Jocko Podcast 202 w. Dean Ladd. The History of Our Freedom. "Faithful Warriors"

2019-11-08T07:28:07Z

Join the conversation on Twitter/Instagram: @jockowillink @echocharles 0:00:00 - Opening 0:03:41 - Dean Ladd. "Faithful Warriors" 3:50:04 - Final thoughts. 3:55:15 - How to stay on THE PATH. JOCKO STORE Apparel: https://www.jockostore.com/collections/men All Supplements: https://originmaine.com/nutrition/jocko-fuel/ Origin Jeans and Clothes: https://originmaine.com/durable-goods/ Origin Gis: https://originmaine.com/bjj-mma-fit/ Onnit Stuff: http://www.onnit.com/jocko 4:14:07 - Closing Gratitude.

AI summary of episode

are muted this far out we can hear artillery explosions but not small arms fire we're all peering over the sides looking abysio looking at the fires and the smoke and the explosions it's an awesome sight a massive smoke and flames holy Moses look at that we say not for the last time we ask ourselves how many of the defenders how the defenders could survive in a place so torn up it's an irrelevant question really many Japanese have survived and they're killing them but have them survived we know that a lot of our men were killed going in and we know that the men who did make it a sure are fighting for their lives we expect we'll have a tough go of it to wear apprehensive who wouldn't be and we're wondering how we'll behave in combat I know the new guys are especially concerned with how they'll behave the great fear the greatest of fear is you won't be able to handle it that you'll turn yellow that you'll let your buddies down we fear this much more than we fear getting killed or wounded one reason for that is no one really thinks he'll be killed or wounded you never think it's going to happen to you never you acknowledge that it could happen to you that it might happen to you but the rational part of your brain makes you understand this but in the such circumstances we now find ourselves emotion trumps rationality every time we know we're too young to die and somehow in a kind of strange and protective twist of logic and feeling we figure that because we're too young to die we certainly won't die you've got to do a lot of hard thinking to reach this conclusion however and because we're all thinking so hard we're not talking that much just as well the engine is so loud you can't talk or hear anyone except the guy standing next to you we wait for the word to begin the assault but it doesn't come we continue circling beneath the hot sun beneath breathing exhaust fumes staring at the island we want we want to know what for Pete's sake is happening we wonder what they're when they're going to send us in and where they're going to send us we wonder gosh how much longer can it go all like this a lot longer it turns out nightfall one moment in the sun one moment the sun is above the horizon and their sky is bright then the sun drops below the horizon in the dark that's how night comes in the tropics no twilight this is on the on-hequator and what what why was that why was that a bad thing we knew that that probably some way we knew that that was where they haven't heard this time was on that beach still shouting major haze assures us that red too won't be a problem the Japanese positions on the beach have been eliminated he tells us and our landing will be unopposed you'll probably go in standing up he actually said that so you said in the book he actually said I guess we were completely surprised thinking back we were none of us really believed we'd go in standing up now not that we think meet major haze is feeding us a line he's a good man he wouldn't do that but it could be that he has been misinformed uninformed is more likely more like it totally uninformed communications with the units ashore or deseray and several instances functionally not existed the same goes for communications with general smith and his staff on the battle ship Maryland the invasions fleet flagship this is doing large but charged measure to failure of our radios which are too fragile to withstand the rigors of amphibious assault I've got a walking talking strapped over my shoulder and it's a hunk of joke hunk of junk I can't even communicate with the other boats which is why major haze had to come by in but that's true what was that what was the fucking dog is what we're doing any good now the officer in charge a red two at that time was Colonel Schupe the 10 of Colonel Schupe he became the combatant later on years later in any event we're relieved the waiting is almost over the business of riding around in boats is for the birds we want to get ashore and throw some punches I'm standing in the battle of our LCVP behind me are 32 marines of my pertune most of them teenagers most of them new to combat I look at them and they look at me I see fresh boyace facias and wide-wired eyes staring out from beneath their brain their helmet brims their helmets all seem a size too big accentuating their boyish making them look young as well most of them really are their helmets jammed down on their heads the straps pulled tight under their chin you can wear helmets this way so they don't fall off while you're clamoring down the cargo nets of the troop transport into your boat the helmet is nothing more than a steel pot heavy and getting heavier the longer you wear it if it falls off all you're on that net it could hit somebody beneath you somebody could get hurt and that's when and that's not when marines are supposed to get hurt not during the boating phase as it's called the phase of the operation when the emphasis is on safety the getting hurt part the part where safety is one might say beside the point comes later for us for me in the men in my boat that part comes now did I say men yeah major haze was right he said we'd be going in standing up and that's what we're doing not that we want to there's no other way no place to run no place to hide some men crowds in the water they watch the bullet patterns the curtains trying to figure out when the curtain will sweep over them it's all a matter of timing they'll duck under water at the right moment to avoid getting shot it would be a good plan if only there were two if only there were one or two machine guns firing at them but there are many many machine guns firing creating multiple curtains that meet and intermingle an overlap and crisscross yeah bullets are flying every which way worse the guns are aimed to fire just inches above the surface so if you crouch with your head just above the water you're likely to get your head drilled might as well stand up that way you'll get shot the chest or stomach which is usually fatal instead of to the head which is almost always fatal also if you're crouching in the water you're not moving and if you're not moving your stationary target and your easier to shoot you have to keep moving you have to get to shore get a shore or die and the whole thing orders were don't stop to help anybody everybody's going to get killed just you get sure stuff in my man that's stop to help me violate those orders that told him don't wait for me go on no no there are planes here now our planes are coming in and strapping and we wonder what is going on of this when they were they were strapping that ship I returned to the task at hand keep moving to the shore how long has this been going on how long have been out here in the water I can't say I have no sense of time everything is moving in slow motion second seems to last minutes minute seemed to last hours it just keeps going on and on every moment is intense filled with intense thoughts emotions actions I'm thinking how can I protect myself how can I protect my men someone screams another one of my men is hit and another and another help corpsman some are killed outright some are wounded some are well it's hard to say some go quietly some noisely they fall back in the water they slip onto the water some flail in the water and they're paying in panic howling and shouting I keep moving my adrenaline is flowing like an electric current through me allowing me to do things I wouldn't normally and shouldn't normally do if I stop to think about what I'm doing I'd freeze up I try to track the bullets the movement in patterns of the enemy's traversing fire the bullets impact start to my left to my right the bullets sweeping back and forth I see no pattern or rather I see too many patterns splat splat splat everywhere it's like the enemy throwing thousands and thousands of stones at us a pattern of splats in the water comes towards me from the right sweeps pass me continue to the left I don't hear the crack of the bullets as they zip by its supersonic speed that's the problem they're not zipping past us they're hitting us they've got our range yeah quite a contrast to the tropical heat and brilliant sunlight on Bezier when Anthony had medicine and yeah shot in the head while peering over the sea wall and red beach too Anthony had fallen back into John Murdoch's arms still alive but unconscious his body twitching his eyes open but empty John held him for a brief time spoke to him and then set him aside on the beach among the bodies of other slain Marines where he died a few minutes later all the solemn knees appropriate to the occasion where observed all the rights were performed the colors were trouped speeches were giving music was played prayers were offered we saying the national anthem the Marine him and amazing grace there was a presentation of military testimonials proclamations were made John Murdoch gave a talk about Anthony then presented Anthony's brother with the purple heart a fitting gesture from a man who comforted Anthony in his final moments of his life and honor guard fired at 21 gun salute taps was played we all wept our tears were shed in both sorrow and joy there was cause for both Anthony's life had been short his dying heart his glory everlasting there was no bitterness no disillusionment no anger his life had mattered his death also and we remembered both and knew that both had meaning and purpose the biographical sketch in the program for the ceremony expressed the feelings well in this regard and serves as a fitting epitaph for every marine in the second world war and here's what it read if the world had been different if he had been born at another time Anthony with his sunshine smile could have married raised a family had grandchildren and lived a quiet typically traditional American life but the early 1940s were not normal times a fascist dictator threatened to conquer Europe and forge an alliance with the militarists who controlled the Japanese government and they're distorted plan for world domination and unprepared and unsuspecting United States became a primary target the American people were shocked in the action by the Sunday morning arrival of Japanese bombers over a wahoo like hundreds of thousands of other young Americans Anthony felt compelled to volunteer to serve his country he simply could not stand aside while America was under attack Anthony gave his life on tarua for his country his core and for his fellow Marines he was not a famous hero more than a by millions extolled in the press immortalized in magazine articles or books he was no one special just another marine private first class the American people should thank god eternally for Anthony and his fellow Marines soldiers see men and airmen who preserved and won a magnificent victory over a wickedly evil enemy semper five brother you are not forgotten and with that Dean Lad has left the building and actually who has joined us in the building looks like Jason Gargert, Jason Gargert's randomly we are in spokane Washington spokane spokane spokane yeah is is crazy to read i'm gonna read it the battle between the american and japanese surface fleets began a little before zero to two hundred like a suddenly breaking storm of cataclysmic size and power in the language of naval tacticians the coming together of two fleets in sea-large channel constituted what is known as a meeting engage in engagement but collision engagement is a better term for describing what happened steaming more or less blindly into the channel of fleets ran into each other at oblique angles their ships quickly became intermingled resulting in a close quarters melee that saw the combatants charging madly about their big guns flashing and booming hurling red hot shells and high flaming arcs above the channel the thunder of the guns rolled across the black water a steady pulsating roar and the molten projectile streak leg meteors crisscrossing the skies with fiery tails rising and falling and crashing into ships and exploding in massive fireballs violent secondary explosions caused by ammunition cooking off in the intense heat of the detonating shells rock some of the ships and sent them furiously ablaze blurning like roman candles fountains of fire sparking and shooting flames and blasting big chunks of steel in every direction all the while star shells and flares burst high above the channel and invaded like dying galaxies as they drifted down at the end of their parachutes into the extinguishing water the canisters that held the flares periodically flew over our positions charging like locomotives search lights probe the dirt lower darkness with their long brilliant beams sweeping back and forth above the surface by secting fixing on some hapless ship bringing the blazing shells down on it streams of tracers from automatic cannons and machine guns curved through the middle of the air every now and then an airant torpedo slammed into the beach below us 2500 pounds of explosives blasting a big crater at the waterline we watched all this from our foxes on the ridge front row seats to a spectacle that john murder john mordocla likened to all the fourth of July's I ever saw my life all put together at once we were a vocal audience awestruck and profane a ship would explode and all up and down the line you'd hear men exclaiming cheese a surprise and holy shit you we also conducted aggressive patrols and probe their lines at giving as good as we got or maybe even better if more frontline Japanese soldiers had survived the war maybe be reading memoirs by those veterans of Guadalcanal campaign recounting how the US Marines terrorized them at night and terrorized them we most certainly did some guys really enjoyed this part of the job teenagers who found their true nature in the jungle who discovered that they were born for the warrior life there were very there were a few in every unit more than a few actually more than you might expect more than I expected they went after the Japanese with a competence and enthusiasm that made them almost as frightening to their officers as they must have been to their enemies it was just amazing observed Murdoch how you could take kids like these and put them out into the jungle and in just a few weeks they'd be great at jungle warfare for them it was like playing cowboys and Indians they'd come back from a patrol and you'd hear them talk how many teeth did you get or how many did you kill and they'd brag while I killed three or four now I wanted these patrols much earlier than what we're talking about right now I was leading this patrol and had four five others with me and we ended up we were in a location where the army had now passed through our lines and they were in control so we came right by the reddish metal regimental CP and the army colonel says what do you guys doing here said well we got it with constant patrols as well we're in charge here now we don't need you any more and so we said so the we moved on for a little bit further back to our own line where we were in reserve and it turned out we had a little bit higher than we was so he'd look up at us and we were on the skyline from his from his perspective very skyline in reality in combat there are few instances when men used bayonets in the traditional manner fixed to the rifles bayonet drills were performed for their psychological effect so that men would learn the psychology of the bayonet namely to kill brutally quickly and unthinkingly without compunction or moral qualms so done realistic as far as the application right but our training merely paved the way for our transformation into hardened killers exposure to actual combat accomplished and completed the process you got hard or you died it was that simple killer be a killer be killed you know and the Japanese made it simple they were they were notoriously unspearing their reputation for ruthlessness and savagery was widespread and well-founded we knew all the stories the rape of Nand King the Badan death marks atrocities committed far and wide and often against prisoners we believed correctly that we could expect no pity if we fell into their hands they neither asked for quarter nor gave any and we responded in kind if they had set rules as we believed we were damn sure going to play by them one other choice do we have they simply would not surrender they would not stop coming out us until we killed them very quickly we learned that trying to take prisoners was a waste of time and dangerous even the wounded if we went to treat them would try and kill us by usually by blowing up everyone themselves and the corpsmen who had stopped to help them with a grenade the dead had a nasty habit of rising up from the ground and attacking us so we made sure the dead were truly dead no sense in taking chances this killer be killed approach to war was as brutalizing as it was brutal and affected everyone to some degree Murdock recalled a corpsman who came up to me and said hey lieutenant I've got well I've got a live one can I shoot him yeah it does not look good you also had some people that couldn't that didn't adopt that mentality and here's Murdoch talking about it talking about people that couldn't adopt that killer be killed mentality he said they'd have to go back because they were no good to us they just disappear they'd be sent back to the states it was a self-weeding process the guys who remained were the guys you could depend on when I became company commander New Zealand that was an awful thing I had to do we could send 3% of our personnel home every so often so they could start new outfits back in the states but you never wanted to send the good guys home you send the shitheads and the screwups I wanted the best men with me I didn't want any of my good men to go in New Zealand just before we sailed for Talawa Tarawa Murdoch told our company now listen I'm gonna send some of you guys home if you fuck up you're going to go but he told me later these kids were so good they just wouldn't do that they wouldn't fuck up on purpose they would do their job and do it well they didn't want to be come known as a fuck up and a lot of those kids were killed on Talawa that I could have sent home yeah check out those books and Mikey in the dragons I don't know a lot of people as I as I always say a lot of people think that's the best kids book ever written pretty well at least for sure at least I do discipline goes freedom field manual you can get that book if you want to get after it and what's interesting about that book is there's no book like it and my publisher I was like is this the biggest risk you've ever took with published in a book and he's like oh absolutely not even close there's no book like it yeah we're in there saving in completely at their mercy you say here 600 yards six football fields just under a third of a mile if you run that distance on dry land unencumbered and unimposed you'll be gasping at the finish line i don't care what kind of shape you're in we're in water and we're wearing and carrying 60 pounds or more of gear and the Japanese are ripping us apart they've got an absolutely clear field of fire and we have to walk straight into it when i returned and i looked i went clear out there where i was hit and walked in and i saw remains of old carbines and so on down in the sand we've got a walk not run because we're in the water remember walk slowly because we can't run we can't even walk fast the marines are the world's experts in amphibious warfare the core has been training for the past two decades to assault an established beach head on a hostile shore it has developed complex doctrines to guide us in such endeavors at bayjio on 21 November 1943 all that training in doctrine doctrine has come to this we step out of our LCVPs into shallow water and walk slowly across 600 yards with absolutely no cover whatsoever to make a frontal assault on heavily fortified and defended enemy positions on my website just go to it by my name just Dean Lad there is a poem in here called curtains of fire and it goes in a great detail similar kind of words but done done a little differently well I'll be a dirty name then he discarded his rifle and started throwing grenades at the top of the ridge the reality of our sudden harrowing plight then struck me this was my first major combat test as a platoon leader and I realized that I had to take immediate and firm control of myself I could not show fear in front of my men a couple feet to my right private McCoy Reynolds had been hurling grenades one after the other each time courageously standing up and exposing himself to enemy fire he crouched down next to me and scanned the top of the ridge then he exclaimed I see them and threw another grenade in the next instant he was shot through the neck killed instantly he fell at my feet for a moment I just looked at him his eyes wide open lifeless stared back at me then I realized that now more than ever I had to get a grip on things and seize control of what was becoming an increasingly chaotic situation I decided at once we needed support from our mortars and backed a little way down the ridge out of the field of fire to further assess the situation now at the same time we were running low on an ammunition as well and we sent back call we need more ammunition next thing we know bandaliar after bandaliar of ammunition started arriving just the same as same Guided guys now that's an interesting I mean you recognized that that you needed to get control of your emotions is that something you would thought about what made you realize that what made you realize and he wanted me to succeed in part because my success would reflect well on him but mainly because he was generally genuinely proud of me also because i was a known quantity whom he had personally mentored he much preferred me to be giving orders rather than some 90 day wonder fresh out of training in the states since he had taught me everything i knew he was confident that in combat together we would more or less be thinking along the same lines and important connection for a top sergeant to have with his petoon leader nor did he know what he broke the slightest in subordination toward me from anyone else in the petoon you obey your lieutenant or you'll have to answer to me he growled at my guys and you could be damn sure they did nobody wanted to have to answer to right sounds like an outstanding marine i'm pretty soon you're going again me getting into a part is my my first encounter of very close calls was losing my life on hill 78 second platoon was dealing with a lone sniper who had fired on us from the open trees on the coastal flap of below he was high up in one of those trees high enough to place my little above the hilltop allowing him to shoot down to us at a shallow angle he pottered us pottered us for a better part of four hours and then by the buy and buy and much to my astonishment a lieutenant i didn't recognize came strolling along in the ridge fully upright fully exposed this sniper smirking at us i was lying on the belly on my belly in the grass and he approached me saying i would be worried about that sniper can't hit me one in the next instant a shot rang out and a bullet wing disarm can't get complacent uh you continue on but they were always present in your head and on your mind you could never fully let go or get rid of them the unrelenting mental strain not to do not not to mention the physical dangers that caused it made us twitch your each passing day you know during the during the times that we were we were back behind the front lines and nobody's shooting at you home like I said it's wonderful nobody's shooting at me and all that stress you know now you now you don't have to worry about it now what about the fact that even though no one's shooting at you right now you have time to sit there and think about the fact that you're going to go again and the enemy's going to attack you and you know somebody pull up pull it what it was stupid thing so it pierced your intestines bladder and sacrum just before that and an exited missing my spinal nerve by a quarter of an inch as it is I'll probably die in a few minutes I'm scared I think my gosh this is it if it happens that you get shot and you don't know how bad the wound it often happens that you get shot you don't know how bad the wound is but when you're hit where I was hit you know it's bad it's a gut wound and you know it's pretty sure thing you're not going to make it very few people survive gut wounds even in the best of circumstances I'm in what are arguably the worst of circumstances if I had been shot on try land I might be able to crawl to an aid station or my buddies might have passed me up but I'm in a lagoon so there can be no crawling and my buddies are forbidden to help me it goes without saying that there are no aid stations close by I can try to reach our LCVPs on the reef a hundred yards behind me and he didn't enough at enough action going on where he was steady was coming down the line where there's air reaction he wanted to get into it well he came he came right by where I was and no one in two months when great was right shortly after that one of our one of our rounds dropped in short he lost two legs in an arm and he was in there's an article in the said reading post about it and saying that at least I have the right arm to wrap the bar with for a drink I'll tell about it and there's some too words uh you guys that during this you also talk about the fact that you would be young stuff back and forth to the Japanese they're a little bit a little bit they'd be yelling at you guys and you'd yell back at them and it sounds like during the daytime yeah ski then announced he was quitting the marine core and quitting the war he meant what he said he was about to head back to the rear when Murdoch arrived on the scene Murdoch's calm ski down and told him that he just couldn't up and quit that it would be desertion in the face of the enemy and that he would get a lot of trouble for it Murdoch spoke softly with him for several minutes in this vein until ski came to a senses ski picked up as weapon and rejoined third platoon and Murdoch assumed command of that unit but ski was a changed man exchanging one man as for another he went from being a marine who did his job and did it well to being a marine who did his job with a singular passion from that day forward he hated the Japanese with a savage intensity and took it on himself to personally avenge Lund's death often going off by himself to hunt the enemy if you were a compassionate man you might say a prayer for any Japanese soldiers who crossed his path he always returned eventually but with little to say about his exploits he was the quiet type guys like him usually are shells exploding washing gaizers machine guns rattling splat splat splat those little dots in the water thousands of them moving this way and that a bullet hits four feet to my right splat splat then bullets hit three feet two foot one foot to my right sure do hope they skip over me and they do this time splat they begin hitting to my left one foot two foot three foot and so on I got lucky I literally dodged the bullet several bullets how long will my luck hold I can't see any muzzle flashes from the enemy guns the Japanese are invisible just like their bullets we're being slaughtered by an invisible force nothing to see nothing to shoot at not that we would be shooting if we could see them you don't stand an open water shooting at the enemy you get yourself to the beach you take cover i mean one second we're looking at this slab of a metal ramp then the ramp drops and we're looking at it in furno fire and smoke fill our bit frame of vision frame by the sides of the bottom and the bottom of the boat orange fire red fire and black black smoke the fire is shooting up the smoke is rolling curling climbing is fast and high the sky isn't high enough to contain it you think we were looking at a volcano being born you wonder what could produce so much smoke surely by now everything on basio that can burn has burned so where's all that smoke coming from from the bowels of the earth it would seem from somewhere deep underground under the ocean from the ever ever blazing furnaces of the world unless not forget the explosions there are a lot of them explosions here they're everywhere fire and fire balls tongues of flame crimson and yellow flashes in the smoke the time is 0-615 and some 600 marines are about to be launched or rather launch themselves at basio codenamed Helen i'm at the front of the boat the lieutenant the platoon leader time for me to lead a few seconds go by i was a few seconds ago i was deploying the limited protection offered by the thin metal ramp now i'm deploying the lack of that limited protection it was after all better than nothing which is what i've got now i kind of feel sick and i'm thinking god why am i in this mess what am i doing here oh god they're in our whole help help they're blood curling cries and thrashing sounds were plainly audible to everyone in the vicinity there were on a point little bit a little bit a head of our regular line and this has gotta be just this is on a mental weedless and horrified but stayed in our holes that's how bad it was to get out of your holes you don't dare because you you anybody outside the holes enemy suddenly the yelling sounds of the fighting ceased we actually waited and listened to pairing through the rain and into the darkness then the Japanese begin probing our position all up and down the line running up to the crest and chucking a few grenades over the top at our holes and running back down hill after the grenades exploded usually harmlessly our guys would leap from their holes dashed to the crest and throw grenades at the fleeting enemy then they'd scamper back to their holes and the Japanese would return to herle their grenades back and forth and went through the night intervals of silence and then flash bang of grenades exploding and men hollering and cursing in the English and Japanese the next morning we discovered that one of them men in the machine gun post had been killed that's that day and headed to death the others have been wounded but somehow they'd beaten back their attackers and you were saying this earlier and I led Denver reconnaissance patrol myself taking out four or five men with me and finding out where they were that was scary situation to all these reconnaissance patrols you know right before they before they stopped that as you're still pushing forward up that ridge you got some great detail in here that's absolutely worth talking about going to the book here the ammunition was quickly distributed so you called for ammunition the ammunition was quickly distributed and once again we moved up hill shooting as we went another of my man men private Walter Cuss was favorally hit while scouting up the ridge from a different direction at the moment of his death he exailed the his last breath and that out a long rising how of pain and anguish like a dying animal it had been run before we landed there sometime before about time before our work and run up like on on the reef and just was still there while the Japanese swam up to it with the machine guns they fired flying in fire right on us so all this is happening and you run the reserves and finally you guys are told all right load your boats which means you guys now know you're going in and you say here we don't know whether the brass is setting us so I opened my eyes and smiled at him and he goes you son of a bitch he goes right from speaking lap Latin to calling me a son of a bitch then he took me down to the infirmary and they patched me up a bit then he took me to his state room and put me in his bed I must have slept all day and all night I didn't hear a thing I wasn't feeling any pain my night my right hand and arm will numb when I came to I didn't know where I was at first then I took a shower changed the bandages and got cleaned up that was the end of my war there my second day on side pan my right arm was no good really my hand even today is no good but nobody knew him at reunions didn't know him so you look out there's six hundred and he and he and I were being lifted up by the by the transport and a bat sabisid and a basket and remote and says it just as we were okay just about up from the landing boat and in this basket taken a reason up to the transport itself and i made a comment says looks like looks like we made it his comment was you made it you made it and he died so you look down going back to this point when the ramp actually opens and you see you've got 600 yards to go and just nothing but machine gun fire and as you said earlier the Japanese you'd watch them storm forward without any ability to maneuver just only thing to do with the salt and now here you are we are no maneuver in the exact same situation gosh they're shooting at us we find this interesting bullets zipping by splatting on the water surface splash splat here splat there splats to the left and right splats in front of us look by golly there's some enemy fire hitting right over there look over there that's me talking that's all of us talking talking and pointing at the impact circles in the water little splats little dots where bullets hit people shooting at us fascinating realizing that we could get our head shot off we ducked down and ducked down into the boat the more bullets splatting into the water but none hit our LCVP we tell ourselves that those are that most are 7.7 millimeter slugs which is what your basic light Japanese machine gun fires and are nothing really much to worry about because they're too small to pierce even the thin skined higgins boat that's what we tell ourselves well I suppose they are we call them men we treat them as men we expect them to act like men they are after all united states marines but really their kids just out of high school or not even that kids with rifles true kids trained to kill also true but kids never the last just turn 17 many of them to use a term like that as long since fallen into general disuse their youths a state of being between childhood and adulthood today's american mail at exercising a lifestyle choice can often can and often does loiter for many years in that state but in the mid-1940s in a world at war the state of youth tends to pass swiftly and do any disayet violently the youth the kids on my boat have got a lot of growing up to do unfortunately they'll be doing a hefty portion of that growing up in the coming minutes and hours in that period far too many will undergrow all the growing up they will ever experience these are the men that went in yeah thus a raid we picked our way slowly through the battle zone our weapons at the ready all around the dead were thick on the ground in numbers that defied comprehension bodies and pieces of bodies everywhere artillery and pounded the area and chopped up the bodies turning the battlefield into an immense open air abitwar strewn with torsos and limbs and heads and chunks of unadunifiable flesh burned black by fire I could recreate the flow I could recreate the flow and ferocity the battle the patterns of the fight and flight by the numbers and positioning of the dead there would be places pockets of resistance where bodies were pile on top of bodies dead Japanese entangled with that americans frozen in attitudes of hand to hand combat clutching each other plunging bay nets into each other locked in their death struggles arm machine gun positions were tabloids of butchery with bodies of the Japanese heaped in front of positions and bodies of american soldiers slumped over their guns for men who didn't want to be there the US army soldiers they were a lot of drafts and all of a bunch of drafts here too that's crazy after all these years you know we talked a little bit about about Murdoch and and he's quite the character and you talk about him a little bit here because captain what happened to Captain of the block you get somehow somehow Murdoch ends up taking over eventually the block was relieved and replaced by Murdoch who's an ideal a Boston Irishman Murdoch was very funny and very tough a superb combat a superb combat commander and a bit wild too all traits that is younger charges greatly appreciated one manifestation of his toughness apart from his courage and coolness under fire was his disdain for metals and combinations very few men who had him as their CEO including me received decorations Murdoch explained I didn't recommend many people I didn't care if a machine gunner killed 50 men that's what he was supposed to do that's what he's getting paid for that was my attitude once in Hawaii we had a big for the formation with the division and they decorated all these guys one company would give 40 metals out I'd give one my attitude was hey killing japs is our job we're not doing it for metals right this is the thing that's crazy for me to think about here is you know you just have one line it says the war wasn't over right and this is 1944 the war wasn't over and as you talked about earlier the thought was that you know America was gonna have to invade every island until you got right into Tokyo and since you had seen the the how how steadfast the Japanese were you all just thought and I know I mean I've since you know with the old breed is kind of the the the the way that I learned like what those guys went through sledge Eugene sledge but this book is just right out right there with it man it's right there with it

Most common words

Episode transcript

[00:00:00] This is Jocopontcast number 202 with echo Charles and me, a jocowilling. Good evening. Good evening.
[00:00:10] On a bright and violent morning in the central Pacific, a dying marine with part of his face shot off
[00:00:18] saved my life.
[00:00:20] He was
[00:00:21] purged to top the partially raised ramp of an LCVP. He was a big solidly built man with a gaping
[00:00:30] gory hole where his eye should have been. Blood streaming from the wound.
[00:00:37] Moments earlier, he had been standing in the water beside me at the bottom of the ramp,
[00:00:42] waiting with the other wounded men for his turn to board. Another casualty in the battle for
[00:00:48] Bayes, you island. I was dying. I'd been shot through the lower abdomen, hit as my unit
[00:00:57] waited toward the shore to assault the island. Two men from my platoon hauled me back to the
[00:01:04] LCVP and struggled to lift me into the boat. The marine with the ravaged face who had just
[00:01:11] boarded. Now saw that they were having trouble with me. He reached down, grabbed me with
[00:01:17] one hand and pulled me up and over the top of the ramp. Amazing. And so I didn't die. That too was
[00:01:31] amazing. But not really all that significant in the grand scheme of things. That incident
[00:01:40] is just a small scene in a very big picture. So an insignificant event like that. Can you
[00:01:53] imagine being gut shot in waste deep water under heavy machine gunfire, barely making it
[00:02:02] back to a landing craft, which is going to save you, being pulled into that landing craft by
[00:02:07] another wounded marine and surviving? Can you imagine considering that series of events to be
[00:02:17] insignificant? It's almost impossible to think that way. But that excerpt is from a book called
[00:02:27] Faithful Warriors, written by Lieutenant Colonel Dean Ladd, who served as an enlisted
[00:02:35] an officer in the Marine Corps in the Pacific Campaign in World War II. He participated
[00:02:42] in the battles for Guadalcanal, Taroa, Sipan, and Tinian. Battles where tens of thousands
[00:02:50] of Americans were wounded or killed as they fought against the fanatical Japanese imperial
[00:02:57] war machine. And while it's impossible for us to understand what those men actually went through
[00:03:06] and what those battles were like. This book does an amazing job of giving us a glimpse into
[00:03:14] this savage part of war. And it is a complete honor to have the author of this book, Dean Ladd,
[00:03:27] here to talk with us about his experiences. Colonel Ladd, welcome to the program. Thank you.
[00:03:36] That's incredible. The things that you went through in this book has been, I could not put this
[00:03:44] book down. And this book is just the picture that it paints of what you all went through in that
[00:03:51] Pacific Campaign is it's unbelievable what you guys went through. It truly is.
[00:04:01] So I guess if we're going to start, I always like to start. I always like to start at the start.
[00:04:09] So for you, go into the book here. It says in early 1939, a boy from the next block came home
[00:04:16] from overseas. And I was never the same become because of it. His name was Lee Preston.
[00:04:22] And he was a corporal on leave from the Marine Corps. He showed up wearing his dress blues,
[00:04:26] creating quite a stern or quiet, spoken neighborhood. Mostly I think the stir was in me. He
[00:04:32] looks so sharp in that uniform and his manner the way he carried himself at once modest,
[00:04:39] but utterly selfish. He got me thinking about myself and my future. I was only a couple years
[00:04:45] younger than Lee, but it didn't seem that way. I was a senior in high school just a teenager,
[00:04:49] still a kid and Lee, well, he was different now. He had changed. He had left home a boy and returned.
[00:04:56] I'm a Marine, a warrior. A man. So the old Marine Corps recruiting process of just sending
[00:05:05] Marines home on leave and their dress uniform worked on you, huh? It really did.
[00:05:12] Ed, what did you know about the Marine Corps at that point in time?
[00:05:16] I bring much. I was being approached by one of the old timers in the local Marine Corps
[00:05:23] reserved, organized and they were trying to get me to join. This was an opportunity to find a
[00:05:31] little bit from another source. What was going to be? What it was like? I was surprised later on thinking
[00:05:38] about this at that time. The Marine Corps was only 20,000. A lot of people that they felt
[00:05:46] forced them to be able to be selected to get in there actually. This is all in 1939 and long before
[00:05:56] we even thought we were going to get in World War II. It wasn't until, not much longer after I joined
[00:06:02] in 1939, that I went to a couple of weeks, just like the National Guard once a week,
[00:06:10] and have to rail right down right close to where we were having this broadcast right now, right across
[00:06:16] the road from us. Then I went to college, Warsaw State University, and had one year, one year of
[00:06:28] college, and went to two encampments with the organizers or one that first one is Sandy Eagle,
[00:06:37] the second one was to Brimerton. Then we got called active duty though in November of 1940.
[00:06:48] That's not very long. It was just a year. That's a year before we got into the war.
[00:06:55] Here we were called and went by two up train and we got about 300 of us at least, and ended up
[00:07:02] with Sandy Eagle, and that was that was for an accampment. Then a year later in November 1940,
[00:07:12] we were called in active duty. We thought we were going to be gone one year, but we were only
[00:07:18] gone what we were going for total of five years. So where were you when Pearl Harbor happened?
[00:07:25] When Pearl Harbor happened, we were in Sandy Eagle, and I was going through a Scott Sniper School,
[00:07:30] and I had a place called Mission Valley. I don't know if you've been to Sandy Eagle lately,
[00:07:35] but Mission Valley is now a mall. Isn't that amazing? That was nothing but a safe Russian
[00:07:42] and a lot of rattlesnakes. So you're going through that Sniper School Pearl Harbor happens,
[00:07:48] and what did they do? They immediately recall you, did they cancel your school? We all had returned
[00:07:54] to the base and we get ready to go here, go there, there was just all kinds of commands going out.
[00:08:03] First of all, hey, what to go here? No, no, we're going to go there and this, all of that.
[00:08:07] And despite of all of that, within one month, well, by first part of January,
[00:08:14] we were board of ship, heading to American Smaller, and to defend that island from the Japanese
[00:08:23] taken over and blocking the supply line from nine states to New Zealand and Australia.
[00:08:32] Now, did the Japanese ever show up? And attack that section of American Samo?
[00:08:36] They didn't for a long time. They would have, if a handman for what's that mean,
[00:08:47] island, and on the other hand, they'd be big battle midway. Midway. Midway. My age and middle
[00:08:53] of the difficult recalling names anymore. It's all good. We got time. So at what point did you get
[00:09:03] the next, the next orders that you are going to not just guard the silent anymore, you guys
[00:09:07] were going to head out? Yeah, about a month before we find a left, we've been training the
[00:09:15] Japanese young men who joined the join the Marine Corps reserve. And they took over the
[00:09:22] guarding each of the little beaches all around the island, somewhere very remote. And so we're
[00:09:30] able to leave and had no idea where we're going. We thought, well, it could be the East Indies,
[00:09:36] who we had no idea. But on the other hand, we know it pretty much is going to be going to go out of
[00:09:43] Kaneal because we were having difficulties there. And somewhere in here, you got your commission
[00:09:48] becoming, and you became an officer. How did that happen? Okay, after we've been on
[00:09:53] small for about three or four months, I was now a corporal at as a squad leader of a machine gun
[00:10:02] like machine gun squad. And I got along very well with the NCOs and with our paternal
[00:10:11] leader. And so I was recommended to go to a machine gun, it was built as a machine gun training
[00:10:20] school. But it turned out it was just to identify likely candidates to become commissioned.
[00:10:30] So I recognize there was probably about, uh, could have been 150 or more of us. And it lasted six
[00:10:38] weeks. And here as a corporal, I was one of those selected to get a field commission.
[00:10:44] And that's it. You had one year of college, they put, put you from corporal to
[00:10:50] second lieutenant. To second lieutenant, and at that time we had no means of even getting
[00:10:55] getting any second Lieutenant bars. It had, it made one down at the, where they were,
[00:11:02] where they're, uh, aircraft were. So you guys just fashioned some, some butter bars for yourself.
[00:11:09] Right, we did. And then, and then next next thing when matter of, and parts first fire, no
[00:11:16] memory, this was only a month after I was commissioned. Uh, here we were bar ship heading to
[00:11:22] Lord knows where and turned out to be Guadalcanale. And here I am entering combat with the same group
[00:11:30] that I had been a list of it before the same company. And I know our first sergeant, he was a
[00:11:37] griffle guy. And he used to read me all like a theater, everybody else. But he saw that any time
[00:11:43] that I was giving a command that he said, you listen to your second lieutenant, you're going
[00:11:48] to have to contend with me. So that was just, it was just wonderful. So I was an extra officer assigned
[00:11:53] to the company headquarters. And that was pretty much the situation they had to have extra officers
[00:12:00] when they got in the casually, they could immediately fill a fill the ranks with, with a new
[00:12:06] pertune commander. And then that's a long story after, right, how I got into the actual
[00:12:11] action of itself. Not knowing how I was going to be able to react as a, as a young lieutenant leader.
[00:12:18] Well, you write about that here. Here, we'll go back to the book and here is you actually
[00:12:23] heading into Guadalcanale. And here we go. I remember thinking as my LCVP chug toward the beach
[00:12:30] that my time had come. And that it would be a time of testing when I would get to show what I was
[00:12:37] made of at last. Even so, a part of me wished I were somewhere else. What if I failed the test?
[00:12:44] Yeah. I was assigned to the headquarters section of B company first battalion as an extra
[00:12:48] second lieutenant with no specific duties other than to follow whatever orders I was given,
[00:12:53] and make myself useful in whatever possible way. The regiment was actually above full strength
[00:12:58] with junior officers to spare. It was an unusual circumstance. And I knew it would suit,
[00:13:02] soon change because junior officers typically suffer the highest casualties relative to the other
[00:13:07] ranks. A Trishin would quickly and inevitably take its toll. Lutonants and command of line units
[00:13:13] would get killed, wounded, injured, and sick. Extra is like me. Would replace them. Inevitably,
[00:13:22] a few junior officers would be relieved for incompetence or cowardice. I prayed that I wouldn't
[00:13:27] be one of them. That I wouldn't turn yellow and let my buddies down when the going got tough.
[00:13:32] A fate worse than death. As for death itself, no worries there. Getting killed was something
[00:13:40] that happened to the other guy. And then arrival, RLCVP's came to a gentle halt at the waterline,
[00:13:48] nosing into the sand of beach red between the Teneru River and Lunga Point. We climbed over the
[00:13:54] sides. There were no ramps on those early model of Higginboats, and we walked onto Guadalcanal.
[00:14:00] We hardly got our trousers wet. We experienced rougher landings during amphibious assault
[00:14:05] exercises outside San Diego. San Chamenie for one. So you're heading into Guadalcanal and there's
[00:14:15] it's a pretty calm entry even though there had been a lot of fighting going on.
[00:14:19] Yeah, previously they had been at that location.
[00:14:23] So once you get on Guadalcanal, you start to move towards the front lines.
[00:14:28] Yeah, in this case it was off of the opposite direction where the front lines were. The
[00:14:35] Japanese had landed. We waste south of us and there was concern that they were going to come
[00:14:41] in and develop us from that location. So our regiment moved out to Hedomoff and going through
[00:14:52] jungle and at night. We didn't know where we were. We'd finally got up to an army up at
[00:15:04] the 164th from the quotas. They had just ended up shooting each other just the day before.
[00:15:13] Here we saw blood all over the place from that situation. We ended up at night and we just had to
[00:15:21] stop right along a river bank and I had my feet dangling in the water at the time. So anyway,
[00:15:30] we never did with the Japanese. They're all suddenly disappeared from that particular location.
[00:15:36] But that was a try. Quite a try in time. Just what it's like to move into combat. Not
[00:15:42] no one's going to happen next. You know one thing that I talk about a lot is the possibility
[00:15:48] of friendly fire occurring. Yeah, exactly what happened. I know I had friendly fire incidents happen
[00:15:54] with me in Iraq and this happened to you as well. I'm going to the book here. You've been moving
[00:16:01] for a while and you're holding up at night and you guys are in your position then all of a sudden
[00:16:06] bang someone yelled another shot fired. Yeah. And then another and then another several shots and
[00:16:12] quick succession all from our foxholes. More shots all at once and just the whole company shooting,
[00:16:18] firing every which way shooting and shouting grenades with their own bursting left and right,
[00:16:22] front and to my rear explosions and muzzle blasts lift the area like popping flash bolts.
[00:16:27] Corporal Lane was hitting the arm a minor wound but he didn't think that it was minor. He panicked
[00:16:33] and shouted out to Sergeant Wimpy right. Top my my arm shot off. Since right and
[00:16:38] Lane were best buddies. A show of concern from the first sergeant might have might in the circumstances
[00:16:43] have been expected and when certainly have been warranted. But right and old salt, who is
[00:16:47] crusty as they come was not practiced and showing concern even to best buddies who had been wounded
[00:16:52] in combat. Muddering just loud enough to make himself heard above the racket. Right replied,
[00:16:57] shut up you fool. You want to let them know where I am? The shooting continued. More grenades
[00:17:02] exploded. PFC Harold Park, a bargarner with first platoon,
[00:17:05] realized that several men just to his left were throwing grenades all around the darn place. The
[00:17:10] guys were just having a little hang grenade war with each other. Maybe the Japanese were out there
[00:17:16] too tossing a few grenades of their own but parked in think so. He stayed low and didn't fire his weapon.
[00:17:21] I didn't figure would do any good even if they were Japanese. You couldn't see nothing.
[00:17:25] All you could do is park was a half Korean and half I have Irish.
[00:17:33] Yes sir. I had a lot of contact with them after the war as well.
[00:17:38] So it was important for him to because I know you say in the book that that he inherited his
[00:17:44] father's looks not as mothers. So he looked more Korean. We told him he'd better stay close.
[00:17:52] Yeah that's a rough one. So you get done with this. This just happening basically all night.
[00:18:01] I mean crazy fire fights and you don't even know if there's any Japanese.
[00:18:05] Well that's time. My Murdoch Murdoch was acting a company commander at that time and
[00:18:13] man near him got shot through the abdomen area and he's more concerned that he lost it
[00:18:19] a lot of his private parts. What are you doing?
[00:18:25] Now was Murdoch? Did Murdoch have experience from some of the other campaigns?
[00:18:30] No he was just like the rest of us. We're all new to combat.
[00:18:36] Speaking of near misses and whatnot, you're waiting to do a link up and here we go back to the book.
[00:18:43] I thought I might grab a quick bite to eat and start to open my sea ration can.
[00:18:47] In the process I somehow managed to cut my thumb to the bone. Blood gust from the wound and I
[00:18:52] spent some frantic moments applying a field dressing to stomp the flow. The noncombs and enlisted men
[00:18:57] watched me probably trying hard not to laugh at me. I still have a scar right there and that's
[00:19:01] thumb from that. And they're watching their thinking second lieutenant's are idiots. Hard to
[00:19:07] argue with that assessment which the lower ranks held as virtually at axiomatic. And I just given
[00:19:14] them another reason for their certified how humiliating and annoying the cut would not fully heal as long
[00:19:19] as I remain on Guadalcanal and I still bear a scar from it. Thus far the chief dangers in Guadalcanal
[00:19:24] posed to my well being it come from one my buddies via friendly fire and two myself. The
[00:19:30] Japanese in comparison had been a relatively benign presence. There are a couple of situations right
[00:19:36] at that same time that happened. One was a young marine from another outfit. He was a real bad
[00:19:42] he thought he was he's really good there. He says I'm used to all this stuff. And here he had a
[00:19:48] Japanese skull hanging from a from a court of some sort and he was just swinging that around crazy.
[00:19:55] Then a little bit later within within an hour or so we had a big air rain just hundreds of
[00:20:00] Japanese planes dropped drop bombs on us. And then I was watching one of our an aircraft cruise
[00:20:08] cruiseers shooting at him and many of their planes dropped at that time. But that was that was really
[00:20:15] a really getting into it in deep way but not really directly in direct wire at the time.
[00:20:21] So that time that kid that you talk about and you mentioned in the book this is sort of the
[00:20:27] so he's a guy that had been fighting somewhere else and he comes back and so this is the first
[00:20:31] person that you see that you look at that's starting to be you know he's having some let's see how
[00:20:37] did you put it he had acclimated to conditions on Guadalcanal that's what you wrote and you know
[00:20:43] however long that takes before you know it's a different it's a different it's a different environment
[00:20:50] it's a completely different mindset and that's what he was doing. Now these all these young people
[00:20:57] they all had beers now you know they haven't shaved for a long time and they they had the
[00:21:02] hand hand up food really the reading Japanese rice and whatnot because our transfers all had to
[00:21:08] leave they loaded off the troops but most of the mature all of the food stuff they were able
[00:21:16] to unload so they had eat this Japanese food so anyway they were pretty good looking people
[00:21:21] but even so they were full of they were full of full of fight you could tell young people and
[00:21:27] you know young guys that are in their teens still you know you get into this
[00:21:34] uh...
[00:21:36] motton account and i say that right the motton account metan account yeah
[00:21:40] metan account uh... this this river
[00:21:45] this offensive that you guys start on ten november which is the hundred sixty seven
[00:21:49] anniversary of the founding of the Marine Corps and here we go to the book separating
[00:21:53] our forces from their geographical objective of coastal village with some four miles of
[00:21:57] of exceptionally rugged terrain grassy ridges falling away steeply to jungle choke ravines
[00:22:03] in several thousand japanese infantry men also exceptionally rugged
[00:22:07] our mission objective was to engage defeat and destroy the enemy formations in our path
[00:22:12] our assault units advanced solely but steadily against the term in resistance the eighth
[00:22:16] marines ordered to move up in column behind the two seven filed across a narrow pontoon bridge
[00:22:23] over the motton account metan account and continue to short distance before halting for new
[00:22:28] in child as before the sweep to call the point we encountered no japanese the attacking
[00:22:34] units are driven them off but we suffered casualties just the same
[00:22:38] that's it's been a bit about there we were we had the child uh... there were many japanese
[00:22:44] bodies lying about some had been partially buried some of the eggs are still sticking
[00:22:48] up uh... there been a major battle between between them attacking
[00:22:53] the other rains that have been there just before we were weeks before
[00:22:57] and here all these mung all these bodies and flies and maggots everything was
[00:23:02] so we ate among all of that
[00:23:05] yeah your sense of some some guys would
[00:23:07] could couldn't even carry on barely because it smelled so bad yeah yeah yeah
[00:23:13] this right near a place called point crews by the way and today it is a city well
[00:23:19] of over twenty thousand that's the capital of the of the cell of solman islands
[00:23:25] at this point you actually say in the book as you were sitting there amongst all these
[00:23:29] bodies these dead bodies and as you're sitting there eating your child
[00:23:34] you say like that kid twirling the skull i was acclimating to the conditions on
[00:23:39] guadal canal i'd been on the island for seven days
[00:23:44] so that's an indication to you
[00:23:47] so then you guys later that day and enemy unit penetrator online and ambush weapons
[00:23:51] patoon killing three marines with a burst of enemy fire with with a burst of machine gun fire
[00:23:55] and then the entire offensive had suddenly been called off
[00:23:59] and not only that we're gonna give up the ground we had taken relinquishing it to the
[00:24:03] japanese what the hell we thought
[00:24:06] so you get told hey you guys stop attacking
[00:24:11] the reason was which you'll get into in this a bit
[00:24:14] is that there's a major task force the japanese
[00:24:18] but twelve transfers full of troops can you imagine
[00:24:22] and uh... battleship and cruisers and lot of destroyers
[00:24:26] and they they were gonna they were gonna just
[00:24:29] knock us off of there
[00:24:30] we had we had we didn't have a good feel that it was that dire but boy it
[00:24:35] turned out it was because that
[00:24:38] and when they did come in at night we saw him come in the mid-no-fammer
[00:24:42] and uh... major battle between the naval battle called the naval battle called al canal
[00:24:47] and uh... you never know watching at night time you didn't know
[00:24:51] who's your our ships and which are theirs all sent you see something blow up
[00:24:55] you see red hot shells being fired going back and criss-crossing fact
[00:24:59] back and forth and then the next
[00:25:02] next morning
[00:25:03] he was they have had troops have the uh...
[00:25:07] some are men that there there's their own ships were sunk
[00:25:10] and now they they're all full of oil and they're
[00:25:14] coming up there could now they're landing on our shore
[00:25:17] it was uh... what and here we used
[00:25:19] watching from a grandstand
[00:25:21] viewpoint on a ridge watching all this happen
[00:25:24] and incredible did you did you know that
[00:25:28] this naval battle was about to take place
[00:25:31] didn't know it's gonna be anything like that
[00:25:33] imagine
[00:25:35] roughly twelve transports full of troops
[00:25:38] all but all but three of them were sunk
[00:25:42] and the three that did beech
[00:25:45] the troops got off but all their supplies and stuff
[00:25:49] remained on
[00:25:50] and and we have
[00:25:51] our planes
[00:25:53] bomb bomb that and try our church
[00:25:56] so we had those we we had to reckon
[00:25:59] with those troops that came we got off of those transports
[00:26:03] and the next or the next week or so
[00:26:05] your your description of this battle
[00:26:07] yeah
[00:26:07] is
[00:26:09] is crazy to read i'm gonna read it
[00:26:11] the battle between the american and japanese surface fleets began a little before
[00:26:14] zero to two hundred like a suddenly breaking storm of
[00:26:18] cataclysmic size and power
[00:26:20] in the language of naval tacticians
[00:26:22] the coming together of two fleets in sea-large channel
[00:26:26] constituted what is known as a meeting
[00:26:27] engage in engagement
[00:26:29] but collision engagement is a better term
[00:26:32] for describing what happened steaming more
[00:26:35] or less blindly into the channel of fleets ran into each other at
[00:26:38] oblique angles
[00:26:39] their ships quickly became intermingled resulting in
[00:26:42] a close quarters melee that saw the combatants charging
[00:26:46] madly about their big guns flashing and booming hurling red hot
[00:26:50] shells and high flaming arcs above the channel
[00:26:53] the thunder of the guns rolled across the black water
[00:26:56] a steady pulsating roar and the molten projectile
[00:26:59] streak leg meteors crisscrossing the skies with fiery
[00:27:03] tails rising and falling and crashing into ships and exploding in massive fireballs
[00:27:07] violent secondary explosions caused by ammunition cooking off in the intense heat
[00:27:12] of the detonating shells rock some of the ships and sent them
[00:27:14] furiously ablaze
[00:27:16] blurning like roman candles
[00:27:18] fountains of fire sparking and shooting flames and blasting big chunks of steel
[00:27:22] in every direction all the while star shells and flares burst high above the
[00:27:27] channel and invaded like dying galaxies as they drifted down at the end of their
[00:27:31] parachutes into the extinguishing water
[00:27:34] the canisters that held the flares periodically flew over our positions
[00:27:37] charging like locomotives search lights probe the dirt lower darkness
[00:27:42] with their long brilliant beams sweeping back and forth above the surface
[00:27:46] by secting fixing on some hapless ship bringing the blazing shells down on it
[00:27:51] streams of tracers from automatic cannons and machine guns
[00:27:55] curved through the middle of the air every now and then an
[00:27:58] airant torpedo slammed into the beach below us
[00:28:00] 2500 pounds of explosives blasting a big crater at the waterline
[00:28:06] we watched all this from our foxes on the ridge front row seats to
[00:28:10] a spectacle that john murder john mordocla likened to all the fourth of
[00:28:14] July's I ever saw my life all put together at once
[00:28:18] we were a vocal audience awestruck and profane a ship would explode
[00:28:23] and all up and down the line you'd hear men exclaiming
[00:28:27] cheese a surprise and holy shit and oh my fucking god did you see that
[00:28:32] it was thrilling really you couldn't help but feel that way but i also couldn't
[00:28:37] help at wondering which ships were ours and how we could dis- and how they could
[00:28:41] distinguish friend from foe i thought of the many men who were losing their
[00:28:44] young lives right before our eyes i felt very fortunate to be in safe in my
[00:28:49] foxhole and i wondered who's winning yeah we had no idea who was winning
[00:28:56] yeah just we just knew that what i we had seen a massive combat
[00:29:03] just incredible and we were at a ring side seat
[00:29:07] now as that's going on obviously you have to realize that if the americans don't
[00:29:13] win this thing yeah that was it you guys are done yeah yeah
[00:29:19] can you imagine a convoy like that that many transports
[00:29:24] they they probably matched our numbers at that time if they had got all gotten
[00:29:28] a shore but they didn't yeah
[00:29:35] early the next morning be company crossed the river to spearhead the attack by
[00:29:40] another green army battalion the one the first the 182nd along the coastal flat
[00:29:47] toward the base of point crews so you guys you guys took lead yeah we were
[00:29:53] we were spearheading that particular attack you know you talk about you
[00:29:58] you mentioned to win be right a little earlier and that's a heck of a nick name
[00:30:01] then doesn't sound like it's easy for a couple and thought about that true
[00:30:05] but but we talk about you know a lot of times we talk about leadership on this podcast
[00:30:09] and you do a great description of this kind of transition and the relationship that you had
[00:30:15] with wimpy right i think it's worse well this is this is my co-author Steve
[00:30:19] wine gardener tell you he was he's a he's a great you know he got a award for a
[00:30:26] police woman that that escaped the holy cost okay
[00:30:31] call lala story well we can definitely look into that book yeah oh yeah
[00:30:37] here's how he describes your relationship with him wimpy right was the company's first
[00:30:42] sergeant he was a tough old salt shorten stocky late 30s or 40s old enough to be my
[00:30:47] father old enough for that matted matter to be the father of quite a few of the
[00:30:51] loutenates in the regiment he was going on 20 years in the Marine Corps and it's
[00:30:54] served in china nicaragua and Haiti he was no new comber to war no stranger to combat
[00:30:59] he was also in our terms he possessed a commanding voice which he used in a full
[00:31:05] throated bellow when reading off one of his charges when reading off one of his charges
[00:31:11] for doing something stupid on sumo before i was commissioned i had been one of his charges
[00:31:15] and it usually more than once deservedly been on the receiving end of one of his
[00:31:22] herangs but now i outranked him i was at first uncomfortable with our new relationship
[00:31:29] i found it hard to imagine giving orders to a man who not so long ago had been
[00:31:33] shouting in my face and giving me a dressing down the likes of which i'd never
[00:31:37] experienced before and never would again it wasn't that i was afraid of him rather i
[00:31:42] respected him too much and knew him and knew too well that he was a great marine to think that
[00:31:46] i could or should be telling what to do and i thought that he might resent my status
[00:31:51] and just to be cantankerous make things difficult for me i need never worried about right
[00:31:58] a consummate professional he supported me fully and ceseerly sincerely i should have expected
[00:32:03] that after all it was because of his recommendation that i received my commission he looked
[00:32:09] on me as his protege and he wanted me to succeed in part because my success would reflect well on
[00:32:14] him but mainly because he was generally genuinely proud of me also because i was a known quantity
[00:32:21] whom he had personally mentored he much preferred me to be giving orders rather than some 90
[00:32:26] day wonder fresh out of training in the states since he had taught me everything i knew he was
[00:32:30] confident that in combat together we would more or less be thinking along the same lines and
[00:32:35] important connection for a top sergeant to have with his petoon leader nor did he know what he
[00:32:40] broke the slightest in subordination toward me from anyone else in the petoon you obey your lieutenant
[00:32:45] or you'll have to answer to me he growled at my guys and you could be damn sure they did nobody
[00:32:50] wanted to have to answer to right sounds like an outstanding marine i'm pretty soon you're going
[00:32:57] again me getting into a part is my my first encounter of very close calls was losing my life
[00:33:09] on hill 78 second platoon was dealing with a lone sniper who had fired on us from the open
[00:33:15] trees on the coastal flap of below he was high up in one of those trees high enough to place
[00:33:20] my little above the hilltop allowing him to shoot down to us at a shallow angle he pottered us
[00:33:25] pottered us for a better part of four hours and then by the buy and buy and much to my astonishment
[00:33:32] a lieutenant i didn't recognize came strolling along in the ridge fully upright fully exposed
[00:33:37] this sniper smirking at us i was lying on the belly on my belly in the grass and he approached me
[00:33:42] saying i would be worried about that sniper can't hit me one in the next instant a shot rang out
[00:33:47] and a bullet wing disarm can't get complacent uh you continue on i didn't much care where that
[00:33:57] lieutenant won or what happened to him i wanted to get that sniper i pulled out my field glasses
[00:34:01] and scan the trees below our position as luck would have it i spotted the sniper almost at once that
[00:34:07] is i spotted his pude wrapped legs and booted feet dangling from the limb of a huge banyan
[00:34:13] tree about 150 yards from my position i lifted the field glasses a notch to the clump of
[00:34:17] leaves where those above those legs i couldn't see him but he had to be there japanese legs
[00:34:23] were always attached to japanese bodies just then he took a shot at me he must have seen me looking
[00:34:29] maybe my field glasses glinting the sun and give me a way his bullet hit the ground just
[00:34:33] inches from my nose sprang dirt my face i dropped my field glasses and snatched up my spring field
[00:34:39] firing from the prone position i unloaded the entire clip at the clump of leaves above his feet
[00:34:44] five shots one after the other working the bolt quickly put smooth me but smoothly so it's
[00:34:49] not spoiled my aim just as i had been taught to do and just as i had practiced on the Marine
[00:34:54] Coriful ranges i didn't think about it i didn't have to think all that training just kicked right
[00:34:59] in and i killed the man who had been trying to kill me he didn't drop from the tree he didn't
[00:35:03] drop his rifle but that was to be expected japanese snipers customarily tied themselves and the
[00:35:08] rifles to the trees bottom line he didn't shoot at us after that he was dead all right the first man i
[00:35:14] had killed yes that's my first my first call the first call the first call of life having around hit
[00:35:24] right front of your face i'm not gonna dirt my face oh he he spotted me i was no longer somebody
[00:35:33] to harass i was somebody it was gonna kill him now we had a dog a dog going on all right
[00:35:44] the eighth Marines first and second battians were to advance by side in columns in tourvine
[00:35:49] then attack and capture hill 83 ridge line the first battalion was to move forward on the right
[00:35:56] be company would lead in the battians advance and my platoon would lead the company's advance
[00:35:59] so that you put you does that put your company right your your company right at the front
[00:36:05] yeah that you're pulled to and right at the front of the company and we were at that time we
[00:36:08] we were right and red in the crux of it following it our an artillery bombardment second
[00:36:14] platoon with the rest of the battalion behind it passed through the army lines and advanced into the
[00:36:18] ravine enemy machine guns and riflemen fired down on us from concealed positions on the ridge
[00:36:23] some 75 yards ahead and above us machine guns chattered rut relentlessly ripping through the jungle
[00:36:30] rustling foliage clipping branches and leaves corporal Olson de Moss and his squad led the way moving
[00:36:36] up out of the ravine and onto the ridge suddenly a voice shouted baker company get off the
[00:36:41] ridge huh i looked around at my man who gave that order most of my men had gone to ground hiding
[00:36:47] in the bush as and were invisible to the Japanese that's the nature of jungle warfare everyone tries
[00:36:52] to stay hidden you can hardly see anyone either enemy or friendly the battlefield seems empty
[00:36:57] and you feel and you can feel alone and isolated on it especially when you're in command especially
[00:37:01] when in the middle of a firefight and when somebody else starts giving orders to your men
[00:37:05] I looked around and a few of the men I could see stared back at me there there are
[00:37:09] ex-blank expressions a firm denial it wasn't me a few minutes later de Moss and his squad
[00:37:14] returned to the ravine having relinquished their brief hold on the ridge top somebody although
[00:37:18] us to get off de Moss explained he thought one of our guys had given the order then we both
[00:37:24] realized what had happened those clever Japanese one of them someone flutten American English had given
[00:37:29] that order very clever he must be pleased with himself he must be laughing at us just about now
[00:37:34] him and his men laughing and how did he know that we were baker company you heard us heard
[00:37:41] us say that that's it now we're going to get a little bit a little bit later than this now I take
[00:37:46] over the puttoon second puttoon they puttoon later was yellow he wouldn't he wouldn't get
[00:37:52] up out of his hole so now I'm in charge and you're going to get into what the close calls I had
[00:37:58] there are boy they were they were mighty close unbelievable I don't know how I survived it
[00:38:07] yeah going back to this we risen to our uphill attack and we were met with more devastating
[00:38:11] machine gun and rifle fire so would you say this this engagement right here is the first time
[00:38:17] that you were under real oh yeah okay yeah other than getting bombed other than having
[00:38:25] area of attack other than it's not for shooting this this was it this is it is about a closest
[00:38:31] close to a call in second be I tell you we kept going for going forward firing on the move leaning
[00:38:37] slightly into the incline shooting from the shoulder and hip firing blindly at the top of the ridge
[00:38:41] we couldn't see the enemy but we knew he was up there dimos on my left banged away with his
[00:38:44] springfield just as fast as he could work the bolt and that his rifle seeves seized up dimos
[00:38:49] looked at me and I looked at him and the spell was broken just like just that fast I came out
[00:38:53] of my battle trance I felt very exposed and insecure judging by the wide eyed look he gave me
[00:38:59] dimos felt the same dimos inspectors rifle discovered that he had a bullet had pierced his magazine
[00:39:05] barely missing the nose his nose in the process he never cursed never uttered profanities and now
[00:39:11] true to form his big eyes still as saucers his eyes still as big as saucers he exclaimed
[00:39:16] well I'll be a dirty name then he discarded his rifle and started throwing grenades at the top of the
[00:39:21] ridge the reality of our sudden harrowing plight then struck me this was my first major combat
[00:39:28] test as a platoon leader and I realized that I had to take immediate and firm control of myself
[00:39:34] I could not show fear in front of my men a couple feet to my right private McCoy Reynolds had
[00:39:39] been hurling grenades one after the other each time courageously standing up and exposing himself
[00:39:44] to enemy fire he crouched down next to me and scanned the top of the ridge then he exclaimed I see
[00:39:49] them and threw another grenade in the next instant he was shot through the neck killed instantly
[00:39:55] he fell at my feet for a moment I just looked at him his eyes wide open lifeless stared back at me
[00:40:00] then I realized that now more than ever I had to get a grip on things and seize control
[00:40:05] of what was becoming an increasingly chaotic situation I decided at once we needed support from our
[00:40:11] mortars and backed a little way down the ridge out of the field of fire to further assess the situation
[00:40:22] now at the same time we were running low on an ammunition as well and we sent back call we need
[00:40:28] more ammunition next thing we know bandaliar after bandaliar of ammunition started arriving
[00:40:34] just the same as same Guided guys now that's an interesting I mean you recognized
[00:40:41] that that you needed to get control of your emotions
[00:40:48] is that something you would thought about what made you realize that what made you realize oh wow
[00:40:53] I better do something because I'm in charge and I need to make some decisions here I don't I don't
[00:40:59] know all of a sudden fear went away I guess I didn't have fear right at that time
[00:41:06] and it's also interesting but I saw the dire situation here we were in a situation that
[00:41:12] we we had we we were committed and either to keep going or are we gonna back up then back off
[00:41:21] finally we were called back down and now knowing that that that's the same kind of movement
[00:41:26] went clear to the top and decided to just call off that drive in general here I was at the
[00:41:33] I was at the spares head right there it was called off and they just said that the general
[00:41:40] from the top on down was that okay we stopped going after him and losing troops and that's just
[00:41:48] let him try in the vine well yeah because at this point you had we controlled we controlled
[00:41:55] all the ways we controlled this up we had taken out their supplies so let's do some siege warfare
[00:42:00] and make them wait yeah make them star so wait we had no more fighting we had a firm
[00:42:09] the fans line along a ridge for a month just just held a line continue with these setting up
[00:42:16] reconnaissance patrols next year you know are they doing what they were doing and I led
[00:42:21] Denver reconnaissance patrol myself taking out four or five men with me and finding out where they were
[00:42:27] that was scary situation to all these reconnaissance patrols you know right before they before they
[00:42:33] stopped that as you're still pushing forward up that ridge you got some great detail in here that's
[00:42:38] absolutely worth talking about going to the book here the ammunition was quickly distributed so
[00:42:44] you called for ammunition the ammunition was quickly distributed and once again we moved up hill
[00:42:48] shooting as we went another of my man men private Walter Cuss was favorally hit while scouting up the
[00:42:55] ridge from a different direction at the moment of his death he exailed the his last breath
[00:43:00] and that out a long rising how of pain and anguish like a dying animal yeah didn't sound like
[00:43:06] human being several attempts were made to reach him and dragon back all on successful
[00:43:11] PFC James Bell said I'm going up there all bring him down he was often running before anyone could
[00:43:18] stop him yeah on his own he did that and he was shot through the chest well before reaching Cuss's body
[00:43:25] we were able to retrieve Bell and he was still alive as we cared him down and out of a line of fire
[00:43:30] but he was just about gone he had a sucking chest wound that made it increasingly difficult to breathe
[00:43:36] hoping about size he couldn't breathe you see
[00:43:38] this was the first time I had seen such a wound and it was a terrible sight our corpsman tried
[00:43:43] to patch him up but there was little he could do a sucking chest wound needs to be sealed internally
[00:43:48] as well as externally and the corpsman could only treat the outside finally Bell said it looks like
[00:43:54] this is goodbye and then he calmly died just like in the movies I thought with his last words and
[00:44:01] everything yeah soon after that we quit attacking and withdrew we couldn't dislodge the enemy from the
[00:44:08] ridge we had been defeated our losses were heavy my Patuna loan suffered seven casualties four
[00:44:16] killed Reynolds Bell Cuss and private Robert Cuss three wounded PFC James Harris
[00:44:25] private burnt Mick Bernie and private named Mandraville total casualties for first
[00:44:31] Patallian were nine killed and 23 wounded overall in the period spanning 18 to 23
[00:44:36] November the 8th Marines lost 42 men killed and many more wounded now do I you got in the
[00:44:48] part where a discurory escort was named after Mickoy Reynolds oh I did not know that well let me tell
[00:44:55] you about that yeah my company commander had been a journalist with a with a anorland's paper
[00:45:03] so he's good at writing up things so I recommended recommended something written up on him he wrote
[00:45:09] this up in such a matter that a destroyer escort was named after him that's called in McOed Reynolds
[00:45:15] and it in turn sank to Japanese submarines later on yeah and was that um was that captain LeBlanc
[00:45:25] that you're talking about yes it is so so captain LeBlanc was your company commander at that time
[00:45:31] and it sounds like it sounds like from the book well let me give you your your thoughts on him
[00:45:38] we called him little Napoleon he was notoriously eager to make a name for himself and just as
[00:45:42] notorious not just as notoriously a verse to taking risks his men took the risks and he took the
[00:45:49] credit for their success he would say come on we've got a tough job to do and then he decides
[00:45:53] someone else to do it sometimes he denounced that we were going on an out on a reconnaissance
[00:45:57] platoon and then he turned a Murdoch or me or one of the other junior officers and say hey how about
[00:46:02] you leading it and at one point he tells you to go back to the go back to the army this is
[00:46:11] a secret is darn thing you can imagine you're reading now he he's telling you to go back to the
[00:46:17] army and tell them what you know what the ethical proposition and they ran into the same
[00:46:23] stuff that we did or and they really ran into it really bad so he tells you to go and this is
[00:46:29] what you this is what you write I come all across the ridges east facing slope walking in the
[00:46:34] grass at the edge of the jungle I was beneath the crests and felt reasonably safe the area was
[00:46:38] deserted a true nomans land I found this very disconserting it was eerie so you're alone
[00:46:44] I'm stupid stupid then I came upon the body of an American soldier he lay slightly above me
[00:46:51] and to my right a stride a narrow trail leading to the top rich his abdomen had been torn open
[00:46:56] and his intestines had spilled out and were spread across the ground a grizzly and heart-rending
[00:47:01] sight I heard past him thinking I wonder what his dreams were will that happen to me now he was
[00:47:10] looking at a photograph do you talk about that there no okay he's now he the last thing
[00:47:16] for a died he's looking at a photograph of his family or his girlfriend is laid out there that's
[00:47:22] the last the last as dying as he's dying he was looking at that and you're thinking I wonder what
[00:47:31] his next would have been me that could be me will that happen to me well that happened yet because
[00:47:36] there's you still have a lot of danger here there's still snipers out there shooting at me at this time
[00:47:44] and now you go I arrived at the army cp to find it in turmoil and anxious captain and is
[00:47:50] visibly agitated staff stood around a field radio listening to a report from the front line emanating
[00:47:55] from the speaker where the sounds of battle mix with the crackling of static a frightened voice crying
[00:48:00] out we're taking a lot of fire put two liter hit leg blown off get us out of here
[00:48:08] I could hear the actual sounds of the battle outside not too far away machine guns rifle fire
[00:48:13] grenades mortars the usual mayhem I reported to the commanding officer and told him what I knew
[00:48:18] and I left the cp laid out close by where's many as a dozen bodies covered with ponchos I
[00:48:25] hurried on instead of staying low on the slope I headed over toward the top of the ridge I don't
[00:48:28] he was interested in hearing me he's already in a so darn deep he didn't care about any more
[00:48:33] detail see he knew he was in a over his hand yeah it's old information met this point yeah
[00:48:43] when I reached the top of the ridge I snuck my head I stuck my head over the crest in the next
[00:48:47] incident Japanese machine gun cut loose at me with a long burst sending a streamable
[00:48:51] it's snapping just inches above the head that brought me to my senses and I ran down the slope
[00:48:56] into the jungle I stood there for a minute grap gasping for breath shaking and thinking holy smokes
[00:49:01] almost bought the farm on that one holy smokes
[00:49:05] that count is one of your close calls micro close yeah yeah that's what I'm now you've already
[00:49:17] covered two of them now two out of eight there's actually there's there's three more on Guadalcanale
[00:49:26] that you'll get to in a subiet well what do they say a cat has nine lives so luckily we only have
[00:49:31] eight to cover otherwise the ninth one we wouldn't be here since it's here talking on November 25th
[00:49:39] we were pulled off the line in sent to positions near in the rear near Hendersonfield for the next
[00:49:45] 15 days we slept in open sighted tents on the grove of coconut palms on ground that was
[00:49:50] saw from frequent heavy rain showers there was always a possibility that Japanese warships
[00:49:55] would foray and to see large channel during the night and throw a few hundred large cowlblows shells
[00:50:02] into our soggy environments but these dangers were negligible compared to what we had recently
[00:50:06] been through on the front line and we did not worry about them actually we did not worry about
[00:50:10] much of anything we were emotionally and physically drained and lacked both energy and inclination
[00:50:16] to worry we mostly sat around doing nothing partly because we had nothing much to do but also
[00:50:22] because we were sort of in a days you might say we were numb it was not it was not an unpleasant
[00:50:28] state we were purely glad to be alive and the fact that no one was shooting at us at least not
[00:50:33] directly or intentionally made us feel downright you fork we were living for the moment and for the moment
[00:50:39] everything was fine and we were content see now we're coming down with malaria as well you see
[00:50:46] now the other thing you go into here which is interesting is during this period of number
[00:50:52] Marines took steps to upgrade their personal armament the main object of their desire was the
[00:50:58] superb M1 grand semi-automatic rifle that had been issued to the army this still had the old ones
[00:51:04] the model 1903 springfield we carried was a fine weapon but it was obsolete the old salts loved
[00:51:11] the O3 like a Viking loves his broad sword but the kids were unsend metal about the rifle because
[00:51:16] they had no history with it so you say while some Marines acquired their M1s through honest
[00:51:23] scrounging in battlefield scavenging others resorted to outright theft and you go through some
[00:51:30] methods that that were used to do that who is also moonlighting you guys had Tommy Guns
[00:51:36] which you said weren't really all that great for most of the purposes the rising
[00:51:42] you know for a while we even had shotgun you know yeah on the night of 30 to 31 November
[00:51:53] at Japanese beginning the beginning using the flame source as well is there too at that time
[00:51:59] rough weapon right there oh yeah on the night of 30 to 31 November a Japanese task force
[00:52:09] steamed in the sea large channel of bringing food to the Belieger Japanese forces on Guadalcanal
[00:52:13] our warships sailed forth to intercept it meeting the enemy fleet in that off-to-speweded gap
[00:52:18] between savvoiled and Guadalcanal just off Tassa Farango how do you say that it's right
[00:52:23] Tassa Farango point because our Bivolac was situated inland on low ground I heard the battle but
[00:52:29] did not see it our fleet took an awful beating one of our heavy cruisers the North Hampton was
[00:52:35] struck by two torpedoes within a matter of seconds consumed by fire she sank a few hours later
[00:52:41] you're still sure the heavy crew cruisers Minneapolis Minneapolis New Orleans and Pensacola
[00:52:47] were severely damaged and the sailors were coming off off of an off cover with oil
[00:52:52] and so would they swim into shore some did probably did it was right near the shore
[00:52:58] yeah the battle had been a clear tactical victory for the Japanese but a strategic defeat
[00:53:05] the task force had failed with its primary mission to deliver food to the Japanese army on Guadalcanal
[00:53:11] this was a calamitous development for the Japanese even before the battle their food stocks were
[00:53:17] desperately not low now they began falling below substance levels the entire enemy army was
[00:53:23] growing physically weaker because the soldiers simply didn't have enough to eat
[00:53:29] we were in better shape than the Japanese overall but only in a relative sense the first marine
[00:53:33] division in particular was greatly reduced by illness and sheer exhaustion as well as by battle casualties
[00:53:40] it had suffered in four months of fighting yeah a large number of its men were unfit for duty
[00:53:46] and many more were only marginally capable of rendering effective frontline service the
[00:53:50] high command recognizing that the entire division had just about reached the end of its
[00:53:54] operation utility pulled it off the front lines began sending it units to Australia starting on nine
[00:53:59] December yeah so they after my birthday December it's so you wave goodbye to those guys as they're
[00:54:07] leaving and meanwhile on 11 December the 8th marine's resume returned to the ridges yeah right
[00:54:14] but we didn't really take off until first part of the January I guess and the final drive
[00:54:20] and then so it's you on one set of ridges and the Japanese were on the other side they were usually
[00:54:25] somewhere right on the first slope in front of us they were dug in like gulfers like gulfer holes
[00:54:32] but most are more further back on the next over the next next ridge so there'd be you on one
[00:54:39] day they would come up close no so hang on a zed us heard so hang on a zed each other all right
[00:54:47] these dispositions meaning these two ridges that you guys had occupied both ours and those
[00:54:52] the enemy remained substantially unchanged for the next 34 days yeah the brass anxious to void
[00:54:59] a repeat performance of the november battles in order to temporary halt to large scale offensive
[00:55:03] operations instead we were told to hold the line and harass the enemy with aggressive patrols and
[00:55:08] raids in the meantime our air and naval forces would strive to introduce the Tokyo Express which is
[00:55:15] their supply chain now while we were at that location there was a sergeant from the Jason company
[00:55:23] and he had a tummy gun and he didn't enough at enough action going on where he was
[00:55:29] steady was coming down the line where there's air reaction he wanted to get into it well he came
[00:55:33] he came right by where I was and no one in two months when great was right shortly after that one
[00:55:40] of our one of our rounds dropped in short he lost two legs in an arm and he was in there's
[00:55:48] an article in the said reading post about it and saying that at least I have the right arm to
[00:55:53] wrap the bar with for a drink I'll tell about it and there's some too
[00:55:59] words uh you guys that during this you also talk about the fact that you would be young
[00:56:07] stuff back and forth to the Japanese they're a little bit a little bit they'd be yelling at you
[00:56:13] guys and you'd yell back at them and it sounds like during the daytime well you say it was during
[00:56:17] the daytime was a policy became one of live and let live during the day of a much different policy
[00:56:24] ruled at night after the case yeah and they were sneaking in on the server now and then make a little
[00:56:30] trying to sneak in and maybe get one of our guys in a fox hole yeah you're going to one of those
[00:56:36] one night during a heavy downport of Japanese crept up from the ravines the sound of their movement
[00:56:41] mass by the falling rain and jump the crew a ferocious hand-a-hand struggle ensued I heard our
[00:56:47] men yelling help oh god they're in our whole help help they're blood curling cries and thrashing sounds
[00:56:53] were plainly audible to everyone in the vicinity there were on a point little bit a little bit
[00:56:57] a head of our regular line and this has gotta be just this is on a mental weedless and
[00:57:03] horrified but stayed in our holes that's how bad it was to get out of your holes you don't dare
[00:57:08] because you you anybody outside the holes enemy suddenly the yelling sounds of the fighting
[00:57:17] ceased we actually waited and listened to pairing through the rain and into the darkness
[00:57:20] then the Japanese begin probing our position all up and down the line running up to the
[00:57:24] crest and chucking a few grenades over the top at our holes and running back down hill after
[00:57:28] the grenades exploded usually harmlessly our guys would leap from their holes dashed to the
[00:57:33] crest and throw grenades at the fleeting enemy then they'd scamper back to their holes and the
[00:57:36] Japanese would return to herle their grenades back and forth and went through the night intervals
[00:57:40] of silence and then flash bang of grenades exploding and men hollering and cursing in the English and
[00:57:45] Japanese the next morning we discovered that one of them men in the machine gun post had been killed
[00:57:50] that's that day and headed to death the others have been wounded but somehow they'd beaten back
[00:57:54] their attackers and you were saying this earlier you we also conducted aggressive patrols
[00:58:03] and probe their lines at giving as good as we got or maybe even better if more frontline
[00:58:07] Japanese soldiers had survived the war maybe be reading memoirs by those veterans of
[00:58:12] Guadalcanal campaign recounting how the US Marines terrorized them at night and terrorized
[00:58:17] them we most certainly did some guys really enjoyed this part of the job teenagers who found
[00:58:23] their true nature in the jungle who discovered that they were born for the warrior life
[00:58:27] there were very there were a few in every unit more than a few actually more than you might expect
[00:58:32] more than I expected they went after the Japanese with a competence and enthusiasm that made
[00:58:37] them almost as frightening to their officers as they must have been to their enemies it was just
[00:58:42] amazing observed Murdoch how you could take kids like these and put them out into the jungle
[00:58:48] and in just a few weeks they'd be great at jungle warfare for them it was like playing cowboys and
[00:58:52] Indians they'd come back from a patrol and you'd hear them talk how many teeth did you get
[00:58:57] or how many did you kill and they'd brag while I killed three or four now I wanted these patrols
[00:59:06] much earlier than what we're talking about right now I was leading this patrol and had four
[00:59:10] five others with me and we ended up we were in a location where the army had now passed through
[00:59:18] our lines and they were in control so we came right by the reddish metal regimental CP and the
[00:59:27] army colonel says what do you guys doing here said well we got it with constant patrols as
[00:59:31] well we're in charge here now we don't need you any more and so we said so the we moved
[00:59:40] on for a little bit further back to our own line where we were in reserve and it turned out
[00:59:47] we had a little bit higher than we was so he'd look up at us and we were on the skyline from
[00:59:51] his from his perspective very skyline and then we would at peace of well you're going to track
[00:59:56] fire being up there well here's parsley crack but not entirely well anyway as we as we
[01:00:04] left my man says say they're they're two or three snipers in a tree right over there C.P.
[01:00:12] what should we do I said shoot them so we shot them killed them and and told the Colonel
[01:00:18] he just shot three snipers right over here C.P.
[01:00:25] and later on later on I'm and we return in 1982 there's a there's a big Catholic church right
[01:00:32] there now and I talked to the to the not a priest when next went up who's there and I
[01:00:40] tell him about it and then that same later on that same day well he so he he's the one
[01:00:49] as a young as a young priest he's the one that rescued Joel Foss when he got shut down
[01:00:56] I've gotten the water and he's all tangled up in his fairs who've never been out
[01:01:00] to tell him about it well later on that day we saw we saw Joel Foss and then in here he met
[01:01:07] he met this priest you know and he was talking about it and so anyway what's interesting is that
[01:01:17] when they told us this army Colonel what we had just done the Colonel was still unhappy with us
[01:01:24] and and and at the same reunion when we saw Joel Foss and all there was there was a
[01:01:34] veteran army who had previously had been a Marine in China and he joined the National Guard
[01:01:41] and that's where he was out there this time and he came to me he says you know
[01:01:46] I just heard you talking I was there and you had a beard like Santa Claus and it says you were there yeah
[01:01:56] and that says after you left I told the Colonel says you know after all we're on the same side
[01:02:03] a small world yeah that's crazy after all these years you know we talked a little bit about
[01:02:10] about Murdoch and and he's quite the character and you talk about him a little bit here
[01:02:22] because captain what happened to Captain of the block you get somehow somehow Murdoch ends up taking over
[01:02:30] eventually the block was relieved and replaced by Murdoch who's an ideal a Boston Irishman
[01:02:36] Murdoch was very funny and very tough a superb combat a superb combat commander and a bit wild too
[01:02:43] all traits that is younger charges greatly appreciated one manifestation of his toughness apart from his
[01:02:48] courage and coolness under fire was his disdain for metals and combinations very few men who had
[01:02:54] him as their CEO including me received decorations Murdoch explained I didn't recommend many people
[01:03:01] I didn't care if a machine gunner killed 50 men that's what he was supposed to do that's what he's
[01:03:05] getting paid for that was my attitude once in Hawaii we had a big for the formation with the
[01:03:10] division and they decorated all these guys one company would give 40 metals out I'd give one my attitude
[01:03:16] was hey killing japs is our job we're not doing it for metals yeah and here here you start to talk
[01:03:26] about just the whole just the the brutality of what's going on over there one of the themes
[01:03:34] running through the preceding anecdotes is the merciless nature of the Pacific war the Marine
[01:03:39] court had tried to prepare us for this in our training bayonet drills were especially important
[01:03:44] in reality in combat there to be aggressive you see right right yeah in reality in combat there are
[01:03:51] few instances when men used bayonets in the traditional manner fixed to the rifles bayonet drills
[01:03:57] were performed for their psychological effect so that men would learn the psychology of the bayonet
[01:04:03] namely to kill brutally quickly and unthinkingly without compunction or moral qualms so
[01:04:09] done realistic as far as the application right but our training merely paved the way for our
[01:04:15] transformation into hardened killers exposure to actual combat accomplished and completed the
[01:04:23] process you got hard or you died it was that simple killer be a killer be killed you know
[01:04:30] and the Japanese made it simple they were they were notoriously unspearing their reputation
[01:04:37] for ruthlessness and savagery was widespread and well-founded we knew all the stories the rape of
[01:04:43] Nand King the Badan death marks atrocities committed far and wide and often against prisoners
[01:04:49] we believed correctly that we could expect no pity if we fell into their hands they neither
[01:04:54] asked for quarter nor gave any and we responded in kind if they had set rules as we believed
[01:05:00] we were damn sure going to play by them one other choice do we have they simply would not
[01:05:06] surrender they would not stop coming out us until we killed them very quickly we learned that
[01:05:11] trying to take prisoners was a waste of time and dangerous even the wounded if we went to treat them
[01:05:16] would try and kill us by usually by blowing up everyone themselves and the corpsmen who had
[01:05:21] stopped to help them with a grenade the dead had a nasty habit of rising up from the ground
[01:05:26] and attacking us so we made sure the dead were truly dead no sense in taking chances this killer
[01:05:33] be killed approach to war was as brutalizing as it was brutal and affected everyone to some degree
[01:05:39] Murdock recalled a corpsman who came up to me and said hey lieutenant I've got well I've got
[01:05:44] a live one can I shoot him I said sure go ahead corpsman won't want to want to
[01:05:48] expose to have weapons and we shouldn't have shot that wounded guy but I let him do it
[01:05:54] we all we all did it all the time because if we took a prisoner it would take two men at least
[01:05:58] to send him back to the rear and we were so thin our lines were really thin because we had a lot of
[01:06:03] guy's sick our units were very much depleted thus we became inert to the horrors of war and not
[01:06:10] surprisingly we did horrible things not without reason when your enemy behaves in a beastial fashion
[01:06:17] it is only natural to look on them as beasts natural and to some extent justify or they consider
[01:06:24] his animals really but we were not without sin in this regard far from it Murdock for example
[01:06:34] never took any prisoners and here's Murdock I wasn't nice I did bad things looking back over the
[01:06:40] years I can say we probably committed as many atrocities against the dead bodies of the Japanese
[01:06:44] as they did to ours pulling teeth for example goal for example we'd heard japs wanted to die looking
[01:06:53] at the sun so we'd rolled them over and stick their faces in the dirt so we couldn't so they
[01:06:57] couldn't see the sun our guys would cut off fingers and make fobs which believe are not with
[01:07:01] the finger of the japs finger hanging down and they'd go out there with the knives and pliers
[01:07:07] trying to pull out gold teeth but if some of us truly relished but if some of them men truly relished
[01:07:15] battle embraced and enjoyed it enjoyed the killing the brutality the horror all of it it is important
[01:07:21] to establish that on the continuum of brutal human behavior the rest of us were not all that far
[01:07:29] removed from them and we tended to move closer as the war went on some manner more capable than
[01:07:35] others when it comes to killing but all men are capable one way we improved on this capability
[01:07:42] such improvement being vital to our effectiveness as Marines not to mention our very survival
[01:07:48] was to look on our enemy as hateful creatures less than human from a psychological standpoint
[01:07:53] it became easy to kill them we were killing animals not men and after killing them we would look
[01:07:58] upon their dead bodies and feel nothing no remorse no guilt no horror pity or whatever from there
[01:08:05] it was just a small step to place in the geography of the mind we were pulling gold teeth out
[01:08:12] of corpses was not all that outrageous but now many were doing that there's just a few crazy guys
[01:08:18] doing it and one of my one of my sergeants that did that and he had a whole had a whole pocket full
[01:08:24] and for some reason rather something happy changes fans or something and they were all so
[01:08:29] I'll get some more yeah I like the fact that you said basically that I mean somebody asked me
[01:08:37] about dehumanizing the enemy and when we were fighting and I rack and I said the enemy dehumanizes
[01:08:43] themselves with their what their actions that they would take and that's the same situation here
[01:08:49] you know the in Iraq the insurgents would be head people and skin people alive and just do
[01:08:57] absolutely horrible I don't know what the Turks seem to be doing that right now it seems like I don't
[01:09:01] know that's a thing cleansing yeah there's definitely some uh it's hard to figure out what's going on
[01:09:09] over there right now I saw some fresh reports of what going on in the absolute yeah it does not look good you
[01:09:20] also had some people that couldn't that didn't adopt that mentality and here's Murdoch talking
[01:09:23] about it talking about people that couldn't adopt that killer be killed mentality he said they'd
[01:09:30] have to go back because they were no good to us they just disappear they'd be sent back to the
[01:09:35] states it was a self-weeding process the guys who remained were the guys you could depend on
[01:09:40] when I became company commander New Zealand that was an awful thing I had to do we could send
[01:09:45] 3% of our personnel home every so often so they could start new outfits back in the states
[01:09:50] but you never wanted to send the good guys home you send the shitheads and the screwups I wanted
[01:09:55] the best men with me I didn't want any of my good men to go in New Zealand just before we sailed
[01:10:01] for Talawa Tarawa Murdoch told our company now listen I'm gonna send some of you guys home if you
[01:10:07] fuck up you're going to go but he told me later these kids were so good they just wouldn't do that
[01:10:13] they wouldn't fuck up on purpose they would do their job and do it well they didn't want to be
[01:10:18] come known as a fuck up and a lot of those kids were killed on Talawa that I could have sent home
[01:10:24] but that's what happened because I wanted to keep the good guys with me man that's a powerful
[01:10:29] statement all these guys have to do is be slackers and they'll get sent home to the states but they
[01:10:36] wouldn't do it that's the Marine Corps. The thing is this isn't a general average opinion I don't think
[01:10:45] he was a little bit overboard and all this discussion you know he's not difficult in other words
[01:10:52] but he was he was well-liked because of because of when he looked at life
[01:10:58] yeah he talks about one guy here he says I had one guy a platoon a lieutenant platoon leader will call him
[01:11:04] Mac. Yeah not as real names. That's the one I took over from and then where I almost got killed.
[01:11:10] He says he was a Yale graduate came from Connecticut very well brought up had money nice guy too
[01:11:15] and handsome a rugged look good looking Marine but on Guadalcanal he'd go on patrol he just could not handle it
[01:11:21] while he'd go bean yes was his platoon sergeant and he'd have to take over Mac's patrols all the time
[01:11:26] Mac tried but he couldn't do it I respected him for that he was trying the kids were calling him yellow
[01:11:32] and they'd say to me we don't want that guy he's yellow and I'd say wait just a minute that guy is not
[01:11:37] yellow he tried to do the job but he's just not he couldn't just couldn't do it just going to
[01:11:42] a yellow man doesn't go out and try he quits Mac won't go this go deenia see became an officer
[01:11:48] he married an anus elin gal I knew him pretty well all right so continuing on here by December
[01:11:59] our long so during the front line of taking a big toll we were wasted by illness multiple illnesses
[01:12:04] we were malnourished and looked it we went about shirtless showing squannie bodies with protruding ribs
[01:12:09] and vertebrae and salose skin stretched over stretched hotly over them our faces were drawn
[01:12:14] in angular beneath scraggly beards and our eyes were recessed in their orbits we didn't have a
[01:12:19] change of clothes during that period and we became unimaginably filthy we looked scary and
[01:12:24] menacing and pitiful a lot of us came down with yellow jannus see that that would do a
[01:12:28] liberate that would do you and too you know the constant threat of enemy attack punctuated by
[01:12:36] intermittent balance of actual fighting was tremendously stressful it seemed that much of the time
[01:12:41] we were either waiting to be attacked or being attacked or attacking the enemy ourselves or we were
[01:12:46] just sitting around trying to get some rest but feeling cruddy because we were sick and we always
[01:12:50] were tensed up thinking and worrying about our next combat action depending on how your day was going
[01:12:55] such concerns might be in the forefront of your thoughts incessant and acute making you all
[01:12:59] edgy and fretful or they might be buried deep usually they were somewhere in between but they were
[01:13:05] always present in your head and on your mind you could never fully let go or get rid of them
[01:13:09] the unrelenting mental strain not to do not not to mention the physical dangers that caused it
[01:13:15] made us twitch your each passing day you know during the during the times that we were
[01:13:22] we were back behind the front lines and nobody's shooting at you home like I said it's wonderful
[01:13:29] nobody's shooting at me and all that stress you know now you now you don't have to worry about it
[01:13:37] now what about the fact that even though no one's shooting at you right now you have time to
[01:13:42] sit there and think about the fact that you're going to go again and the enemy's going to attack you
[01:13:47] and you know somebody pull up pull it what it was stupid thing so it's through a hand grenade
[01:13:52] dummy into a tent everybody just took off why would a guy do that I don't understand he thought it was funny
[01:13:59] I'll tell you why I'm laughing when you tell that story because one of my friends what
[01:14:06] am I good friends a guy by the name of Lave Babin who I work with and wrote a book with
[01:14:12] wrote two books with him actually he did that two a couple of his guys took a
[01:14:17] took a grenade and we were in Ramadi and he took a grenade the pin was in it was still taped up
[01:14:22] but it was real grenade and there was a couple of guys sitting in a room talking and he just opened
[01:14:26] the door and rolled the grenade in there we were just talking about the other day yeah oh yeah
[01:14:31] we were just talking about the reason I remember we were just talking about yesterday and he goes
[01:14:35] yeah that wasn't smart it wasn't smart because who knows what's going to happen I mean those guys
[01:14:39] it with they had guns they might have shot I mean there's all kinds of crazy things that couldn't happen
[01:14:43] you make it mean later on yet in here but also in our last drive on Guadalconelle I had
[01:14:50] an enemy grenade filled right there by my legs and I tried to kick it away and hit something came
[01:14:56] right on back it was a dud. Here's Murdoch talking about Guadalconelle and why what made it
[01:15:13] what made it Guadalconelle he said each campaign was different each with different problems
[01:15:18] Tar was the worst in terms of fighting but the battle lasted only three days right after it
[01:15:23] we right after it ended we were taken off Baycheo and sent back to Hawaii but on Guadalconelle
[01:15:28] we were on Guadalconelle for three months. For the amount of time we were there we didn't do
[01:15:32] all that much fighting but there were other things the sickness and the heat especially the
[01:15:37] living conditions were the worst on Guadalconelle and then you say as bad as it was it was worse
[01:15:42] for the Japanese much worse their condition was no mystery for us as December gave way to January
[01:15:47] there was a noticeable drop off an enemy activity that we correctly ascribed to their deteriorating
[01:15:53] health their nocturnal probes dwindled and in time virtually ceased altogether they simply
[01:15:59] lacked the energy to come out us in the night. We didn't know they didn't even bother to yell at us
[01:16:12] they rarely achieved success when they did attack in battle we found we had as we been told on
[01:16:17] Simoa the Japanese made the same mistakes over and over for instance they would commit their units
[01:16:22] to battle as they became available instead of holding them back and massing them for a single
[01:16:26] powerful blow and they would keep coming in small coming out of until they were killed primarily
[01:16:31] by our artillery the carnage was sickening even to us weak and we couldn't understand why they
[01:16:36] never seemed to learn from their experiences and make the necessary adjustments. One one thing
[01:16:41] that was wrong with their strategy that they they had attacked and there was no command to change
[01:16:48] are you going to go out of flying or something like that to just keep coming and keep coming
[01:16:51] to other all kill. Yeah that's a lack of leadership and maneuver warfare right that's not
[01:16:58] no maneuver no maneuver at all no maneuver just hey we're going forward we're going to do a
[01:17:01] a frontal assault and they would just get killed to get mode down and that happened time and
[01:17:06] time again. Here we are coming in the terror law the same situation we had no no way to maneuver
[01:17:13] anything and just keep going into facing heavy machine gun fire just like the Japanese did.
[01:17:20] The Japanese thought their indelvinable will would provide them with a margin for victory it did
[01:17:25] not occur to them or they could not acknowledge that the Marines and soldiers they were battling
[01:17:30] were equally indelvinable and in the end victorious. They had so easy on moving all down through the
[01:17:38] the east end is not that and it's just everything just just faded away and they just kept going
[01:17:45] no problem at all. And then they met American forces. So then so this is this is a turning point
[01:17:53] of going to go out and where they that's where they return the tables now where now we're in the offensive. Yeah
[01:17:59] do so January 10th you begin going on off. Eighth Marines the one eight the two eight and the
[01:18:07] three eight I worked with the three eight a bunch of your body they were outstanding. Yeah our mission orders
[01:18:13] issued by General Patch were to attack and destroy the Japanese format forces remaining on Guadalcanal.
[01:18:19] Yeah. We moved up and I'm just reading and I always have to mention this I'm obviously not reading
[01:18:29] this whole book. I could read this whole book. I want to read this whole book because the book is
[01:18:35] outstanding but I'm jumping around so if it seems a little bit scattered it's because I'm jumping
[01:18:39] from I'm skipping over big chunks that you're telling with great detail and and this is this is one
[01:18:45] of the most outstanding accounts that exists of these campaigns. So just know that you have to buy
[01:18:52] the book the book is called Faith for Warriors. So here we go we moved we pushed on we moved up
[01:18:59] and over hill 82 the hill and jungle draws below were in festo with Japanese my men saw a
[01:19:03] single Japanese soldier and open fire killing him instantly I collected some personal effects from
[01:19:08] his body a diary a lock of hair a first aid kit a photograph of a group of soldiers and a
[01:19:14] thousand stitch belt which is a piece of cloth embroidered with a thousand stitches by wellwishers
[01:19:20] that he carried for good luck. No I sent a lot of this stuff that we took off of the dead home
[01:19:25] to Japan to their to their families eventually. Eventually and we'll probably get into a bit but
[01:19:31] the I received a letter from the brother one of these soldiers just beautifully done calligraphy
[01:19:36] you know. Yeah so you you held on to this stuff and eventually figured out who this got
[01:19:43] did that because we we were asked to talk to a Japanese in Los Angeles and there's a Japanese
[01:19:50] Japanese area there and the the the priest there suggested I do that he couldn't speak any
[01:19:59] English but through the translation I knew that that's what had to do and so we sent it
[01:20:05] to the to the relatives of Philadelphia worked with at North American Aviation and
[01:20:11] his wife's family were Honda which is a Honda car and so we sent her to one of her cousins
[01:20:20] and when they they came to Fay baseball in this country after the war and they lost so they
[01:20:27] had lost face to so to speak so they wanted to go back with something so they took this all
[01:20:33] of these items that I'd taken off of these soldiers that we're talking about here and they put it
[01:20:38] in a white box strong around their neck as they got as they landed in Hawaii a lot of
[01:20:45] Buddhist priests were there with me to play when they got to Tokyo all a big thing always picked up
[01:20:52] and my name got all over all over Japan about over that incredible. What were you thinking about
[01:21:02] at the time I mean at the time you couldn't have been thinking about that all that was going
[01:21:06] to happen. You know and also you know where we we were asked to attend this Buddhist ceremony
[01:21:14] and my family had made three daughters with me and here we're the first ones in line and you're
[01:21:19] we're supposed to you're supposed to you had to carry these incense and there's a gong and
[01:21:25] goes on and well bunch of stuff we we led that procession as it went by then after that we we had a
[01:21:33] get together sokiyaki and and beer in the in the percentage yeah and I'd be real careful
[01:21:41] what I said you know I had my friend as a translator be real careful they didn't call them
[01:21:46] japs and all that yeah and I said how come come there's so interesting what happened here
[01:21:52] as well these these people from northern part of Japan and they had no clue of what had
[01:21:57] happened to their soldiers way down south yeah because they didn't have enough weightness is
[01:22:07] living after the war you know to explain and then on on site pan and I was talking to Donny
[01:22:13] Edwards we were there at you been there you know where this what this call suicide clip
[01:22:18] well there there's one monument there and there were paid for by children raising the money
[01:22:24] and one of them faces south kneeling a mother mourning over her lost her sons lost in the
[01:22:32] south city the other was facing the suicide cliff mourning the children that were carried over
[01:22:38] the cliff to be killed and what is happening was they were just putting in the new monument
[01:22:46] they hadn't don't have the new captions yet and I was explaining to Donny what that what that
[01:22:50] was all about and it's on it's it's on uh uh uh Instagram go to Instagram and you go to best
[01:22:59] defense foundation and they'll tell about it okay yeah so even though you're gathering souvenirs this
[01:23:08] is not over yet and here you go the fighting was constant but not everywhere at the same time one squad
[01:23:13] might be resting wall nearby another was engaged with a sharp fight yeah it's true with a sniper
[01:23:19] machine gunness and all up and down the line automatic weapons rattled rifles crack grenades
[01:23:24] popped the air carry this the stringent smell of cordite in places where there had been a lot of
[01:23:30] firing the atmosphere was hazy with gunsmoke and the smoke of burning foliage there was a lot of
[01:23:34] shouting someone screaming the and the frequent cry corpsman corpsman stretcher down this is not
[01:23:40] a general atmosphere this this is a certain locations this is happening because not here where you say
[01:23:45] yeah because then this is because the Japanese were really depleted at this point pretty much so yeah they
[01:23:49] will yeah uh stretcher bearers many of them musicians in the divisions band yeah right ran around
[01:23:56] the battlefield picking up the wounded and carrying them back the battalion aid station so every
[01:24:02] Marines arrive amen as well as there's the band out there there's the pressure pressure bearers
[01:24:09] yeah 14 January we continue to advance the action much the same as the day before
[01:24:16] intermittent class with Japanese diehard some of the Japanese we came upon
[01:24:20] blew themselves up and their holes were just sat there and let us kill them with the grenades
[01:24:24] yeah my puttune made good progress you got a guy named the blowing sounds up a little hand
[01:24:31] grenade right here put he had it and kick it off and his team blown south up right over here
[01:24:36] so with they trying to take Marines with him not well yeah as they could but when you get
[01:24:43] in a side panel explain there how would we we saw a hundred over a hundred doing that as we
[01:24:47] advance and they could have shot back as they didn't instead they just we got so close
[01:24:53] and they blown themselves bang bang bang as we as we as we had passed incredible
[01:25:00] uh one guy you lost a guy named Gunner Lund and you with a gunner Lund had kind of a
[01:25:11] had a kid that looked up to him made her shall wheelcy and you and he wrote he's a
[01:25:16] one that did some of these illustrations okay and in this one here okay so wheel ski you're
[01:25:22] the one that has to tell wheel ski that you know his his he is no more he's no more and here we
[01:25:28] are shortly thereafter it fell upon me to break the news of Lund's death to corporal hercial
[01:25:33] wheel ski ski as he was known was a bar man and a squad leader in Lund's puttune yeah
[01:25:39] he took Lund's death very hard gunner Lund was a popular figure and B company an old salt
[01:25:44] who was trusted and respected for his courage competence and common sense battle wisdom
[01:25:49] and loved for his tough his rough humor and for the obvious and genuine affection
[01:25:53] and concerned he felt for his young charges before the war he had been sea going marine
[01:25:58] serving on the beloved aircraft the Lexington he'd always been smoking a cigar how
[01:26:03] we was able to keep himself stock with stowies on guano canals anyone's guess such
[01:26:07] of the talents of an old salt he used to say that after the war he was going to buy himself a
[01:26:11] big shiny cattle act convertible and ride around smoking his cigars instead of that high
[01:26:16] visit his family after the war he had a sister that had been to a dance and they couldn't
[01:26:22] find her anywhere she was dead in the trunk they found her body in the trunk of the car
[01:26:29] been murdered and they got this this same time as hit as when he the family found out about Lund
[01:26:35] oh yeah you said that that was a simple dream for a simple very good man a dream never realized
[01:26:46] all the kids looked up to Lund wheel skiing particular ski idolized Lund the gunner was everything
[01:26:50] to him a hero mentor father figure older brother and best friend at first he refused to
[01:26:55] believe that Lund had been killed yeah i was just talking to him a few minutes ago he said
[01:26:59] but then the truth said again and he became distraught and threw his weapon on the ground this
[01:27:04] damn war he exclaimed yeah ski then announced he was quitting the marine core and quitting the war
[01:27:10] he meant what he said he was about to head back to the rear when Murdoch arrived on the scene
[01:27:14] Murdoch's calm ski down and told him that he just couldn't up and quit that it would be
[01:27:19] desertion in the face of the enemy and that he would get a lot of trouble for it Murdoch spoke
[01:27:23] softly with him for several minutes in this vein until ski came to a senses ski picked up as
[01:27:29] weapon and rejoined third platoon and Murdoch assumed command of that unit but ski was a changed man
[01:27:35] exchanging one man as for another he went from being a marine who did his job and did it well
[01:27:40] to being a marine who did his job with a singular passion from that day forward he hated the
[01:27:45] Japanese with a savage intensity and took it on himself to personally avenge Lund's death
[01:27:51] often going off by himself to hunt the enemy if you were a compassionate man you might say a
[01:27:55] prayer for any Japanese soldiers who crossed his path he always returned eventually but with
[01:28:02] little to say about his exploits he was the quiet type guys like him usually are yeah
[01:28:09] he's the impediment he pedamy of a combat marine and so this continues on and then you say this
[01:28:20] and so to the end my memory of the final days of January offensive is blurry and I find it
[01:28:24] difficult to remember the details that reunions we reminisce about our very limited personnel
[01:28:29] personal perspective of the offense and the countless little battles that were fought as we went
[01:28:34] forward at that perilous time we focused primarily on our own concerns about adequate cover for
[01:28:41] incoming artillery and other life threatening events in our immediate area we advanced on a broad
[01:28:46] front but never in an even line some units always move faster than others depending on the terrain
[01:28:51] and the resistance they encountered we went up and down more hills and ridges up and down up and down
[01:28:56] sometimes fighting and killing the Japanese sometimes just killing them and to January or last week
[01:29:02] on guadal canal be company was bivalact by Henderson Field awaiting transport off the island while
[01:29:07] there I came down with jaundice and I lost a lot of weight I would be getting off the island just
[01:29:12] in time in the meantime there were no duties to perform some of them very on there's on the
[01:29:18] in the meantime there were still duties to perform in some of them very unpleasant one of Murdoch's
[01:29:22] responsibility was to record the location of the battle site graves on an overlay it troubled him
[01:29:27] that the locations couldn't always be specifically pin-boinered so there was no so there could be no assurance
[01:29:32] that the bodies would later be found for relocation to permanent cemetery now regarding those bodies
[01:29:38] year or so go the organization that at locate bodies and get some buried all there and
[01:29:46] they're in hoi and on lilloo and they ran out of money but they were going to pay for me go down
[01:29:53] and help them locate these bodies we're talking about but the guy that he was he was a doctorate
[01:30:01] and he says I just I just ran out of legal room money wise couldn't do it
[01:30:10] so finally this is last year wow yeah well maybe we can raise some money for him
[01:30:20] this was a call cheap back and then it's now a new name they probably might say they were missed missed
[01:30:25] they were missed missed they were missed handling money there's many money where they shouldn't have
[01:30:31] been so a lot of those going on you probably heard about and then the new secretary fan came
[01:30:37] down he did he just changed the whole thing around so we wrapped this up the section on January
[01:30:49] on 31 January the one eight and the entire second regiment boarded the troop transport crescent city
[01:30:55] and then during the first week of February the Japanese managed to evacuate more than 11,000 troops
[01:31:00] a minor triumph that did little to offset the magnets you do there to feet they lost upward of 25,000 men
[01:31:07] in Guadalcanal campaign of these maybe a thousand were taken prisoner our losses were comparatively small
[01:31:13] according to army historians about 1600 were killed and 4,245 were wounded on nine February the
[01:31:21] rest of the eighth Marines left Guadalcanal on board the troop ship hunter ligate at American
[01:31:26] Legion that same day Guadalcanal was declared secure one way or another for the living and the dead
[01:31:35] the fighting on Guadalcanal was over forever
[01:31:37] so your next chapter here is called heaven yeah because from the hell of Guadalcanal you went to
[01:31:54] a place called New Zealand and this was quite the change for you all going from Guadalcanal
[01:32:01] to New Zealand no longer sweating jungles you you highlight some of the good things about
[01:32:09] New Zealand and then then you get to what apparently is the biggest highlight in New Zealand
[01:32:14] it says this there were girls holy smokes whether they're all gone but they were
[01:32:20] they were welcome here so for no because they're men were overfighting because they were
[01:32:25] in North Africa young girls pretty girls smiling girls they were everywhere lots of them
[01:32:31] my girl my girlfriend was 19 and not here I was I was approaching 23 he 22 she's still alive she's
[01:32:38] 95 no wow can you imagine they stared at us and we stared at them and they smiled at us
[01:32:45] and we smiled at them and in many instances we greeted each other and exchange pleasantries
[01:32:50] and actually conversed with them even the castanovas among us had a hard gov at at first
[01:32:56] it had been a long time since we had spoken with girls we were out of practice we were also
[01:33:00] gasey is the term you use staring inward a thousand yards back into our heads flashing on our
[01:33:05] thoughts and visions of Guadalcanal put in there our faces and what do you have for that
[01:33:13] just be just yeah just remembering yeah
[01:33:15] the contrast was immediately apparent profoundly jarring we had learned how to handle hell
[01:33:22] but heaven would take some getting used to a board ship we we hadn't been aware of our gasey
[01:33:27] conditioned we all seem normal to each other but here in this beautiful city among these wonderful
[01:33:33] civilized people among all those pretty girls it was possible to see how far from normal we were
[01:33:38] what would they think of us they loved us and we loved them right back so you guys I mean you
[01:33:48] do talk about some of the things that happened there and some of those adjustments getting into it
[01:33:53] and and then the kind of I guess the kind of mayhem and chaos that you were more dark himself
[01:33:59] he there's one story about where where he come barging barging into the owner the woman owner
[01:34:06] the hotel where our her officers mess where the get together was and it tells about it in there
[01:34:15] yeah anyway he comes he called he crawled he was drunk no clothes on I guess and crawled along an
[01:34:23] edge and then wrapped on the window and she opened it up that I mean he ended up going then next morning
[01:34:29] woke up here's with us older woman and oh my gosh yes she says something like you know good
[01:34:38] morning he says did I have a good time or something like that but she said yes you did
[01:34:44] sounded like he she he was avoiding her for the rest of the time yeah yeah you
[01:34:51] all right to get back to the military side of this after a few weeks new Zealand we started
[01:34:57] training in earnest we we needed a lot of training both to get ourselves back into shape and incorporate
[01:35:02] replacements who are streaming in from the states our experience on Guadalcanal provided the template
[01:35:07] for our training we built positions on the Japanese model and practiced attacking them we advanced
[01:35:13] through wooded areas against simulated sniper attacks we worked on the use of supporting fires
[01:35:17] and we worked with tanks one of the most important changes overall was to give the squad leaders
[01:35:23] more freedom of action to make decisions in combat let them decide on their own how to maneuver
[01:35:28] their men and move around to develop and any members I'm sure there's no room for maneuver
[01:35:37] no no no chance to use tanks but it's interesting you know we we talk a lot about
[01:35:44] kind of the principles of combat leadership and one of the most important principles of combat
[01:35:47] leadership is decentralized command and that is allowing your support and leaders to lead and that
[01:35:52] right there even the private say even a private say come on guys this going he pull them together
[01:35:57] let's go yeah and and you that's obviously you're taking that lesson that's it then you say
[01:36:02] that's a change overall yeah you guys even you all realized hey we need our frontline troops to
[01:36:07] be able to lead yeah yeah I mentioned that when I I spoken to Marine Corps League you know
[01:36:13] the Marine Corps birthday balls know that and I mentioned that leadership aspect
[01:36:18] you're written books about two I know I have it's one of the things I talk about all the time
[01:36:23] oh yeah and when I taught leadership inside the steel teams that's one of the main things I
[01:36:27] needed the young troopers to do who you would have been a disaster that had happened yeah
[01:36:35] so fast forward a bit through the you talk some more about that training and what it's like
[01:36:40] in New Zealand and the continues on and then finally we get to this I'm not going to say that
[01:36:45] we knew we were leaving for good but many sense this might be the case so did everyone in Wellington
[01:36:50] the girls especially just before our ships cast off again for Hawks Bay a number of girls some
[01:36:55] hugely pregnant came down to the docks to find out what was going on nobody could or would tell them anything
[01:37:02] but many had dire for it nobody knew you guys didn't even know we did had no no never clue
[01:37:07] without we're going another another another land here exercise our ship steam north past Hawks Bay
[01:37:13] continued on a northern league yet after a few days it's he was announced that we were going to
[01:37:17] invade the Taroa toll in the Gilbert Islands maps and sand tables were brought it out one square mile
[01:37:24] one square mile our sudden permanent disappearance from New Zealand was very hard on our Kiwi
[01:37:31] girlfriends and wives one day they woke up to find us gone a new year head into battle
[01:37:37] then towards the end of November they started hearing rumors that a lot of us had been killed
[01:37:43] the rumors proved to be true yeah we lost over eleven hundred killed and twenty five hundred
[01:37:53] wounded in three days most of them two days so you get to Taroa and here we are the navy promised
[01:38:03] us a preliminary build bombardment that would blow the Japanese and their defenses to kingdom come
[01:38:08] leaving the Marines to carry out what would amount to little more than a mopping up operation
[01:38:13] during a pre invasion staff briefing an admiral announced that it was not the navy's intention
[01:38:19] merely to neutralize ratio island gentlemen he told me assemblage we will obliterate it
[01:38:26] this statement was passed on to rank and file and we believed it at the same briefing a battle ship
[01:38:31] captain declared we are going to bombard at six thousand yards we've got so much armor
[01:38:36] we're not afraid of anything the japs control back at us the commander of the second marine
[01:38:41] division major general julian c-smith was in sense to buy the captains brave words gentlemen
[01:38:46] he retorted remember one thing when the Marines land and meet the enemy at bay net point
[01:38:51] the only armor a marine will have is his khaki shirt it is unbelievable though when you see
[01:38:58] the bombardment you can see film of the bombardment at Taroa i mean they just look like it was just
[01:39:02] obliterators right and i had i had a situation where my guys in the battle of ramaati
[01:39:12] got caught in a friendly fire situation and you were there ramaati yep and uh an army unit that
[01:39:20] we had called for qrf came in and put about 150 rounds of 50 caliber machine gun fire into the building
[01:39:28] that my guys were in at a range of about 25 meters 150 rounds and you you would think anybody
[01:39:36] that's seen a 50 caliber machine gun you'd think everyone in that building would be dead but
[01:39:41] what i'd one guy get wounded it wasn't actually all that bad and so when you see the the that's
[01:39:48] why you can never trust that you know big bombs are going to actually solve the problem it doesn't
[01:39:54] always happen and this is a classic example of that and the main reason that naval gun fire
[01:39:59] wasn't wasn't all that effective is that we're just only you know the land was only about six
[01:40:04] foot above sea level so things you must have just gone over if you hit there it's just such a narrow
[01:40:11] target and they what you should have done is landed on a adjacent island and pounded it with
[01:40:19] what the way mortars are you know a sharp rain artillery safe fire and that's what they did and that's
[01:40:24] what they did in the marshals they made all difference their world less and learn to no much later
[01:40:29] so you say this it's tough going right from the start the Japanese are heavily armed firmly and deeply
[01:40:33] entrenched and as always they've resist fiercely infecting heavy uh inflicting heavy casualties
[01:40:38] on our assault teams the radio reports start coming in their spotty and intermittent but we get the
[01:40:43] picture encountering heavy resistance heavy machine gun fire boats destroyed units scattered
[01:40:48] many casualties the voices on the loudspeakers are numerate these calamities and measured tones
[01:40:53] they sound calm almost attached if you if you didn't know better you'd think the situation wasn't too
[01:40:59] terrible but we knew better we were all looking at each other thinking some version of oh boy this is bad
[01:41:05] this is really bad the tides the tides which were supposed to cover the reef to an adequate depth
[01:41:13] proved uncooperative the waters too shallow just inches and just inches deep in some spots
[01:41:18] and always less than needed for the three foot draft of the landing craft see the problem
[01:41:23] was that there was just barely three feet what we require for now CBP to clear the reef
[01:41:30] but we got hung up with their big guns their their big naval guns shooting under
[01:41:35] transports so our transports had to move further out that means the all landing craft took a
[01:41:40] lot longer to get in and the meantime the tide was going out now we didn't have three feet
[01:41:47] not only that it was the kind of a tide that was extra low so you you were actually
[01:41:54] part of the reserve element is that is that the right we were going what you were doing the one
[01:41:59] out the the battalion on him was going to was supposed to land on the next island up
[01:42:03] instead hey oh we need to write down here in real and unright the middle where the worst of
[01:42:10] it was so here here we had our guys on the beach and here here the enemy should know where
[01:42:16] they're head right at us out there we could do anything but yeah terrible so just for folks
[01:42:25] they don't understand what you just said you've got marines on the beach on the beach looking at us
[01:42:31] Washington's being mowed down and you're at sea and we can't shoot back you can't shoot because
[01:42:35] now there's friendly forces in between you two just and like you said the sea level is only
[01:42:40] are the altitude only six feet and not only that there was one beach to have a British transport
[01:42:48] and it was beach it it had been run before we landed there sometime before about time before
[01:42:53] our work and run up like on on the reef and just was still there while the Japanese swam up to it
[01:43:00] with the machine guns they fired flying in fire right on us so all this is happening and you
[01:43:08] run the reserves and finally you guys are told all right load your boats which means you guys
[01:43:13] now know you're going in and you say here we don't know whether the brass is setting us yet but we
[01:43:17] don't expect to go where the fighting is hottest and we expect to go soon we circle and circle
[01:43:23] in the lagoon we're standing in the boat either leaning against the sides or holding on them
[01:43:27] for balance in general we have a soft ride because the water is mostly still except for the
[01:43:31] turbulence caused by all the boats the turbulence buffets the LCVPs and this movement combined
[01:43:37] with the stench of the engine and the nervous tension we all feel makes many of a sick some of the sick
[01:43:43] men some of the sick men stick their heads over the sides to stretch while there's puke into the
[01:43:48] wooden deck the men standing next to them just step aside like it's no big deal to get sick
[01:43:53] because it really isn't a big deal when the men when the sick men finish wretched they straighten
[01:43:57] up as if nothing had happened no one thinks the worst of them for it after a while depending on how
[01:44:03] long we're out there in the boat the deck might be slippery with puke but that's no big deal either
[01:44:07] you can't smell the vomit or anything else for that matter because the exhaust fumes overpower
[01:44:12] every other smell diesel engine help the minutes go by lengthening into hours the hours go by
[01:44:19] but we're going nowhere we're just going around and around the sounds of battle are muted this far out
[01:44:25] we can hear artillery explosions but not small arms fire we're all peering over the sides looking
[01:44:30] abysio looking at the fires and the smoke and the explosions it's an awesome sight a massive smoke and
[01:44:35] flames holy Moses look at that we say not for the last time we ask ourselves how many of the
[01:44:41] defenders how the defenders could survive in a place so torn up it's an irrelevant question really
[01:44:46] many Japanese have survived and they're killing them but have them survived we know that a lot of
[01:44:54] our men were killed going in and we know that the men who did make it a sure are fighting for their
[01:45:00] lives we expect we'll have a tough go of it to wear apprehensive who wouldn't be and we're wondering
[01:45:05] how we'll behave in combat I know the new guys are especially concerned with how they'll behave
[01:45:10] the great fear the greatest of fear is you won't be able to handle it that you'll turn yellow
[01:45:16] that you'll let your buddies down we fear this much more than we fear getting killed or wounded
[01:45:21] one reason for that is no one really thinks he'll be killed or wounded you never think it's going
[01:45:25] to happen to you never you acknowledge that it could happen to you that it might happen to you
[01:45:31] but the rational part of your brain makes you understand this but in the such circumstances we now
[01:45:36] find ourselves emotion trumps rationality every time we know we're too young to die and somehow
[01:45:42] in a kind of strange and protective twist of logic and feeling we figure that because we're too
[01:45:47] young to die we certainly won't die you've got to do a lot of hard thinking to reach this conclusion
[01:45:53] however and because we're all thinking so hard we're not talking that much just as well
[01:45:58] the engine is so loud you can't talk or hear anyone except the guy standing next to you
[01:46:03] we wait for the word to begin the assault but it doesn't come we continue circling beneath the
[01:46:07] hot sun beneath breathing exhaust fumes staring at the island we want we want to know what for
[01:46:14] Pete's sake is happening we wonder what they're when they're going to send us in and where
[01:46:19] they're going to send us we wonder gosh how much longer can it go all like this a lot longer it
[01:46:24] turns out nightfall one moment in the sun one moment the sun is above the horizon and their sky is
[01:46:31] bright then the sun drops below the horizon in the dark that's how night comes in the
[01:46:35] tropics no twilight this is on the on-hequator you see yeah boom it's gone yeah it's bright one moment
[01:46:41] dark the next beijo isn't dark however beijo is on fire and the sky above it glowing red suddenly
[01:46:48] it's morning see the problem is that the top command thought we'd already landed and really there was
[01:46:55] just a lack there was all communications were disrupted so you guys are out there for so they didn't
[01:47:01] know we're out there still circling didn't know it how much fuel does things have because you're
[01:47:06] out there for twenty hours oh twenty hours yeah amazing not horrible yeah that's usually
[01:47:15] Sunday it's morning the sun pops over the horizon and then there was light we're still
[01:47:18] circling waiting for orders base you always still burning I was wondering how our boat can carry
[01:47:22] enough fuel to circle how long is it 12 14 16 hours answer we float we were float for about 20 hours
[01:47:29] our mouths dry our muscle stiff we feel haggard and cruddy some guys are sipping from their
[01:47:34] cantines or nibbling on the rations although there's not much eating because we just aren't hungry
[01:47:40] about five zero five thirty the LCVBA LCVP carrying our batai commander major major
[01:47:46] warranties chugs along up next to our boat cupping his hands around his mouth and shouting to
[01:47:51] make himself heard above the noise of the boat engines he says we're going in at red beach too oh no
[01:47:57] and what what why was that why was that a bad thing we knew that that probably
[01:48:01] some way we knew that that was where they haven't heard this time was on that beach
[01:48:07] still shouting major haze assures us that red too won't be a problem the Japanese positions
[01:48:13] on the beach have been eliminated he tells us and our landing will be unopposed you'll probably
[01:48:18] go in standing up he actually said that so you said in the book he actually said I guess we were
[01:48:23] completely surprised thinking back we were none of us really believed we'd go in standing up now
[01:48:30] not that we think meet major haze is feeding us a line he's a good man he wouldn't do that
[01:48:35] but it could be that he has been misinformed uninformed is more likely more like it totally
[01:48:41] uninformed communications with the units ashore or deseray and several instances functionally
[01:48:47] not existed the same goes for communications with general smith and his staff on the battle
[01:48:51] ship Maryland the invasions fleet flagship this is doing large but charged measure to failure
[01:48:57] of our radios which are too fragile to withstand the rigors of amphibious assault
[01:49:02] I've got a walking talking strapped over my shoulder and it's a hunk of joke hunk of junk
[01:49:07] I can't even communicate with the other boats which is why major haze had to come by in
[01:49:12] but that's true what was that what was the fucking dog is what we're doing any good now the
[01:49:17] officer in charge a red two at that time was Colonel Schupe the 10 of Colonel Schupe he became the
[01:49:24] combatant later on years later in any event we're relieved the waiting is almost over the business
[01:49:31] of riding around in boats is for the birds we want to get ashore and throw some punches I'm
[01:49:36] standing in the battle of our LCVP behind me are 32 marines of my pertune most of them teenagers
[01:49:41] most of them new to combat I look at them and they look at me I see fresh boyace facias
[01:49:46] and wide-wired eyes staring out from beneath their brain their helmet brims their helmets
[01:49:54] all seem a size too big accentuating their boyish making them look young as well most of them
[01:50:00] really are their helmets jammed down on their heads the straps pulled tight under their chin you
[01:50:06] can wear helmets this way so they don't fall off while you're clamoring down the cargo nets of
[01:50:10] the troop transport into your boat the helmet is nothing more than a steel pot heavy and getting
[01:50:14] heavier the longer you wear it if it falls off all you're on that net it could hit somebody beneath
[01:50:18] you somebody could get hurt and that's when and that's not when marines are supposed to get hurt
[01:50:23] not during the boating phase as it's called the phase of the operation when the emphasis is on
[01:50:28] safety the getting hurt part the part where safety is one might say beside the point comes later
[01:50:34] for us for me in the men in my boat that part comes now
[01:50:38] did I say men well I suppose they are we call them men we treat them as men we expect them to act
[01:50:46] like men they are after all united states marines but really their kids just out of high school
[01:50:53] or not even that kids with rifles true kids trained to kill also true but kids never the last
[01:50:58] just turn 17 many of them to use a term like that as long since fallen into general disuse their
[01:51:07] youths a state of being between childhood and adulthood today's american mail at exercising
[01:51:14] a lifestyle choice can often can and often does loiter for many years in that state but in the
[01:51:19] mid-1940s in a world at war the state of youth tends to pass swiftly and do any disayet violently
[01:51:28] the youth the kids on my boat have got a lot of growing up to do unfortunately they'll be
[01:51:33] doing a hefty portion of that growing up in the coming minutes and hours in that period
[01:51:40] far too many will undergrow all the growing up they will ever experience
[01:51:47] these are the men that went in and I have a WRK written on all the casualties in this picture
[01:51:56] and roughly half half her casualties going in
[01:52:08] in that period
[01:52:12] the youths the kids on my boat have got a lot of growing up to do unfortunately they'll be
[01:52:17] doing a hefty portion of that growing up in the coming minutes and hours in that period many
[01:52:22] far too many will undergrow all the growing up they will ever experience they will transition
[01:52:28] with almost obscene dispatch from youth to adulthood to the grave
[01:52:34] a beggio youth won't be served it will be served up and consumed literally in fire these youths will be
[01:52:41] men only briefly and then they will be just a memory forever all of this sounds as if i'm a
[01:52:50] grizzled veteran i am a combat veteran i fought in Guadalcanal earlier this year but the fact is i'm
[01:52:56] just 23 years old still young and not all that grizzled in appearance or temperament practically
[01:53:01] speaking though i'm the graveyard of this bunch same goes for the platoon sergeant who's about my age
[01:53:08] where the tribal elders the warrior chiefs i'll lead my boys off the boat and the platoon sergeant
[01:53:13] standing in the back will make sure they follow urging them and conjolling them yelling at them
[01:53:19] maybe throwing a few choice cuss words whatever it takes to get them moving i'm watching my
[01:53:24] boys as they watch me things begin to happen fast with the majors lzvp leading the way our boats
[01:53:31] break formation one after the other and file off to our departure line this is an invisible line
[01:53:39] about 6,000 yards offshore that runs parallel to the landing beaches when we get there our boats are
[01:53:44] form up all the inline abreast arrayed like a cavalry squadron waiting for the bugle to sound
[01:53:50] charge the coxons rev and gun the engines in neutral gear and the boats are rearing and
[01:53:54] lurching trump charting at the bit it's as if the coxons are struggling to rain in war horses
[01:54:00] that can't contain their eagerness for battle our boats engine is blasting the noise almost painful
[01:54:05] to the years we're pumped up my men i and i i we're really pumped up the adrenaline is flowing
[01:54:11] surging through us clutching our weapons looking over the side of the boat at the island breathing
[01:54:15] hard thinking fast focused on the tastered hand stealing ourselves getting ready ready ready
[01:54:22] here we go the signal is given our coxons shifts out of neutral pushes us all over the light brigade
[01:54:28] but thinking right there yes yes and repeating repeating verbs as well you see
[01:54:37] oh i'm ready ready ready ready ready ready ready ready ready yeah ready yeah
[01:54:43] little literary yeah little little literary so that's that's that's that's the thank you behind
[01:54:48] tip of the hat yeah here we go the signal is given our coxons shifts out of neutral pushes the throttle
[01:54:55] wide open the engine bellows betch's belch's smoke the stern dips the men in the boat rock
[01:55:00] back slightly as the boat leaps forward now we're barreling toward the island our boat all the
[01:55:05] boat 600 men more less of the first battalion eight marines water churning boiling behind the boat
[01:55:13] we're bucketing and bouncing bullying ahead with our squared off bow musseling the water aside
[01:55:18] the boat is throwing spray soaking us and we're getting closer closer to the island
[01:55:24] we're about 800 yards from the shore when zip zip zip we hear tiny objects flying past
[01:55:29] and those aren't hornets boys their bullets we're in the range of the Japanese machine guns
[01:55:34] and good gosh they're shooting at us we find this interesting bullets zipping by
[01:55:40] splatting on the water surface splash splat here splat there splats to the left and right
[01:55:45] splats in front of us look by golly there's some enemy fire hitting right over there look over there
[01:55:51] that's me talking that's all of us talking talking and pointing at the impact circles in the water
[01:55:56] little splats little dots where bullets hit people shooting at us fascinating
[01:56:01] realizing that we could get our head shot off we ducked down and ducked down into the boat
[01:56:06] the more bullets splatting into the water but none hit our LCVP we tell ourselves that those are
[01:56:12] that most are 7.7 millimeter slugs which is what your basic light Japanese machine gun fires
[01:56:18] and are nothing really much to worry about because they're too small to pierce even the thin
[01:56:22] skined higgins boat that's what we tell ourselves all right but we really don't believe it
[01:56:28] we know good and well that the Japanese are also shooting at at us with heavier automatic weapon weapons
[01:56:33] big 13 millimeter machine guns and the even bigger dual purpose anti boat anti aircraft guns
[01:56:39] which range in size from 37 millimeter to 77 millimeter and they're lobbying shells from 70
[01:56:45] millimeter mountain howwitsers these weapons can and do inflict considerable damage on our
[01:56:52] salt teams killing and wounded hunting hundreds of them disabling or destroying many amtrax and
[01:56:58] LCVPs they're not my conceife concern however and never mind that they might at any second
[01:57:04] blow us to eternity what really bugs me is being hunkered down in this boat where I can't see anything
[01:57:09] I can't see where we are where we're going where we should be I can't observe the enemy fire
[01:57:14] engage resistance we're likely to encounter I feel as if I'm going into battle blindfolded
[01:57:19] this really stinks how can I do my job if I can't see anything how can I be sure the
[01:57:23] coxin is taking us to the right place my men what are they thinking they're watching me
[01:57:29] watching to see how I'm bearing up well I'm watching them too and for the same reason they look
[01:57:35] okay check that they look grim and resigned but that's good grim and resigned look means they've
[01:57:43] more or less accepted this situation which is also good because the situation isn't going to change
[01:57:47] unless it changes for the worse this whole thing is on the rails it's a runaway train and there's
[01:57:54] nothing going to stop it now if you know this if you accept it you can keep your fear under control
[01:57:59] and if you can keep your fear under control you'll do your job you won't let your buddies down
[01:58:05] so we're doing fine relatively speaking the boat is racing toward the shore when
[01:58:10] crying scraping bottom metal grinding on coral it abruptly stops we're thrown forward cursing
[01:58:17] we've run a ground all along the reef it's the same boat grinding to a halt on base
[01:58:22] yours fringing reef I think what the heck the tide is supposed to be up the water deep enough to
[01:58:28] allow the LCVPs to clear the reef we're 600 yards from the shore 600 long yards this just cannot be
[01:58:35] wrong it can be it is though we're not aware of it where victims of the same disagreeable
[01:58:45] title conditions that fouled up yesterday's landings this is as far as we go our cox and yells
[01:58:50] we're going on mode his passengers are not happy there are exclamations of astonishment and protest
[01:58:57] oh shit you gotta be kidding but he's not kidding yeah this is far as we go here repeats we're hung up
[01:59:02] we've hit the reef you gotta get out here then he works the controls that release the cables that
[01:59:07] hold the ramp up the cables which are still strong along the sides of the whole unwind with a
[01:59:13] macaalic metallic rasp the ramp screeches as it opens drops splashes into the water and there
[01:59:20] before us is basio in all its hideous glory not to exaggerate or overdramatize but it is a scene
[01:59:29] from hell i mean one second we're looking at this slab of a metal ramp then the ramp drops and
[01:59:34] we're looking at it in furno fire and smoke fill our bit frame of vision frame by the sides of the
[01:59:40] bottom and the bottom of the boat orange fire red fire and black black smoke the fire is shooting
[01:59:46] up the smoke is rolling curling climbing is fast and high the sky isn't high enough to contain it
[01:59:54] you think we were looking at a volcano being born you wonder what could produce so much smoke
[02:00:00] surely by now everything on basio that can burn has burned so where's all that smoke coming from
[02:00:06] from the bowels of the earth it would seem from somewhere deep underground under the ocean
[02:00:11] from the ever ever blazing furnaces of the world unless not forget the explosions there are a lot of
[02:00:17] them explosions here they're everywhere fire and fire balls tongues of flame crimson and yellow flashes in
[02:00:23] the smoke the time is 0-615 and some 600 marines are about to be launched or rather launch
[02:00:29] themselves at basio codenamed Helen i'm at the front of the boat the lieutenant the platoon leader
[02:00:37] time for me to lead a few seconds go by i was a few seconds ago i was deploying the limited
[02:00:45] protection offered by the thin metal ramp now i'm deploying the lack of that limited protection
[02:00:50] it was after all better than nothing which is what i've got now i kind of feel sick and i'm thinking
[02:00:58] god why am i in this mess what am i doing here but i'm resigned to the situation i've got to
[02:01:03] write it out no matter what happens no turning back now so the ramp hits the water and i run down
[02:01:12] the ramp clutching my m1 carbine waving my guys forward shouting let's go i sense that my
[02:01:17] manner hesitating by the pain no attention to them i jump into the water not knowing how deep it'll
[02:01:21] be thinking that i might jump into a shell hole and go all the way under but i land on coral and sand
[02:01:27] solid footing that's only five deep water relief and the water feels good that incredibly is my
[02:01:32] first thought the water feels good it's calm and warm like bath water almost soothing a pleasant
[02:01:38] contrast to the still cool morning air it's murky though sand and coral all stirred up beneath the
[02:01:44] surface none of that crystalline purity that comes to mind when you picture a tropical lagoon
[02:01:50] war comes to paradise and literally fouls it up i look sure word only 600 yards to go
[02:01:59] now the fellow that reached down and pulled me up over the ramp here a few months ago
[02:02:15] we ran across a photograph of him and what did it look like and a little bit of reference to
[02:02:23] his family but never never made a contact now this is as of within six months or so ago
[02:02:33] so this is and nobody and nobody else i talked to really knew who this guy was he was new to the
[02:02:40] outfit he was the sergeant he was new so but nobody knew him at reunions didn't know him
[02:02:46] so you look out there's six hundred and he and he and I were being lifted up by the
[02:02:55] by the transport and a bat sabisid and a basket and remote and says it just as we were okay
[02:03:03] just about up from the landing boat and in this basket taken a reason up to the transport itself
[02:03:12] and i made a comment says looks like looks like we made it his comment was you made it you made it
[02:03:22] and he died so you look down going back to this point when the ramp actually opens and you see you've
[02:03:30] got 600 yards to go and just nothing but machine gun fire and as you said earlier the Japanese
[02:03:37] you'd watch them storm forward without any ability to maneuver just only thing to do with the salt
[02:03:43] and now here you are we are no maneuver in the exact same situation yeah we're in there saving
[02:03:49] in completely at their mercy you say here 600 yards six football fields just under a third of a
[02:03:57] mile if you run that distance on dry land unencumbered and unimposed you'll be gasping at the
[02:04:03] finish line i don't care what kind of shape you're in we're in water and we're wearing and
[02:04:07] carrying 60 pounds or more of gear and the Japanese are ripping us apart they've got an absolutely
[02:04:13] clear field of fire and we have to walk straight into it when i returned and i looked i went
[02:04:19] clear out there where i was hit and walked in and i saw remains of old carbines and so on down in
[02:04:25] the sand we've got a walk not run because we're in the water remember walk slowly because we
[02:04:36] can't run we can't even walk fast the marines are the world's experts in amphibious warfare the
[02:04:42] core has been training for the past two decades to assault an established beach head on a hostile
[02:04:47] shore it has developed complex doctrines to guide us in such endeavors at bayjio on 21 November
[02:04:53] 1943 all that training in doctrine doctrine has come to this we step out of our LCVPs into shallow
[02:04:59] water and walk slowly across 600 yards with absolutely no cover whatsoever to make a frontal assault
[02:05:06] on heavily fortified and defended enemy positions on my website just go to it by my name just
[02:05:16] Dean Lad there is a poem in here called curtains of fire and it goes in a great detail similar
[02:05:23] kind of words but done done a little differently and it's so that's where that's where it's all spilled out
[02:05:34] you you say some training in some doctrine that they've been working on that's your quote
[02:05:38] we cannot believe the volume of fire that's coming from the island the air is just filled with bullets
[02:05:44] we can't see them but we can see where they hit splat splat splat like raime drops dotting the
[02:05:50] water dot pattern sweeping back and forth across our line curtains a curtain of fire it's called
[02:05:56] curtain of fire passing over us through us yeah I realize oh my god the Japanese have got this
[02:06:02] reef zeroed in which means they don't even have to aim their machine guns they just lock the guns
[02:06:07] to a predetermined setting and traverse the barrel left and right left and right just a lot
[02:06:12] along the reef like shooting a fish in a barrel yeah yeah major haze was right he said we'd be going
[02:06:19] in standing up and that's what we're doing not that we want to there's no other way no place to run
[02:06:24] no place to hide some men crowds in the water they watch the bullet patterns the curtains trying
[02:06:29] to figure out when the curtain will sweep over them it's all a matter of timing they'll duck
[02:06:33] under water at the right moment to avoid getting shot it would be a good plan if only there were
[02:06:38] two if only there were one or two machine guns firing at them but there are many many machine
[02:06:42] guns firing creating multiple curtains that meet and intermingle an overlap and crisscross
[02:06:47] yeah bullets are flying every which way worse the guns are aimed to fire just inches above the
[02:06:53] surface so if you crouch with your head just above the water you're likely to get your head drilled
[02:06:59] might as well stand up that way you'll get shot the chest or stomach which is usually fatal
[02:07:04] instead of to the head which is almost always fatal also if you're crouching in the water you're
[02:07:10] not moving and if you're not moving your stationary target and your easier to shoot you have to
[02:07:15] keep moving you have to get to shore get a shore or die and the whole thing orders were don't
[02:07:21] stop to help anybody everybody's going to get killed just you get sure stuff in my man that's
[02:07:29] stop to help me violate those orders that told him don't wait for me go on no they they just took
[02:07:36] a stick around walking straight into curtains of machine gun fires not something that comes naturally
[02:07:44] your instinct's oppose it every fiber of your beam being seems screams in protest resisting
[02:07:51] telling you no way it hell am I going to do that that's why when I glance over my shoulder to see
[02:07:57] how my man are doing I see that I haven't that many haven't left the boat a few most likely those
[02:08:03] that are just next to me in the boat are in the water but the others are bunched up at the top of
[02:08:06] the ramp all tensed up to take the plunge but hesitating unable to make themselves move I can't
[02:08:13] blame themselves for hanging back but I can't allow it for one thing they make a big fat target
[02:08:19] standing they're crowded together at the front of the boat they've got to get into the water
[02:08:23] and disperse before the Japanese machine guns find them and wipe them out with a couple well place
[02:08:27] purse but more important they've got a job to do they've got to get off the boat get a sure
[02:08:32] and fight and kill Japanese I gesture them and shout come on guys let's go get moving move out
[02:08:38] they obey me they get moving they're good men the best they charge down the ramp jump
[02:08:46] feet first in the water start waiting toward the shore and that's when the slaughter really begins
[02:08:51] right away the men around me my men are taking hits and falling I'm very aware of this
[02:08:57] I'm hearing cries for help cries for corpsmen the wounded are calling out corpsmen corpsmen I'm
[02:09:01] hit I'm hit over here they're calling out as loud as they can I see men going under
[02:09:06] often for the last time what do I do I keep moving forward that's what cries for help everywhere
[02:09:13] and I ignore them I have to you get hot you get hit you just have to keep going you have to
[02:09:18] cope with it yourself do the best you can hope for the best the sounds of battle are everywhere
[02:09:24] there are those sweeping slashing curtains of fire dozens of machine guns rattling a
[02:09:29] a cacophony of staccato hammering artillery shells exploding in the water splashing throwing up
[02:09:37] washing gaizers of water and human body parts and most especially most memory the shouts and
[02:09:43] screams of the wounded in the dying oh god I'm hit corpsmen over here corpsmen help me help me please
[02:09:52] manner dropping everywhere to the left and right me falling and sinking into the water going
[02:09:56] under some men don't cry out hardly make a sound when they're hit the bullet or bullets
[02:10:01] thump into them they grunt and they're gone we're not permitted to help them the corpsmen can
[02:10:06] come to the raid but but not the rest of us our orders are to move on to get to shore as fast as we can
[02:10:12] if we stop the help the wounded will get shot too and we won't make it to the beach where we're
[02:10:17] needed so we keep waiting forward my men my men from other boats the entire battalion what's
[02:10:24] left of it struggling through the water holding the rifles over their heads pushing through
[02:10:28] toward the beach and into the teeth of all that infillating gunfire they're courage is incredible
[02:10:34] that world only begins to describe it insulating from that beach to British transport or ship
[02:10:44] crossfire you guys are it yeah shells exploding washing gaizers machine guns rattling
[02:10:52] splat splat splat those little dots in the water thousands of them moving this way and that
[02:10:56] a bullet hits four feet to my right splat splat then bullets hit three feet two foot one foot to my
[02:11:02] right sure do hope they skip over me and they do this time splat they begin hitting to my left one
[02:11:07] foot two foot three foot and so on I got lucky I literally dodged the bullet several bullets how
[02:11:13] long will my luck hold I can't see any muzzle flashes from the enemy guns the Japanese are invisible
[02:11:18] just like their bullets we're being slaughtered by an invisible force nothing to see nothing to shoot at
[02:11:25] not that we would be shooting if we could see them you don't stand an open water shooting at the
[02:11:29] enemy you get yourself to the beach you take cover and then you start shooting anyway my weapon
[02:11:34] isn't good for shooting at long and medium ranges for that matter it's not much good at close range
[02:11:40] either it's an m1 carbine a pathetic excuse for a fire arm a weakling with a weakling punch
[02:11:46] I'm holding it at port arms across my chest as I weigh through the water maybe there'll be a stop
[02:11:50] maybe there'll be a maybe it will stop a bullet that would otherwise kill me that's about all the
[02:11:55] good it can do me I walk on pushing forward straining to move faster the water drag me at my thighs
[02:12:01] no one ever said a speed rucker record running in five deep water I've gone about 100 yards only
[02:12:09] 500 yards to go we're taking fire from the front from both flanks from the rear
[02:12:17] the rear what the hell and that's what you talk about that's the that's the uh
[02:12:21] uh sunken ship that's out there and there's well no no there are planes here now our planes
[02:12:27] are coming in and strapping and we wonder what is going on of this when they were they were
[02:12:32] strapping that ship I returned to the task at hand keep moving to the shore how long has
[02:12:41] this been going on how long have been out here in the water I can't say I have no sense of time
[02:12:45] everything is moving in slow motion second seems to last minutes minute seemed to last hours
[02:12:50] it just keeps going on and on every moment is intense filled with intense thoughts emotions actions
[02:12:56] I'm thinking how can I protect myself how can I protect my men someone screams another one of my
[02:13:01] men is hit and another and another help corpsman some are killed outright some are wounded
[02:13:06] some are well it's hard to say some go quietly some noisely they fall back in the water they
[02:13:12] slip onto the water some flail in the water and they're paying in panic howling and shouting
[02:13:16] I keep moving my adrenaline is flowing like an electric current through me allowing me to do things
[02:13:22] I wouldn't normally and shouldn't normally do if I stop to think about what I'm doing I'd freeze up
[02:13:27] I try to track the bullets the movement in patterns of the enemy's traversing fire the bullets
[02:13:32] impact start to my left to my right the bullets sweeping back and forth I see no pattern
[02:13:37] or rather I see too many patterns splat splat splat everywhere it's like the enemy throwing
[02:13:41] thousands and thousands of stones at us a pattern of splats in the water comes towards me from the right
[02:13:47] sweeps pass me continue to the left I don't hear the crack of the bullets as they zip by
[02:13:51] its supersonic speed that's the problem they're not zipping past us they're hitting us they've got
[02:13:56] our range I'm in the impact zone I have to get through it or die I turned to look back at my
[02:14:00] men let's go I call out for the umpteenth time I turn facing this shore then finally it happens
[02:14:07] a sickening splat like an inner tube being snapped across my abdomen slapping my bare stomach a sharp
[02:14:14] staying sensation I'm hit I hear myself say a bullet is struck me nearly dead center below the
[02:14:20] naval piercing me above the water line I'm gut shot one of the worst wounds of all oh god
[02:14:28] I've probably been hit by small caliber machine gun bullet fired from straight ahead on the beach
[02:14:37] it didn't make much of an impact not long enough to knock me off my feet or even stagger me
[02:14:41] later I would learn to tour right through my body piercing my intestines later and goodness it didn't
[02:14:46] hit a bone yeah so it pierced your intestines bladder and sacrum just before that
[02:14:55] and an exited missing my spinal nerve by a quarter of an inch as it is I'll probably
[02:15:04] die in a few minutes I'm scared I think my gosh this is it if it happens that you get shot
[02:15:11] and you don't know how bad the wound it often happens that you get shot you don't know how bad
[02:15:14] the wound is but when you're hit where I was hit you know it's bad it's a gut wound and you
[02:15:20] know it's pretty sure thing you're not going to make it very few people survive gut wounds even in the
[02:15:26] best of circumstances I'm in what are arguably the worst of circumstances if I had been shot on
[02:15:33] try land I might be able to crawl to an aid station or my buddies might have passed me up but I'm
[02:15:38] in a lagoon so there can be no crawling and my buddies are forbidden to help me it goes without saying
[02:15:43] that there are no aid stations close by I can try to reach our LCVPs on the reef a hundred yards
[02:15:49] behind me but I probably won't make it I'm dying is why I don't my gear into the water off goes my
[02:15:57] pack my helmet my webbing the walkie talkie slung over my shoulder goodbye m1 carbine into the drink
[02:16:02] you go never shot fired an anger it takes just seconds for me to shock my equipment in those seconds
[02:16:07] I lose most of my strength after a few more seconds I'm almost too weak to stand it happens that
[02:16:13] fast the energy is draining out of me I'm going into shock the weakness doesn't paralyze me and it
[02:16:18] doesn't come from any place in particular it's an overall sort of feeling that makes me go heavy and
[02:16:23] limp I'm in pain but it's not too bad not yet and I'm not bleeding very much either but I'm
[02:16:29] slipping away no doubt about it my biggest worry now is that I'll collapse sink beneath the surface
[02:16:35] and drown all I want to do is keep my head above water so I won't drown before I die from
[02:16:40] the bullet that reamed through me I know this isn't rational what differences and make how I die
[02:16:45] drowning or dying from getting my inner scrambled by a bullet either way I'm a garner and soon
[02:16:51] but I'm not thinking rationally I'm thinking I've got to keep my head above water period maybe
[02:16:57] 10 seconds have passed since I got shot that is all in that time the man close to me
[02:17:03] PFC Thomas F Sullivan has hastened to my side Lieutenant where are you hitting ass I tell him he pulls
[02:17:09] up my Dungary jacket checks my wound so long as the puttons eight ball a nice guy just a teenager
[02:17:16] but he's got a wild streak he's always getting in a trouble you can bet dollars to donuts when
[02:17:20] he goes on liberty he lays the dick and gets arrested and afterwards spent a few days in the
[02:17:25] brig is punishment this happened in New Zealand before we left for Tarrawer this happens everywhere
[02:17:31] we go it's standard operating procedure for Sullivan you can put you can count on him to kick
[02:17:37] up a road to put him in low key to mat for is I try to never good I know he survives a war oh
[02:17:43] he definitely survives yeah and you're happy that right now he's the kind of guy that's rebellious
[02:17:49] because he's dope diso-bang the orders which the orders are you keep going and he looks at you and
[02:17:54] says no you know I thought as I got her so why why have somebody else die trying to help me
[02:18:00] another guy joins him pft. Duffy also remember my petute and also with Tima Kiddoo does know how to
[02:18:09] fall. When I returned this last time I found out where he was buried. Duffy yeah yeah
[02:18:21] and you even say you'd think you'd be happy that these guys were staying with you but you're actually
[02:18:25] thinking which is what they were disobeying orders and they were gonna lose their lives too.
[02:18:32] And finally they say we're staying with you where do you want us to take you to the beach or to the
[02:18:36] boat and you opt for the boat. Yeah. It takes about 10 minutes to reach the nearest LCVP.
[02:18:45] The boats crowded with other wounded Marines other wounded men are being dragged to the boat by their
[02:18:50] buddies. Evidently Sullivan and Duffy weren't the only one to ignore the order to ignore the wounded.
[02:18:55] The wounded men and the rescuers are clustered in front of the ramp which is about three quarters
[02:19:01] raised. One by one the wounded men are half pushed half flung over the top of the ramp after which
[02:19:06] they rolled down onto the deck my turn comes. The man next to me is that big fellow with the
[02:19:11] ravaged face. His wounded is terrible worse than mine. I motion for him to go before me. He is boosted
[02:19:17] up to the top of the ramp. Sullivan lifts me up. I'm groaning like mad. The pain is getting worse.
[02:19:22] I'm really hurting really bad now. My helpers can't quite get me over the top. I'm limp and heavy.
[02:19:27] A bulky sack of flesh and bone with a hole in it and they just can't manage to raise me high enough.
[02:19:33] That's when the Marine with the ravaged face performs his life saving deed. One army me into the boat.
[02:19:40] How did he do that? He must be in torment from his wound but that didn't stop him from helping me.
[02:19:45] I tumble groaning down onto the dock alongside the man with the ravaged face. The deck is covered
[02:19:52] with the main and wounded men. Their bodies bandages and bloody many writhing and pain.
[02:19:57] Many just groaning just like me. Another wounded man is taking aboard. The ramp is then
[02:20:02] closed and the boat begins to move. The coxon aware that our lives are hanging. The balance
[02:20:07] opens. The throttle wide and soon we're going full tilt racing through the channel in the barrier
[02:20:13] reef toward the Sheridan. This description I think is the best description I've ever heard of
[02:20:23] of that kind of combat. Well, yeah you take a scene of small line. Your line burger is
[02:20:29] he's increasing credible. He does a lot of writing. He worked with
[02:20:35] a guy handed up the Chicago Tribune. He worked with him regarding the army unit that was
[02:20:42] in more or more too. Then he wrote this about the Polish woman that was in the Jewish woman.
[02:20:51] That was survived the time that they were almost killed. It's incredible.
[02:21:00] That's the end of the tunnel of battle for you. Lasted what? 20 minutes? I guess 20 hours
[02:21:14] in 20 minutes because you did the first 20 hours circle around. You give a great account
[02:21:21] from all the people that were there that got interviewed.
[02:21:25] The next time he's pushing in the fighting at taro. It's really all taking place at this sea wall.
[02:21:36] Later on, later on he was in the motorcycle officer in the LA. He's been in accidents and
[02:21:47] shot at it. He hospitalized 20 times. Oh my gosh. Yeah, these guys getting a sure a few
[02:22:02] seconds later, dick steps a sure. This is what you're being loaded down the Sheraton.
[02:22:08] Yes. Momently loaded. He said to himself, well, they ain't going to give me now.
[02:22:12] Then he looked around in his elation evaporated nearby, led dead marine with a Japanese bayonet
[02:22:18] protruding from his chest and three dead Japanese soldiers sprawled around him. Dead bodies were
[02:22:22] everywhere floating in the water, piling up at the waterline, strewn about the beach.
[02:22:26] Guys from the second marine to a landed the day before. Guys from the eighth marine's too.
[02:22:30] And many Japanese, the beach was strewn with rifles as well as bodies and he took one off of the
[02:22:35] dead marine and took the man's ammo clips as well. Now he could fight back. And then another
[02:22:43] guy named Hester, Hester, collected his men and led them back to the sea wall. They found the perfect
[02:22:48] example of taking leadership. This Hester called Big Hester. What happened with him? Well,
[02:22:54] he's able to gather people together and they let go. That's the guy is not how much
[02:23:02] it's on Mars. I say about him. I mean, there were two brothers. One brother was killed. His younger
[02:23:08] brother was killed on Guadalcanel, but the time when I was killed. Well, you start talking here
[02:23:16] about him and Hester and then Murdoch. Yeah. And he said, Hester, they found Murdoch near a wrecked
[02:23:23] damn track in the mad rush to reach the sea wall and jump over it. Duffy somehow got separated
[02:23:27] from the group and they never saw him again. Never saw him. He was killed. The guy that saved
[02:23:32] your life sitting with his back the wall taking a breather dick looked over the cord the shore
[02:23:36] immediately behind Murdoch. The incoming waves washed the dead marines onto the shore and pushed
[02:23:41] them into small piles. It looked like a little mound and at the top of that mound facing the
[02:23:45] sky was Anthony Boyle. His helmet was off in the top of his head. He was shot on the ground.
[02:23:48] On that same oil. A number of years ago, Murdoch, I and another one or two, went to a big
[02:23:55] memorial for him in New York. Overlooking the Hudson. And we had one Lieutenant General
[02:24:04] Boomer was with us and he was one of the spokesman for the fighting in the jury involved in.
[02:24:13] He was a guy and the main guy. So he was there with us. But we had a big ceremony in a big
[02:24:21] Catholic church. We had a parade downtown. So the downtown was a big event. And this is what
[02:24:30] happened to him. That's what happened to him. Is. Yeah. Only seconds before Oboil had been standing
[02:24:37] next to Murdoch period over the world. Then a Japanese bullet took off the top of his head and he fell
[02:24:42] back into John's arm. John created Oboil in his arms for a long moment before laying him gently
[02:24:47] aside. Someone else must have hauled him up to the pile of bodies at the water's edge to get away
[02:24:52] from the wall. During this time, someone from the company passed Dick's position and informed
[02:24:57] that Duffy had been killed. Duffy was a very quiet person. Never talked to him much, but it really
[02:25:01] nice to hear. Dick remembered. He was a little older than the most of us in his earlier mid-20s,
[02:25:09] which made him an old man in our outfit. He was Oboil's best buddy. Now they were both dead
[02:25:15] killed within minutes of each other. For everyone involved Americans, Japanese, there's a peculiar,
[02:25:27] peculiar nasty way to fight a war. The situation favored the defenders, but only two
[02:25:31] appoint battles are won, not by staying in fortifications that are won by attacking. And on
[02:25:36] Baygio, the Marines, we never saw the enemy. Because they were there soon, he had to hear from
[02:25:41] a, from a whole out of a hole somewhere. They had to assault each and every Japanese position,
[02:25:47] making short rushes across open ground through murderous fire. Heavy casualties were the result,
[02:25:52] but ultimately, Japanese casualties were heavier. In fact, almost total. The Japanese would not yield
[02:25:58] because their military ethos forbade it to beat them. You had to kill them. But the Marines
[02:26:03] would not quit, and they could not be stopped. Against the foes, such as the Marines with their
[02:26:09] absolute determination and capability to win, the initial advantages enjoyed by defenders fighting
[02:26:14] from a concealment could have won outcome. A annihilation. Now I have a, I have a book here written
[02:26:21] by one of the Japanese defenders. And I wanted to meet him when I went there and met two other
[02:26:29] Japanese officers. But we never, we never, we never actually able to get together. We were on a
[02:26:35] phone. But the name, the name we were called, I'll see what they called, called Heavenly,
[02:26:44] something rather. They believed that I went to a heaven too. There's a different kind of heaven.
[02:26:50] And they died. Continuant all of this. Yes, yes, a coney shrine for one place.
[02:26:59] OK. You know, the officers, especially, we will be again in the S. Coney shrine.
[02:27:05] And this one officer that I met on Guadalconeo and who I got in a real well, we
[02:27:10] we of course, minor for about 15 years. And talked a lot about the, I learned a lot about their,
[02:27:21] their whole background of their Bouchito code. No, let's talk.
[02:27:25] I've read on this podcast. I've read some of letters that the Kamakaze pilots would write.
[02:27:32] Because they would write a letter before they would go and die. Yeah. And, and there's also,
[02:27:37] there's also talk of how like they would write these letters. But some of them were not writing
[02:27:44] from the heart. Yeah, what? And as they, when they, when they die, sometimes they would cut off their fingernails.
[02:27:50] And that would be sent back. Now, this one, this one, one fellow who had just been killed,
[02:27:55] he was in a go for like hole, who just starting our final drive. And that's where I,
[02:28:01] I got the diary from him and the thousand, whole, a stitched belt. And all that kind of stuff.
[02:28:08] And anyway, I had the, I had a little, little piece of part of a hair that had long to
[02:28:21] think and long to his, his girlfriend or something. Anyway, I just want to send all that back.
[02:28:27] And that, when, when the, when the soldier was killed, the life, and that would have been his wife.
[02:28:33] The wife is supposed to take care of his family. Instead, she had remarried. She felt bad about it.
[02:28:39] When she saw this, saw what he had written, but one of her remarried. What did you understand me?
[02:28:45] Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
[02:28:52] Again, jumping ahead a little bit, because people need to get the books, they can read it for themselves.
[02:28:59] But the casually told was nothing less than catastrophic. The New Zealand, the company,
[02:29:03] had been beefed up into a little more than 200 men to give it an extra punch in the assault.
[02:29:07] 90 were lost, killed, or wounded in the Bayesian Lagoon. In other words, nearly half the company was
[02:29:13] out of action before anyone stepped ashore. The men Murdoch found on the beach were all exhausted.
[02:29:19] And with the terrible look on their face, that's according to Murdoch. But their shocking
[02:29:23] exhaust did not could not concern him. What I was more interested in was who's alive and who I
[02:29:27] have I got. What have I got? To make that assessment, he continued rounding up the guys in the beach
[02:29:34] and taking them back to his area.
[02:29:41] All the wild Vietnamese fire was flailing on the beach, John ignored it. When Anthony
[02:29:44] Oboil was shot and fell into his arms, he wasn't faced. And once he laid Oboil,
[02:29:49] Oboil's twitching body aside, he didn't think about him anymore that day. He didn't have time,
[02:29:54] much less the inclination to grieve for Oboil or to feel horror for the slow,
[02:29:58] hideous way of all of that. See at that point of time, our battalion, especially our company,
[02:30:05] led by Murdoch, were wiping out the last resistance. It was a hard, it was really a
[02:30:16] real determined group fighting there. And that's where we lost right now. One of the people
[02:30:21] that's in this picture here, he got shot by fellow down in a hole like a little spider hole
[02:30:26] where he caught. And up in his gut killed him instantly. He died thinking that he died, thinking that
[02:30:32] I'd be just been killed. I visit his family in Tennessee afterwards and they were still so sad that
[02:30:43] they didn't even want to hear more about it. Didn't even want to talk to me about it. Progress is
[02:30:52] eventually made toward the middle of the day, Bill noticed that seems things seem to be going a
[02:30:56] little bit better for the Marines. They seem to be making some progress. Bulldozers had landed by
[02:31:00] that. And they pushed up against the pillbox entrances, sealing them and intuming the Japanese
[02:31:06] inside. But the flame throwers really did the trick. A flame thrower on. So one of those
[02:31:11] that was inside, I ran into the first time returned, first time I returned to Terala. And he had been
[02:31:18] been in the Navy for many, many years, probably a little over 20 years. And he was in charge of the
[02:31:25] mess area. And then he had been transferred from there to New Guinea just before we landed. That's
[02:31:33] why how he survived. Oh, so he so just before he landed, he had been transferred. Yeah, he had been
[02:31:39] gone. Well, he, you know, maybe a month before some period of time. Right, right. That's the only
[02:31:44] reason. So he wrote that. So now here he is, he returned, same time, I'm idea, and I met him,
[02:31:49] you know. And I showed him the picture of the one, the one, the Japanese soldier that, what they
[02:31:56] do with they put, they put their toll in the, and pull the trigger of the rifle, and point
[02:32:02] it right up there, I've got him out. And he was doing that. And he saw that. And he, the reaction
[02:32:08] from there was already something. It was for you something. And he saw that picture, he says, yeah.
[02:32:14] Yeah, there's been a lot. Man. Here's what here's what Murdoch says as the, as the fighting kind of comes to
[02:32:27] an end. As they get to the end, all of a sudden things began to move. We were moving, but very,
[02:32:33] very slowly like a snail. My guys would go out ahead of me. Then they'd be moving and I'd run up
[02:32:38] with my gang and get behind them. We were all very close. The enemy, a matter of feet, not yards. It
[02:32:43] was small, very slow progress. But it was progress nonetheless. For the first time since they landed
[02:32:48] the day before, the men of B company were advancing and not falling back after each forward push.
[02:32:53] The Japanese meant to fight to the last man, and they were coming ever closer to realizing that
[02:32:57] goal. Marine assault teams mostly add hawk assemblages, destroyed the enemy bunkers one after
[02:33:02] another, killing the Japanese while they're inside, or when they ran out, the Japanese were
[02:33:07] literally slain in heaps, as their numbers were reduced, so as the volume and intensity of their
[02:33:12] fire. Finally, when John and his men in advance as far as they could, the battle just sort of
[02:33:18] Petered out. The shooting stopped bringing silence to their sector of the battlefield and leaving
[02:33:22] everyone stunned by the abrupt end to the fighting. They didn't know quite what to do, we just kind of
[02:33:28] sat there and did nothing. The next day, first battalion marched over to the pier where the LCVB
[02:33:37] waited to take them back to the Sheridan. On their way, they witnessed a dual flag raising ceremony
[02:33:44] for the stars and stripes in the British Union Jack with a representative from his Majesty's
[02:33:48] government presiding. The stars and stripes went up first, but the Union Jack was given the place
[02:33:53] of pride and honor on a higher pole and acknowledgement of the British sovereignty over the Taroa
[02:33:58] toll. There were some muddled complaints for the men of the one eight, but not much.
[02:34:03] Most just smiled grimly and shook their heads. Great Britain may have held the title to Bejio,
[02:34:10] but the Marine Corps truly owned it. Well, I recurrent the first time.
[02:34:14] I recurrent the first time in 82 and I stayed with missionaries there for a couple of days or more.
[02:34:27] Then during that time, we all decided to, okay, there was the breakaway and that church group.
[02:34:37] Part of it is going to another church just a thatch type of a place and walking hand walk through
[02:34:44] some kind of a jungle area to get there. They had it, we sat down and I spoke and asked him to
[02:34:56] sing and they just loved to sing. And then it's not, you got to sing the Marine Hill.
[02:35:03] Then what happened was I didn't really sing it. I said, now we'll sing it. The words, I mean,
[02:35:12] we'll sing the tune of it. It was a love song based on a hymn. It was kind of two iterations of
[02:35:25] apparently and then I had to then I told him a little bit about, well, you know, that's interesting.
[02:35:30] And I said, down, these words and I went through the words to a certain extent.
[02:35:38] Well, that was so interesting. But here they sang that song that was the love song. Like
[02:35:42] same as our Marine Hill. Oh, then after that, I invited him over to the other church that they
[02:35:49] had spent off from and I had got a hold of the film that was done by a government norm hatch.
[02:35:57] He was recently died away. He's one took all these pictures. Come back photos. It was
[02:36:01] inverted by the way. And anyway, I played that for them and it showed that flag rising and these kids,
[02:36:11] they all scythe and the Marine Hill flag and they were real quiet. The British flag one just like
[02:36:17] was described in here. Here's the results. The battle for Bayesian lasted 76 hours. Some 4,690
[02:36:29] Japanese troops, about 97% of the garrison died. A mere 17 Japanese were taken prisoner
[02:36:36] as were 129 laborers. The second, these most of these were Korean laborers. Yeah. The
[02:36:42] second Marine Division suffered 3,407 casualties of these 1,150 Marines and sailors were killed
[02:36:49] in another 2,292 were wounded. These Salt units lost 41% of their men dead and wounded.
[02:36:56] The first Patanian 8th Marines lost more than 30% of its men just getting to the beach.
[02:37:02] There's probably, there could be as many as 400 still there. Three or 400,
[02:37:06] still there, because they're under homes under park and lots and so on. Overall, the battalion suffered
[02:37:13] 343 casualties on their naked. When I was there, the third time. And here the archaeologist
[02:37:22] was brushing about brushing off the bones and on this one person, no, that and two of the two of them
[02:37:30] they found wedding rings on their, something huh? And I saw that as they were doing it. Yeah.
[02:37:40] casualties in my platoon were 12 killed and 15 wounded, including myself 75% of its original
[02:37:46] strength, most were hit while waiting to shore. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. And you can look at the faces of all
[02:37:57] these that were killed in this one photograph. And you talk about the news clipping,
[02:38:04] sort of the news stories that were reported about Taram. Yeah. Okay. And part of it, I always was told
[02:38:11] that they released some of these, it was the first time that they really released a lot of
[02:38:16] events. It's a very, very long one that one that general public realized, you know, this is not going
[02:38:21] to be easy. This is what it's really like. Just terrific combat photos, home and credible.
[02:38:29] Yeah. And those were the first ones showing mass casualties in my arrogance. Yeah. You, you've
[02:38:34] probably seen that one. Oh, yeah, I've seen it. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah, Norm Hatch. Just wanted to do that.
[02:38:39] Oh, so that is him. Okay. Norm Hatch. Oh, yeah. I got no real well. Yeah.
[02:38:44] All right. And in the end, we just read this book, I published, was there's a Colonel Alexander,
[02:38:52] Joseph Alexander died the last, in the last year for years. Anyway, he was the, he was the
[02:38:59] prime historian for the Marine Corps. And, and then he was very well thought of
[02:39:07] the name of the list to press. So when it came to making a proposal to enable us to press,
[02:39:14] it had to go through their, uh, through their border review scene. And then after that, no, I
[02:39:22] seen that. It had to go through, it had to go through your, when it, what's the word for it?
[02:39:27] Somebody has the same, same mountain as you do. I pretty much, anyway, this Joseph Alexander
[02:39:33] was one of the prime ones that did, did, did it when my peer review. Okay. And then when that,
[02:39:39] so that when that got to the, to the review board, oh, he says, fine. So I'd just say,
[02:39:47] you're laying on through, you know. And then now, my book was on the first ones to go on as
[02:39:54] an ebook, first ones for the press. And I have the ads or some of the, the, the, the proceeds magazine.
[02:40:02] Yeah. That shows, shows that they're displayed. One of them is with, uh, with Papay going to,
[02:40:08] is on that same page with him. Well, yeah, this is available on ebook for those of you that
[02:40:13] want to get it, and can't wait to get it. You get immediately. Just go straight to ebook.
[02:40:17] Not only that. Yeah, that too. And not only that. When they go through, and it goes through, and it
[02:40:21] goes up, going through email, I read to, uh, what's, what is it, uh, Amazon.com. It'll be delivery,
[02:40:29] you know, matter about three days or less. And, and, and, no, no shipping costs.
[02:40:35] Yeah, that's the way Amazon works. Oh, it's an amazing deal. I do. I don't understand. Yeah. And,
[02:40:42] I don't know if there's, there's, but that's where I got my copies. So, yeah, you can get, I have
[02:40:49] the hardcover and the softcover. Yeah, both. Yes. I don't play around with the music. You know,
[02:40:53] when you get ebooks, they cost three versus three quarters of much as a, uh, one of those. Yeah.
[02:41:01] That's, the publishing world is very strange. Taking it now to where you get onto the
[02:41:09] Sheridan. So now this is, this is, uh, no sooner than my stretcher touched down on the Sheridan's deck
[02:41:14] that I was west away into the operating room. I was one of the first wounded marines to be treated
[02:41:19] and the medical team was fresh and rested and ready to go to work on me. I guess that qualifies as
[02:41:23] a stroke of good luck. Even better fortunate awaited me in the operating room in the form of
[02:41:29] lieutenant commander Lloyd Sussex formally an abdominal, an abdominal specialist at the Mayo Clinic.
[02:41:37] Now the key member of three-man team, Dr. Two doctors in a corpsman that would say,
[02:41:41] there you go. How lucky is that you had a guy. Unbelievable. And, I'm part of the shift.
[02:41:45] And that's all there was. And if I gone unsure, I would have died. And most other places you,
[02:41:52] you wouldn't have an abdominal specialist. And then it says the operation last about an hour.
[02:41:57] I was conscious the whole time and didn't feel any pain. No, they didn't want their put me out because
[02:42:01] I died. I was in shock. And the doctor spent most of that hour bent over my lower body.
[02:42:08] And although I could not see what they were doing, I could hear a little clicking and
[02:42:10] sniffing sounds made by their instruments as they worked. They repaired my bladder and removed
[02:42:15] a portion of my large intestine and gave me a blood transfusion. Then they closed my wound and that was
[02:42:19] that. Yeah, and didn't need a half of a bay of afterwards. I had made it through surgery. But
[02:42:25] he'd been a close call. Dr. Sussex told me that I could not have survived another two hours
[02:42:29] because of the toxins that were building up inside. And that right after the right after the
[02:42:33] operation I was kept in a hot, covered tent. And it was miserable. I kept trying to shove it off
[02:42:40] they had they had a carman sitting there with me all night long to keep me even throwing it off.
[02:42:46] And then another couple of days I was able to walk into the watch and move me with their
[02:42:51] blood. People couldn't be here. I was walking in there to see the movie. They couldn't believe it.
[02:42:55] I mean you were as good as dad. Got shot in. Unbelievable. Not even to the beach yet.
[02:43:00] Yeah, they had very people survive period. I got shot. Very few. Because he told me he said
[02:43:07] I talked to him later and said, yeah, you know the poison in your system. You wouldn't
[02:43:13] you wouldn't have lasted another couple more. No hour or two that was it. And here's up in an hour
[02:43:19] about an hour or an hour or an hour after I was hit. I was just unbelievable.
[02:43:26] There's unbelievable. You say a few days later I was checked over by a younger doctor, a gloomy
[02:43:31] fellow with a bit with a bit of a bit of a bit of a bit of a match. You told me don't flu that my wound
[02:43:35] was very serious and that I wouldn't live much past my 50s. Yeah. Well, sort of doctor says such
[02:43:40] that they do his patients. I reported his words to Dr. Soxix, who's who's appalled.
[02:43:45] He shouldn't have told you that. Soxix said and there's no truth through it anyways. And I guess
[02:43:48] we're improving that right now. Soxix, if you're talking about it. Well, now what happened to him?
[02:43:54] A year later he was operating on a guy at Ferregette Naval Training Center. This is Soxix.
[02:43:59] Yes. And here he's about 55 years old. He died of a heart attack. He was
[02:44:04] operating on that guy. And I've talked, I've talked in Mayo Clinic about that. And then
[02:44:08] there's people that are written up a lot of history about that. They written a little bit about
[02:44:12] Sussex. And I gave a lot of information too. But so anyway, that's this end of the story all with him.
[02:44:20] In, uh, lad, like you said, you come walking up their plane of moving.
[02:44:24] Yeah. Yeah. You know, the best that you come walking about up my buddies could hardly prove
[02:44:27] believe their eyes. Oh my god, look, here's lad. They did the exclaimed.
[02:44:30] Yeah. Yeah. First they thought I was dead. Then they were told those grieves he wounded all
[02:44:33] to her up a basket case. And now here I was walking into the movie theater. How many days
[02:44:38] it have been? It couldn't have been more three days. Oh, man. Uh, while I was
[02:44:46] really, you know, all was in a hospital. They must get around. It's fast as possible. Anyway.
[02:44:50] Okay. Yeah. While I was recovering from my surgery, John Murdoch dropped by to give me a
[02:44:55] samurai sword. He had survived. He had proven near to unbezier. Yeah. Hold it from me until I returned.
[02:45:01] He said he assumed that I'd gotten a million dollar wound. It would be sent home. I thought the same.
[02:45:07] Left unspoken, but implicit and what he said was that he didn't think you'd be coming home.
[02:45:12] The sword was probably mine to keep. Yeah. He was, it was, his was a common sentiment.
[02:45:19] I would venture to say that after Taroa, most second division Marines didn't believe
[02:45:23] they would make it through the war. Yeah. Because you're looking at the entire rest of the island
[02:45:28] campaigns and then you got to go into mainland Japan. And it's going to be a bloody fight the
[02:45:32] whole way. Oh, boy, if they had that bomb had not dropped. It's horrible saying, but gee. Murdoch took
[02:45:40] a head count of B company using a pretty battle roster for reference checking off one name after
[02:45:45] the other from the list. He had known that the toll would be large, but even he was shocked by the
[02:45:51] final count. My god, he thought. Now that the chasms are listed or they're listed in there.
[02:45:56] We've not there listed. They're listed in here all the casualties. What's the name of the guy that
[02:46:01] uh... Yeah, they're not fully listed in here. What's his name uh... wrote the book, the story of
[02:46:06] the story of the battle. What's it? What is it? Anyway, I've got that whole thing.
[02:46:12] They're all listed in here. One's wounded. One's it killed out right. Now this is his book by the
[02:46:22] way right here. See? That's the right here. Here, that book. Sure, what? Okay. Sure,
[02:46:28] right. Okay. No, you know, all of the names are all back here. So here they are. If you
[02:46:33] know, they're all back in here. See this? Got it. See that? So that's where they all are.
[02:46:39] And I talked to him in person and uh... it's getting okay, you know, to quote him.
[02:46:47] And I said, well, I have a little difficulty with uh... with the uh... publisher.
[02:46:52] Mm-hmm. Just don't pay any attention to them. So I'm giving you the okay. All right.
[02:47:01] Now you guys sail to Hawaii. So you go from you go from this hell. How
[02:47:08] longs take you to Hawaii? Like 20 weeks? 20 weeks? 20 weeks? 20 weeks?
[02:47:13] So then you guys get to Hawaii. You guys are pure side. You're all sitting up there looking
[02:47:18] pure side and a car pulls up and here we go back to the book. Outstept Admiral Chester W. Nimitz,
[02:47:25] Commander in Chief Pacific Fleet and Pacific Ocean Air. He's getting to ascend the gangway
[02:47:31] a company by an aide. His friends called him Chet. So did the Marines. The nuclear
[02:47:36] experiences had given them the right. He chet, they shouted. When we go back to the states,
[02:47:42] Chet, we can't wait for the Golden Gate. Does our skipper know the way to day go?
[02:47:47] How about some liberty, Chet? We got to get off this tub and do some Christmas shopping.
[02:47:51] And perhaps most tellingly, hey Admiral, get us someone who knows the reefs for our next landing.
[02:47:59] So that's that's why. And then his driver, then the same...
[02:48:03] Mark said his driver's seat. Oh yeah, you see, you guys you look like some
[02:48:11] Hollywood guy. Yeah, you look like Hollywood guy. So that's Chet's remarks,
[02:48:14] Marty. Yeah, you guys must have been pretty away. But anyway, for sure.
[02:48:18] Hard to control a couple off of taro. So anyway, he was, he was so glad to say these guys here.
[02:48:23] So they're just full of it. Great. That's good. Yeah. And so here we go. Shortly after Nimitz
[02:48:29] departs. The PA announced that the shared would be proceeding directly to the big island.
[02:48:37] In other words, no liberty on a wahoo. This didn't set well with the Marines.
[02:48:41] And they went wild hooting and yelling and whistling, throwing all matter of junk down on the
[02:48:46] dock, pelting the band and the short patrol. The band's been lowered. Their instruments
[02:48:51] and accompanied by the short patrols fled to a nearby shed. The eighth Marines achieve nothing
[02:48:56] with their show of angry emotions, except perhaps to blow off a lot of steam and confirm to all
[02:49:00] concern parties that they should not have been given liberty. The rest was not about the turn.
[02:49:05] These barbarians loose on the civilian populace of a wahoo. The civilized world wasn't ready
[02:49:10] for us. And to be honest, we weren't ready for this. And like, whole life is concerned.
[02:49:13] What, all I've got to do is Japanese. What are you going to do? And there's a lot of Japanese.
[02:49:18] It was just as well. The brass had plans for us. The second division as a whole.
[02:49:21] And these did not involve a return to the United States. First, we would go to the big island
[02:49:27] to rest rebuild and then train for them. And we had to put up the tents.
[02:49:33] There was no face to sleep. So they sent you guys out at the middle of a wahoo.
[02:49:41] No, no, no. This is this is a big island. They sent you out at the middle of it where you
[02:49:45] guys had to establish your own base camp. Oh yeah, yeah. We had to set up the tents and start training.
[02:49:50] Oh, yeah. You get here. You get the stuff out. And then after that, the camp was used by the
[02:50:01] others that eventually took Ewasima. Okay. You say here, you get the camps set up. You get a little
[02:50:09] bit of downtime. And then they get you guys right into training. Our training stress to combine
[02:50:12] norms approach to warfare for veterans of Bayesian and Guadalcanal many aspects of this training
[02:50:18] world. But the replacements in the division we were receiving was receiving almost daily.
[02:50:23] They needed all of it. Replacements are going to be in the Guadalcanalcino area. And we knew
[02:50:29] we were going to use the tanks. And we knew that we were going to have to have communication
[02:50:33] by a phone and the back of the tank. Okay. Yeah, this was a new modification. It was a new
[02:50:38] new home. Yeah, home to the Hadoan maneuver around the strong points at all. You say that most
[02:50:45] of the replacements, most were fresh, fresh teenage, fresh, and so on. Now we're starting to get
[02:50:50] trapped. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's what you say here. Yeah. Eager kids with no combat experience and no
[02:50:59] idea what they got themselves into. The rest of us just looked at them and shook our heads. We
[02:51:03] did know what they had gotten themselves into. And we wondered how they would survive in the battles
[02:51:07] to come. Never forgetting that our own survival thus far was due in large measure to the vagaries
[02:51:12] of chance and circumstance and maybe just a little bit to the grace of God as well.
[02:51:17] Luck in God's grace, we're desperately slim reads on which to hang our hopes,
[02:51:21] slimmer still for the replacements because they're in experience. We expected that many would die.
[02:51:26] The odds were against them because they had seen no action. But we also expected to die.
[02:51:31] The odds were against us because we had seen too much action. Either way, you did the math.
[02:51:36] It came out bad. Yeah. And it's the war went on for another two years. Yeah, you're a
[02:51:40] hundred percent figure, you know. Yeah. Your chance of security. Yeah. Your percent. Yeah.
[02:51:48] We were, oh, here you talk about the drafties. We were especially skeptical about the
[02:51:52] skeptical about the drafties of which there were significant number. These were selective
[02:51:58] service Marines were something new to which was previously an all-volunteer force, new and unwanted
[02:52:06] and a matter of grave concern for the rest of us. Would the drafties measure up to Marine Corps
[02:52:10] standards? Would we be able to depend on them in battle? We had our doubts. We were wrong to doubt
[02:52:15] them in battle when the chips were down. They proved that like volunteers, they were worthy
[02:52:20] be called Marines. So you eventually take over a as a 60 millimeter mortar section. Yeah, because
[02:52:29] I'm still weak because you're still hurt. Yeah. And so I didn't have to get out and do a lot of
[02:52:33] moving around, you see. And then, again, you cover some of this stuff in good detail on the book,
[02:52:41] but then soon enough, it's your hit and cyber. I learned how to load this ship and
[02:52:47] be a court recorder and all that kind of stuff. Like do these stuff? How long were you guys in Hawaii
[02:52:54] for? Let me think about about six months, five months. Yeah. So you get five, did you get any
[02:53:01] liberty at that time? Oh yeah. Okay, so they let's go. Yeah, we were down a heel a lot. Okay. Yeah.
[02:53:06] Nice. Yeah. All right. So now you get done with that and then boom, morning, 15 June,
[02:53:13] 1944. Shells rained down on our salt waves. This is Sipan. Yeah, but not before we left Hawaii.
[02:53:20] We had our LSTs all lined up, Sipaside. And one of them blew up a mortar shell or something
[02:53:28] that we were doing some welding or something. Anyway, I'm Mercy, I'll blew up. And then
[02:53:33] fires have spread from ship to ship. And we lost, I don't know, maybe could four or four hundred
[02:53:41] men would lost their lives. Yeah. And that whole lineup there. That's it. And then we lost a lot of
[02:53:47] equipment because of that. Did that set back the operation? Yeah, it did. It did put us, yeah.
[02:53:52] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So now that was in a place called Westlock. Yeah. You probably heard about that
[02:53:57] when Hampshire. Yeah, no, and you've got a written, I did. I heard for it about because they
[02:54:00] made changes to the way that they did business with regards to handling. Now this happened,
[02:54:07] this happened when we were at Lenny exercises on Maui. And I think we had some, we had some
[02:54:15] complications at Lenny do that whether something was. And so that was part of it. I, that was part
[02:54:24] of it. But the main thing, they don't know exactly what caused the explosion, but they think
[02:54:28] it probably was. What's what I just mentioned. Yeah. But guys got blew up and just got flying out.
[02:54:36] And one of my friends seems he had happened to him and he was swim, swim, no, he was picked
[02:54:42] up by bolt came by and had it pulled a line. So grab on. And then just drag them over to the beach,
[02:54:50] you know. It's incredible. It's crazy. These vets from Gualdo Canal and Tarowen and then
[02:54:56] de Paris and that was unbelievable. Yeah. But you push it back, I guess. And then you guys had
[02:55:04] this iPad. And here we go, June 15, 1944. Sheels rained down on our sole waves kicking up tall
[02:55:10] columns of water. Now can you imagine landing on side pan? They had all of our cheerrails set
[02:55:16] on the west side of the mountain. Fire over at us. All zeroed in on the reef and along the beach.
[02:55:26] All they had to do was just break back and forth. And we could even show you. And we lost so many
[02:55:33] all of wounded. Our wounded were all going back and then here they got hit by all this archery
[02:55:37] fire. And our pertain, a lot of what pertain commanders were wounded and killed. Because
[02:55:42] there were our main our CPs were wrecked along the beach. And then our ships couldn't fire back
[02:55:51] at them from that angle. They had to go clear around the outside of the island and hit them from
[02:55:55] the river. That's what happened. Yeah. You say here are not only that. They had to spot her
[02:56:02] on a smoke stack and it's sugar refinery. And all that was called in. Just perfect. Perfect. Yeah.
[02:56:12] To my friends were killed right there in the beach. One led to death. Yeah, they're a lot
[02:56:17] other. The same way. Basically it. Yeah. Yeah. This is what Murdoch said about it. Our amtrax
[02:56:27] were in line to breast and we were taking our telefired. The heaviest we ever encountered.
[02:56:31] Yeah. You could see the shells hitting the water exploded. Yeah. Making the water splash way up.
[02:56:36] Just off to my right shell, scored a direct hit on one of my boats and pow, it just went to pieces.
[02:56:41] There was a flash and a big explosion. I could see pieces of men flying out of it. I thought, oh shit.
[02:56:46] But I also thought thank God it wasn't my boat. But I was mostly thinking who was it that got hit
[02:56:52] and how many guys am I going to be without? Man Murdoch was a serious like marine combat leader.
[02:57:01] Yeah. He got there too. Hit there too. And this is this is your this is you say this is your
[02:57:10] experience. When my amtrax reached the reef we were all crouched low below the sides. There was
[02:57:14] too much metal flying around the air to risk popping up for a look around. The guys had their heads
[02:57:19] pulled down between their shoulders and they stared at each other with eyes. We big eyes and said nothing.
[02:57:24] The veterans of Taro had been through this before and were probably having a harder time of it,
[02:57:28] precisely because of their prior experience because they knew how bad things could get.
[02:57:32] The new kids were mostly better off because they didn't have a clue.
[02:57:36] Certainly they were scared but they were also fascinated and awestruck by all the noise and
[02:57:39] commotion and these emotions blunted their fear. Nothing in their experience had prepared for them
[02:57:44] for this. The live fire exercise in Hawaii were puny by comparison and so they did not realize
[02:57:50] that our situation was terrible and likely to get worse. You can be sure that I was scared but
[02:57:55] fortunately I had the concerns of an officer to distract me. What wave were you and what group were
[02:58:03] you in? There was so many with ahead of us on the beach I landed on. We were way on the northern
[02:58:11] end of the landing beach and what happened is the tide of her was forces further way to the left
[02:58:19] and we had to realign a couple hundred yards further back to right again. Now thing is there's
[02:58:28] we didn't have a lot of problem getting into the beach but once we got to the beach there
[02:58:34] was nobody on the beach so they didn't defend themselves at the beach instead it was a heavier
[02:58:42] artillery fire so they landed basically you landed through but where I was we had to cross a
[02:58:49] fighter strip that they had so we had to cross and that was kind of scary going across that
[02:58:54] exposed from people shooting out of the side but then as we maneuvered kept moving to the right
[02:59:02] further to get back where we were supposed to be then the heavy artillery fired just all over
[02:59:08] the place it was just cannon wound him or um yeah you said so many good men were killed that day
[02:59:15] one of them was first lieutenant new old teacher yeah he was a four-year school teacher
[02:59:21] former school teacher you know when I went on one on the I'm never did together a lot in
[02:59:26] New Zealand yeah shell fragment sliced off one of his legs no country be found to help him yeah he
[02:59:32] did it died no other than the same time oh yeah that's his from moral artery pumped the last of his
[02:59:43] blood on to the sand he looked up at those gout around him and whispered get them in off the beach
[02:59:47] yeah yeah yeah because more the fire was coming in we're on the same time John we saw these guns
[02:59:54] by the way when we return up there those guns are still up there two of them are and now it's
[03:00:00] it's a Japanese memorial and that these are part of the memorial up there yeah I I mentioned to you
[03:00:06] that I was just saying I'm too this is right above a physical sandbass city in the city yeah
[03:00:11] right up there I don't know if we I don't know specifically because no I don't know I don't know
[03:00:16] talk of that hill as you get it was a big night above on the top now it'd be just in the
[03:00:21] North towards Shepard shell yeah it's just that that's where the that's where these these are
[03:00:26] this artillery is however and then then down to the left there's the monsters monsters that
[03:00:35] dig out of where they they got the coral the coral gravel or sand to make the airport with
[03:00:43] now that all got filled in with Japanese tanks and and and the amphibian tractors they're all buried
[03:00:49] right in there you probably didn't see it because it's all been buried but I got a picture picture
[03:00:54] I mean one book here I want to look like before they recovered up so I was here when when
[03:01:05] your friend knew was it new no no you said around the same time John Murdach John Murdach was
[03:01:12] running up the beach after disembarking from his amtrak came across Gus Kriger Kriger
[03:01:19] of one of B company's veteran first we tendons in a close friend he's who was lying on the ground
[03:01:24] I've got his picture here yeah his body perforated by shrapnel he was alive but just barely
[03:01:29] John now beside his friend I looked at him to see what I could do for him John recall but he was
[03:01:35] bleeding and so many places I knew I couldn't do anything he wanted to cigarette so I gave him one
[03:01:39] I let that form and I said Gus you'll be okay I got to go I had to go there was too much to
[03:01:46] do I had to get the company organized and I left him there so he died there I've visited his wife
[03:01:52] back afterwards he was later lost within the span of a few minutes John had lost two of his
[03:02:00] season to put two leaders also wounded and put out of action were the second and third battalion
[03:02:04] commanders we tend to crumble Henry P. Jim Crow you heard him and Jim Crow yeah legendary
[03:02:11] he was the former commander of the scout sniper school that you did and also we
[03:02:16] tended John Miller, Lieutenant Colonel John Miller so both the battalion commanders out of
[03:02:22] action yeah from that artillery yeah man yeah you're again you know it looks
[03:02:32] sort of hopeless so that's stage just seeming hopeless here we're catching heavy artillery fire
[03:02:37] and we couldn't do anything about it you know it's it's I like I like bringing up these points in the
[03:02:41] book where you talk about things like this while that's all that's happening you say meanwhile
[03:02:45] I lay in the brush with my man and try to free myself from the despair that suddenly gripped
[03:02:49] me the situation seemed hopeless it was Tarua all over again how I wonder do we gonna get out of
[03:02:55] this mess exactly my feelings at that time and then you say the feelings soon passed I just didn't
[03:03:00] have time for it at my command we moved out everyone rose from their shell holes and craters
[03:03:06] and went forward no hesitation imagine from the bushy strip we lumbered about 10 feet to the
[03:03:11] air strip keep going keep going ahead myself shouting don't stop it's good I like to bring
[03:03:16] those points up because there's several times where you talk about you as a leader have to kind of
[03:03:22] get yourself together and and I think what that's helpful for for is young leaders in the military
[03:03:28] that are gonna feel that same thing if they get into tough situation okay you got to recognize it
[03:03:33] and then you got to take action young 23 year old with all that responsibility I got so then
[03:03:42] next day I got got strapped off my own motors hit hit the leaves up above us and went off
[03:03:55] I didn't report it it just I got entered entered up and there's still air or there goes still there
[03:04:00] I didn't report it yeah you guys are pushing forward and then you guys get kind of a
[03:04:10] a skirmish line and then the Japanese counterattack several points along our line
[03:04:16] Don mains he recalled this they bonds out across the gas dang swamp and we just shot him up
[03:04:21] the swamp was marshy water and you remember it's a physical suicide he likes a
[03:04:25] super I don't remember it's a swampy area and what happened is one of the other officers
[03:04:30] in our battalion he was like a soldier for a type of a guy and he'd been with a pretty
[03:04:36] state army as an ambulance driver and north Africa and we just figured well he's either going to be
[03:04:42] a hero or he's gonna get killed one the other and he got killed what happened was that that
[03:04:47] we were we're at this spot and there are a lot of Japanese on the other side not exposing himself yet
[03:04:53] but he's trying to get it he walked out of head trying to get him and exposing himself he thought
[03:04:58] they were he getting him a surrender and instead this one guy being over had received him
[03:05:04] and strapped his back killed him yeah a lot of guys a lot of casualties and and actually
[03:05:17] at this point there's another casualty and it's a guy by the name of John Murdoch and this story
[03:05:26] is about as good of a story as I've ever heard about the military as a whole so here we go this is
[03:05:34] around this time John Murdoch also became a casualty hit while landing B company hit while
[03:05:40] leading B company on a sweep west of the landing strip down toward Sharan Konoa yeah
[03:05:47] Sharan Konoa and this is so this is John Murdoch now it's called it's really is a
[03:05:54] shalin shalin Konoa they couldn't they couldn't pronounce they couldn't fence their
[03:06:03] are so we call Sharon Konoa so here's John Murdoch talk in fact all of our past signs
[03:06:12] had a lot of wires in her teeth and that's where Roger comes from right yeah like when we say Roger could
[03:06:18] be I was told that that's possible I had thought that it's possible yeah that's the original
[03:06:24] usage was that we knew if someone says Roger you know it was on quite on Guadalcanale Murdoch
[03:06:29] was in there was was taking a piss and here Japanese come come in they don't know if I
[03:06:36] caught sure not is an engineer in one of our interpreters oh you read out a second take I don't
[03:06:44] know how you mentioned that yeah you're about it and here oh yeah oh gosh so here's Murdoch
[03:06:50] talking about him he gets wounded yeah opposition was very light on the other side of the strip
[03:06:56] and when we got down to the end of it we stopped and a Sherman tank came up to help us the tank
[03:07:00] had a phone in the back and I was on the phone and I'm trying to tell the guy inside what
[03:07:03] what I wanted him to shoot at the big smoke stack in the sugar cane factory I figured a
[03:07:08] jab was up there spotting for artillery which was very accurate then all of a sudden boom
[03:07:13] shell started falling all around the tank and I knew the spotter in the smoke stop was telling
[03:07:18] his guns to fire at us so I ordered the tank commander get that smoke stack then I put the phone
[03:07:23] back on and I'm running back to the safety in a hole and that's when I got hit by shrapnel in the
[03:07:27] left leg in the right elbow so I'm sitting there and the corpsman comes over and starts bandaging
[03:07:34] my arm and I look down and I'm down and my pants are all wet and I said holy shit I piss my
[03:07:39] pants and the corpsman said that's not pissed that's blood that's my found out I'd been hitting
[03:07:43] the leg so I dropped my pants and my drawers and now the corpsman's bandaging up my lead
[03:07:48] leg and the jab start to shell us again so I jumped and ran to a nearby hole which wasn't
[03:07:52] easy you know because my pants and my drawers were down around my ankles and so because I haven't
[03:07:58] read the entire book you know you talk about Murdoch and I've mentioned that he was a character
[03:08:03] and you know obviously you mentioned that he liked drink and one of the people he was in
[03:08:07] alcoholic a lot of time he finally got over yeah well one of the people that I would say what's
[03:08:12] that word aided him in being an alcoholic and somebody he apparently become a good friends with
[03:08:17] because it was a Catholic was the Catholic priest father Jo Keehan so they were really good friends
[03:08:23] and they spent a lot of time together and so as as he's starting to move towards being leaving the
[03:08:32] area there's a guy John's executive John's exo Jim Westman appeared on the scene and told and
[03:08:38] John told Westman to take over. He's a Westy congratulations you just made company commander I'm getting
[03:08:44] out of here now Westman got hit by the same arterial that I almost got hit almost got
[03:08:50] covered with and he he was out of the service after that he got badly wounded. Wow and we
[03:08:56] got 50 casualties in Westman was one of I was so so this is Murdoch continuing how it goes from him
[03:09:07] so I head down for the beach looking for the evacuation team I wasn't bleeding all that badly
[03:09:12] but I was a mess I could walk sure and I walked I was looking for one particular doctor
[03:09:17] soul cassal a dentist early your I had seen him on the beach there now I found him and I said
[03:09:23] solos this is fun he's a sound and my friend a ticket please because you couldn't get evacuated
[03:09:28] without a ticket they had to put a ticket on you he looked me over my right hand wasn't any good I
[03:09:33] couldn't use it so solomon ticketed me a little while later I was evacuated in a small boat
[03:09:38] and I said to the navy kid who is driving get hey find me a p.a. 51 will you and he said sure
[03:09:44] we found the ship and by then I was lying down and the guys on the deck called down to me
[03:09:49] will pick you up in a boom on a stretcher and I came up in the basket and I'm all dirty and
[03:09:55] bloody and I see our chaplain father Jo Keehan who I'd become very friendly with so when they took
[03:10:02] me out of the basket and put me on the stretcher on the deck I closed my eyes and attended I was dead
[03:10:08] father Jo Keehan over and started giving me my last bite in the church last right of the church in
[03:10:13] Latin but I can't keep a straight face so I opened my eyes and smiled at him and he goes you son of a
[03:10:19] bitch he goes right from speaking lap Latin to calling me a son of a bitch then he took me down to the
[03:10:24] infirmary and they patched me up a bit then he took me to his state room and put me in his bed I
[03:10:28] must have slept all day and all night I didn't hear a thing I wasn't feeling any pain my night my
[03:10:33] right hand and arm will numb when I came to I didn't know where I was at first then I took a shower
[03:10:38] changed the bandages and got cleaned up that was the end of my war there my second day on side
[03:10:43] pan my right arm was no good really my hand even today is no good yeah here's the thing even
[03:10:49] after it's many quite a snoop there's this summer be done
[03:10:53] it was a million dollar room I don't have any feeling the right side of my hand the nervous
[03:10:59] cutters are million dollar room really because my thumb and two fingers are good still good
[03:11:03] and the next the last finger the little finger we're dead so I thought that was about as good
[03:11:11] of a story as I've ever heard oh character you know you know when he what happened to him there
[03:11:21] when he walked barred into this hotel window and he was drunk as drunk as I'll get out of
[03:11:29] course well anyway the retain commander talked to him then next day about it and he says you know
[03:11:35] you should be more like an officer you shouldn't be doing that then he went on to say then
[03:11:40] the retain commander says well why don't we'll mind and say so I'm kind of like that myself
[03:11:47] you got a whole story about him in the whole one this same retain commander he was killed on
[03:11:51] Bogumville as he landed they call them they called him well he he took over the one of the
[03:12:02] what he called it one of the the Chinese way column yeah name right there in name form like the
[03:12:07] equivalent of the of the in in England the equivalent of it and what I don't know I don't know
[03:12:17] was an important you know that kind of like the like the uh recoluses but no no no no no no no no no no
[03:12:23] there be unit that would be the ones that just like you a seal say a raider a raider he took over the
[03:12:30] raider battalion that landed on Bogumville okay and he was killed there and then his his comments
[03:12:36] were as he died so well it's been a short war for me well well you there's actually another another one
[03:12:49] of these big situations that happens where there's a battle at sea oh yeah Philpincy yeah
[03:12:57] and Maryana's turkey shoot yeah you know that it's coming you'd see this before and he said
[03:13:03] we were right a few days later we learned that a great battle had indeed been fought in the waters off
[03:13:07] west of siphon something in the decisive victory for the US yeah well yeah with their defeat in the
[03:13:12] battle of the Philpincy the Japanese lost all hope of re-releaving their forces on siphon now was up to
[03:13:19] us the marines knee army to win the land battle do we call do I call it the mariana's turkey shoot
[03:13:25] yeah I did right there okay I don't think you've used those words well okay that's that's
[03:13:29] traditionally what it's called yeah that is that's the same one now that's the reason that this guy
[03:13:37] he held on because he thought the navy could come back and take it back now because he surrendered
[03:13:44] even after the war he was not promoted to major in a terrible and and the other thing was even
[03:13:53] the other other officer that I visited the same time that had fired at us from business artillery
[03:14:00] in Guadalcanel named by name a tannihaki otannih he bad mouth is this guy says well he should have
[03:14:07] even committed here he's even now he's a third side he's gonna be even he's still yeah oh yeah
[03:14:16] now you guys are kind of pressing through the rest of the island you say here my mortar
[03:14:26] section was always about 200 yards behind our lead elements and outbreak of small arms
[03:14:30] firing front of us was a single stop and set up our weapons you see now in the in that
[03:14:37] that movie about Pacific now you mean the the series the Pacific series yeah here here they had a
[03:14:45] six-million meter per his right up in the front and I don't know why the advisor does hey you don't do
[03:14:49] that yeah it doesn't make any sense and also all script is all screwed up it was all about a guy
[03:14:57] that was going through a going through some kind of a psychological thing and hurry's talking he's talking
[03:15:03] to the the kernel in charge of the of the of the of the hospital that he's at you know that
[03:15:11] you're talking to the carman you know stuff like that yeah well Hollywood they don't always
[03:15:17] terrible because you know they have to in the real world everything goes spread out so you
[03:15:23] know that they take a picture so they they they take a picture some real concentrating you see
[03:15:29] it's not like that at all yeah still one of my favorite uh war movies the Pacific yeah
[03:15:36] what did you think of it well this this sets for incredible they were incredible I
[03:15:43] I like friends this I I've been to Palo and good wonderful wonderful wonderful set yeah the
[03:15:52] and let's see what was it there what was the other place they were they did Guadalcanale
[03:16:00] so one Guadalcanale yeah well all the landings were they were great yeah they were great
[03:16:07] was that one I was you know yeah that what I thought I did it cover each size those two
[03:16:14] okay I'm thinking primarily I wanted Palo to like yes yeah yeah yeah I just the first time I ever
[03:16:21] watched it I was riding on a airplane I had it on my computer I had a headphone's in I was watching
[03:16:27] it really close and I I thought that the tone of the script is horrible oh the script might be
[03:16:33] horrible out the combat scenes for me they were unbelievable unbelievable the any actually
[03:16:38] we have your book I was I was saying while they did a great job because one thing that I
[03:16:42] was said to myself you know it's you know when some of the fire fights the night fire fights
[03:16:48] it's just flashes and they're like oh yeah that's what it's like there you go and you capture
[03:16:52] it in your book you can't really tell what's going on but it's bad yeah and they did a great job
[03:16:57] of capturing that hopefully this nail die who we'll pick up on this yeah you'll see the potential there
[03:17:05] hopefully you will see
[03:17:13] so now you guys are as you guys are pushing through you say casualties overall were relatively light
[03:17:18] yes they were at that time well thing is you know this ran for almost a month so yeah I
[03:17:25] just dragged out but the casualties were kept coming in of course yeah and then you say meanwhile
[03:17:31] off to a right in the other side of the mountain the 27th Division had run into a meet grind
[03:17:34] of these areas attacking on a plateau a plateau border on its left by a sheer cliff that formed
[03:17:39] the east face of the mountain called purple herds yeah and they were held up and so
[03:17:48] Alameda Smith he just he got rid of their their general and the army and National Guard troops
[03:17:56] they they they they never really got over it that was unfair they shouldn't have done that
[03:18:01] well I they did run if some terrible things down there were catching from the flank you know
[03:18:05] true bad yeah and here I was up I was up way in and further and I could look down I see what they're up against
[03:18:14] here speaking of friendly forces or friendly fire incidents here you were I was resting on one
[03:18:20] knee next to a tree holding my carbine upright where you go up plate to the ground when suddenly
[03:18:25] wham wham wham three big shells explode over a hundred to five millimeter long-term long-times
[03:18:31] long range the shells cannot from Japanese artillery but from a battery of armored tanks didn't
[03:18:38] believe that we were that far forward so he did it I found out like the western man told me about it
[03:18:45] he's the one that called it in short he and it was horrible oh it was devastating oh my
[03:18:52] guys so so many guys were just pulverized we didn't know what it hit us most of us did not hear the
[03:18:56] shells coming no one's out of nowhere no one ducked for cover no one of the shells burst in the
[03:19:01] tree above me deflecting the force of the blast and most of the strappin' outwards and set a
[03:19:05] straight down that's my life a single piece of metal pierced my elbow the wound whose larger than
[03:19:10] a bullet hole about an ancient dinammer at hurt like hell but it didn't look serious it hardly
[03:19:15] blood and the bone didn't seem damaged it's still the wound needed treatment a few minutes later
[03:19:21] several hospital jeeps converged on the scene and I talked over one of them on the way just 50 yards
[03:19:26] from me I passed a large creator containing the remains of several men from weapons platoon who
[03:19:30] been playing blackjack when the shell hit their position they'd little bit literally been blown
[03:19:35] to bits several of those men had been my friends in Samoa I'd served in their unit before
[03:19:41] being commissioned I could identify only one of them and because he was glasses yeah yeah
[03:19:47] a few of the name was costinson a fact I have a picture of him too somewhere here
[03:19:54] a few yards further on a dead marine lay in a hole beneath a coral outcropping where I had
[03:20:00] spent the previous night he'd been killed by the army's misdirected salvo the same shell
[03:20:06] the killer yeah you want yeah the same shell that killed the blackjack players wound a dick
[03:20:11] stine then a member of weapons platoon he doesn't remember the explosion or anything else about
[03:20:16] the day one moment I'm standing on the ground with the guys in the weapons platoon and the next
[03:20:19] thing and I know I'm waking up in a tent there in the fuel hospital and it's around midnight
[03:20:23] just a concussion in this case he just how long am I here so he just takes off
[03:20:31] he's could still be alive I think he's he's in a rest of now I think
[03:20:36] all in all the shells from the 150s fives killed or wounded more than 50 marines
[03:20:42] yeah yeah yeah now the fellow wrote the wrote a book we came to win or we are be killed or
[03:20:49] did die and he got hit he retired as a Colonel by the way and anyway he got hit by the same
[03:20:57] same rounds and then put him out he got he got medical medical discipline uh retirement
[03:21:06] devasting no no no no no that he had one of his pretty close to friends
[03:21:12] turns out he was my company commander at at this particular time and uh the cell server they
[03:21:18] was cell server he'd been a professional dancer and he got he got hit by by a large round
[03:21:25] on on on on uh tenion and then I then I took over took over I was at exact took over and
[03:21:32] he went he went to the hospital in Guadalcanal he killed himself because he did want to live
[03:21:39] without a one leg because he's professional dancer and I know I don't think that this fellow wrote
[03:21:47] the book realized he he he writes in the book he was the spun it he didn't rent he didn't never
[03:21:52] mention he killed himself I talked to the guy that wrote the book he didn't really know one
[03:21:56] yet others well he did I know what a coincidence I dated a gal one time she was a she was a
[03:22:05] receptionist for William Morris agency and they they represent a lot of the big people
[03:22:11] then it turned around all of those well anyway uh she uh I was invited to their Christmas party
[03:22:20] and this was in 44 William Morris agency and as they came in she told me who was so on
[03:22:27] money will be and so on is he all came in and then I ended up a day to do a couple of times and one time
[03:22:34] uh we were in this uh this big place well no place can't think of name now but anyway
[03:22:41] others had just returned it's about a month after I had from from Memorionis and I said how did
[03:22:47] he how did son son make out and they said oh you didn't know he killed himself my girlfriend
[03:22:55] says I knew that we were close fans of his family we used to play brist together
[03:23:00] and a small world that's crazy yeah that's crazy yeah so at this point you're wounded yeah yeah
[03:23:12] and you go back to the aid station yeah and then late on the 7th of July my 3rd day in the
[03:23:19] field hospital doctors and corpsman went through the words towards telling all the walking
[03:23:23] to remember to the units because we had to lock up and they were about to the Japanese
[03:23:29] and the guns I had to have a still thousands of their hiding ready ready to kill themselves
[03:23:36] or make one last bunch of charge and her I had walked right through her 40 were killed
[03:23:45] that that that the last night of the mop up can you imagine and then this guy
[03:23:51] he was in these were his men and when I I found out his track his track and my track
[03:24:02] crossed okay I found out on that and so when I once stood I wanted to talk to him sure enough
[03:24:07] she's yeah I was there some reason I wasn't saying bonds on all that no that was another guy
[03:24:14] so here and then then he and then then the guy wrote a book about him I have the copy of the book
[03:24:19] it's called the last the last samurai by by Jones and I helped I helped the reviewer of the book
[03:24:26] before he published it well so uh ended up uh he was invited by the author to attend our reunion in Florida
[03:24:42] and when he came he and his wife came and some of our guys treated him materially they could not
[03:24:48] believe this guy could have done what he did as far as given him such a bad time being up there
[03:24:54] right up until after the war and I tried to I tried to call things down and I had to hit
[03:24:58] the time there's an article there's an article look at this article I hear tell the about it
[03:25:02] look at this article think I have it in here I think no I guess I don't have it here I never think
[03:25:11] yeah here's article I know oh I guess I don't have the way man no that's not yet he's a darn it
[03:25:24] by the way here's a picture this guy I showed you that there's a picture this guy that I'm
[03:25:28] interviewing this is the other guy that fired his known as pistol peat he's one that did
[03:25:33] most of the shooting at us at 105 long range rifle yeah for him and two and one was on
[03:25:43] Guadalcanale we we went to it that's I have a picture in my book with him standing at it and
[03:25:50] he became a major his his father had been a general in at a kind of like our like west point
[03:26:01] but for senior officers to come to and one of these officers was the prince he was a
[03:26:08] tenant general became a lieutenant general and he was one of the one standing on a Missouri
[03:26:14] at this room that was the one of his students his father's students amazing huh yeah
[03:26:23] and by the way this is what the bonds are look like here you see that here we're we buried those bodies
[03:26:28] we dragged them into the ditch and we buried probably 4,000 bodies like that
[03:26:34] well and now they're homes all through here yeah for so they're still there they're still
[03:26:40] they're only about four feet down and then then there's then there's a beautiful new hotels right
[03:26:47] on the beach just across the road from that and you were probably told about that when you were
[03:26:52] there I don't know it's a place called place called tannipay I don't know tannipay and also
[03:26:58] place called sandrokey yeah so for people that are just listening these are just images of
[03:27:05] this this massive attack it happened was we we fired in our live in three is our tour
[03:27:13] we fired in at them as they were charging and so their bodies are all chuda all chuda
[03:27:21] you go into some pretty good detail about the about that bonds I had to talk about this
[03:27:26] about the age band and radio that is a best you'll find anywhere and in fact
[03:27:33] that's where you know I had to reveal it in detail because I had some doubt about it and I said
[03:27:38] well it looks like in general he's okay he's he's said it right there's nobody else can talk about
[03:27:43] it's in that detail don't but he can then oh it's a great idea oh first hand yeah
[03:27:49] now I did go to a reunion of those people in that battalion back in Iowa and so this guy was
[03:27:57] there and he was one of the ones that the interview of course for this yeah and then yeah so
[03:28:04] if you want to do some account of just incredible fortitude you got to read this book and
[03:28:11] then it picks up where you what you were just talking about this is when you go now to do sort of the
[03:28:20] sort of a cleanup and you see this many of the bodies were recognizable yeah and
[03:28:29] one of the guys Sandy and the others had to reach the bloody remains for dog tags that would
[03:28:34] identify their friends discovering which one of their friends they were charging and hunger
[03:28:39] if I own people were killed most of them soldiers they went right through them you say that this
[03:28:45] bonsai this bonsai resulted in as near as I can determine from what I saw and what I've read
[03:28:51] the Japanese lost upward of 4,000 men some 500 Americans were killed most of them from the army
[03:28:57] the two battalions that were overrun and nearly wiped out each battery suffered 150 two
[03:29:02] casualties in the attack 75 killed or 6 wounded they got completely your run
[03:29:07] it's estimated that some 600 Japanese were killed on the open ground directly in front of the
[03:29:12] batteries guns yeah yeah man you're you were pushing up again this is another another thing
[03:29:23] that you passed through we passed through their positions and deployed to skirmish lines
[03:29:27] extending the water's edge in the railroad tracks of 6 buildings advancing along the
[03:29:32] along the shore in the eighth of longer road yeah thus a raid we picked our way
[03:29:37] slowly through the battle zone our weapons at the ready all around the dead were thick on the
[03:29:42] ground in numbers that defied comprehension bodies and pieces of bodies everywhere artillery
[03:29:47] and pounded the area and chopped up the bodies turning the battlefield into an immense open air
[03:29:52] abitwar strewn with torsos and limbs and heads and chunks of unadunifiable flesh burned black
[03:29:58] by fire I could recreate the flow I could recreate the flow and ferocity the battle the
[03:30:03] patterns of the fight and flight by the numbers and positioning of the dead there would be places
[03:30:08] pockets of resistance where bodies were pile on top of bodies dead Japanese entangled with
[03:30:12] that americans frozen in attitudes of hand to hand combat clutching each other plunging
[03:30:18] bay nets into each other locked in their death struggles arm machine gun positions were
[03:30:22] tabloids of butchery with bodies of the Japanese heaped in front of positions and bodies of
[03:30:27] american soldiers slumped over their guns for men who didn't want to be there the US army soldiers
[03:30:32] they were a lot of drafts and all of a bunch of drafts here too yeah not all the Japanese were
[03:30:38] dead of course as usual some were shaming yeah we knew this would be the case and we very quickly
[03:30:43] and we're very quick on our triggers if we saw any movement if one of those bodies so much
[03:30:47] is twitch we poor fire we'd poor fire into it even if we didn't see movement if a body or group
[03:30:52] of bodies looks suspicious we shot it through and through bushes big enough to provide concealment
[03:30:57] were preemptively blasted into wood chips and leaf bits now and then as we advance across the
[03:31:03] battlefield the dead body rose suddenly to throw a grenade or shoot it us some Japanese jumped
[03:31:08] to their feet and tried to run away we shot them all just shot them all right down no prisoners
[03:31:14] were taken we moved forward at a steady pace hardly breaking a stride rarely halting we just kept
[03:31:19] walking through the killing ground looking around scrutinizing the bodies firing at the Japanese
[03:31:24] are coming to a probably under dead probably at least a hundred and we we we we had only
[03:31:30] a couple of wounded as well we had that process yeah that was a large of stuff the war
[03:31:41] that was what that was a large of sponsi counter attack of the war see if they were given
[03:31:47] no objective to just keep going keep going it gives many of us as possible until they're
[03:31:53] in the end of the house lost their life and and the two two commanders they they
[03:31:59] committed very carry before started and one was the one the gumo was the one the lead to attack
[03:32:04] on Pearl Harbor now gumo and then we finally get to the last campaign a little a little
[03:32:16] over three miles south of siphon sent tinian twelve miles long six miles across it's widest point
[03:32:23] and this was your oh this is really something too that first night
[03:32:34] one eight landed late that afternoon yeah the second division unit involved the only the only
[03:32:40] second division unit involved the jday operations the regiment quickly established a reserve
[03:32:44] position behind the beach has perimeter digging in and string barbed wire and anticipation
[03:32:48] of enemy counter attack all moving around the perimeter. All of it's 200 miles 200 to 100 foot
[03:32:54] to 200 yards wide beach they had no idea they were going to be up there they thought we
[03:33:00] got land down down there the main town which was called a well-known called san Jose
[03:33:05] you guys fainted you could there's a fake we did a fake but we had a battle shed hip hit
[03:33:10] it was a lot of damage and lost lies from counter counter fire counter battery fire.
[03:33:15] This was for me and many other second division marines the fourth combat operation in just 18
[03:33:20] months the three previous guadal canal tarua and siphon had all been difficult each in its own way
[03:33:26] taking enormous physical and emotional toll on all the survivors most of us have been wounded at
[03:33:31] least once all of us have been sick. Now somewhere we're you're going to get to the point where
[03:33:38] we had to at night go over and head off the Japanese that we're attacking our artillery and
[03:33:46] they're we're you know you don't know and I'll tell you about it if you don't see yeah yeah
[03:33:53] the thing that's interesting about this is I mean just you guys having been through
[03:34:00] everything that you'd been through at this point I mean the mentality going into this you know
[03:34:05] you say here the air force could have dropped bushels of purple hearts on our front line units
[03:34:09] and every marine who grabbed on what had deserved it. Okay now they're talking the
[03:34:13] napal was dropped the first time to war on on tinian probably before we landed.
[03:34:20] Yeah you said you said then the aircraft used napal bombs something you do us we
[03:34:24] watching amazement as the bombs fell earth were tumbling and over and an exploded on a ridge
[03:34:29] that instantly erupted in flames and oily smoke along its entire length about 10 seconds later
[03:34:34] gust of hot air from the ledge blew us over. Next day first batiny elements moved up on the
[03:34:39] ridge and poked around the scorched landscape most of the undergrowth had been burned away.
[03:34:44] The ground was black and reaped of gasoline and the foxholes were filled with the corpses of
[03:34:48] Japanese soldiers blackened and shriveled by the incinerating fires. Yeah first use in napal?
[03:34:57] What was the other section that you were talking about? Okay right I'll tell you in the
[03:35:01] day the island of secure. August 2nd here I'm a company commander. We reached the next the last
[03:35:12] bit the beach you know looking down over the cliff and when that one we returned there when
[03:35:18] they're in March of this year we looked from the south side of that beach where the civilians
[03:35:26] all jumped and killed themselves and looked up across and my company was spread from about halfway
[03:35:34] up to clear to that point and we had we had we had both go out with a bullhorn to form the surrender
[03:35:42] and gave them all the made of they didn't so then we fired them machine guns and martyrs at them
[03:35:47] and they all jumped off off the point this side of it and hunters jumped off their des.
[03:35:54] And then that night we were spread out so long so so thinly we decided I'll talk to my
[03:36:03] my company exactly that time and what's we do at long and so you're just going to have to have
[03:36:08] strong points figure where they're likely to come through. So we did and we looked out they tried to
[03:36:12] come through right a strong point so we'll let but anyway these the then we had to send people down
[03:36:23] and try to get them out of the caves down below us there are a lot of civilians in there.
[03:36:29] So were the civilians out where they were they staying with the with the with the with the
[03:36:32] no they're by themselves families. Yeah the were families one not to run there they're
[03:36:36] even the same cave some soldiers were them yeah yeah and eventually you could say here the
[03:36:43] Japanese I mean and again this we're jumping through all kinds of you know just crazy combat
[03:36:50] and then you get to a point where the Japanese had no no more fight left of them they were ready to die
[03:36:57] if not yet call it quits for the most part they went on. Okay then what happened you see when
[03:37:01] I when I told you right after we landed the first night and here we got here we got we got
[03:37:06] we got got a message that our artillery was being being overrun by our other Japanese and so we
[03:37:14] had here's that for dark and probably around midnight and here we here as a tiny I was a
[03:37:20] company exact and I took up 200 or maybe two Patoons and we went single file to former sliders
[03:37:29] from the front of the artillery well that's great dangers because anybody walking around is
[03:37:35] going to get going to get the enemy you know right well then I went when morning came here there were
[03:37:41] all kinds of shovels out there and there was Japanese and here we had the our line of scrimmers
[03:37:48] had to go forward oh this is going to be horrible the air in fox though they're in holes and we're
[03:37:53] not not a lawnmower shot at us as we came up very close with an less than 100 feet or so I
[03:38:02] just put a hand grenade shoot kill themselves bang bang 100 and kill themselves as we walk forward
[03:38:08] and we only had a couple of men wounded so we had and why they didn't shoot back I don't understand
[03:38:15] we're in all of them were given orders not to thank you in the air hurry wow
[03:38:22] what a relief what a relief so going back to the book here and again I'm jumping through
[03:38:29] some incredible stories but Tinian was declared secure on one August first Patan pulled back
[03:38:36] about a mile from the coast and set up camp the end of the fighting was very abrupt suddenly we didn't
[03:38:41] have anything to do there was no enemy activity in the immediate area no danger no shooting I just
[03:38:46] sat back and tried to enjoy the situation that this wasn't as easy as you might think I was exhausted
[03:38:51] and filled with a lingering dread a sense that I'd used up all my lives I had I had been
[03:38:57] become conditioned to wondering whether I was going to survive another day and then all of a sudden
[03:39:01] all the causes for concern had vanished as though I had been given a reprieve from a death sentence
[03:39:07] I could hardly believe it a strange feeling I didn't have long to dwell on it a few days later
[03:39:11] I received orders to return to the states 32 months after leaving San Diego I was going home
[03:39:21] three weeks later at Pearl Harbor where I'd been marking time in the transit center I'd
[03:39:26] boarded a giant Martin Mars flying boat for the final leg of the flight that was oh my gosh
[03:39:33] well landed in Patan when he called that place I can't think we're now in Berkeley
[03:39:39] what is it like? Alameda Alameda Alameda Alameda Naval Air Station
[03:39:44] everyone on board service men from every branch returning home watching outer silence as the golden
[03:39:48] gate bridge passed beneath I reported to a marine facility was granted 32 day furlough one for every month of
[03:39:55] overseas duty later that day I visited a barber shop while I was sitting in the chair one of the
[03:40:01] patrons began bitching about the terrible state of things in the country I listened to him for a while
[03:40:05] and then I exploded you don't know what terrible is I told him he shut up after that
[03:40:11] you know talk about the woman ran to the what the woman ran into oh yeah yeah yeah yeah
[03:40:15] yes the best I picked up that was your first time in the female marine yeah yeah and you know
[03:40:20] because they brought the women in now they could form a six division but taking all them in
[03:40:28] they had clerical type of work take them out put them in combat right this is the thing that's crazy
[03:40:35] for me to think about here is you know you just have one line it says the war wasn't over right
[03:40:40] and this is 1944 the war wasn't over and as you talked about earlier the thought was that
[03:40:46] you know America was gonna have to invade every island until you got right into Tokyo and since you
[03:40:53] had seen the the how how steadfast the Japanese were you all just thought yeah I might be home for
[03:41:00] year but I'll be back over there as a as a battalion executive officer and a battalion officer or
[03:41:05] whatever you know all my friends that came back and they they ended back up
[03:41:09] keeping preparing preparing for that so about a year you spend at Kwanico at the basics school
[03:41:17] teaching the young marine that and and the first what called PCS tuned commander school
[03:41:22] I went through the first as a captain and then I went through orientation crashed
[03:41:27] because I became an instructor you see okay so they sent you through a school
[03:41:31] they sent you to a commander even though you'd already been a company commander in combat yeah yeah yeah
[03:41:35] so anyway I don't know the academics of it basically and well and then now it's a
[03:41:42] commander then the next I'm a commander the at the basic school and here I have a
[03:41:48] battalion of a second of tennis just recent graduates in naval academy and a battalion senior
[03:41:56] NCOs and none of them wanted to continue they just wanted to retire at their rank you know
[03:42:03] you're going to be back to a second lieutenant and I never forget when the first things I had to do
[03:42:09] was keep my little extra on formal guard mouth and I never been the formal guard and I told them
[03:42:16] I told these guys I said I never I've been a combat almost as time and I've been a formal guard mouth
[03:42:22] since I I had a felt presentation to move it felled around you know they didn't give me a bad
[03:42:28] time they'd all they'd all been through it you know but I never never had been through it you know
[03:42:33] and I told them major about it and said he told me said you figured out you figured out
[03:42:40] no
[03:42:42] here we go on August 15th after night of devastating bonding raids bombing raids on eight
[03:42:47] Japanese cities the Japanese announced their intention for surrender yeah
[03:42:50] for Americans and most of the and this is after obviously the bomb yeah you know
[03:42:54] um for Americans and the rest of the world the announcement signaled the end of World War two
[03:43:00] even though the formal surrender didn't take place until the second second of September
[03:43:05] a few weeks later our classes were terminated in orders were cut by thousands to release
[03:43:09] men from active duty I was asked whether I wanted to stay on and take a regular commission in
[03:43:14] the Marine Corps I was tempted I'd started as a private made it all the way up to Captain at age
[03:43:19] 24 no small achievement and then was the potential for further advancement in the postwar corps
[03:43:24] at first I said yes and signed my the requisite papers but after sleeping on I changed my mind
[03:43:30] the next day I would do my papers shortly thereafter I was released from active duty
[03:43:33] I bought a 1940 crisis or convertible yeah and an octobre hydrovocross country to spook a
[03:43:39] yeah yeah five day journey yeah and then then I went to work at the H1th of college
[03:43:47] I went to work for North American aviation and there was there for six years
[03:43:52] and then lucky there was there for 23 years and I was on primarily on the exploration space you
[03:44:02] know I was involved with the first the first flights to Mars and the first fly by
[03:44:08] it was a failure we provided the vehicle that did the injection took it to it and it was going to
[03:44:15] as it flow by and then take pictures of it's blue by and also provided the shroud that protected it
[03:44:21] get now the atmosphere well the shroud outcast and blew up and here I had to take a technician
[03:44:28] down to JPL who would provide the spacecraft and and then then that had to take down a half was
[03:44:34] shroud and they put it in temperature out of two chamber it did blow up and I had to go back and tell
[03:44:41] our engineering people hey it did blow up and this all no it couldn't there's just they just
[03:44:48] convinced you did no it did blow up so then we had to work like the next the next launch
[03:44:55] next launch window was just matter a couple months later so we built a different kind of
[03:44:59] different construction and it made it from then on I was involved and all kinds of involved
[03:45:05] with with the with the tech pictures of the moon where they uh Boeing provided space
[03:45:11] to get we provided the means of getting there and then astronauts when they prepared to land
[03:45:16] the moon will they their practice meeting with our spacecraft that kind of stuff yeah and one time
[03:45:23] one time and then I became the I became the president of the management association about 3000
[03:45:29] members and one time we had we had uh put this name uh the first on the moon um Armstrong Neil Armstrong
[03:45:39] he spoke to us and I asked him a question we had about seven hundred people in our tennis
[03:45:44] and he asked him a question and says sometimes you look up there at nighttime and he has to kind
[03:45:49] of pinch yourself I was really there can you imagine can you imagine what his answer was
[03:45:54] I have no idea his answer was I've learned to live with it
[03:46:00] and just brought down the house oh she and then what you when did you get married when you have kids
[03:46:05] uh that was in uh just a minute 40 47 yeah and uh I mean this this book is just like I said
[03:46:27] I've read a fraction of it probably read less than 10% of it tonight the the amount of
[03:46:33] information the amount of detail the stories are just okay now this is unbelievable this is
[03:46:38] when you get that one and it's entirely different this is based on interviews by a very
[03:46:44] and this is based on some talking to people but mostly I'm talking to the natives I'm talking
[03:46:51] to Japanese uh I'm describing what what it's like now what the landscape is like all in the
[03:46:58] pre-lying around so it's almost like this book should have been written first and should have been written second
[03:47:03] well I don't know you see see the thing is this is too broad or is this is getting
[03:47:07] not detailed and detailed with the people yeah and that's mentioned in in the in the
[03:47:13] in the prologue or the forward in the forward in the forward that's where it's mentioned that's
[03:47:17] reason it's a different entirely different and I didn't even tend to write this but uh you got
[03:47:23] you know here hit all of these all these tapes and now only that and a little little little
[03:47:29] tape recorder and the one's Japanese are in two acute and he was doing the same thing so
[03:47:33] anything I said he was recording or I'm saying so on and so that's when it said okay that was
[03:47:39] 82 then 85 183 a tickle group out as a tour guide then 85 I went I went to japan went on
[03:47:47] space A and so here I entered you and that was that was really interesting I'll tell you this guy
[03:47:54] this guy Tani he told me all or the space we've had yassikuni shrine and the you know the
[03:48:01] in person if he had less than all that kind of stuff and just a lot and then went into a
[03:48:08] a TV studio and all that kind of stuff is incredible and any any point or doubt you know
[03:48:14] I think it was so fire bomb you know it all this is all new all new but then everyone is so friendly
[03:48:21] to me you know just couldn't believe it yeah then he built he built a he built a you know a battleship
[03:48:28] that was the Japanese battleship that had it's shilled Guadalcanale he made it and it would
[03:48:36] it was radio controlled and it would fly even it would fire from the guns with a photo flash flash out
[03:48:43] and he had in his garage and his eight foot long is the same size is the actual drawings of the
[03:48:51] of the battleship so he made it the same size okay and now he he came down with cancer
[03:49:00] and we we of course one with a 15 years and so then he wanted to hear he had the same what should
[03:49:07] I do it said well you know there's there's the museum back in Kalamazoo
[03:49:14] Guadalcanale battles and he did he sent it back there and send a museum now
[03:49:20] oh wow yeah I have a picture of him in my book here summer
[03:49:24] well and then here have a lot of that a lot of little cartoons he drew I'd say what happened here
[03:49:31] and so he drew out he drew it out this is this is what happened or he'd send me something about here
[03:49:38] here he is just starving there and now here he's dreaming of a meal that later on he will
[03:49:44] had stuff like that it's just incredible well this stuff is is amazing these these this
[03:49:52] book is like I said this book is awesome thanks to my co-author he know he know how to craft it
[03:49:56] all I did was hey yeah this is correct yeah yeah oh well there's more of this there's a little
[03:50:02] more here and there's not the main the main was on site pan I just I had some doubts because
[03:50:09] he had he did believe in some conspiracy theories about other things that's reason I was concerned
[03:50:14] but overall it was okay it was good well it's like I said it's an incredible book to read I
[03:50:20] know I've had you here for just about four hours talking but I wanted to I wanted to kind of close
[03:50:26] it out with one last thing one last section of the book and you already kind of mentioned it a
[03:50:30] little bit but the way it's written is just just such a fitting close to this is not the guy
[03:50:36] that's the life yeah and so it says this on October on on 22 November 1993 the 50th anniversary
[03:50:45] of the bout for Taroa I tended this ceremony in yorkers New York to be dedicate here you go
[03:50:51] Anthony O'Boyle Memorial Park in the name of the fallen private from my pontoon he was well known
[03:50:57] there in that town also attending where Anthony's good friends and foxhole buddies yeah
[03:51:03] Bill Crumpacker said it right yeah he was with a dickstein yeah our company commander John Merck
[03:51:10] and several other Taroa vet as well as a member as a number of high-ranking Marines
[03:51:18] including Lieutenant John General John J. She hand he bought a herd of a man Jeff yeah
[03:51:23] then a member of the joint chiefs of staff yeah it was a cold gray day with an icy wind blowing
[03:51:29] off the Hudson River yeah quite a contrast to the tropical heat and brilliant sunlight on
[03:51:34] Bezier when Anthony had medicine and yeah shot in the head while peering over the sea wall
[03:51:40] and red beach too Anthony had fallen back into John Murdoch's arms still alive but unconscious
[03:51:46] his body twitching his eyes open but empty John held him for a brief time spoke to him
[03:51:53] and then set him aside on the beach among the bodies of other slain Marines where he died a
[03:51:59] few minutes later all the solemn knees appropriate to the occasion where observed all the
[03:52:06] rights were performed the colors were trouped speeches were giving music was played prayers were offered
[03:52:16] we saying the national anthem the Marine him and amazing grace there was a presentation of
[03:52:23] military testimonials proclamations were made John Murdoch gave a talk about Anthony
[03:52:30] then presented Anthony's brother with the purple heart a fitting gesture from a man who comforted
[03:52:36] Anthony in his final moments of his life and honor guard fired at 21 gun salute
[03:52:43] taps was played we all wept our tears were shed in both sorrow and joy
[03:52:51] there was cause for both Anthony's life had been short his dying heart his glory
[03:53:00] everlasting there was no bitterness no disillusionment no anger his life had mattered
[03:53:10] his death also and we remembered both and knew that both had meaning and purpose the biographical
[03:53:22] sketch in the program for the ceremony expressed the feelings well in this regard
[03:53:27] and serves as a fitting epitaph for every marine in the second world war
[03:53:33] and here's what it read if the world had been different if he had been born at another time
[03:53:44] Anthony with his sunshine smile could have married raised a family had grandchildren
[03:53:51] and lived a quiet typically traditional American life but the early 1940s were not normal times
[03:54:00] a fascist dictator threatened to conquer Europe and forge an alliance with the militarists
[03:54:07] who controlled the Japanese government and they're distorted plan for world domination
[03:54:13] and unprepared and unsuspecting United States became a primary target the American people were
[03:54:19] shocked in the action by the Sunday morning arrival of Japanese bombers over a wahoo
[03:54:25] like hundreds of thousands of other young Americans Anthony felt compelled to volunteer
[03:54:32] to serve his country he simply could not stand aside while America was under attack
[03:54:40] Anthony gave his life on tarua for his country his core and for his fellow Marines
[03:54:48] he was not a famous hero more than a by millions extolled in the press
[03:54:53] immortalized in magazine articles or books he was no one special just another marine private first class
[03:55:05] the American people should thank god eternally for Anthony and his fellow Marines soldiers
[03:55:14] see men and airmen who preserved and won a magnificent victory over a wickedly evil enemy
[03:55:24] semper five brother you are not forgotten and with that Dean Lad has left the building
[03:55:36] and actually who has joined us in the building looks like Jason Gargert, Jason Gargert's randomly
[03:55:41] we are in spokane Washington spokane spokane spokane and since you originally linked me up with
[03:55:52] the Dean Lad on a few random flights somewhere and you saw what was he just wearing like a
[03:55:58] Marine Corps hat sure is one of the Marine Corps hats sitting there and I struck up a conversation
[03:56:03] with them and the next thing you know he's like oh I was like wow what can I tell you
[03:56:07] taro up and I was like holy cow and he goes out and wrote a book about it you don't have to be kidding me
[03:56:11] it was awesome just so funny you text from the flight yeah and that you get so funny because
[03:56:16] you and I were just standing out there talking to him you know how you get you know you and I are
[03:56:19] used to hear in all of our friends say like oh well now it was in Baghdad or when I was in Marsha
[03:56:25] or when I was in wherever I was in Ramadi and we were just standing out there and he's like
[03:56:29] well you know when I was in side pan I was like that's so much better so much cooler than we are
[03:56:36] dang it and that is the most ridiculous what those guys went through is completely ridiculous
[03:56:43] and I know I mean I've since you know with the old breed is kind of the the the the way that I learned
[03:56:53] like what those guys went through sledge Eugene sledge but this book is just right out right
[03:56:59] there with it man it's right there with it and you're just getting gut shot while you're 500
[03:57:07] meters from the beach at tarua yep you there's no way you're gonna live and yet you live and then
[03:57:14] and then guess what you go to Hawaii for six months and then you're hitting the beaches of
[03:57:20] side pan and then you barely survive that and then guess what you're hitting the beaches of
[03:57:25] tinian and by the way all of this is after you were at the wild canal crazy it's completely insane
[03:57:31] and by the way when he got back he got back in 40 August of 44 when he gets back he has like 32 days
[03:57:39] leave one day for every month that he was overseas and then he's like none of those guys thought
[03:57:47] the war was gonna end they just got done literally killing every single Japanese except for 17 on an
[03:57:54] island they all fought to the death and then they think okay there's however many millions left in
[03:58:00] Japan yeah we're gonna have to go kill them all we're gonna have to kill every single one of those people
[03:58:05] that's what they were thinking so he was thinking cool I'm gonna be on short duty back here training
[03:58:09] Marines for a year and then I'll be going back overseas as a as a company commander or as a
[03:58:14] battalion X or whatever totally nuts they came up with a bomb that grew in to perfectly good
[03:58:22] war is what I heard some of you say on this podcast yeah yeah that was that was Jim Kunkill said that
[03:58:30] good so anyways it's it's so awesome that first of all that you manage awesome that I mean it's
[03:58:37] it's just amazing to be able to sit here and talk to these guys and one of the reasons that we're
[03:58:41] able to do this is because of the support that is given to us from you the listener
[03:58:47] sure and what we've tried to do is set something up where you can support not only this podcast so
[03:58:53] that we can continue to go around and talk to the Dean Lads of the world and capture their story
[03:59:00] but also while you're doing that you can support yourself yes while you're on the path
[03:59:04] it's a mutually supporting scenario yes which is a good thing so on the path what's the the first
[03:59:11] thing that comes to mind obviously in my opinion due to so many due to just so many you need to get you get
[03:59:17] and urgent or a genie yeah 100% that was a common question when we started this hey I'm starting
[03:59:24] due to just a good of course that's good what you should I get common question easy no answer
[03:59:29] easy no or if it wasn't for that question we wouldn't even be connected to or it was that question
[03:59:35] and me telling people to buy originies even though I didn't wasn't connected with them yet
[03:59:39] yeah so that's pretty cool to think about so please relax regards yeah I'll just
[03:59:45] be wearing your legs right now by the way like right now some American denim origin jeans what
[03:59:51] are you two Jason Gardner oh we're three right here oh yeah every time I wash them they get better
[03:59:59] they get better they're so nice and you know what is coming out right now the Delta 68 jeans
[04:00:05] which are named after the may-con Delta which is where our forefathers served in Vietnam
[04:00:11] and where our forefathers in the SEAL teams wore blue jeans because they were tougher and way cooler
[04:00:20] so they're like lightweight though so anyways jeans you can get those there to your t-shirts
[04:00:27] sweatshirts supplements yes keep you on on your game and on the path big time
[04:00:33] mock extra protein in the form of of a desert joint warfare is it the dirt in the form of extra protein
[04:00:39] to get some kind of a desert the form of a check actually I utilized that combo the other night
[04:00:45] it was like it was straight here's the thing I had some pumpkin pie with it though I don't think
[04:00:49] a pumpkin pie that a violation yeah it was a desert for the pumpkin pie it's like a desert for
[04:00:54] the desert so many asked me if we're gonna make pumpkin spice uh milk what like seasonal or seasonal
[04:00:59] even if it's wrong no man do it because that reminds me of pumpkin spice latte which I
[04:01:06] know is like a thing for people with like weird hipsters yeah hipsters hey man still are you
[04:01:15] a pumpkin you're giving me a look over there no I was just thinking about you know as long as there's
[04:01:20] enough fat with what you're eating that dessert it's gonna blunt your insulin response so you
[04:01:25] okay fire it up do you think I'm gonna come out of this guy come out of the bank critical of my
[04:01:32] bio chemistry here all right cool man thank you I'm gonna talk to you more about that if you want
[04:01:37] to drink something uh for some energy we'll call it sure yeah if you want to drink some you can try
[04:01:44] some discipline some discipline go some discipline powder and right now I'm completely on this kick of
[04:01:51] the jockel pomer which is the best thing I've ever been so the discipline go you know the
[04:01:57] energy drink the cans is that discipline go or just go it's like discipline it's as disciplined
[04:02:04] in small but it's go I guess so it's discipline go but it's the energy this is where some big
[04:02:10] marketing machine it's gonna be like hey need to rethink your marketing plan because it's like no
[04:02:16] I'm kind of care and I seem channeling a BTFD I'm a marketing advisor is Tony yeah yeah
[04:02:25] makes this like no either way that in the form of energy drink those I've been on I've been like
[04:02:35] so I don't want to say addicted I'm not gonna use that word for you but my wife the other
[04:02:40] day goes in hey darling how many is too many of those things to drink the day and I'm like probably
[04:02:47] four she's like oh okay and I'm like how many you've been drinking a day and she goes well at least
[04:02:52] three every day she let it know meets the threshold hey yeah join warfare don't forget about that
[04:02:58] get a loyal that'll keep you in the game big team all queer are to oh and then warrior kid milk
[04:03:03] for the little kids so instead of feeding your kid actual poison yeah actual poison
[04:03:09] which is what uh normal chocolate milk and strawberry milk is it's poison for your child
[04:03:15] you might as well as give them strict nine is that what it's like yeah just give them just give them
[04:03:21] straight yeah yeah well okay all right so get the warrior kid get some get some tea to winters coming
[04:03:27] get that little little chocolate white that don't get some there it is this is all at
[04:03:33] origin main dot com also when you get faithful warriors I got it on the website
[04:03:39] I'm not worries it under books from the episode I think I'm gonna list the other books as well
[04:03:44] that he sort of mentioned okay yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
[04:03:47] I'm about to alter all making attempt faithful warriors 100% will be there um you know so you
[04:03:52] can get that good support on now and also we have a store chocolate store actually we it's all
[04:03:59] it's everyone's store now pretty good it's gonna change the name to everyone's store maybe
[04:04:04] maybe I'm gonna have a little bit of Tony he might let me just go communist on it call the people
[04:04:10] store maybe it would fit is what I'm saying anyway it's called jockel store currently jockel
[04:04:17] store dot com this is where you can get more rashguards more how should i say representative
[04:04:22] directly of the game the path more of the funny we just took it for granted we talked about
[04:04:28] origin we didn't say that it was made in america after we just talked for four hours with
[04:04:33] someone that fought to keep america free and then we didn't mention the fact that everything
[04:04:39] in origin is made 100% without compromise in the United States of america yeah that's pretty cool
[04:04:44] just a cotton is grown see yes and that's the part two like you can say yeah 100% made
[04:04:50] had to call these materials and I made them right here in america 100% which isn't even bad
[04:04:54] I'm not even hating on that it's good but we're just like wait wait wait what about the materials though
[04:04:59] you know okay okay I get it man okay all good either way but what about those materials
[04:05:05] you know or the origin materials that's that's grown in america so jockel store
[04:05:11] rashgargard rashgargard made in america well from origin so boom in the game trucker's hats
[04:05:17] beanies hoodies like and heavy whatever you like well it depends on what you mean
[04:05:27] it they're heavy technically but you know you just use 20 minutes from the Canadian board
[04:05:32] at a bro you don't have heavy for him you need heavy for him you are right so all
[04:05:38] us stuff is at jockel store dot com representative yes also subscribe to the podcast
[04:05:43] if you haven't already a contrary to what jockel says I'm not saying you don't
[04:05:48] what do you keep saying that you don't think people subscribe to the podcast you need to
[04:05:53] tell them no so I can't open door if I remember correctly which I probably don't but if I do
[04:05:59] I my initial uh contention was that we don't have to say to subscribe to the podcast we don't have to
[04:06:05] say hey subscribe you know what do we have to say that nothing oh I'll just subscribe to this
[04:06:11] podcast if I like it kind of thing that I think I don't I think that was the whole contention
[04:06:16] nonetheless why is it even there then why are we saying it that's the whole reason I brought it up
[04:06:20] at that time it's like why are we even saying this remember but then we did like
[04:06:25] sent you a message yes that's how that's described that's right yeah so it's like a good reminder
[04:06:29] and then you're like see yeah okay it's all come to see thanks all right so so subscribe to the
[04:06:35] podcast if you want to talk about that if there's also some other podcast one of them
[04:06:38] is called the Warrior Kid podcast which you may or may not know about it's for children it's for parents
[04:06:42] it's for everyone in the world and then we have another podcast oddly enough now
[04:06:47] which is called the grounded podcast grounded podcast yes this I guess you was formulated kind of
[04:06:55] with the offshoots of conversations about your tattoo in life right yeah well here's the thing
[04:06:59] there's some things that we taught that you and I talk about and then that you and I talk about
[04:07:03] with everyone that we know yeah that doesn't quite fit in the purview of jocopotcasts actual yeah
[04:07:10] right like yes the jocopotcasts is for Dean lad yes it's not for Dean's director
[04:07:19] but the Dean has Dean's been on it but like Dean's you know we we we covered the primary
[04:07:25] jocopotcast type stuff from him but Dean has other information for us other things that we talk about
[04:07:30] that that is the perfect way to put it back so there you go so subscribe to those podcasts and
[04:07:34] also if you want to get some some soap because you probably need soap in fact I'm going to go
[04:07:38] and say you do need soap get from Irish Oaks Ranch dot com from young aid and who's making soap on
[04:07:43] his farm from goats it's not allowed to sell goat milk in California because speaking of communists
[04:07:50] they like to control everything out there but you still go to milk soap yes get the milk for
[04:07:55] consumption there I know so get some soap and stay clean also we have youtube channel on the
[04:08:02] industry to stay in the video version of this podcast we want to see what we look like
[04:08:07] even at me maybe jocco actually I know it's not like you know it didn't lad looks like yeah yeah yeah
[04:08:12] 98 90 years old just in here just more energy and he I wish you to go on like on a full
[04:08:21] fitness diet like longevity protocol what's going yeah he's been what's he what's he given me on that
[04:08:29] path not to mention it took a round of the guts like I can't be killed bro he's the
[04:08:36] he's the ultimate still rolling so yeah and then we got psychological warfare if you need some
[04:08:41] little mental spot you can get that it's available on various MP3 platforms me talking to you about
[04:08:46] your moment of weakness if you need a visual version that go to flipsidecampus.com a little company
[04:08:51] run by Dakota Meyer you can get you can get art sure I said it and then also books
[04:09:02] you want to exercise your brain so get this book this book is epic faithful warriors a combat
[04:09:08] marine marine marine remembers the Pacific War I like I said I read 10% of it at most on this podcast
[04:09:14] I didn't touch there's huge peace that even touching here so order that book
[04:09:20] leadership strategy and tactics field manual just got cleared by the DOD so we are clear hot
[04:09:26] it's coming out January 14th and you're probably thinking oh well I weighed a little while to order
[04:09:32] it and if you think that you're not getting that first the niche and then I will look at you with
[04:09:35] shame when I meet you so no seriously uh leadership strategy tactics preorder it now so the
[04:09:42] so that the publisher knows how many to print we all know that this has been a problem for some
[04:09:47] people in the past being included. We're the warrior kid one two and three order those books immediately
[04:09:53] for your children and for every child that you know yeah get them I'm been buying them for the
[04:09:59] kids libraries that's also I got the three warrior kids books and Mikey in the dragons brought
[04:10:04] it down to the school library here you go the I just realized I gotta go get it for the little
[04:10:09] town where libraries too so more kids and just the ones that I know that's awesome and the teachers
[04:10:15] have they been reading in school with your kids uh the fifth grade teacher yes because I
[04:10:20] I got a bunch of letters from the kids yeah they read it they're in the game they are they have a
[04:10:25] pull a banner close now yes you know what that right there my mission in this world has been
[04:10:32] accomplished that there's a classroom in America with a pull-up art every classroom in America
[04:10:37] because they have a pull-up art and a couple of copies that were good so yeah check out those books
[04:10:41] and Mikey in the dragons I don't know a lot of people as I as I always say a lot of people
[04:10:48] think that's the best kids book ever written pretty well at least for sure at least I do
[04:10:54] discipline goes freedom field manual you can get that book if you want to get after it and what's
[04:11:01] interesting about that book is there's no book like it and my publisher I was like is this
[04:11:08] the biggest risk you've ever took with published in a book and he's like oh absolutely not even
[04:11:12] close there's no book like it it's totally outside of any other normal book so yes this is a big risk
[04:11:19] but it it outperformed every model of sales that they had created for it like even though that
[04:11:28] well if it really does great it'll be here it I did all that so why word a mouth and you all
[04:11:34] spread the word so thank you discipline because freedom field manual and then of course there is
[04:11:37] extreme ownership and the dichotomy leadership that I wrote with my brother life babbin about
[04:11:43] leadership not just in combat but everywhere and then we have Ashland front which is our leadership
[04:11:50] consultancy and what we do is solve problems through leadership worldwide that's what we do go to
[04:11:56] Ashland front dot com for details eF online since leadership training can't just be a shot
[04:12:03] in the arm and then you're good to go you need to do more persistent training over a longer period of time
[04:12:09] that's eF online go to eF online dot com check it out we're doing new modules all the time
[04:12:15] sir master 2019 the last master that we are doing in 2019 is in Sydney, Australia we are about to
[04:12:25] head down there so every master we've done is sold out if you want to come to the master in Sydney it is a two
[04:12:31] day leadership conference instruction seminar that is guaranteed to up your leadership again you will
[04:12:41] have pragmatic actionable things to do that are going to make you better leader when you leave and what does
[04:12:46] that mean that means you'll do better in everything in your life period and then we have eF overwatch
[04:12:55] where we are taking veterans from spec ops and combat aviation and we are placing them into companies
[04:13:02] in the civilian sector and be on the lookout for eF Legion where we are taking broad military
[04:13:08] troopers and placing them into the civilian sector so they can use those military skills take the
[04:13:14] principles that we know from the military that we know from extreme ownership and put them in your
[04:13:19] company so your company can win and if you want to continue to interact with us virtually
[04:13:27] then you can do it on the inner webs Jason is at Jason dot n dot garden on instagram
[04:13:38] yeah Jason Jason and garden twitter yeah i knew there was a difference somewhere in their facebook
[04:13:45] Jason and gardener on facebook which one is your most used social media platform
[04:13:53] i like twitter the most not excuse me instagram yeah i could cause the graph the grandma's
[04:13:59] deal twitter's a bit clunky seeing a root what stuff like that and it's interesting but
[04:14:09] alright well if you want to talk to Jason that's him echo is at echo Charles and i am at
[04:14:15] jocca willing that's twitter is to grab an on the fuss some book and and once again thanks to
[04:14:24] Dean lad lieutenant colonel dean lad you know it's a spring court for his service and
[04:14:30] sacrifice and the same obviously goes out to all our service men and women out there
[04:14:36] thank you for protecting our freedoms and to our police and law enforcement firefighters paramedics
[04:14:43] EMT's dispatchers correctional officers board a patrol secret service all first responders
[04:14:49] thanks for what you do every day to keep us safe here in our homes and to everyone else out there
[04:14:59] never forget never forget the price that has been paid for our freedom a price of blood and horror
[04:15:10] a price of sacrifice and suffering a price that we cannot fully repay but what we can do
[04:15:22] is live a life that honors every single sacrifice that has been made for those
[04:15:31] that gave their lives go out there and live and until next time this is Jason and echo
[04:15:45] when jockel out