And I wanted, I craved that leadership development and training.
[00:31:31] And I saw the outside of the military.
[00:31:33] Like I was reading business books and personal development books because I knew I just needed that.
[00:31:37] And the teams didn't have that.
[00:31:38] And tell you, I always thought as crazy is you didn't go to, like,
[00:31:42] leadership development training until you're in E7 E8 E9.
[00:31:45] I'm crazy.
[00:31:46] They need to as an E3 E4 E5 E6 where there's a large portion of our community is at that rank.
[00:31:53] And they have a large amount of interaction with other forces out there.
[00:31:56] They need professional development and leadership development.
[00:31:59] And it wasn't until you took over trade at that.
[00:32:02] We didn't have that.
[00:32:03] Yeah, that it was really strange the way the teams used to be.
[00:32:07] And it was all OJT.
[00:32:08] And you were going to learn, you learned your leadership skills from whoever your chief was,
[00:32:13] whoever your platoon commander was, you know, your platoon commander was probably going to learn from his chief.
[00:32:18] But which is awesome.
[00:32:20] If you have an awesome chief.
[00:32:22] And if you don't have an awesome chief, you don't.
[00:32:25] And sometimes you would get it like a platoon chief coming through our training and you did have issues.
[00:32:31] And you could pull the thread and see like who he did his LPO for, who he, you could kind of figure out what his background was because you would just get this string of people that just won't really the best leaders.
[00:32:42] They were, you know, people that led through their rank or people that didn't understand tactics.
[00:32:48] And so you end up with you had a very wide variety of a wide span of skills that these leaders had.
[00:32:57] And there was no one.
[00:32:59] Teaching them, all right, here's what you need to do as a leader.
[00:33:02] So when I put together that freaking leadership brief, it was like, okay, it was, I was very lucky to be able to do that.
[00:33:09] And that's what, that's what was cool.
[00:33:13] That was awesome for me.
[00:33:14] And you know, it's funny because I never said to like, I never said to lay for or to Seth like, hey, here's the four laws command and say that tone.
[00:33:23] I was like, yeah, I was like, hey, dude, hey, you need to put your machine gunners out if you're going across the road.
[00:33:28] Why, you need to cover for that. You need to cover for an okay. That's cover move. Like, dude, your plan is freaking way crazy.
[00:33:33] Complicate. So those guys got it over time, you know, just through repetitive interactions of saying, dude, what do you do?
[00:33:42] Trying to get ahead count right now. You're freaking getting shot. What are you doing?
[00:33:45] Like, like, you're stoner, be like, Roger, you know, like, no handle that shit.
[00:33:49] And so all those, I had a bunch of things in my head, but when I got to trade at, that's when I was like, oh, I, well, that was a, that was the,
[00:33:57] that was a, that was the huge eye opener for me. I had lay for Seth and the officers and be able to say, like, hey, we're going to do that
[00:34:05] Erase again. We're going to be here for a month at Land Warfare. I'm going to get to teach you this little things, make little adjustments.
[00:34:11] But when I took over trade at, it was like, oh, I'm going to see this platoon for a week here and a week there and a week there.
[00:34:17] And I need to dump them all this information as quickly as I can in a way that they can understand it.
[00:34:23] So that's why the very first thing that I went, the very first training evolution I went on went back and wrote down this for all all's combat.
[00:34:30] It goes to one of the things that we talk about and we teach at echelon front is when you put somebody in charge of training or in charge of, just anything.
[00:34:39] It changes the way they think and naturally. So you had been thinking this way for your whole career.
[00:34:46] But it wasn't until you were in charge of trade it that you were actually more mindful of, oh, and then you just sat and you thought about it.
[00:34:55] And it's one of the things that we do obviously in the field training exercises is everyone gets rotated through different positions of leadership.
[00:35:02] But you started really implementing it at trade it where every or actually no, I'm sorry, in our task unit where everybody was going to be in charge of something.
[00:35:11] Oh, yeah, yeah. And it was like, hey, bigels, you're in, you're the task unit commander for this run. What?
[00:35:16] J.P. you're going to be the acting contingent.
[00:35:19] What?
[00:35:21] But once we were in those positions of leadership it forced us to think differently.
[00:35:26] And then once we had that new, you know, thought process, it changed the way we operated going forward.
[00:35:33] And that's why training is so critical to success.
[00:35:37] Yeah, I was thinking if you were right or not. And you were right because I was thinking if I would have just done another task unit, I would have done this exact same thing.
[00:35:46] I wouldn't have, I would have trained the guys the same way.
[00:35:49] And I would have trained the guys through more of an indirect method of like, hey, let's do that again.
[00:35:54] Oh, you need to make sure you're covering, hey, mate, that's a little bit comp. I would have done it the same way I did it with lathe and Seth and the rest of the guys like, hey, this is what you're going to learn over the next year.
[00:36:04] I wouldn't have said, oh, this stuff need to be distilled down. Here's the way it's going to be.
[00:36:08] And I need to kind of get this formula that people can utilize immediately.
[00:36:14] I wouldn't have done that if it wasn't if I hadn't been put in training.
[00:36:17] So, yeah, you're right, you're right.
[00:36:20] I think whatever I heard like a little rumor, whatever, I don't know who called me, but someone, you know, basically, it was like Colonel Troutman was getting the call.
[00:36:31] You need to come get your boy.
[00:36:34] Because you're going to have to give the reference so people understand what you talk about.
[00:36:37] Oh, Rambo.
[00:36:38] Rambo.
[00:36:39] Colonel Troutman, you know, Rambo's out in the woods, you know, killing civilians, killing friendly civilians.
[00:36:44] There aren't no friendly civilians, but he's out there doing that.
[00:36:47] And they have to go get, or Colonel Troutman shows up to get him out and freaking get him back under control.
[00:36:53] And I got some kind of a call like that.
[00:36:56] It's so funny because everybody knew 100% that I was 100% going to absolutely take you, break you, shield you.
[00:37:07] And there was going to be no beef about this whatsoever.
[00:37:10] No one even made like any reference to anything other than this is 100% going to go, Jaco.
[00:37:16] You know, JP, not really fitting in here too.
[00:37:19] Come get your boy and all good. It wasn't like, hey, this guy, no one even wouldn't say a negative thing about you.
[00:37:26] They would just say like, hey, you might, he might be a little better if he goes back working for you again.
[00:37:33] I'm like, check.
[00:37:34] I'm going to say, I don't know who was.
[00:37:37] I want to say, I mean, too.
[00:37:40] That was so long ago, but I feel like it was Z.
[00:37:43] I feel like some, you know, it might have been Bobby.
[00:37:46] Bobby was there as buds.
[00:37:49] And he actually pulled me up.
[00:37:52] So he pulled me aside a few times and I had always had tremendous amount of respect for him.
[00:37:57] Yeah.
[00:37:58] Yeah, he's a stud guy always looked up to him.
[00:38:01] There were a few times like he pulled me aside.
[00:38:03] I was just like so well and tight.
[00:38:05] But this shitty chief that was in charge of us just completely, like even though Bobby was like kind of
[00:38:12] Raymy back and I was like, okay, yeah, and then this guy, I was like, nope, got to go harder until I'm a hemide of,
[00:38:19] I don't know, I don't know, but he might have reached out to Z.
[00:38:22] Z, he got a hold of you either way.
[00:38:24] It was, I was probably going to get in trouble.
[00:38:27] And they were like, oh, he's TAD.
[00:38:30] He's, well, where is he a tap?
[00:38:31] Oh, he's still a team three, but he can't go back there.
[00:38:35] Jocco, bring him to trade at me.
[00:38:37] And I remember when I went there because that day I checked in there.
[00:38:39] I went out and talked with you. You went and introduced me to a few guys.
[00:38:43] And it was, I was like, this is where I need to be.
[00:38:46] And I still, I know we'll get into a little bit more.
[00:38:48] I, there was, I was excited to be there for a field to be there.
[00:38:51] But I didn't fully grasp.
[00:38:55] Well, yeah, talking a little bit.
[00:38:57] It took you, you still wanted to be overseas, shooting people.
[00:39:00] Yeah, which is a big, um, gaping hole in your heart when you're not overseeing
[00:39:06] overseas, shooting people. And instead you're back in America, which is just boring and miserable.
[00:39:11] And you didn't want to be doing that.
[00:39:13] Whether it was instructing in Docs, or at trade at.
[00:39:17] But yeah, we just had to make a little connection between, you know, you being at trade at.
[00:39:21] And by the way, making sure our guys are the best trained in the world.
[00:39:25] Yeah. And that's the conversation we had.
[00:39:27] Yep.
[00:39:28] Um, and then you went right, you went right into South.
[00:39:31] Did you go right into South?
[00:39:33] Yes.
[00:39:34] Yep. It was South, and you can see, I was, I was running. I was in, in both.
[00:39:39] And then South is when, uh, I think I was there for a year.
[00:39:44] And then I became the LPO of South.
[00:39:47] So let's talk a little bit about, um, South.
[00:39:50] And what's interesting, so this is again, this is urban training.
[00:39:53] We have a few urban training sites that we would use.
[00:39:58] We would set, they were very realistic, very realistic training.
[00:40:03] We had set designers come out to design things to make them look like they were little villages
[00:40:09] and I rack her Afghanistan.
[00:40:11] Um, we would have speakers with noise simulations coming over them.
[00:40:18] I remember we had, we set tires on fire.
[00:40:22] And because I remember the first time I went into Ramadi at night,
[00:40:27] the moush had set fires set tires on fire all the place totally screwing up your night vision.
[00:40:31] And I was like, damn, these, these dudes are next level to smart.
[00:40:35] Yep. And I was like, okay. And sure enough, we would have the fires going.
[00:40:39] We'd have the noise simulator's going.
[00:40:41] So you hear like urban noises.
[00:40:43] And then you do, then comes the call to prayer.
[00:40:46] And it's very realistic.
[00:40:50] When I would put down my nods, because I'm an instructor, whatever I'm in my instructor mode,
[00:40:56] when I would put down my nods and start walking,
[00:40:59] I would 100% feel like I was in Iraq.
[00:41:04] So the realism is legit, totally legit.
[00:41:10] The interesting thing is that coming into the training,
[00:41:15] we would tell them exactly what they needed to do to win.
[00:41:20] And this is what, this is what's interesting.
[00:41:22] So going to CQC, when I go out and watch CQC,
[00:41:25] you'd have some instructors that would like to talk about
[00:41:28] a talk a lot.
[00:41:30] And you'd have another instructor that, or another group of instructors,
[00:41:33] where they do a little bit more action, a little less talk, a little more do.
[00:41:36] And you take those two groups, like,
[00:41:39] that'd be one-platoon with a talking instructor and one-platoon with that action instructor.
[00:41:43] And so the, the talking instructor, he's sitting there,
[00:41:46] talent stories and talking about this and giving all these details and talking through it again,
[00:41:50] and hey, watch this and watch me do this,
[00:41:53] and let me explain to you this and talk and talk and talk and talk and talk.
[00:41:57] And then there'd be another guy that, hey, here's the basic, here's the fundamental,
[00:42:00] all right, start doing it.
[00:42:01] And almost,
[00:42:03] well, it's guaranteed that the platoon that started doing it is going to learn it quicker.
[00:42:08] The platoon that just gets to hear about it,
[00:42:10] it's not going to, it's not going to land.
[00:42:13] Now look, you need some level of instruction.
[00:42:15] Somebody needs to tell you, like, this is what we're doing, this is how we do it.
[00:42:18] You can't just go blind, obviously.
[00:42:20] But what's interesting is, we would tell the guys, hey,
[00:42:24] here's what you need to do to win,
[00:42:27] cover move simple, prioritize next,
[00:42:29] you decentralized command, you need to do that.
[00:42:31] If you don't cover move out of your,
[00:42:33] you're going to get shot up.
[00:42:34] If you don't have a simple plan,
[00:42:36] it's going to be insane.
[00:42:38] And we're going to have a bunch of problems,
[00:42:39] you need to prioritize next to you.
[00:42:41] By the way,
[00:42:42] you need to use decentralized command because things should be happening that,
[00:42:45] not one person can control.
[00:42:47] You need to detach, take a step back,
[00:42:49] like we would tell them these things,
[00:42:51] we would tell them.
[00:42:52] But they would understand it,
[00:42:56] but then you've got to go and do it.
[00:42:58] You've got to go and put, get put into those situations.
[00:43:02] I mean, I'm just writing so much down.
[00:43:08] Like since I started talking,
[00:43:10] I just wanted all these points,
[00:43:11] but what you're just talking about goes along with,
[00:43:14] I remember when I was at trade at one of my chiefs told me,
[00:43:17] as an instructor, he's like, hey,
[00:43:19] we have to teach these guys how to think,
[00:43:22] not what to think,
[00:43:23] because the battlefield is very dynamic.
[00:43:25] And these guys need to be able to think on their own.
[00:43:28] And it wasn't until we actually had them out.
[00:43:30] They're doing it.
[00:43:32] It doesn't matter.
[00:43:33] You can give a scenario all day long.
[00:43:35] You can tell stories,
[00:43:36] but until somebody's actually putting their hands on it,
[00:43:39] it doesn't matter.
[00:43:40] I teach shooting on the side.
[00:43:42] And I can talk about it all day long,
[00:43:44] but until I have somebody actually loading rounds into a magazine,
[00:43:48] and then locking the slide to the rear.
[00:43:51] And being like, oh, that little butt,
[00:43:52] yeah, that's how you lock the slide to the rear.
[00:43:54] And I can talk about all day long,
[00:43:56] but if they've never done it,
[00:43:57] just watch somebody fumble over the most basic thing,
[00:44:00] that I think is just the most basic thing ever,
[00:44:02] but if they've never shot before,
[00:44:04] it's actually a real big deal.
[00:44:05] Locking the slide to rear,
[00:44:06] putting a loaded magazine into a gun,
[00:44:08] releasing the slide,
[00:44:10] making sure rounds chambered.
[00:44:11] These are things that you and I do without even thinking.
[00:44:13] No thought whatsoever.
[00:44:14] I know thought whatsoever.
[00:44:15] I can hear the slide go forward
[00:44:17] and no if we round as chambered or not.
[00:44:19] Whether it was that magazine seated all the way,
[00:44:21] was it not to round actually get chambered,
[00:44:23] and I've done that before,
[00:44:24] like there's nothing in there.
[00:44:25] And I checked the magazine,
[00:44:26] it wasn't fully seated.
[00:44:27] Check the chamber.
[00:44:28] Yep, no round in there.
[00:44:29] Because we've done it hundreds of thousands of times.
[00:44:33] Someone who's never done it,
[00:44:34] they actually have to do it before they can feel it.
[00:44:37] And when people feel it,
[00:44:39] then that's what that's when it comes home,
[00:44:42] like you were saying earlier,
[00:44:43] like when you make a mistake and you feel that mistake,
[00:44:46] when the cool thing about that TX program is I've been able to build a team.
[00:44:51] And Cody's been on full time with us for a few years,
[00:44:54] over three years now.
[00:44:55] We just got Carlos Mendez on board full time,
[00:44:58] or I mean,
[00:45:00] all these guys that have on the team are studs,
[00:45:02] you know, Cowey, Danny.
[00:45:03] And we do what we teach, right?
[00:45:06] And so now my team is doing all the classes,
[00:45:08] all the entrances in the morning,
[00:45:09] so I can be detached,
[00:45:10] I listen, I observe,
[00:45:12] I come in with my points when I need them.
[00:45:14] One of the things Carlos always says that I always say that Cody always says that you guys always say is,
[00:45:19] hey, when you make a mistake where it cost you something,
[00:45:22] you feel that and you remember it.
[00:45:25] And it's just that's the power of training is when you can feel a mistake,
[00:45:30] you'll remember that mistake.
[00:45:33] There's something,
[00:45:35] when you said you got to do it, right?
[00:45:37] It's so strange.
[00:45:39] The experience that you can watch people have.
[00:45:43] As they get wrapped up and absorbed and overwhelmed by the man.
[00:45:48] And this happens when you run your FTXs.
[00:45:51] When I'm out there, I'll watch people go insane.
[00:45:54] They're totally,
[00:45:56] they're having an out of body experience.
[00:45:58] Like an out of mind experience.
[00:46:00] It's crazy to watch.
[00:46:02] And sometimes they don't even understand it.
[00:46:05] I remember when we first started getting video cameras.
[00:46:09] And we started videoing training.
[00:46:11] This was like, the first time I would say I video training was maybe in the late 1990s.
[00:46:17] Hey, let's watch our room entries and see what they look like.
[00:46:21] And a case that you'd get a guy that would just do something so insane.
[00:46:26] And they wouldn't even understand that they had done it.
[00:46:29] They wouldn't understand that they had done it.
[00:46:31] And you'd have to say, look at the video.
[00:46:33] Watch what you just did.
[00:46:35] We'd like, hey, you backed out of that room.
[00:46:37] I didn't back out of the room.
[00:46:38] No way.
[00:46:39] Okay, watch this. There you are.
[00:46:41] Literally backing out of the room.
[00:46:43] You didn't even understand that you did it.
[00:46:45] I remember I used to have my little audio voice recording.
[00:46:49] So I used to carry a little audio voice recorder echo Charles.
[00:46:53] And the reason because during these nighttime FTXs,
[00:46:56] there's all this stuff happening.
[00:46:58] And you can't write notes.
[00:46:59] So I would just most of the time, I'd just be saying,
[00:47:02] Oh, they pulled a guy off the flank over there.
[00:47:04] That guy left by himself.
[00:47:05] That this is going to go bad.
[00:47:06] I would be making notes to myself in the night come back and be like,
[00:47:08] Hey, you guys left that guy out of the flank.
[00:47:10] That's how we got left behind.
[00:47:11] So I would make notes myself.
[00:47:12] But then sometimes I would use it to capture the audio of what was actually occurring
[00:47:16] of people losing their minds, of people yelling, screaming,
[00:47:21] giving crazy orders, not understood.
[00:47:24] Like, I would record conversations that were mutually unintelligible between two people.
[00:47:29] Where two people were talking to each other and neither one of them.
[00:47:32] It made you could play it.
[00:47:33] And it would be a senseless conversation that made no sense whatsoever.
[00:47:36] They're talking about two totally different things.
[00:47:39] Like, one guy's like, we need to get back over there.
[00:47:41] And then the guy's like, yeah, we do, but one person is talking about back over there
[00:47:44] behind the building.
[00:47:45] The other person's talking about back over there across the street.
[00:47:47] They're talking about two totally different things.
[00:47:49] And I would record them.
[00:47:51] And then play it back for them.
[00:47:53] And they'd realize how absorbed and how you get into this mode
[00:47:58] where your world is shrinking, your getting target fixation.
[00:48:02] It's the opposite of the attachment.
[00:48:04] You're doing the opposite thing. You're just getting fixated.
[00:48:06] Don't watch right in front of you.
[00:48:07] And it'd be a total disaster.
[00:48:09] But what's good is when they'd hear that video or they hear that audio.
[00:48:14] And you'd see the look on their face like damn dude.
[00:48:17] I suck.
[00:48:18] I suck.
[00:48:19] I sounded like an idiot.
[00:48:21] I sounded like a complete idiot.
[00:48:23] And then that would be a way to kind of crack the eagle open
[00:48:28] and crack the mind open and for them to be like, dude,
[00:48:31] what are you saying I need to do?
[00:48:32] Here's what you need to do.
[00:48:34] Take a step back man.
[00:48:35] When the stuff starts getting crazy, when people start yelling,
[00:48:37] if you're yelling, you're the putton commander.
[00:48:40] If you're yelling and screaming, this is not a good indication.
[00:48:43] So as soon as you start raising your voice,
[00:48:45] think to yourself, why am I raising my voice right now?
[00:48:47] What is happening?
[00:48:49] I'm not saying you never have to raise your voice.
[00:48:51] Because sometimes you do.
[00:48:52] Sometimes you've got to get control things.
[00:48:54] But if that's what's happening, you know something's wrong.
[00:48:58] So guys would that's what would start to kind of get their minds open
[00:49:03] sometimes where they would start to realize like, oh,
[00:49:07] I'm not as good as I thought I was.
[00:49:10] And I just had to freaking out of body experience.
[00:49:13] And I think I might be an idiot.
[00:49:16] That's what makes the field training exercise.
[00:49:19] I remember running an echelon front.
[00:49:21] That's what makes it the most impactful form of training that we have
[00:49:25] at echelon front because you're feeling it.
[00:49:28] Like you said that late, this isn't just me saying
[00:49:30] because it's my program, right?
[00:49:33] It's because it's the truth.
[00:49:36] Like you actually feel it.
[00:49:37] You come back from a run and you're humbled and you're sitting there
[00:49:41] and the first thing we do is we debrief that run.
[00:49:44] All right, what was your key takeaways?
[00:49:46] And we're always very clear.
[00:49:47] Remember, we don't care about the tactics when I hear
[00:49:50] the T2 tactics.
[00:49:51] I don't, if you were supposed to come up with the E-side,
[00:49:53] it doesn't matter.
[00:49:55] What would you take away that applies to business or your personal life?
[00:49:59] And so people are, like you said, that you just cracked it open.
[00:50:02] They feel that it's humbling.
[00:50:04] We had a guy here talking about like people just saying crazy stuff.
[00:50:08] We've heard this one multiple times.
[00:50:11] It'll be like squad one, line up on the left, squad two, line up on the left.
[00:50:15] Yeah, and people are like, look around.
[00:50:17] Why is nobody moving?
[00:50:19] They don't realize they said that.
[00:50:21] And one a few weeks ago, I'll put me shit again.
[00:50:24] And it's one of our scenarios where I'm not going to give it out.
[00:50:27] But anyways, it's a stressful situation and also we change something on them.
[00:50:31] It's a prioritizing execute run.
[00:50:33] And the guy sitting there and they come over the plan and somebody asked a question.
[00:50:37] He's like, it's the plan that they came up with.
[00:50:39] We're going to do it.
[00:50:41] He was quoting as if it was somebody else's plan.
[00:50:44] But it was his plan that he just came that he's how the team to go.
[00:50:48] But he's so overwhelmed. And I remember I was watching him and he like just drops the laser tagger to the side as hands to a side and takes a step back and looks around and goes,
[00:50:59] We're going to do their plan.
[00:51:02] Yeah.
[00:51:03] Oh, I'm writing this one down.
[00:51:04] Yeah.
[00:51:05] And in the future, that Jason Gardner story Jason Gardner, they get done there at CQC.
[00:51:10] They're like out right here in SoCal, just in our little kill house.
[00:51:15] They do a run and they're standing around debriefing.
[00:51:19] And one of the officers cracks off around as they're standing there debriefing goes between like a guy's legs.
[00:51:26] And the guy looks up and he goes, he was decocking it.
[00:51:31] You're naming he's talking about himself in the third person as if that's the exact same thing dude.
[00:51:37] Like you're when you start referring to what's happening as if it's someone else in a bad way.
[00:51:43] This is not a good side.
[00:51:45] I stole your your voice recorder trick for when I got out and I was doing sales.
[00:51:50] And I'd be driving, you know, I was starting off cold calling and then I just go to appointments and I was more efficient on the road.
[00:51:56] But I would try to hit as many people as a day and I get done with the run.
[00:52:00] Well, I had to take notes on the conversation I just had so I could follow up with the right contract and everything else like that.
[00:52:05] But I also couldn't sit in a parking lot for 15, 20 minutes because I had other client.
[00:52:09] I had that anxiety that I needed to go go go.
[00:52:12] Wow, it was also commission based only so I needed to get out there.
[00:52:15] And so I bought a recorder and I'd get done with the meeting as soon as I walked out of their doors to my rental car.
[00:52:21] I'd start debriefing myself on that meeting as I'm driving in the next one.
[00:52:27] Stop and then I would do that and then at the end of the night I would listen to all those notes that I had for each one.
[00:52:33] Generate the emails contracts, whatever, get them sent out.
[00:52:36] I know I'm asked all that from you from trade.
[00:52:38] It was efficient.
[00:52:40] I have some of those recordings. I sent a group text with some of those recordings.
[00:52:44] Some team guy because team guys used to record me debriefing.
[00:52:48] And I wasn't me. Wasn't those things. I do have some of those things too.
[00:52:51] Still some of them just out in the field like, like, hey, what's going on right now?
[00:52:55] I have no idea.
[00:52:57] We're all gonna die.
[00:53:00] So some of the problems that we'd throw at the teams obviously given them downman was was a big one.
[00:53:09] We're giving them civilians to deal with putting them in an IED field.
[00:53:13] We build a little simulated IED.
[00:53:15] So things are blowing up.
[00:53:17] Kind of they would end up with split forces for whatever reason.
[00:53:22] Whether we set up a target where it made sense for them to split forces.
[00:53:27] Or we would just drive some situation that would make them split their forces.
[00:53:32] Give them target and then change the target. So they've got like updating intel.
[00:53:37] So that there's a bunch of problems right there.
[00:53:40] And we haven't even mentioned that there could be an enemy shooting at you.
[00:53:43] So those problems, downman, civilians, IED field, split forces, changing targets.
[00:53:49] You haven't even encountered the enemy yet, right?
[00:53:52] So you know it's gonna get wild.
[00:53:55] And then once we start bringing the enemy on,
[00:53:58] and that's when you start to get into, you know, barricaded shooters and you're taking massive casualties
[00:54:04] and hostage situations. We would capture the, just one of the seals.
[00:54:09] We get left behind, we capture them.
[00:54:11] I mean, I used to give 72 hour liberty if you could get a seal.
[00:54:15] Like if you, I'd be like, alright boys, you bring me back a body.
[00:54:18] You bring me back a live one. You got 72 hour liberty.
[00:54:22] I brought you back a few. And one of the times I actually took the guys,
[00:54:26] Cammy's and gear off of her.
[00:54:28] Oh yeah. And then put all the clothes back on and then join back in with the group.
[00:54:31] And just starting murdering everybody. And inside, got into one of their homfies,
[00:54:35] drove off. Came back, was just like shooting them with their own 50 count.
[00:54:39] And they're like, what is our guide note?
[00:54:41] Because I was wearing the kit and the cammy's and I looked like I was one of those guys.
[00:54:45] Yep.
[00:54:47] Yep.
[00:54:47] And that's the kind of mayhem that would go down.
[00:54:50] Well, I didn't help when you're like, J.P. activate.
[00:54:53] Done.
[00:54:54] I rolled back to shark.
[00:54:56] So I can get away with.
[00:54:59] Oh, man.
[00:55:01] And here's the deal, like I said before, all those problems,
[00:55:07] they can be solved. And they can be solved by utilizing the laws of combat leadership.
[00:55:12] And if a leader didn't step up. And again, I don't care what leader.
[00:55:16] I don't care if he was an E5. I don't care if it was a new guy.
[00:55:20] If someone in the platoon didn't step up and start to lead, everyone would die.
[00:55:27] And that was another interesting thing that we could do sometimes is
[00:55:33] is pull, take a platoon guy and be like, all right, dude, you come walk with me on this run.
[00:55:38] And you can watch and you can see how this unfolds.
[00:55:41] And then you give them the ability to detach or sometimes just while some craziness is going on,
[00:55:46] I walk over to like, hey, dude, Kimmer, get off your gun.
[00:55:48] Come over here, step back with me and look and see what's going on.
[00:55:52] Do you see what's going on?
[00:55:53] Yes.
[00:55:54] Dude, we know what decision to make now. Three seconds go.
[00:55:58] You had no idea what to do because you were looking down a corner, pulling your trigger,
[00:56:01] and nothing was happening. Everything was stagnant.
[00:56:04] I pulled you off that corner. Someone picked up security for you.
[00:56:07] Now you look around and it's really obvious what you need to do isn't it? Yes, it is.
[00:56:11] So you have to let people see and feel like you were saying,
[00:56:15] feeling the laws, but feeling what it feels like to detach.
[00:56:21] And then they realize, okay, that needs to be my protocol.
[00:56:24] That's what I need to focus on.
[00:56:26] And the improvement and the learning curve will be so fast.
[00:56:29] Once guys started doing this, like I said,
[00:56:32] by the end of the South training, by the end of land, more for training,
[00:56:35] the platoons would be able to crush the instructors most of the time,
[00:56:40] most of the time.
[00:56:41] Yeah.
[00:56:42] Okay, so that's what we have a failing troop,
[00:56:44] and they just couldn't get it together,
[00:56:46] and they would get recycled, reloaded.
[00:56:48] Yeah, one of the things I wrote down when you were first talking,
[00:56:51] and then you said it again is just as a reminder,
[00:56:54] when I was acting as a role player,
[00:56:57] my at the beginning of like them coming out there for that training,
[00:57:02] I would literally just have on a pair of gator-sung glasses,
[00:57:05] like not a mask, not the nails,
[00:57:07] because I wasn't really worried about being shot up too much.
[00:57:09] Like I just, I was really confident in my abilities as an individual,
[00:57:13] because when you're moving as an individual,
[00:57:15] if you're good at what you do, you actually have some advantages.
[00:57:19] But as the training would progress along,
[00:57:21] the groups that were really starting to get it,
[00:57:24] I knew I was like, oh, this next run is going to be really bad for me.
[00:57:28] It's like, I have a picture of me, I'll try to find it,
[00:57:30] or one of the runs.
[00:57:31] I didn't have a, I forgot to grab a ball of clava,
[00:57:34] or I just had my gator-sung glasses,
[00:57:37] and I got shot two, three times in the face of elimination.
[00:57:40] And those plastic rounds were like sticking out of my cheek,
[00:57:43] but that's what would happen is when they would use the laws of combat,
[00:57:48] we couldn't beat them, even us using them,
[00:57:51] because it's a full-polltune.
[00:57:54] Yeah, yeah.
[00:57:55] And when you're moving as a fire team, I can't do anything.
[00:57:58] Unless I'm acting as a sniper from a distance,
[00:58:01] yeah, I'm going to have that advantage.
[00:58:03] But even then, if they're using the laws of combat,
[00:58:06] and they understand this situation,
[00:58:09] then they're going to, they're going to pin me down,
[00:58:11] they're going to maneuver on me, they're going to call an air support.
[00:58:13] They're, they are going to win when they use the laws of combat.
[00:58:18] It's the same thing for every aspect of your life.
[00:58:22] I don't care what your business is.
[00:58:24] If you decide to use the laws of combat, you will win.
[00:58:27] Personally, I'm professionally.
[00:58:29] And I just remember, like, when guys would be progressing and training,
[00:58:32] I just knew I'm going to get my ass kicked.
[00:58:34] And there was times that I got, my ass kicked as a role player,
[00:58:38] and I loved it.
[00:58:40] Because I met that we were doing our job.
[00:58:42] 100%.
[00:58:43] And I met that those guys were going overseas.
[00:58:45] And what they were going to do, those enemy fighters,
[00:58:47] was going to be glorious.
[00:58:49] And they were all going to come on.
[00:58:51] And that was the purpose.
[00:58:53] That was our mission.
[00:58:55] Yeah.
[00:58:56] Yeah, it was so rewarding to see them start to step up and see the leader start to lead,
[00:59:01] and see the E5 mafia start to take control of stuff.
[00:59:04] And then it would just be mayhem.
[00:59:06] Mayhem for the role players.
[00:59:08] You guys would be doing everything you could cheat, lie,
[00:59:11] freaking sneak, bring yourselves back to life.
[00:59:14] Just do everything you could.
[00:59:16] And they would just kick your ass because, like you said,
[00:59:18] there's 40 of them.
[00:59:20] And there's maybe six, seven role players.
[00:59:22] And you're just going to hit your ass kicked.
[00:59:24] Oh, what if you come against a force that's 40, you know,
[00:59:27] why shouldn't we try and do fight against 40 people?
[00:59:29] Well, no, we shouldn't.
[00:59:30] Because if we're not going to go fight a fair fight,
[00:59:32] we're not going to fight 40 against 40.
[00:59:34] And if we fight, or if I'm going to bring 4,000.
[00:59:36] Yeah, exactly.
[00:59:37] And we would put them in scenarios like that as well.
[00:59:39] Where what the right call would be to back off,
[00:59:42] leave.
[00:59:43] Oh, this building is so well defended that you just kept throwing bodies at it
[00:59:48] and throwing seals at it and they keep getting killed,
[00:59:50] keep getting killed, keep getting killed, no.
[00:59:52] Just take a step back, go, your J-Tack to drop a bomb on that damn thing.
[00:59:55] That's one of my favorite, I would say my top favorite run that we do
[01:00:00] in the field transition as program is it doesn't matter what they do.
[01:00:04] If they keep pushing forward, they're all going to die.
[01:00:08] And it's not until we get done and we're in the scenario and we end it right there.
[01:00:12] And we do a debrief real time so they can see it and feel it in their eye.
[01:00:17] Shit, yep.
[01:00:19] And then it's like, okay, so you have a business.
[01:00:23] You've invested in some marketing campaign.
[01:00:27] The return on investment has been zero.
[01:00:31] What should we do?
[01:00:32] Go harder.
[01:00:33] Put more money into it.
[01:00:34] Okay, so we put more money into it.
[01:00:36] What's the return on investment now?
[01:00:38] Nothing.
[01:00:39] Okay, what should we do?
[01:00:40] Well, it was my plan.
[01:00:42] I think it's a great marketing plan.
[01:00:43] Let's put more money into it.
[01:00:45] And we continue to go down that path.
[01:00:46] We don't take a step back.
[01:00:47] We let our ego drive our decision making process and we realize that everyone dies.
[01:00:51] We lose all of our money, all of our marketing money for the year because we got committed to a plan that didn't make sense.
[01:00:57] And so those are the kinds of transfers of knowledge that goes from this thing that you feel during the FTX into a thing that translates directly to how you're running your business.
[01:01:11] We call that scenario murder hole.
[01:01:16] And it was really cool.
[01:01:18] We did that with a group that we had going, I mean, the amount of diversity of people that come through our field train exercise program is incredible.
[01:01:26] I mean, we've literally seen every walk of life come through that training.
[01:01:30] You have guys that are super fired up.
[01:01:32] I mean, they've got the Jocco haircut.
[01:01:34] They're wearing the Jocco T-shirt when they show up.
[01:01:36] They're wearing the Horjun boots, the origin jeans.
[01:01:38] I mean, they are in origin belt like head to toe, origin, jocco fuel.
[01:01:42] Like Jocco podcast stuff.
[01:01:44] I mean, they're like, so they're running to lead 100%.
[01:01:46] Yes, absolutely.
[01:01:47] And then you have the complete opposite spectrum where it's an individual that you look at them and you're like, okay, they're not, you know,
[01:01:55] on the path when it comes to their health or working out or, you know, just you could tell that in some of them, they don't want to be there.
[01:02:03] There's there because their bosses made them come because we do corporate and then individual ones.
[01:02:08] And I remember we were doing it with this group and there these people were there too smart.
[01:02:12] They're a group of engineers.
[01:02:14] And we get done with that murder hole scenario.
[01:02:17] And we stop and we stop them real time to show them the train and, you know, and this lady, you know,
[01:02:24] if you were to judge a book by the cover, you're probably like, hey, she hates this.
[01:02:28] She doesn't want to be here.
[01:02:29] Like at the beginning of the day, that was just probably her body language.
[01:02:32] We get done with this run and I'm just talking through it and she goes, can I, can I say something on my calves?
[01:02:38] Absolutely.
[01:02:39] She goes, this represents and she goes down this path of like something happened.
[01:02:43] She goes, we were working on this coding problem and it should have been like two weeks.
[01:02:48] She goes, seven months later.
[01:02:50] And she goes, this is that, this is what we do all the time because of our egos.
[01:02:55] We get sucked into projects because of our egos.
[01:02:58] We need to actually detach and we need to actually understand what our priorities are.
[01:03:02] She's going through every, all this.
[01:03:04] I'm like, this is awesome.
[01:03:06] That's it.
[01:03:07] It was so cool.
[01:03:08] And she just has this big smile.
[01:03:09] She goes, this is the best type of training I've ever been to.
[01:03:13] And then I was like, all right, you guys ready for lunch?
[01:03:15] And it was like the run right before lunch.
[01:03:17] We go back and it was for me to sit back as an instructor and watch the guys run the training and have my points.
[01:03:25] And I have my points written down and then for the student going through the training to literally hit all my debrief points.
[01:03:34] Beautiful.
[01:03:35] Was incredible because it shows that they're actually taking on board what we're, what we're telling to them.
[01:03:42] But the reason why is because the training is humbling.
[01:03:44] Like it's you're going to be humbled in the training.
[01:03:47] I don't care who you are.
[01:03:49] You're going to be humbled in that training.
[01:03:52] And that's what's awesome is because that's when they're learning really starts to happen.
[01:03:55] Yeah, the first time we tried it, the first time we tried an FTX with civilians.
[01:04:01] You know, life and I were doing it.
[01:04:03] This is when it was like, Ash Lamp front was basically just life and me.
[01:04:06] And we were, we tried it.
[01:04:08] And you know, you don't know what, you don't know what the reaction is going to be.
[01:04:12] And if people are going to make those connections, those correlations between leadership on the battlefield and leadership and everything that they're doing.
[01:04:18] And it was so awesome.
[01:04:19] I mean, it was, you know, bunch of stories that exact same type of story like, oh, this is what we're, this is, you know,
[01:04:24] ops never support sales.
[01:04:26] This is the problem.
[01:04:27] And you're like, oh, you don't cover move for each other.
[01:04:29] This is exactly right.
[01:04:30] You guys are never there for us.
[01:04:31] And this is what.
[01:04:32] So you get to see these things real time.
[01:04:34] And and as soon as we saw that, that application and how well it correlated, that was when I was super stoked.
[01:04:41] For you to, you to come over and with a long term goal of taking over that program running that program and and growing it.
[01:04:50] So talk me through talk talk us through how what does that program look like right now.
[01:04:56] And not like the broad program, but like let's say I got a company.
[01:05:01] And I, I hear about this thing and I want to bring my team together.
[01:05:06] What am I doing? What is my, I got 20 people?
[01:05:09] I got my leadership team, my executive leadership team. What does the program look like?
[01:05:13] So it will do like a pre-liminary call with the client to kind of figure out exactly what they want to do.
[01:05:19] And you know, Jack Daniel, he's he's been doing all those calls and then it's for an FTX.
[01:05:23] He then does another call with them and me and Jack so awesome.
[01:05:27] He's like, probably you're so busy.
[01:05:28] I don't want to put it on my.
[01:05:29] Hey, if it's for an FTX, put on my calendar, we're doing a call.
[01:05:34] And I just, I really want to understand what their intent is. What are they looking to get out of it?
[01:05:39] Because every FTX is customizable.
[01:05:42] To your industry, your problems, what you have going on now is you know the principles are universal.
[01:05:47] That's what's beautiful about this.
[01:05:49] And, but we can make things where they're different than the others to drive home certain points to you and in your team.
[01:05:56] So we do that call and then, you know, now because of COVID, the virtual world like we just have real quick.
[01:06:03] Yeah, I'll have a company and their growing rapidly and the younger leaders aren't stepping up and making things happen.
[01:06:14] And on a call, they'll be like, look, we need to have better decentralized command.
[01:06:19] Yeah. And then it's like, hey, JP, let's let's set up some runs to make sure we really drive home the point of how necessary it is for subordinate leadership to step up and lead it.
[01:06:29] That's the kind of adjustments we're making so we can drive home specific address specific issues that a company has.
[01:06:36] Yep, absolutely. So we'll be able to do that and put them in the notes and then as we're building out the scenarios, we'll be able to kind of change through all the different scenarios.
[01:06:45] But, you know, most of the time we do a half day or full day class ahead of time to make sure everyone understands the principles.
[01:06:53] You know, we talk about the Valoramadi laws combat, my sister victory, do some application drills. If that's something won't, if they don't, we just do a quick virtual to lead them up to it because
[01:07:03] The FTX program, you're going to learn the principles real time. So depending on the company's time and or budget, some companies, they don't have two full days where they can take the full team out of the field.
[01:07:13] That's fine.
[01:07:14] Well, we can send over a pre-recorded video that everybody watches or we can do a one hour to hour three hour virtual session ahead of time to prepare them with the principles.
[01:07:25] And then we, we come to them or they come to us. They can come to different locations that we have.
[01:07:31] The flexibility that we have with this program is incredible. And then the actual FTX, it's all the hands on application. So we'll show up in the morning.
[01:07:38] We'll put them into their their squads. We'll sign the leadership positions. We'll give them an intel brief. And then they get a plan the first mission and go out there.
[01:07:47] And I think did you skip explain how you teach you give, you know, Mary, who's never handled the weapon before.
[01:07:57] Yeah, never been to never been never been never handled a squirt gun before. Yep. And now all of a sudden you're going to have her clearing rooms. And I know when when we first started actually with you, I had to be like, bro,
[01:08:10] You're not going to make these guys into seals in a two hours.
[01:08:15] They need to have the basic fundamentals of how to enter a room in a safe way in a systematic way so they can clear.
[01:08:24] Well, that that alone is a great example of me not asking enough questions from you and life to get like your actual commanders intent on the field training exercise program.
[01:08:34] Because in my mind, I'm like, cool on my teaching tactics and the entire leadership and it's really important that they do all this stuff and it's like,
[01:08:40] No, actually, I don't have to teach them any of this because we're not here for the tactics. So yes, we start off.
[01:08:46] We give them a, hey, here's what to expect brief. Like it's in all of our notebooks. We breathe them on safety. We breathe them on the fact that hey, you're going to impose more stress upon yourself.
[01:08:57] Then it's actually needed everyone kind of chuckles and like just you wait and see. And then after first couple runs everyone's like,
[01:09:03] Man, I am putting too much stress on myself, my weird. It's like we talked about that.
[01:09:07] And so we run through all this stuff to set the stage. They know what to expect.
[01:09:12] And then we give them their gear. And so we invested into these high speed laser tag systems, which, by the way, is what we used in land warfare. We usually use those in our urban training, but in land warfare in the
[01:09:22] Seal teams, we used a high speed laser tag system that this thing is the civilian equivalent to. Yes, it's freaking legit. It's and that was a complete god thing.
[01:09:33] Because when we ran a few FTXs, it was all it was airsoft. And that's cool because you're getting shot, but there's a, there's a major safety concern with airsoft.
[01:09:42] And people were lifting up their masks because they get fogged and like, we're having a stop training.
[01:09:46] And it took away the, from the purpose of the training, which was leadership. And as we say all the time, communication is what ties everything together.
[01:09:55] And they couldn't properly communicate doing airsoft for paintball because the mask.
[01:10:00] So I reached out to a team guy body. I'm like, hey, I know you did like some events for kids and he had laser tags.
[01:10:07] Can you give me that guy's info. So he sends it to me and look it up. I'm like, oh, these, these aren't what you would think for laser tags. They're pretty legit.
[01:10:15] It's not looking like a nerf laser tag.
[01:10:17] No, it's not like the legit on the green, which by the way, props and nerfs. I've, you've heard me talk about this. Those nerf guns, the nerf laser tag guns that I raised my kids with, our freaking legit for teaching tactics. By the way, just FYI.
[01:10:29] I mean, if you're teaching a kid's at, yes.
[01:10:32] How it, it wasn't what we needed for the FTX program. And we had a client that was, that told us, hey, we want to do this, but we cannot do airsoft for paint.
[01:10:43] We cannot have any safety risk. I'm like, okay, so reach out to team guy body. Give me the info. I look up 35 minutes from my house from when we just moved there to Texas. I'm like, okay, thank you, Lord.
[01:10:56] I go meet the guy. Guy was a veteran. I explained to him what we're trying to do and he's like, well, I'm actually changing these systems to where they looked very realistic. And I was like, okay, this is awesome. So we invest into them.
[01:11:09] And so we have the gear, the sensors, and so what we do is we just, Cody and the guys, they give an awesome class on hey, here's how you use these taggers, these taggers are tools.
[01:11:21] Just like you have tools that work like you in order for you to get the job done, your tool has to be used properly. So we explained to him how to use the taggers.
[01:11:30] And so when we have somebody that's super nervous, I've had people say, I'm not comfortable with guns. And I'm like, that's good. You shouldn't be comfortable around guns unless you have training.
[01:11:41] That's a, that's a good feeling that you have.
[01:11:44] But once you understand the use of weapons, you shouldn't be scared if you know how to use them properly. And I told this lady, it's like it's the same thing for these taggers. One, these taggers can't hurt you. That's why we invested into them.
[01:11:57] So even if you accidentally pull the trigger and it's pointed out you or somebody's face, you won't hurt them.
[01:12:03] And ladies, okay, that's good. I could shoot super well tight. And rightfully so she'd never been around a weapon or a toy gun at all.
[01:12:11] And then, um, which for me was a realization of like the things I just take for granted of just my what I've been around just it's not normal for most people. And so that was when we really shifted over to, hey, let's make them feel as comfortable as possible.
[01:12:28] Like if they're not doing something right, make sure we're not being like, hey, you know, get on to them like we would team guys and Marines because team guys and Marines are very good at going back to that default of like, hey, you stupid.
[01:12:40] Okay, they've never done this before. So we have all the guys there and they're like helping them put on the sensors and hey, you want to plug in the sensor and we go through a class when we say, hey, these are your SOPs for how to use them throughout the day before you, you know, you get your intel, you plan the mission, you breathe the mission, you get approval.
[01:13:00] Then you've got to go find the key guy that the key guy's going to turn on your guns that key guy is a minimum wage employee that's only jobs to turn on your guns every single time we get that brief every company's like, oh, we got one of those guys.
[01:13:14] It's just a minimum wage person that affects whether they can go do their job. The learning point there is how do you treat that key guy.
[01:13:22] And we've had everything from hey mother fucker, you need to get our guns on because we're running late and I was like, oh, oh, I wonder how that works out for you.
[01:13:32] Yeah, excuse my language all my church friends that are listening, I apologize, but that's like you were quoting someone. Yeah, but that's extreme like we will have that we're like.
[01:13:41] So we go we give the class and then we let them have fun like our hey shoot the guns like shoot them as fast as you can here's how you reload it we teach them how to put like a basic patrol and I always tell them like, hey guys these are not tactics these are the basics.
[01:13:55] These are tools single file dual column here's how you get ahead count.
[01:14:00] And so we give them enough tools where they can actually go be successful on the first couple runs based off of the level of those first couple runs.
[01:14:12] When you talked about it's interesting just to just to point out you're talking about the amount of stress that gets created and I just wanted to say that a lot of times people think, oh, well, you know, these are seals they must be talking about all this physical stress, but it's actually.
[01:14:27] No physical stress it's all it's all mental stress it's all the confusion the chaos the mayhem and because the physical this isn't a physical evolution no this isn't a physical evolution there's no in fact.
[01:14:42] You don't allow people to sprint or run that that's part of the embryo no running absolutely no running for and for multiple reasons one safety like hey if you run you roll your ankle you're hurt yourself.
[01:14:55] You trip fall you hit a tree one of these buildings.
[01:14:58] Now you're done and you've taken away from the purpose of the training the purpose of the training is for us to work on our leadership skills for you actually go through the runs and I always tell the story of like when you're running trade it when somebody would do something they're not supposed to.
[01:15:12] You would say hey stop doing the enemies job you get arrested out in town you can't deploy you get in a fight you break your hand you can't deploy you can't run training you can't do whatever you've done the enemies job so I always we tell them that to make it real like hey.
[01:15:27] Don't do the competitions job by taking you out of this training you need to finish the training people are is when you say don't do the competitions job I love I love watching people look on people's face body posture change and I mean we so go back to that lady she didn't even want to touch the attacker I'm like cool just hey you know here let's get you a chair we brought her chair we had her sit down there hey just watch just watch the class by time we get down with a class comes up just okay.
[01:15:56] Do you have an extra like set up for me on my cowboy will get you taken care of and she goes over her cowly gets your size up runs through like hey little quick let's make sure you're good with it.
[01:16:05] Not lady wasn't rock star yeah well if you think about it from somebody that's maybe not familiar at all with the military not familiar at all with weapons and they're just intimidated by it.
[01:16:14] And then they sit off to the side and go oh wait a second this is legitimately like they're playing tag yep but they have teams this is a game that we're about to play and I think I should play this game and we're not going to get hurt so that's another thing in a world of companies will you know we got people that aren't in the best physical condition can they walk down a hallway then they can do this training and what's interesting so we're saying all this stuff look you can't run you can't get hurt you can't shoot at are you you're not going to shoot somebody.
[01:16:43] No one's going to get injured you throw all the things out like oh that might be kind of lame right and here's the thing I was just thinking about like chief shy freaking police chief oh yeah when the first time he came through when he sings totally blown away fx is the leadership lessons that you learn and we got we got all kinds of that's going through going.
[01:17:02] I wish I would have had this when I was in the military so believe me even though it is even though it is like.
[01:17:13] It's it's contained in it's presented in a way that is very safe and very professional and very almost this is the word I was looking for us trying to find the word benign it seems benign it's like oh wait a second
[01:17:29] We're like we can't even run and we're just going to be moving around and these are just laser tag guns it seems super benign you think oh this sounds like it's not going to be that big of a deal and then you go to run number three where people like I need someone else over here we got another and we have to hold it.
[01:17:47] We're not supposed to run and people are sprinting people are going crazy people are losing their minds people are giving orders that don't make any sense all this stuff happens from a benign laser tag system.
[01:18:00] That's what happens that's what unfolds it's crazy I mean we've actually we had a guy that had.
[01:18:08] Multiple sclerosis to he's like I mean he had like a cane and so we were doing the classes you sitting in a chair my guys like took care I remember watching how my guys took care of them without me even having to say anything and I.
[01:18:22] Shocker got a little emotional watching that because I was like my guys know they get it you know I mean like coding coward taking care of this guy.
[01:18:42] I'm like for him saying like oh this is cool it's on it's on to the point where our guys were like all right he can't keep up the group he's not going to walk.
[01:18:52] And so we would drive him out there the role players would drive him off as a sniper and he would be put in places and it was awesome because I listen to radio and I'm here the role players go.
[01:19:17] You can we have positions for you you can shadow me and act as the ground force commander and relay information and it was after two run shoes like hey can I get in there and actually have a position of leadership.
[01:19:28] Absolutely we change up the the re-organ it was cool seeing people who showed up with.
[01:19:49] Why they wouldn't be able to perform and then when they realized that that was all BS that that was imposed upon by themselves nobody else gave them those limitations.
[01:19:59] They gave them to themselves and they saw like oh actually I can be a part of this oh I can actually lead oh I can actually do this I can learn.
[01:20:07] It's incredible I mean just the transformation that you see from and we had a lady who is like we we gave out the leadership she comes up she goes when you say gave out the leadership what you mean by that is you assign leadership for different iterations.
[01:20:21] Okay here's what you're trying to do this yeah each run has a new set of leaders so you like you're saying you're your company of 20 people everybody's going to go through multiple positions of leadership to where they feel all the different.
[01:20:35] I see also in charge assistant officer in charge squad leaders fire team leaders or just a shooter where you're just trying to listen and do the work it's it's incredible it's like.
[01:20:50] You'll become a better leader by serving in each one of those levels like Denver Witton from digging construction came to F. T. X. 001 and he was like super frustrated like and he's a very motivated very smart dude has a very successful construction company out in the Phoenix Arizona area and he came out to it and he was just like kind.
[01:21:12] I remember I remember watching him and listening to him the comments you'd say about the other guys and then he got put in a position of leadership.
[01:21:20] And I think he said it's life. I'm pretty positive you guys I now know what my team feels.
[01:21:26] And I've been doing all these same and it was for him to have the aha moment and then two weeks later he hit us up or now we can have later he goes hey I need to run an F. T. X for 50 of my employees we did two days of F. T. X training with a half day classroom on the back end of how do you implement right strategically how do we implement all these takeaways so.
[01:21:49] You see all this stuff happening real time from all different walks of life it's it's ridiculous so I cut you off of your talking about a female.
[01:21:58] Yes so thank you because I was like what where did we go this one.
[01:22:05] So we give out the leadership and she comes up and makes a comment goes well that's a mistake putting females in charge and I look at her and this is from a company where they have a culture where if you say something offensive like you're you get in a lot of trouble.
[01:22:20] And I looked at her I'm like if somebody else said that to you would you find that appropriate. And she just pauses. She goes well I'm just being real right now I'm like that's actually a lie saying that just because a female is in charge is going to go bad.
[01:22:36] I'm like that's a lot I was like I know a lot of bad ass females that run companies that are kicking ass I know a lot of bad ass female leaders in the military that did some phenomenal things I'm like don't.
[01:22:51] She was dead serious like just like this is going to be horrible like body posture like like go down to the side like and I was like okay so immediately I'm like there's something there like there's something deeper there obviously for her to be like she was not thrilled and just thought it was going to be bad.
[01:23:09] So I talked with Carlos and Cody like we give the intel pull them aside on my k we just keep an eye on her we need to like pour into her because she thinks it's going to be horrible like we need to make sure she gets the burden.
[01:23:23] And then we go to the right we go to the run obviously we put a bunch of stress on her so we wanted her to feel it like we do everybody wasn't any different but we're just very mindful of making sure we're watching and I said you know because we've had some people come to the training where they just stop they're like hey I can't do this is too much I might yes you can like come over here real quick let's talk through it and they're like.
[01:23:50] And this one guy was like I that was all me I put too much stress sorry I won't let that happen again.
[01:23:54] So it's in post stress it was to the point where the guy wanted to stop training he tried to physically stop the training so I want to make sure this didn't happen to this lady.
[01:24:03] Just FYI if you feel like you are too stressed this is a massive red flag that's telling you to detach take a step back take a breath which is as soon as you said that guy okay step back take a breath he's like.
[01:24:13] Okay I can do it's going on all right I'm ready rock and roll yeah and and so I really felt like I just I knew there's something else with with this lady so we get back from the run it was hard but guess what they accomplished with their supposed to accomplish we get done with the run we're doing the debrief.
[01:24:31] And it's in one of my notebooks I remember wrote down what she said but the great point was just the limitation she had and I asked her because she said something her take away was.
[01:24:46] I don't limit what you're capable of and that was like awesome I said expand upon that a little bit.
[01:25:02] I'm like what do you got like this is like this is the time for let's talk through it as if you're comfortable if you're comfortable with it she goes well for my past.
[01:25:15] I'm like right in the line that this could go really but I also knew as an opportunity that if we could talk through something that.
[01:25:37] I said I should not do this because I'll give you some patience she's put on herself because well when you come from another career where your life was threatened and you know you your life was actually threatened.
[01:25:54] She knows because you weren't doing what you should have done she's like.
[01:25:57] I care that.
[01:26:03] I should have afterwards just to get a little more like
[01:26:07] I guess information or situation awareness
[01:26:10] But you know, we talked through it and I said well, hey, I'm glad that you came to that realization like these are one that that's the purpose of the train is for us to feel these things and realize like hey
[01:26:19] These tools work when we use them and all the other stuff that we have in our mind
[01:26:23] It a lot of it's all BS because it's that's not the reality and then we did our end of the day debriefs like our key takeaway
[01:26:31] So we do all the runs we rotate through different positions and then at the very end. It's like hey, what was
[01:26:37] What was your biggest takeaway that you're gonna
[01:26:41] Leave this training with the implement back home and hers was you know same thing like I'm not gonna let my past define me
[01:26:48] She goes today as a fresh start and I
[01:26:51] Always try to explain that when I'm talking to the clients and like that's what you did when you came in a task in a bruiser
[01:26:57] Hey, we're not testing a problem. We're testing a bruiser all the other stuff doesn't matter
[01:27:02] Like this is who we are and this is what we're going to do and I like to also tie that in
[01:27:07] When I'm talking about Ramadi, you know when we talk about like hey, well you come back from the point when we talk about the cost and the burden and all that stuff
[01:27:13] I tried to make it very clear when I'm talking with individuals or large groups like
[01:27:19] We're all gonna have those dark times we're all gonna have those things from our past that could hold us back if we allow them to
[01:27:26] But if that's all we focus on like anger frustration darkness guilt doubt all that it gets us nowhere and I know we've talked about this multiple times
[01:27:34] But we have to focus is the lessons that you've learned and more importantly
[01:27:38] What are you going to do going forward and that's the big thing that we talk about in the field training our sizes like yes
[01:27:43] Hey, you guys made mistakes, but what are we gonna do going forward as a group if we're not sitting and debriefing and coming up with new standard operating procedures
[01:27:52] We're wasting our time
[01:27:53] If we were just a re-organ like all right, hey new leadership go new leadership go new leadership go
[01:27:59] There wouldn't there would not be that progression that we get if it wasn't for the debriefs and
[01:28:05] The debriefs are an awesome opportunity for you to do some soft reflection and that's what's powerful is that soft reflection
[01:28:14] Yeah, well what's interesting about that is
[01:28:17] this this training program
[01:28:20] In situations like this which I've seen and you've seen
[01:28:25] when it goes
[01:28:27] Beyond
[01:28:28] Business application beyond the combat application obviously beyond the business application and it starts to get into people souls
[01:28:38] and
[01:28:39] sitting there listening to people debrief seeing
[01:28:43] grown men
[01:28:51] Seeing you know women apologizing for behavior that they know they they shouldn't have done and it was negatively impactful to their family like seeing those
[01:29:05] deeper
[01:29:06] those deeper changes
[01:29:08] That's always it's always amazing to see that this stuff applies and gets through
[01:29:17] gets through the people's souls it does I mean
[01:29:22] One of our larger field train exercise clients one of their upper executives
[01:29:27] You know the company I'm talking about everyone that we've been interacting with since 2018 run these FTXs all of those key leaders
[01:29:34] They they don't just know the principles to actually live their principles. They apply them. They believe in them and
[01:29:41] Guess what?
[01:29:42] every single one of those individuals has grown within the ranks like multiple tiers of it now
[01:29:48] high level executive leadership positions and
[01:29:52] The individual I'm talking about he's just been in the games since day one with us helped us bring the program to them
[01:29:58] He sent me a text and I always for them to you in life and and Jamie and Dave just so we're all aware of like the impact that we're truly delivering
[01:30:05] I know we know it and I always give it to my team and I I like to if I'm in person with the guys
[01:30:10] But hey just so you guys know this is what you're a part of and as we grow this you're gonna have more and more and more of this because if we do what we teach
[01:30:20] And we do it the right way which we are you all are gonna have teams eventually running this training and
[01:30:26] This is what you need to focus on is the impact that we deliver everything else
[01:30:32] It's important, but it's the impact that we deliver that's what you have to like strategically
[01:30:36] That's what I want you guys thinking about and he sent this text where one of his his executives that
[01:30:43] or directly his his direct report said
[01:30:46] That training fed my soul. Thank you. I didn't realize it's what I needed
[01:30:51] It's just it's incredible to see that impact in
[01:31:00] I wrote this down is one of the things you're talking about is when you were running training
[01:31:04] You said literally we could almost do whatever we wanted
[01:31:10] So I wrote down wide boundaries leadership capital withdrawal return on investment so
[01:31:15] It reminded me of when we went back and you were running training and we literally could do whatever we wanted and
[01:31:23] The reason why is because the training we produced delivered
[01:31:28] Results it we had guys come back from deployment saying the hard training you guys put us through kept us alive
[01:31:38] It kept us alive and I remember when I was being an absolute jackass at training
[01:31:43] I won't be very clear. I've said this multiple times. I always want
[01:31:49] I know I'm in a unique position working at echelon front
[01:31:54] I
[01:31:54] Wasn't this phenomenal leader in the seal teams. I wasn't like Seth
[01:31:59] Relays or you or Dave. I was in some unique positions and there was times where I was a good leader
[01:32:05] But I also know that I was a jackass and that I was
[01:32:08] You know that I was that that guy that my leadership had to deal with so I know there's no one on the seat
[01:32:15] There's no one at the echelon front team that doesn't have that caveat bro no one just FYI
[01:32:20] Yeah, but I mean we want to start pulled up
[01:32:23] You know, yeah, I got deep how deep you want to go. I know, but there's no one that's why we're here. Yes, and I know
[01:32:30] But I also know that because I have that background perspective
[01:32:34] I do at times a peeled a larger base
[01:32:36] Then some of the other instructors because
[01:32:40] I can relate to all the different levels and I and I get that so I want to be when I'm like talking through this stuff
[01:32:45] I want to be I don't think I was just phenomenal like perfect leader in the military
[01:32:49] I was a
[01:32:51] Good team guy. I think I think I think I was a good team guy. I believed in the mission and
[01:32:56] I remember when you pulled me aside because I was struggling with some personal stuff that was starting to affect me professionally
[01:33:02] That's when you told me like hey your job is to be the best damn instructor that you can be so that we don't have to put our uniform on to go to another funeral
[01:33:12] And I know I've shared that story before multiple times
[01:33:15] It was when I realized that it just changed my
[01:33:20] perspective and
[01:33:22] When we started delivering that impact
[01:33:25] That's why we were able to do whatever with with training and
[01:33:29] And
[01:33:31] Because the amount of leadership capital that you built within our community by delivering the absolute best training
[01:33:39] It allows us to make large withdrawals
[01:33:42] But if you make a large withdrawal that has a high return
[01:33:46] You're actually at a higher level when you come back. It's like basic investing. I'm a pull a hundred dollars out
[01:33:53] But it's gonna make me a hundred and fifty dollars
[01:33:55] Cool keep doing that
[01:33:57] every time you've ever made a withdrawal in your
[01:34:03] Career especially tasking a breeder and I trade it the return on that investment was ridiculous and that's what we try to tell companies like hey
[01:34:12] If you're gonna make a withdrawal
[01:34:14] They're better be a large investment
[01:34:17] They're better be a large investment and the more
[01:34:20] Relationships you have within your team the more trust the more trust you have the more influence and you can actually go out and do those things
[01:34:26] And that's what people see real time in the training. Yeah, I remember you had a situation
[01:34:32] There was a safety incident took place and the report came back
[01:34:37] If we hadn't just gone through this training this would have been a complete disaster if we hadn't just gone through this FT
[01:34:44] Extraining this is a
[01:34:46] Let's say up a
[01:34:48] Yeah, a company that does dangerous work, you know dangerous construction type work
[01:34:51] They hadn't a safety incident take place and they reported if we hadn't
[01:34:57] Been through this training whatever it was two weeks ago. This one a bit an unmitigated disaster
[01:35:02] We were able to get control of it prioritized next-cute and decentralized command
[01:35:07] We made things happen and got the problem solved much quicker than we would have had we not been through this journey
[01:35:13] So I've talked with the leadership about that and I asked like hey, how can I share this?
[01:35:17] What can I share because I know some of its sensitive?
[01:35:19] So I'll share what I know we can't share
[01:35:24] There's actually a death on a job site and
[01:35:27] It was we had been running a week of FT X training and it was on a Friday. There was a beautiful day
[01:35:35] And I remember we came back from one of our runs and I was looking around and I could see people's
[01:35:39] Poster changing as they're looking at their phones
[01:35:43] And one of the guys comes up to me and he has tears in his eyes and he said hey
[01:35:46] One of our guys just got killed on a job site and it brought me back to when when Seth was like hey
[01:35:54] Mark just got killed
[01:35:56] It brought me right back to them and I remember sitting on the wall
[01:36:01] That's all I could think about is just like I didn't think I was dealing with this stuff anymore
[01:36:06] And so I said all right, you know you guys kind of let me know
[01:36:11] I'll give you guys some time to kind of think about it and everyone's kind of like checking and they're talking and there's a few people crying
[01:36:15] And they're upset and
[01:36:18] So I'm making an announcement to the FT X team and and to the client
[01:36:22] You know, and I just shared with them I said you know hey
[01:36:26] I told you you guys deal with human life just like we did in the sealed teams and you guys have a very dangerous job
[01:36:33] But it's a very critical job as well if you guys don't do what you do people can suffer
[01:36:38] Like people's lives and businesses can
[01:36:40] Suffer bad so it's necessary that you guys do your job, but it's very dangerous
[01:36:46] And so we go through this whole talk and that you know
[01:36:48] I said hey, I know one of you guys have to leave because it's actually your your teammate
[01:36:52] I said you guys have hit all the training objectives and so we can be done and this would be a good day training
[01:37:01] Or we can do one more run and we can do it to honor this gentleman that just got killed
[01:37:06] Because I'm telling you right now leadership is what's gonna solve every problem within this organization
[01:37:12] If we pulled the thread there was a leadership failure somewhere that allowed this
[01:37:17] complacency to creep in and this individual just got killed
[01:37:21] Because what this guy was doing he had done thousands of times over his career
[01:37:28] It was literally thousands of times and so we finished the run we finished today strong
[01:37:35] That was a Friday
[01:37:37] We had another week with them that we're supposed to do at the end of that month
[01:37:40] Two days later we get an email from the leaderships and hey, we'd like to talk to you guys about
[01:37:44] You know some stuff so we get on a phone call with them and now I can we do another two to three weeks worth of training before the end of the year
[01:37:52] We're like I don't know if we can we might I think we might have a two week block open in December
[01:37:58] But December in your region is miserable
[01:38:01] They're like here's a deal so they took the reason why is because when the executives showed up on
[01:38:09] This location where this individual being killed
[01:38:13] It was a situation they'd never seen before because
[01:38:16] There was no pointing a fingers. There's no one he blaming it wasn't the union blaming corporate corporate blaming union
[01:38:23] There's none of that when they showed up everything would have been taken care of the executive leadership was being told what they needed to go do
[01:38:30] Hey, we're all you doing this you guys you need to go do this boom boom boom boom
[01:38:34] Everything had been taken care of and there was no blame there was no arguing none of that and then the CEO
[01:38:42] And some of the other leaders sat down with the union president and some other leaders and like hey
[01:38:47] How do we make it toward this never happens again?
[01:38:50] And a union president said we go all in with that echelon front leadership training that's the only thing that's gonna keep this from happening again
[01:38:58] And the CEO goes okay, and the executives right all right, we'll see what we can do and
[01:39:05] That's when they came back to us and said hey, we knew we want another two to three hundred leaders put through this training
[01:39:11] And so we put 400 leaders for that training in 2018
[01:39:15] 2019 we're supposed to do a bunch more and
[01:39:18] We have continued to have a great work in relationship with this with this client, but it was a union president that was telling the executives
[01:39:27] We need to go all in with this training because he saw first hand
[01:39:33] Well the reason why everything was running so smooth at that fatality was
[01:39:38] The leaders had gone through our training earlier that week
[01:39:44] That's that same week and you know it was you know, I've had a few members from that company go
[01:39:51] It was a complete godsend that we had your guys is training that week because that was a real
[01:39:56] It was a real hard thing for them to handle and
[01:40:00] I mean
[01:40:02] They've also explained to us like how their culture has changed. I mean, it's been a drastic and you know you know some of the details awesome of just change and it's just
[01:40:13] You know when when we talk about complacency and leadership solving people's problems and we kind of get personal
[01:40:20] And we explained them like hey
[01:40:22] That problem is a leadership problem that is a leadership problem and you allow complacency to creep in
[01:40:29] People get offended at first
[01:40:31] They they get offended, but then we kind of changed the tone like let's pull the thread
[01:40:36] If we pull the thread enough it goes back to a leadership problem that allowed the complacency to creep in
[01:40:43] Because if we go to war with that complacency and we combat it and we do what we're supposed to do we mitigate all those things
[01:40:50] That's what we talk about being default aggressive as what we tell people hey default aggressive isn't and mindset for victory against another human being
[01:40:57] Now in combat yes, but we're not talking about that
[01:41:00] We're talking about being default aggressive to improve a relationship
[01:41:05] Work on your communication being default aggressive to mitigate safety risks and if you're
[01:41:13] Not allowing that complacency creep in because
[01:41:15] Of the leadership that you have because the culture culture is an ultimate form of decentralized command
[01:41:22] And so if you team knows what they're supposed to be doing they don't cut the corners
[01:41:25] Therefore we keep our people safe and it enables like you're talking about in that scenario like hey, I'm not having junior leader step up
[01:41:32] They see enough in in the snares that we run
[01:41:35] There's a void of leadership guess what we should do. Oh, Johnny step up. I don't have an arm bed
[01:41:41] I'm not a leader and I just look and I tilt my head and they're like
[01:41:44] Roger that
[01:41:46] You know, and it's just it's amazing. Yeah, it's it is you know all the problems are leadership problems and what does that mean the beautiful thing about that
[01:41:54] That means leadership is the solution and that means that we can solve the problem we can solve these problems liberating and that is a a powerful powerful thing
[01:42:04] Hey, man
[01:42:07] I mean we work with so many different companies
[01:42:09] I was going to I was about to close it, but I said hey, that's one company and we work with all these different companies
[01:42:14] I know tech companies financial companies
[01:42:18] Manufacturing companies construction companies energy companies. I just every different facet and every different type of
[01:42:27] Group, you know from the tech world to the financial world and the lessons are learned and the
[01:42:34] The culture is changed and leadership rises to the surface to be the solutions to problems that these companies have
[01:42:41] Yeah, I have to show I have to show love for groundworks because you talk about a client
[01:42:47] That's in the game for sure. I mean
[01:42:50] Matt Malone I call Mr Malone he always gets pissed off
[01:42:52] I mean he's like it's Matt and I'm like
[01:42:55] Okay, I have a role. I can't just do that. I have a hard time. I can't you know every since I was a kid. That's why I was raised but
[01:43:01] Matt at groundworks. I mean he saw the power of extreme ownership he read the book and was like hey
[01:43:07] This is this is what I've been looking for came to a monster pay for some guys to go to the monster with them
[01:43:11] Came back was like hey, we want to engage with you guys
[01:43:14] We did a we did a little trial FTX with with a bunch of their leaders and when they saw that FTX are like
[01:43:21] Okay, we need this
[01:43:24] I won't get into all the details of how they run their business and what they're doing
[01:43:28] But I can tell you they are extremely successful growing expanding dominating the market like dominating
[01:43:36] And one of the cool things that they do is every small to every company
[01:43:40] They acquire their their goals are acquiring small to medium companies in their industry with in 90 days
[01:43:46] They run an FTX legit and the reason why they do that is to show this new company that they acquired
[01:43:53] Their commitment to them to develop them as leaders to give them hope to give them like the tools to lead and be successful and
[01:44:01] He says there's no better program out there to implement the lessons and the principles that we need
[01:44:07] But also to tie in the culture. Yeah, because it's like hey
[01:44:11] This is how we do things at groundworks. You're now part of our tribe. Yes, you're still this company right?
[01:44:17] You're whatever that company is you're still them
[01:44:19] But you're also a part of our tribe and it's I mean just to see like the coups bombs like
[01:44:26] To see companies that are that committed to see an individual like Matt that that's that committed to their companies growth and
[01:44:34] Development it's in press vibe just shared with you one of the personal examples that guy that pulled me aside recently
[01:44:42] It was yeah, I made you so incredible. Yeah, it's a it's a huge impact
[01:44:46] And that's a great example like you said of the of a company that is just taking these
[01:44:51] Taking these leadership principles, I've been applying them continuing to applying them applying them at scale
[01:44:57] Yes, which is awesome and continuing to see success after success after success that's
[01:45:05] That's another great example of the many companies that we work with that go out there
[01:45:09] It take these principles implement them and dominate yeah, and it shows them one thing that I've written down
[01:45:15] I wanted to hit is the importance of like
[01:45:18] Like the diversity of people's like different people's ideas and backgrounds
[01:45:23] That's one thing I was talking like a company. I'm like
[01:45:26] The reason I feel one of the reasons why this field team for so successful is because we have like true diversity of skill sets and thoughts in
[01:45:34] And how we conduct business. Hey, I can have a opportunity in full of 18 jocos and that's gonna be an awesome
[01:45:39] Team but he doesn't have all the things that I need not as good as a platoon full of 18 different people
[01:45:46] Yes, not even close yes, I only see what things one way one perspective and that's not what we want
[01:45:52] I want to have 18 different perspectives. Yes, and that's what people see real time in the FTX program is as
[01:45:58] Everyone's rotating through different positions of leadership
[01:46:02] We actually we developed this workbook for them so that afterwards they can capture their their takeaways
[01:46:07] And you see the takeaways
[01:46:11] Evolving as the day goes on because there's all these different ideas and thoughts and the diversity of a company that now they say like oh
[01:46:19] So and so like her ideas are awesome his ideas are awesome
[01:46:23] Let's get them to work together and at the end of the day when they start working together when they start applying the principles
[01:46:31] It sucks from our role players. Yeah, well, that's that's what I was talking to earlier when we kicked this thing off
[01:46:35] I was talking about a seal putt and I was like oh you got all these different types of people in the seal putt and
[01:46:40] You got some smart guys you got some educated guys you got some uneducated guys you got some short guys some tall guys some slow guys some fast guys
[01:46:48] You got somebody that was born with a silver spoon in their mouth
[01:46:51] You got someone that was raised in the ghetto you got all these different people with all these different perspectives and
[01:46:57] That makes that platoon strong. That's what it is
[01:47:00] It's not like you said 18 jocos cool. That's great, but that's not as powerful as 18 individuals that all bring a different perspective
[01:47:08] a different mindset a different viewpoint and that's what makes a platoon strong is
[01:47:14] All the differences that people have you they they they you get to see more you get to see the problem
[01:47:19] You get to see a problem from multiple different angles
[01:47:22] with you know when we when we go out in the field and do a reconnaissance of a target
[01:47:27] We don't just look at the target from one side. No, we do a clover leaf around the target
[01:47:32] We we back out we go in from another angle we back out we going from another angle
[01:47:36] We go all the way around so we can see as many different angles of the problem so that we can figure out how to solve it
[01:47:42] So we if you have 18 jocos that's a one viewpoint if you have 18 individuals
[01:47:47] You got that clover leaf you get to see as much of that target as you can possibly see and that's how you're gonna solve the problems
[01:47:52] I'm smiling because you're saying the clover leaf. I just I watched Cody do this with a group
[01:47:58] The other week they're briefing their plan and
[01:48:01] They're just kind of sitting there listening and you could tell like it wasn't the right plan and so
[01:48:07] Right him and Carlos do instead of saying hey you should do this. They just ask questions. They don't hey
[01:48:13] What if like so I said you have your guys right here and you have your guys right here
[01:48:18] And so they're split so that would be split forces right?
[01:48:20] So we want to make sure they know what we're talking about and Carlos is going to if somebody pops up the middle
[01:48:25] We have to shoot like what would you be able to shoot them and it's all every single time
[01:48:32] Like the client who has zero tactical training goes oh
[01:48:36] That's yeah, we shouldn't do that we shouldn't split forces. We're okay. That's gonna be a
[01:48:40] And Cody built this train map for the large client that we have that we have all the work with he built a actual
[01:48:46] 3D terrain map of the playfields that we use and they were going through some stuff and Cody just grabbed the OIC
[01:48:53] Who is on one side of the table looking at it and brings them around to the other side?
[01:48:58] It's like hey, what do you see?
[01:49:00] And you're this is not the major but just the changing of that guy's perception from over here
[01:49:06] He saw it in a different way. He goes
[01:49:08] Yeah, we shouldn't probably go up that way and Cody's like I like your plan
[01:49:12] Yeah, you've been talking about a bunch of our corporate clients, but also yep, what was it last year was that last year?
[01:49:19] We started the first FTX individual. Yeah, thanks. Well, this is so March
[01:49:22] Okay, so if somebody wants to like let's say I'm just Fred and I this sounds awesome and I got
[01:49:28] I got a small company. I can't I can't bring an echelon front to teach my company
[01:49:32] Because I only got 22 employees, but I got three people. Yeah, my main you know
[01:49:36] Subordinate my two team leaders. I want to bring them so we have a program for that too. How's that work?
[01:49:42] Yes, so we have the individual program the individual FTX program tour and individual like you just said can sign up and come to the training or guy like Denver
[01:49:50] What and who's like I think I want this
[01:49:53] But I'm not sure like let me go test it out. He came to the training tested it out and me
[01:49:57] It was like I need two days worth of this training
[01:50:00] And so we have the next one the next one is in April
[01:50:03] I want to say eight so it's not the dates on lockdown yet. No, I'd have to put my car
[01:50:09] But we'll go to echelon front dot com go to go to
[01:50:13] Events master individual one so FTX
[01:50:16] Zero zero four. It's gonna be in Dallas Fort Worth so we're gonna be back in Dallas again in April in April. So it's kind of cool
[01:50:23] Yes, it's the weather's gonna be perfect and it's so it's the last week in April whatever that Monday Tuesday
[01:50:29] I want to say 2324 something like that
[01:50:32] That will be having that one in April and then we're looking
[01:50:36] Depending on how that one sells out. We have some we already have corporate clients that are like putting locks in our calendar
[01:50:43] 2022 for FTX's I know so FTX zero zero five and zero zero six
[01:50:47] We're not sure those dates and locations yet, but right now and it's gonna sell it every the first three sold out
[01:50:53] It's gonna be in April so an individual can sign up for it
[01:50:56] It's two full days of training so you're getting two full days of those field training exercises
[01:51:02] Well, we'll do the check-in meet and greet on Sunday
[01:51:06] Give out the sweat pre-mission bags with all their gear
[01:51:09] And then on Monday we start the class we do overview
[01:51:14] We give the classes and then they're run emissions all day. We have a team dinner
[01:51:18] And then like kind of open Q&A with you, lay for myself and then on Tuesday full day run emissions and then we'll do GJ2 afterwards as well
[01:51:27] Yeah, and awesome debrief at the end to capture make sure when gets it well freaking right on
[01:51:35] Awesome
[01:51:36] I'm so glad you came to ask a lot of front and you take it this thing and run in with it
[01:51:41] It's just it's amazing to see the impact on individuals on companies on businesses on teams
[01:51:46] It's just how freaking awesome and that we're able to take these lessons and pass them on and people can put them to use to go out there and just and just do what they're supposed to do in the world. Yeah
[01:51:57] It's awesome. Yeah
[01:52:00] Well, thank you for the opportunity once again. Yeah, echo Charles. Yes, we're over here
[01:52:06] You know we're running FTX's and we're doing GJ2 a lifting you know
[01:52:11] F dang yes learning leading right seems like we might
[01:52:17] Want to get all the help we could get in some of these departments what you know what we got for support
[01:52:23] Hacken foundations well
[01:52:25] Well, we can talk about a lot of stuff, but you know in the physical capability realm. Okay. Yeah, we do
[01:52:31] Appreciate the support when we can get it
[01:52:34] Wait JPC or when we just talk about sour apples sniper all day
[01:52:37] Oh, you know we could we could two p okay. Let's rewind you're at trade-out with me
[01:52:44] How many energy drinks are you drinking a day?
[01:52:47] What do you think you're what do you think you're worst like your max energy drinks at day was?
[01:52:53] And we're talking like the big ones that had a big 100
[01:52:57] Oh, that was six to seven eight oh
[01:53:01] I know it's not good
[01:53:03] Yeah, it's bad not true about it's a freaking disaster. Oh, it was absolutely yeah
[01:53:12] All right, so those means where people were like this is my body like with all the checklights like
[01:53:20] That was you me I trade at me on the outside and sales of financial company
[01:53:26] It's been me for a long time, but not anymore that you're like
[01:53:29] Like
[01:53:31] And you know like
[01:53:34] Whatever see whatever you want about me. I don't have I could not
[01:53:39] Make something like that and sell it to people I couldn't yeah as far as I'm concerned
[01:53:45] I might as well be a drug dealer that that that is a drug dealer that is it that is a person that is
[01:53:50] Given freaking crystal meth and fedemine to people and and knowing that they're gonna get a dick to do it
[01:53:57] Knowing that you're hurting the health probably gonna kill them and you don't care because I'm making money
[01:54:01] I could not do that from a moral standpoint as a human couldn't do it zero chance and yet
[01:54:08] I kind of felt like I got to do something because otherwise people are out there
[01:54:13] They're visiting the meth dealers
[01:54:15] Right going to seven eleven there's a meth dealer in there in a you know freaking ice box and
[01:54:23] There's a short term benefit
[01:54:25] That you need that I need sometimes that echo Charles needs sometimes hey you need it look it's a long day
[01:54:32] Whatever it's
[01:54:34] Last night I got I
[01:54:36] I guess I got like three and a half hours of sleep. I actually woke up at 4.30. I was like, okay
[01:54:41] If I'm not feeling it I'm gonna go back to bed. I was like I need more sleep
[01:54:44] I tried to go back to bed. I couldn't go back to bed
[01:54:47] I couldn't go back to sleep so I just got up worked out and
[01:54:51] But then I then within we're in here
[01:54:54] I'm tired
[01:54:55] All right, was tired when I showed up then I so what do I need I need something to help get over that
[01:55:02] fatigue
[01:55:04] What do I need oh I'm gonna have one of these things do I want to go down to do the crackhouse and buy some rocks because that's gonna hype me up too, right
[01:55:12] It's gonna hype me up right. That's a terrifying dog
[01:55:16] Yeah, it's gonna hype me up, but guess what it's gonna kill me. Yes, so we're not doing that
[01:55:21] No, so we made something that you can drink that's good
[01:55:25] Literally good for you no downside
[01:55:29] Makes you feel hype
[01:55:31] Is that a good one?
[01:55:33] Approved this out is not you're shaking your head. I sense it. I'm not there yet. Let's say that what would be a better word
[01:55:38] I was digging deep for the old vocab
[01:55:41] I like I like fired up. That's the
[01:55:43] I don't like that. I don't know
[01:55:46] I think I'd prefer hype over fired up
[01:55:49] Okay, hype it is then I'm in
[01:55:53] D.P. Anything better than that?
[01:55:55] I mean not everyone's gonna fully get this, but there's a few times I've cracked these open. I just tell myself activate
[01:56:01] Yeah, that's great
[01:56:03] I'm gonna get that
[01:56:04] I do like soccer saying JP activate on radio
[01:56:08] That's a little level seven free from our load. Yeah, if you follow me on Instagram if you ever see or on a post and I've have a hashtag activate
[01:56:16] It's for that. It's just hey
[01:56:18] Just
[01:56:20] Yeah, so in JP way JP would be the bad guy one of the bad guys and the cartoons would be like trying to work through a problem
[01:56:26] Whatever and they just be screwed something up screwing something up and they needed to pay the man
[01:56:30] I just come up on the radio and be like
[01:56:33] JP
[01:56:34] activate
[01:56:36] He would come out of a spider hole
[01:56:40] Or a false wall with a mark 46 of reconcibian issue. I just lay ways. I remember one of the times
[01:56:47] I was like waiting for it. I'm not gonna say his name because he's still in but it's nicknamed man bear pig
[01:56:53] So
[01:56:54] Which was very fitting for this human being yeah, it's terrifying and he was like now the new LP out and his towards my end as I was getting out
[01:57:03] And I was like waiting. I was like he could tell he said hey
[01:57:06] He's like wait wait until jockel gives a call
[01:57:09] And I'm just like freaking out like just like waiting because I was so hyped up
[01:57:13] I mean I I loved what I did I loved every single day of being in the sealed teams and it's the same thing now
[01:57:20] I'd actually on front running these filtering. I mean people like man. I don't like
[01:57:25] You don't get it like how do you keep on I'm like I love I literally love what I'm doing and it was like the same thing
[01:57:30] He's like wait just wait hold like hold like all and I'll study like JP activate. He's like go
[01:57:35] Yeah, if you need to activate activate it like it boom if you need to activate freaking crack open one of these and you'll get
[01:57:47] Activated kick out that door start laying the waste with a mark 46
[01:57:51] The right way but yes, no price you don't pay no price later. No, you just go
[01:57:56] We're not doing the freaking Nazi thing putting our guys on on math. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, they deal with the devil
[01:58:02] Yeah, it's like oh, what do you need oh you need that oh yeah, and then they collect that check afterwards
[01:58:07] Right you can big trouble something big trouble. We don't get that with draw
[01:58:11] Did you were talking about that with draw what we're looking for no, no, no, no, oh good
[01:58:15] So yes, jaco discipline go or are we going with jaco go because kind of interchangeable really interchangeable
[01:58:21] Yeah, that's the energy drink. That's the one that we want this one
[01:58:24] We want to stick with sour apples sniper. It's a good flavor to their all good flavors
[01:58:29] They're all good flavors and I can tell you personally the
[01:58:33] Ftx program is run and fueled by the discipline goes because we get them sent to every location ahead of time
[01:58:41] Jack Daniel just he's in the game. He takes care of that. I used to do it. He's like I got it
[01:58:44] He's like JP. I got we have him at every Ftx for our team
[01:58:51] For all the prep I had a day's ahead of time all the stuff they're doing and then also for the client as well
[01:58:57] And we have to put it out right. Hey
[01:59:00] You these are healthy, but you don't need a drink one after every
[01:59:04] Because they taste so good. We had one guy. I was like watching it
[01:59:07] I was like hey, he's like what's up? I'm a camera. He's twitching. Oh no because you literally could drink six of these
[01:59:14] And be equal to two of those larger drinks from the devil and and so I
[01:59:19] Pulled my side. I'm like hey how many he's like I've had one after every run. I'm like
[01:59:23] You're drinking water for less the day. I'm like you're good
[01:59:28] Still like not an unhealthy level. I said, but man like you're just you don't need to be doing that
[01:59:34] He's like they just taste so good. I like now I want to as I I'll let you in a little secret
[01:59:38] I know that in the future they're talking about hopefully having
[01:59:44] Caffeine free. Yeah, he's like okay
[01:59:47] He is so excited guys in the game. We'll get there. Oh, yeah, and it makes sense
[01:59:53] Good because the you know how when you drink in the different drink or whatever you drink one
[01:59:57] You're like cool you drink two and you're like okay, two's kind of good
[02:00:01] Whether it be the flavor the heaviness of it or whatever
[02:00:03] Don't have that and as they electrolytes too
[02:00:06] You can dig it. He's drinking one after every run. Yeah, just feeling it
[02:00:11] That's one yes. I suggest mango. That's my suggestion. I was talking to a gentleman
[02:00:17] By my advice
[02:00:19] A little bit biased, but hey, maybe it's your bias you gave you said I said that all good
[02:00:23] They are all the fries. Oh, okay, so one guy who's talking to you is like hey, I'm gonna
[02:00:28] I'm gonna try either the orange or the mango
[02:00:31] Yeah, care was it making you witness this whole thing kid and I said okay
[02:00:34] You're asking me that okay. All right. I said I think if you want to go a little bit more exotic a little bit more risk
[02:00:40] I'm trying mango. Yeah, if you want to go to the the the the the dried and true
[02:00:45] You go orange. Yeah, I think sour apple snipers kind of like on the same level as mangoes for his that goes
[02:00:51] I think no, I don't think so you think it's more tried in true. No, I think it's tried in true
[02:00:55] The the thing with the sour apple is it's the sour is
[02:01:00] It's a lot more it's a lot more sweet than sour. I mean if we can taste
[02:01:04] It's sweet. It's sweet. It's freaking sweet. So orange is sweet
[02:01:08] sour apple definitely sweet mango has some exotic
[02:01:12] To it it's still sweet. Yeah, sweet
[02:01:16] Yeah, so a lot of people they like they love they love love and they think it's like way better
[02:01:21] But then some people are just straight up not down actually one person
[02:01:24] For the mango. Yeah, you mean me. Yes, you're right. I don't like mango that
[02:01:28] Dax out as you'll throw you off because you don't know and then you taste you like oh yeah
[02:01:33] Why is this so good like you try figure out and people that love dog no pepper to my or starting a distribution company
[02:01:39] Yeah, he just decided he's just gonna become an distributor of the drinks
[02:01:45] Yeah, so he started just rolling into places and now he's just going on the war path so I
[02:01:51] Like not at that level. I think so he he was talking to Amanda not at the Vegas Musker
[02:01:57] And she's like that's that's amazing
[02:01:59] Yeah, you know that's how I got introduced to the new jujitsu gym on that is through Dedeko
[02:02:04] It's for me, yeah, right? He's gym double five and he's setting him up so I have I don't even know how many jimves
[02:02:11] I have under me as like whole set of those because I can set up the amazing thing and then I thought
[02:02:17] Did Dakota was doing that as well. Yeah, he's doing it like freaking he's gonna start restores
[02:02:27] I'm sorry
[02:02:29] Good of course very exciting stuff, but yes, stay in the game with all this stuff helps us go
[02:02:34] I had today but I didn't eat breakfast or lunch and I got one of these at the house same
[02:02:39] Yeah, it's good two of the pills with it
[02:02:43] That's just falling in bottle for the flight
[02:02:46] Don't forget about your drinks. No, forget about you talk about complacency creeping in
[02:02:52] But yeah, but sometimes that you that'll come on slowly where you don't notice the one that you're looking at
[02:02:56] I mean, I'm like I gotta feel like I gotta warm up just to live in my normal life, but you don't want that
[02:03:01] So you take the joint warfare the superkilled oil and just keep keep everything in line then
[02:03:05] It's good you'd be happy you did also vitamin D3 and cold war this for you moon immunity
[02:03:11] Greens by the way
[02:03:13] I think you're so some good stuff about the dreams. They're really good. Yeah, you use the particular case
[02:03:21] You did
[02:03:27] You're gonna go into it. I thought that was like pre podcast talk
[02:03:33] Let's say you have some cocktails just some wine with your significant other sure
[02:03:40] So man, and I were having some drinks and you know the next day I'm like
[02:03:44] This is exactly why I don't drink. I don't drink for this reason
[02:03:50] When grab two scoops of the greens half water half apple juice
[02:03:56] tasted phenomenal
[02:03:58] I felt amazing afterwards back in the greens greens greens is kind of a the greens kind of a miracle
[02:04:03] You can also do it right before bed like so if you have some drinks
[02:04:07] Yeah, and maybe you shouldn't be drinking and but you do and
[02:04:10] I want to choose scoops of the drink of the greens water right before bed so we got hangover prevention
[02:04:17] We need to know it
[02:04:19] We need to know but we have it if we're talking about the
[02:04:22] You know how you feel things real time like when I have the greens
[02:04:28] I feel really good
[02:04:30] Really good
[02:04:30] Don't study sample size of one you know that's where it starts
[02:04:34] 100% for the for the factual is true
[02:04:36] fact also mook don't forget about mook you want to make it more protein about mook
[02:04:41] Yeah, that's hard it's hard different about mooye
[02:04:43] Right, but yes, that's that's a dessert. There's nothing there's nothing
[02:04:48] There's nothing but you just sit there like you'll be in some a random spot and just think
[02:04:52] Man, I really want to go right now. That's yeah, that's the thing
[02:04:56] There's no other even steak even steak. I won't have a I won't have a craving for a steak as much as I will have a random
[02:05:06] I really want to mook right now. Yeah. Yeah. That's how tasty
[02:05:10] I mix two thing have you mixed a greens with the mook? No, I have not done that's bold. Let's both think about this vanilla gorilla with the greens
[02:05:19] Getting crazy over here. It's really good drinks
[02:05:21] Yeah, because if you know vanilla protein powder with fruit right if you want to make a smoothie you're gonna put some frozen fruit in there
[02:05:28] well
[02:05:30] The greens have that fruit flavor the pineapple and coconut so it's it's really good
[02:05:34] Interesting because yeah, that's kind of how mook the nature of mook can be is you make some other stuff in there
[02:05:40] Let hey look I stick with the chocolate
[02:05:42] So if I put anything in the chocolate put a little bit of a frozen banana and that's sort of it right
[02:05:47] Tell us oh yeah, that's the one right there, but yes, especially with the vanilla you can mix all kinds of stuff in there
[02:05:53] Yeah, just enhance it
[02:05:55] It's good. You know, Tosi's done a lot of amazing things in her life and the only thing that you seem to care about is that she told you to put half right
[02:06:02] My fantasy your freaking mook bro
[02:06:04] Girls with them veteran
[02:06:06] She's the congresswoman. She's a surfer. She's a fighter and you're over here talking about rotting bananas
[02:06:13] Go into mook and that's like the deal well. It's face it toll sees surfing abilities and you know her service and stuff play
[02:06:21] Less of a role in my day to day life and check okay, but I'm just saying that frozen banana mook
[02:06:28] Face it
[02:06:29] Kind of a game. Yeah
[02:06:31] She didn't do much for you as a as a representative of Hawaii
[02:06:36] She didn't do much of you as a combat back going overseas. I didn't help you out, but day to day
[02:06:40] She's all up in that mook the moot train. She gives good advice
[02:06:46] Hey, you get the drinks you get the drinks at walla on the east coast
[02:06:48] We're going into a bunch of other stores right now. I'll keep you posting on all of that
[02:06:52] You can get the you get everything a vitamin shop
[02:06:55] Go hook up the vitamin shop and look you can get all of it at jockelfield.com and if you subscribe
[02:07:01] There's no
[02:07:03] Shipping payment which is a big deal
[02:07:05] Because look let's face it. There's other companies out there you might have heard of some of these companies and they're
[02:07:11] Get you on this little thing where you're getting stuff shipped your house for free and that can be hard to compete with
[02:07:17] How do you compete with it? Do a little subscription activity help us put down the big boys
[02:07:21] But if there is an issue with your order that if you order from jockelfield.com or jemaine.com
[02:07:28] Then you reach back out to origin in jockelfield and they fix it
[02:07:32] Hmm the the other ways that you can get it like if there's an issue with your order
[02:07:37] There's an issue with your order. That's it
[02:07:38] But jockelfield and origin they're gonna resolve that problem. They're gonna take care of it. They're gonna make it right
[02:07:45] Yeah, it's true also you mentioned origin origin USA.com. It is the origin main to it
[02:07:51] It is all the all the same gig
[02:07:53] This is American made stuff denim boots belts wallets whatever else Pete thinks up does a heavy hoodie
[02:08:00] You're a great thing. I don't have one, but you know, that's good
[02:08:04] That's kind of me
[02:08:05] I understand you over there with rotten thin
[02:08:08] Brought bananas. We got to have the hoodies
[02:08:10] I just want to go to a merchant camp and not leave with a heavy hoodie yeah, oh yeah, I kind of jam them up that opportunity
[02:08:17] Real lip-y over there. Yeah, I got a cookie. I got a good
[02:08:22] Yeah, so everybody that attendance merchant camp
[02:08:25] One leg of them origin origin USA. Yeah, all made in America everything from the materials themselves
[02:08:32] Yeah, oh by the way there's a bunch of people that have been trying to get stuff from overseas and there's a bunch of
[02:08:37] Ships sitting off the coast of California New York and they can't get their stuff in here
[02:08:42] Their supply chain is all jacked up. Guess what we got Americans supply chain on the American supply chain did I just say that the whole thing
[02:08:49] every single part of that
[02:08:51] Garment that you're wearing be it jeans be it boots be it a freaking rift key
[02:08:58] Doesn't matter that whole supply chain is right here in America
[02:09:03] We're not waiting in the port. We're not we're not paying somebody to have imposed slave labor to build you a freaking pair of jeans
[02:09:12] And then call them American
[02:09:14] No, that's not American how can a pair of American jeans not be made in America?
[02:09:21] Answer me that real be that echo Charles. It's a hard riddle. You can't you can't solve it because it's wrong. It's a lie
[02:09:30] We're not doing that. No origin USA
[02:09:33] Also jocos a store. It's called jocos store
[02:09:37] I know nifty name I get it, but some good stuff on there. This win goes freedom shirts hat to it
[02:09:42] Djitsu is life jitsu is life yeah
[02:09:46] Got a little jitsu. So there's a jitsu kind of section emerging look at you
[02:09:52] section I don't I don't
[02:09:55] Condone not doing jitsu choosing not to I'm not gonna condone it
[02:10:01] But some people don't some people do the people who do not like a little section of
[02:10:07] Representation on the path on the jitsu path is being is emerging right now
[02:10:13] You know how many people have told me that they've started jiu jitsu because of the podcast
[02:10:18] How many think I don't know how many you know how many people have come up to me and said hey
[02:10:23] I started jiu jitsu because the podcast and I really regret it
[02:10:26] Zero that number is zero if you are listening to the podcast if you're living human being go start trying to jiu
[02:10:34] To go start trying to jiu jitsu start right now. Yeah
[02:10:37] It is then you can stop then you can shop this do jiu jiu sacks yeah and also think about
[02:10:43] All the people that said oh yeah, I started jiu jitsu. I wish I would have started sooner 100% I'm one of those people by the way
[02:10:49] I am too. Yeah, I wish I was born on the massive justice
[02:10:57] How about that shirt locker do you know you're always excited about your little
[02:11:02] Designs you say they're yes you give these you try and explain to me
[02:11:06] You say they're more creative or they're more layers you just say weird stuff about you don't know how to describe
[02:11:11] You're limited vocabulary tricks you up right there jiu up as you like to say
[02:11:16] So I was at juggle live last night and I see you guys walking up to me
[02:11:21] He's got a shirt that looks freaking legit. It's got like a metallic tank
[02:11:25] Writing on the top and it says discipline and then there's an actual tank with the barrel pointed at the
[02:11:32] At you as you look at the shirt and as you get closer. It's a comic book cover and I'm on it some cartoon version of me riding a tank
[02:11:43] And it's a t-shirt so that's the first one that I've said yeah, well, you know kind of dope
[02:11:49] Then the first one is me. Yeah, it's the most it's the most
[02:11:55] differentiated from your standard
[02:11:57] Joco store shirts. It's the most differentiated one. Yeah, it's kind of a curve ball stylistically
[02:12:04] It was good though. Yeah, I think it landed very well. Oh, I did so it's death core to the core. Yes
[02:12:11] I learned something new recently somebody who's talking about the shirt locker
[02:12:15] subscription and I know a
[02:12:19] Good amount of people are like man that'd be awesome. I just have too many shirts
[02:12:22] I got I get it trust me. I get it
[02:12:24] Well recently I heard a comment friend of ours. I'm not put his name on blast in the podcast
[02:12:30] But he was like I have way to make shirts
[02:12:33] I don't need it. He's like, but I do a shirt locker just a support echo
[02:12:36] And what he does is he gets all these shirts
[02:12:39] He wears them for a little bit and then he just gives them out as gifts to people and people were like super stoked about it
[02:12:45] And so if you have if you're thinking if you're like hey, I have too many shirts
[02:12:49] I don't need the shirt locker. Give the shirt locker and just get your re gift on
[02:12:53] In this guy loves it. He goes he gets so much fulfillment. I just being able to give out the shirts to different people or someone's like
[02:12:59] Hey, I like that shirt. He's like cool and he gives it to him
[02:13:02] There you go. There you go see the shirt locker gonna pay you twice
[02:13:06] I'm gonna pay you gonna get a cool t-shirt. Yeah, pay when you give it away to your friend because I liked it
[02:13:11] Yeah, I don't I mean it depends on your lifestyle. I don't feel like I have too many t-shirts
[02:13:17] Because of the shirt locker because all of them that come in are in the rotation granted. I'm a little bit biased because I probably won't make one that I wouldn't wear
[02:13:27] I would hope I don't think so. I'll be kind of whack. Yeah. Yeah, that doesn't make sense to do that
[02:13:33] Yeah, but you know how like you just you know how some people that anticipate. Oh, yeah, or they get a lot of recommendations for something
[02:13:38] And you'd be like oh it's a good idea. I don't know if I would necessarily wear that
[02:13:42] But it's okay, but they the poofies in the putting everybody saying this and it's actually technically
[02:13:46] I got a CSE and now it is now
[02:13:48] You're so ready at the whim of the people kind of chasing the glory like oh everyone else likes it
[02:13:53] So I'm just gonna go that's where we're at now
[02:13:54] That's figured it out. I call it. I call it listen to my people
[02:13:57] That's what I call it. I should I not listen to them. Look each other. Maybe maybe I have all the stuff
[02:14:02] I have all the stuff out. I don't want to listen to nobody except your all attention
[02:14:05] So I get this here. So if there is a demand for these things yourself on report you go
[02:14:10] Would you go V-neck route then?
[02:14:12] In the words of both you guys by the way
[02:14:16] If there was a demand signal for V-neck then yeah, I might consider sure
[02:14:23] Anyway, short locker is on jockelstore.com
[02:14:26] Hey, if that's for you we have some developments in that section by the way
[02:14:32] So if you're a current member we're gonna have some upgrades and some updates for you
[02:14:37] Any problem now don't store.com. Oh, subscribe to this podcast wherever you subscribe to podcast check out the unraveling podcast with Darrell Cooper DC
[02:14:46] Grounded podcast warrior kid podcast. I got jockel live last night kids children put me on the spot
[02:14:52] I have one question for you mr. Willink
[02:14:56] Yeah, what's up son? How can I help you when is the next warrior kid podcast coming out cuz it's been 14 months
[02:15:02] Next question from a kid hi uncle Jake. I'd like to ask you a question. Oh, what's your question young man?
[02:15:12] How can I help you? I was wondering when the next warrior kid podcast is coming out
[02:15:20] Yeah, I'm sorry man
[02:15:24] Also joccon around.com if you want to hear some alternative podcasts some some alternative information
[02:15:31] Life advice by the way life advice Q and A
[02:15:35] Didn't a lot of Q and A in there you can go to joccon around.com now
[02:15:39] Here's what we've been talking about
[02:15:42] Why do we do that well because we don't control the platforms we don't know what the platforms are gonna do the platforms big tech what do we okay?
[02:15:49] What whatever
[02:15:50] What could possibly I be doing that would make someone say?
[02:15:53] You know what we need to pull this guy pull the reins in on this jocco guy. I don't know but I got freaking straight up shadow ban
[02:16:00] Oh, yeah, I was gonna text you cuz on one of your poor wealth of the video
[02:16:05] You know that we did
[02:16:06] Yeah, Travis Miller and you post it so I'm like oh, yeah, you know
[02:16:10] It's fun to see people's reaction to that can stuff and man it was getting no trash
[02:16:15] You know yourselves like brother this doesn't and then you had that other one that you were kind of posting like stuff right like
[02:16:20] The video of your screen. Yeah, the video that someone sent me of my screen not seeing me right
[02:16:27] Yep, I was like you got straight up shadow bin shadow banned for what I actually don't know
[02:16:33] I actually am not 100% sure I have some suspicions. I have some things that I think it could be
[02:16:42] Yeah, I've spoken out about some situations that are unfolding on
[02:16:48] Instagram on podcasts on my podcast on other podcasts and
[02:16:53] And
[02:16:55] That's that we don't really where someone it makes me so mad. I was in Colorado and I told you this right before the monster
[02:17:03] I was there working with a client
[02:17:06] It was on about that this family. There's like a little kids
[02:17:09] You know, it started talking to him like, okay, you should check out my boss
[02:17:13] He's got these kids for he's got these books for kids called the warrior kid and then mom was like
[02:17:17] I'm a teacher. This would be a phenomenal and so that the dad was like well, what's his name? I'm a jocco
[02:17:22] We're like he's like, okay, which it's funny anytime I say your name is somebody doesn't know you
[02:17:27] It bothers me
[02:17:29] I
[02:17:31] What are you talking about you don't know and then I have to be like oh, okay not yet everyone doesn't know him yet
[02:17:36] But they will and so I was like hey, let me see your phone. I was like you have Instagram
[02:17:40] I'm like open it up. It's like all right because I don't want to do like hey look at my plate
[02:17:43] Yeah, well forget so I now this my default is I hate open up your phone
[02:17:47] All right, okay
[02:17:48] Open up your Instagram. Okay
[02:17:50] And I'm like oh let me see it real quick. I just take it and I start typing it. I'm like
[02:17:54] The heck he's like is that him? I'm like know that's a meme page about him. He goes he has a meme page about him. I'm like oh, yeah
[02:18:00] So he's starting to use like his a quote page to you
[02:18:03] Oh, yeah, I had to type your name fully for you to show up
[02:18:07] Then I clicked on it and then I immediately was like and I was like hey, you're following him now because I followed you
[02:18:12] You gave him back to them like I was like why was this that I'm like you look like he's being shadowed
[02:18:16] It starts like looking through all your stuff. He's like why would he be shadowed out on like because he speaks to truth
[02:18:23] It's so freaking crazy it's crazy that that's
[02:18:26] That's a dangerous thing is to speak that truth these days. It is very disturbing
[02:18:31] It is very very disturbing and to that degree where they can wear someone and I'm totally dispaculating
[02:18:37] But they'll hear you say something that they didn't like like
[02:18:41] Somewhere else and then be like let me go to his Instagram
[02:18:44] And shadow it really makes me start to think about all the level of
[02:18:51] Interconnectivity between some of these elements out there and it's
[02:18:56] Because it is very strange now look could it be like oh, I was you know someone mentioned me or something
[02:19:02] There's some fall and and they got an algorithm that runs and it's like oh, yeah
[02:19:05] This guy I boom and he got and then they went. Yeah, we shouldn't have we shouldn't done that now because apparently
[02:19:10] I think I might be on shadow band right now. I think I think yeah, I got sure I went on on Sarah's phone and looked for you
[02:19:17] And you pop right up, okay, but I think she's following she follows him. Yeah, so that's
[02:19:24] Well, hey because of all this what what J. P. I was gonna say it's just even more
[02:19:30] Confirmation that you know you're doing the right thing we're doing the right thing dogs don't bark at parked cars
[02:19:35] True, you know so
[02:19:37] Because of this
[02:19:40] We and we figured this out was it a year ago we started joc on the ground calm because I knew we needed
[02:19:45] Consentancy plant in case things went sideways we could get taken off of every platform that could happen
[02:19:50] And so if you want to support us go to joc on the ground calm it's a $8.18 a month
[02:19:55] That allows us to have this platform that if things go sideways we will be standing by in the underground to do what we got to do
[02:20:04] If you can't afford it, it's all good
[02:20:05] We still want you on the team email assistance at joc on the ground calm and it for like a reward or an appreciation
[02:20:12] We do another little podcast and talk about some alternative subjects and you know it what you know what I'll do is I'll
[02:20:18] I'll on that I will do a one about why I think I got shadow banned
[02:20:22] I'll give all the details because I I'm pretty confident I have I'm pretty sure I know why
[02:20:29] Interesting um throughout the side here. I don't need to sleep tonight. We can do it tonight if you want
[02:20:38] YouTube channel subscribe to that a
[02:20:42] Fish, yep, it's official whatever
[02:20:45] Can see what J.P. looks like you can see as Jjit to his life t-shirt
[02:20:48] You can see my t-shirt only only what I was saying T-shirt a lot. Yeah, that's kind of what I do
[02:20:54] Orgen USA has a cool
[02:20:56] YouTube channel as well. We have psychological warfare. I made a little album
[02:21:00] You can listen to it if you have a moment of weakness you can overcome that moment of weakness flip side canvas speaking of the code of Meyer
[02:21:06] Not only does he have a distribution company
[02:21:09] He also has flip side canvas can hang cool stuff on your wall
[02:21:13] To go to Meyer freaking one of my heroes got a bunch of books final spin J.P. J.P. The Mel
[02:21:20] Come on J.P. What up so J.P. The Mel you read you got on the plane and you read final spin how that work out for you. Oh
[02:21:32] Good, well this is what I love about you guys people don't understand this little behind the scenes J.P. and I
[02:21:39] We can both we we are both
[02:21:42] We we can both we can both get emotional at certain things. Yeah, and
[02:21:47] It's funny to watch each other get emotional and
[02:21:50] We make fun of each other forgetting emotional laugh at each other
[02:21:54] Literally I was at the last monster. I'm sitting backstage of watching J.P. Joke up and I'm laughing and I'm just preparing
[02:22:03] Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's just preparing so I'm like okay
[02:22:06] So anyways as soon as he
[02:22:09] He goes
[02:22:10] Walked in the age and yeah, I read the book on the plane and I saw the look at his face. I was like oh
[02:22:13] He hit him because it's a rough book to read emotionally. Yeah, it's an emotional roller coaster
[02:22:18] It's awesome. So we got the copy of the final spin at the monster so we're leaving Vegas Amanda Amanda had a copy
[02:22:27] I ordered 10 like when they first came out and
[02:22:31] I knew so I had some comment and so I I stole it from her like I took a picture put on Instagram
[02:22:36] She's like give me my book back. I'm like let me read it for a little bit
[02:22:38] She said okay, so I start reading it. I was like oh my gosh
[02:22:42] This is legit
[02:22:44] She's like takes a book back. She she finished she's reading on the flight
[02:22:49] Then I'm gone for FTX's come back the books are there I grab it and I read it in two or three days
[02:22:56] I just I could not put it down and I didn't want to read it at night because I knew like when I would read at night
[02:23:02] I was I was not going to sleep because I was like no one more check one more one more and
[02:23:06] Today you know flying out here
[02:23:09] I'm finishing up my packing and I grab it and it irritated me because I knew I was gonna finish it before I took off
[02:23:17] But I needed to finish the book, but I was like I'm a finish
[02:23:19] I'm just carrying another book for a week on the road again. I had my other book that I'm gonna be reading
[02:23:25] or finishing off, but yeah, it was awesome like I was just like sitting there and I'm
[02:23:30] Very friendly playing everyone's coming on board and I have tears rolling down my face as I'm like reading the book
[02:23:36] I'm like you have your kid and me now if anybody knows me well, it's not a surprise like you know a
[02:23:41] emotional person you know one of my real close friends is one of my black people so Matt Waltman and he
[02:23:48] He just knows he's like bro, he's like I know when you're gonna get emotional
[02:23:52] If you listen to a podcast amount he's like yep, and then I'll get emotional just if you know me well
[02:23:57] You know that I'm an emotional person and I use a ball. I mean, I don't carry anymore because I'm like whoa
[02:24:02] That's the way God does it. I mean, yeah, it's the way God designed me
[02:24:05] It's part of who I am, but yeah final spin that was awesome sitting on the plane tears rolling down my face
[02:24:11] I gotta be kidding me because I
[02:24:14] Think and I'd like to talk to more people about it, but I truly think
[02:24:20] Every human that reads that book will be able to relate to all of the characters
[02:24:25] I don't care what your background is 100% I don't care what your background is
[02:24:30] You are gonna find a relationship to every one of the characters
[02:24:34] Everyone like the store manager. I wanted to beat that guy up because I've had some of those bosses in the past right?
[02:24:41] I'm already
[02:24:43] Man that kid, you know
[02:24:50] Just just everything, you know, and just what the main character did for his brother
[02:24:57] Yeah, it's just a phenomenal book and I I truly I would put a large amount of money down and say if you read the book
[02:25:04] You will be able to relate to everyone of those characters and I'm not gonna
[02:25:09] Like I can give it away. Yeah, because it's ridiculous, but I will say like just that style
[02:25:14] That that style that you wrote
[02:25:17] Like I'm looking for it to more books and that and if not then
[02:25:23] You're the biggest jerk ever with that out there and then not have more books coming down the pipeline
[02:25:28] Check right on appreciate it that book is called final spin. It's an emotional roller coaster
[02:25:35] You don't even expect it really at some points and all of a sudden you're like wait wait
[02:25:39] Why am I getting choked up right now? Yeah, so I wanted to say this quote earlier and I didn't find the right time, but
[02:25:45] I think it ties into this book just like the principal of the book you said this
[02:25:50] At one of the last FTX's FTX-002 that we had in San Diego
[02:25:53] I wrote it down and I know I I shared at the master part of my talk, but you said when you transition from
[02:26:00] Loving winning to loving your team winning more than you winning yourself you transition into a true leader
[02:26:09] And that's sacrifice
[02:26:11] if
[02:26:13] When you're willing to put the team above yourself the mission above yourself
[02:26:18] That's when you become a true leader and you you ask his question
[02:26:22] And we ask it now at all that FTX's
[02:26:26] What do you think makes a good team guy and
[02:26:28] Everybody all the answers are great. They're just not the right answer
[02:26:32] It's when you put the team first and the mission first. That's what makes you a good team guy and that's not just for the seal teams
[02:26:40] Company XYZ
[02:26:42] When you and your employees put the team first and the mission first
[02:26:47] That's what makes you a good leader and you don't have to have a title to be a leader. We've said this
[02:26:51] Your title doesn't make you a leader
[02:26:53] Your ability to influence those around you to do the right thing to believe in the sauce to believe in the mission
[02:26:58] That's what makes you a leader and
[02:27:00] I love this quote. I've written in all my notebooks that I have just as a reminder as well as
[02:27:07] Discipline was rooted in the truth that we tell ourselves that you told me and I just it reminds me
[02:27:12] I think that's all so why I got emotional reading that book is because
[02:27:15] He was willing to do what he did for his brother
[02:27:23] And that's what good leaders do like they they are willing to put the team and the mission above them self at all costs now
[02:27:33] Well, he did in the book is obviously part of the book to it but the base of that is he it wasn't about him
[02:27:40] It was not about him and
[02:27:42] When we look at the good companies that we work with the leaders that care more about the team than themselves
[02:27:50] I remember I called you I sat and had dinner with Denver before we ran the FTX
[02:27:55] And he was sitting there and he was emotional and
[02:27:59] He was talking about how much he loves and cares about his team and it was real
[02:28:04] You know and we've worked with companies where you knew they were kind of full of it. They're trying to put on the game
[02:28:08] I mean he he pulled out like index card that he has notes on for our talk and just
[02:28:14] The level of impact of the training hat on him and how much he cared about his team
[02:28:19] I remember I text you and and life afterwards and I called you because just the burden of that and you're like
[02:28:25] Hey bro, you're gonna deliver the training that he needs and that's all as I check Roger that and
[02:28:31] It's just it's cool just when you see
[02:28:34] Leaders truly care about their team and they put the mission first what they're able to accomplish
[02:28:46] That's it man
[02:28:49] Final spin a lot of those themes in there. One of my friends texted me and said
[02:28:55] This is a great piece of American literature
[02:28:58] And I said thanks man appreciate it. It's a bold statement right bold statement
[02:29:06] Final spin leadership strategy in tactics
[02:29:09] Field manual
[02:29:12] We code the display the code the evaluation the protocol discipline the freedom field manual
[02:29:16] way of the warrior kid one two three and four best books ever apparently
[02:29:22] That's what a lot of people are thinking adults children cross the board
[02:29:26] Mike in the dragons come on
[02:29:29] Come on
[02:29:33] About face by hack worth extreme ownership and that I caught a new leadership that I wrote with my brother, Dave Babin
[02:29:38] We also have what we talk about once today if you if you're interested in the FT Act or any of the
[02:29:43] Consultancy that we do go to echelonfront.com
[02:29:45] You can also find out where we're doing the next master which is Dallas, Texas
[02:29:49] March 24th and 25th
[02:29:51] We also have an online training program extreme ownership academy. We are on there all the time
[02:29:58] We got courses that you can take we got live interaction that you can do you can come ask
[02:30:02] Ask us questions. There's so much benefit. It's a leadership gym
[02:30:06] You don't get good at leadership by reading one book. It doesn't happen just like you don't get good at
[02:30:10] Gitu by going to one class you got to make it part of your life go to extreme ownership.com to make leadership
[02:30:15] Part of your life and if you want to help service members act and retired to families gold star families
[02:30:21] Check out Mark Lee's mom mom and Lee she got a charity organization. She is really helping out veterans
[02:30:28] Just giving them treatments. You've had those treatments. Yeah, the hyperbaric chamber
[02:30:34] Game changer. It was an absolute game changer. My body was in a medical
[02:30:39] State that the doctors literally were like we don't know what's going on. I'll tell you what's going on
[02:30:43] You're drinking nine monsters a day for three years
[02:30:47] Yeah, I don't know like ten years
[02:30:49] It was I was having kidney and adrenal gland failure and we just
[02:30:54] Like when you're going to doctors and they're like, okay, we don't know this this is what we know is going on
[02:30:58] But we don't know what to do. We don't know how to stop. We don't know what's causing it and then COVID hit and
[02:31:03] I hit up my Malika she was like, hey, you need to get these treatments for your TBIs and I'm like, okay, yeah, because you know
[02:31:09] Real bad tonight is and you know just
[02:31:12] Issues with just remembering stuff and headaches and stuff like that and
[02:31:16] Problems sleeping and she just been trying to get me in the treatment. I couldn't because I couldn't commit to the treatments that I had to do because of how busy
[02:31:23] We were we'll COVID hit and I was able to do it and I did all the treatments
[02:31:30] All those issues were gone you know like they're gone and they haven't come back and we I have no other team guys
[02:31:35] They had masses growing in their in their head
[02:31:38] Put two Terry gland like
[02:31:40] Cancer's types of masses that they didn't really know what was going on
[02:31:44] Going get the treatments and they're gone. They're like just it's incredible
[02:31:49] What those treatments do and actually to the point that
[02:31:52] One of our clients that I should on a front that's a part of Dave's LDAP program that we did an FTX for
[02:31:58] One of the guys is like, hey, what's a good charity that we can donate to and I told them America's mighty warriors
[02:32:02] This is what they're doing
[02:32:04] Well, one of these team members was so motivated because I told them what happened to me
[02:32:08] Other members like Cowell who's on our team a he went got those treatments
[02:32:12] He said it's been a game change night and day and
[02:32:16] And every everybody I've listened it's not just for team guys. We're talking just any service member that has problems we're getting them in there
[02:32:23] Well this member of the client
[02:32:26] That we that we work with ran up the chain of command and now their company is doing a thing to where
[02:32:31] They they produced trailers like heavy haul trailers for the trucking industry
[02:32:36] They designed a America's mighty warrior trailer where has logo on the trailer on the back everything
[02:32:43] And they're donating I'm not gonna say them out but for every trailer. They're donating a large amount
[02:32:49] to the foundation and their goal is
[02:32:52] They want to be able to pay for I want to say it was like five or seven treatments through
[02:32:58] It's incredible and
[02:33:00] And she's only able to do this through companies and individuals that donate. Yeah, it's it's insane
[02:33:07] If you ever wonder what happens with money that you donate to a charity and if it's effective
[02:33:12] This is 100% this is what's happening medical treatments that are that are game changers for veterans
[02:33:18] So that is America America's mighty warriors dot org. This is Mark Lee's mom momily
[02:33:26] That's where you can go to to help out with that
[02:33:28] Um
[02:33:30] If you want any more of my
[02:33:33] TDS tirades or you need any more of Echo's perplexed ponderings or
[02:33:41] You want some more of JP's hyped up hypothesis
[02:33:45] That's great
[02:33:46] And you can find us on the interwebs on Twitter on the gram
[02:33:50] Facebook JPS at JP Denel
[02:33:53] Echo is at Equatraw's I am at jokka willink echo any closing thoughts good defeat JP in person again
[02:34:01] JP anything to close it out
[02:34:04] No, I said what I wanted to say right on all right
[02:34:09] Well
[02:34:10] Speaking of military personnel to all the military personnel out there around the world
[02:34:14] Staring evil in the eyes in order to keep us safe. Thank you for doing what you do and to our police and law enforcement fire fighters paramedics
[02:34:26] EMTs dispatchers correction officers border patrol secret service and all first responders
[02:34:33] Thank you for protecting us from evil here at home
[02:34:37] And everyone else out there remember there's always more to learn there's always new information to absorb
[02:34:44] You can always hone your skills you can always improve your technique you can always increase your knowledge and you can always
[02:34:51] Always get
[02:34:53] better
[02:34:57] Well actually almost always because
[02:35:01] If you close your mind
[02:35:03] And your ego says that you already know it at all will the guess what you won't learn you won't improve and ultimately you won't get better and you won't win
[02:35:10] So put your ego in check go out there
[02:35:14] Keep learning keep getting better and yes
[02:35:17] Keep getting after it and until next time this is J.P. and Echo and Jaco out